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Default Pre-Pay service electronic keys?

Hi all,

Daughter recently took on her stepsisters flat when she passed away
recently (39) and in the process of cost-cutting, went from British
Gas to Bulb as her electricity supplier.

She was sent a new 'key' and yesterday put £20 on it but when she put
it in the meter, got an error message:

'Your new key isn't talking to the meter correctly' ;-(

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit (as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer (she left
it that late because it warns when you put in the new key in it will
wipe any remaining credit. A lesson learned though might have been to
do it during office hours).

So, she's switched off all but the essentials (mainly just the
fridge/freezer) and will ring them on Monday and hopefully get it
sorted (do some '8 digit TAG code to re-program her key' thing?) but I
have no experience of such so wondered if anyone could answer any
questions please?

Like, if she got credit put on the key, would the shop get any
acknowledgement that it had worked correctly (eg, could they have seen
it f-up but taken her 20 quid anyway (she has the receipt))?

If she took it to another place, could they tell her if it has any
credit on it or not (proving the key 'works' and there is credit on
it)?

How do Bulb get their money? Does the key determine that via the
payment terminal?

I don't know that she followed (or saw) their online guide re using a
new key (in case it matters):

"How do I start using my Bulb prepayment key or card?
How to use your electricity prepayment key
Use up all the credit on your meter before you plug in your new key.
This is important, otherwise your new key will wipe your existing
credit.
Plug your Bulb key into the meter and wait for 60 seconds
This will register your key. Once that’s done, we’ll be your official
supplier of green electricity.
Top up at your nearest Paypoint, Payzone or Post Office"

So, are they saying there you *have* to 'register the key' (with the
meter presumably) *before* you add credit and try to use it, or is the
last sentence just a general guide to the fact you can top these keys
up at many places? Should that last line be in the 'how to use your
key' guide?

Obviously Bulb c/s should be able to answer some of these questions on
Monday but I'd like to find out more in the meantime.

Additionally, is it possible to have more than one key ... so that
maybe we could get / have one and help her out now and again?

Cheers, T i m
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Dont know.

However, my daughter could only get prepayment,
(Expensive per unit I believe), until my Brother in law
(Who is a reseller Of utilities) was able to get her a credit meter (same physical meter I believe).

Whether he could do this for any customer, or just did it as a one of for her, I dont know.

Other resellers are available.
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T i m wrote:

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit


does it cut her off at zero, or have a bit of leeway?

(as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer


That much credit would run the FF alone for about a week

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On 07/07/2019 12:30, T i m wrote:
Hi all,

Daughter recently took on her stepsisters flat when she passed away
recently (39) and in the process of cost-cutting, went from British
Gas to Bulb as her electricity supplier.

She was sent a new 'key' and yesterday put £20 on it but when she put
it in the meter, got an error message:

'Your new key isn't talking to the meter correctly' ;-(

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit (as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer (she left
it that late because it warns when you put in the new key in it will
wipe any remaining credit. A lesson learned though might have been to
do it during office hours).


I thought that when pre-payment meters run out of credit, they (possibly
with a button press) will allow emergency use (used to be about £5
worth) which is paid back when the next top-up is done?

Hmmm, just looked at Bulb and they list various types of meters, all of
which require inserting the pre-payment card as part of enabling the
emergency credit facility - which may not work if your daughter's card
isn't paired to the meter!

Surely they have a 24hr emergency line of some sort?

SteveW
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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 12:56:22 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

T i m wrote:

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit


does it cut her off at zero, or have a bit of leeway?


I understand there was a sort of reserve on a previous solution of
about £5 but she's not sure if it's the case atm (and can't find out
till Monday).

(as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer


That much credit would run the FF alone for about a week


Understood, but I suggested she still try to avoid all other
non-essentials till she can get it resolved. I've said she'll be ok
with lights (all LED) and even the router / laptop if needed but her
phone / data would be better for now.

Luckily they have gas hot water and hob so can boil water and cook
stuff.

It was really more about what might have gone wrong with the key
payment system?

Cheers, T i m





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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 13:07:57 +0100, Steve Walker
wrote:

snip

I thought that when pre-payment meters run out of credit, they (possibly
with a button press) will allow emergency use (used to be about £5
worth) which is paid back when the next top-up is done?


I think they have seen / used that before, but not sure if it's in
place atm? ;-(

Hmmm, just looked at Bulb and they list various types of meters, all of
which require inserting the pre-payment card as part of enabling the
emergency credit facility - which may not work if your daughter's card
isn't paired to the meter!


Ah, quite. ;-(

Surely they have a 24hr emergency line of some sort?


You would have thought.

"How can I contact you
How can I contact you - There are a number of ways to get in contact
with us from social media to a good old fashioned phone call.

Email -
Community - community.bulb.co.uk
Live chat - To chat with us, click on the blue circle in the bottom
right of your screen.
Telephone - 0300 30 30 635

What are your opening hours
We're all in the office between 9am and 6pm Monday to Friday. Our
community is available 24 hours seven days a week, so if you need help
at 2am on New Years Eve then that's your best bet."

I've just registered on their forum and asked some questions there.
Could be a handy place for other related questions for the future etc.

Cheers, T i m
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T i m wrote:

It was really more about what might have gone wrong with the key
payment system?


Don't suppose many here are used to credit token meters, last time I had
one it was 50p's in the gas meter as a student in the mid-eighties.

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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 13:58:41 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

T i m wrote:

It was really more about what might have gone wrong with the key
payment system?


Don't suppose many here are used to credit token meters,


There may have been some who have had dealings with them, even if not
their own?

last time I had
one it was 50p's in the gas meter as a student in the mid-eighties.


;-)

The only time I've come across such things is in holiday chalets. ;-)

Cheers, T i m



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On 07/07/2019 12:30, T i m wrote:
Hi all,

Daughter recently took on her stepsisters flat when she passed away
recently (39) and in the process of cost-cutting, went from British
Gas to Bulb as her electricity supplier.

She was sent a new 'key' and yesterday put £20 on it but when she put
it in the meter, got an error message:

'Your new key isn't talking to the meter correctly' ;-(

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit (as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer (she left
it that late because it warns when you put in the new key in it will
wipe any remaining credit. A lesson learned though might have been to
do it during office hours).

So, she's switched off all but the essentials (mainly just the
fridge/freezer) and will ring them on Monday and hopefully get it
sorted (do some '8 digit TAG code to re-program her key' thing?) but I
have no experience of such so wondered if anyone could answer any
questions please?

Like, if she got credit put on the key, would the shop get any
acknowledgement that it had worked correctly (eg, could they have seen
it f-up but taken her 20 quid anyway (she has the receipt))?

If she took it to another place, could they tell her if it has any
credit on it or not (proving the key 'works' and there is credit on
it)?

How do Bulb get their money? Does the key determine that via the
payment terminal?

I don't know that she followed (or saw) their online guide re using a
new key (in case it matters):

"How do I start using my Bulb prepayment key or card?
How to use your electricity prepayment key
Use up all the credit on your meter before you plug in your new key.
This is important, otherwise your new key will wipe your existing
credit.
Plug your Bulb key into the meter and wait for 60 seconds
This will register your key. Once thats done, well be your official
supplier of green electricity.
Top up at your nearest Paypoint, Payzone or Post Office"

So, are they saying there you *have* to 'register the key' (with the
meter presumably) *before* you add credit and try to use it, or is the
last sentence just a general guide to the fact you can top these keys
up at many places? Should that last line be in the 'how to use your
key' guide?

Obviously Bulb c/s should be able to answer some of these questions on
Monday but I'd like to find out more in the meantime.

Additionally, is it possible to have more than one key ... so that
maybe we could get / have one and help her out now and again?

Cheers, T i m



There is usually an emergency button that will give a small credit in
the event of you running out. You still have to pay as it will be
deducted from the next credit added.
I think you can only use it once before adding credit.




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On Sunday, 7 July 2019 12:30:54 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
She was sent a new 'key' and yesterday put £20 on it but when she put
it in the meter, got an error message:
'Your new key isn't talking to the meter correctly' ;-(
Like, if she got credit put on the key, would the shop get any
acknowledgement that it had worked correctly (eg, could they have seen
it f-up but taken her 20 quid anyway (she has the receipt))?


If she got the receipt then it worked.

If she took it to another place, could they tell her if it has any
credit on it or not (proving the key 'works' and there is credit on
it)?


Probably not.

How do Bulb get their money? Does the key determine that via the
payment terminal?


Yes.

I don't know that she followed (or saw) their online guide re using a
new key (in case it matters):


I think it may do.

Plug your Bulb key into the meter and wait for 60 seconds
This will register your key. Once thats done, well be your official
supplier of green electricity.
Top up at your nearest Paypoint, Payzone or Post Office"
So, are they saying there you *have* to 'register the key' (with the
meter presumably) *before* you add credit and try to use it,


I think so.

When I got a new key (they actually sent me to the shop with a reference number) I got the key which they updated on the payment terminal with the ref number, then I went home and keyed-in to the meter, then I took the key back to the shop and got some credit.

It might be worth (and probably won't do any harm) taking the key to the shop again and asking them to put it in the terminal, then back to the meter ....

She can also try Power Cuts on 105 and reporting loss of supply due to faulty meter. They might refer it back to the Bulb or they might come and legitimately bypass the meter to put her back on supply temporarily.

Owain


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With regard to the freezer, maybe a neighbour has an extension lead and that
can be used. It should only cost her the price of a drink and use an
extension cable. Be fine for a couple of days till its sorted.
Brian

--
----- --
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"T i m" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

Daughter recently took on her stepsisters flat when she passed away
recently (39) and in the process of cost-cutting, went from British
Gas to Bulb as her electricity supplier.

She was sent a new 'key' and yesterday put £20 on it but when she put
it in the meter, got an error message:

'Your new key isn't talking to the meter correctly' ;-(

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit (as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer (she left
it that late because it warns when you put in the new key in it will
wipe any remaining credit. A lesson learned though might have been to
do it during office hours).

So, she's switched off all but the essentials (mainly just the
fridge/freezer) and will ring them on Monday and hopefully get it
sorted (do some '8 digit TAG code to re-program her key' thing?) but I
have no experience of such so wondered if anyone could answer any
questions please?

Like, if she got credit put on the key, would the shop get any
acknowledgement that it had worked correctly (eg, could they have seen
it f-up but taken her 20 quid anyway (she has the receipt))?

If she took it to another place, could they tell her if it has any
credit on it or not (proving the key 'works' and there is credit on
it)?

How do Bulb get their money? Does the key determine that via the
payment terminal?

I don't know that she followed (or saw) their online guide re using a
new key (in case it matters):

"How do I start using my Bulb prepayment key or card?
How to use your electricity prepayment key
Use up all the credit on your meter before you plug in your new key.
This is important, otherwise your new key will wipe your existing
credit.
Plug your Bulb key into the meter and wait for 60 seconds
This will register your key. Once that's done, we'll be your official
supplier of green electricity.
Top up at your nearest Paypoint, Payzone or Post Office"

So, are they saying there you *have* to 'register the key' (with the
meter presumably) *before* you add credit and try to use it, or is the
last sentence just a general guide to the fact you can top these keys
up at many places? Should that last line be in the 'how to use your
key' guide?

Obviously Bulb c/s should be able to answer some of these questions on
Monday but I'd like to find out more in the meantime.

Additionally, is it possible to have more than one key ... so that
maybe we could get / have one and help her out now and again?

Cheers, T i m



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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 14:39:09 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

snip

There is usually an emergency button that will give a small credit in
the event of you running out.


I have heard that yes (and believe daughter is aware of it).

You still have to pay as it will be
deducted from the next credit added.


Make sense.

I think you can only use it once before adding credit.

That also makes sense. ;-)

Cheers, T i m
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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 07:22:57 -0700 (PDT),
wrote:
snips

If she got the receipt then it worked.


Ok. ;-)

If she took it to another place, could they tell her if it has any
credit on it or not (proving the key 'works' and there is credit on
it)?


Probably not.


Hmm, I was thinking on the lines of yer Nectar card when they can put
points on *and* tell you the points that are on there and what they
are worth?

How do Bulb get their money? Does the key determine that via the
payment terminal?


Yes.


Ok. ;-)

I don't know that she followed (or saw) their online guide re using a
new key (in case it matters):


I think it may do.


There may be more to it that what I first understood. It turns out
daughter has successfully used the Bulb key a couple of times so it's
not the initial 'registering' thing I first considered / reported to
be a cause.

Plug your Bulb key into the meter and wait for 60 seconds
This will register your key. Once that’s done, we’ll be your official
supplier of green electricity.
Top up at your nearest Paypoint, Payzone or Post Office"
So, are they saying there you *have* to 'register the key' (with the
meter presumably) *before* you add credit and try to use it,


I think so.


It turns out that in her absence, the 'flatmate' had used the old BG
key and whilst it didn't do anything credit wise, it may explain why
the meter is now not talking to the key? ;-(

When I got a new key (they actually sent me to the shop with a reference number) I got the key which they updated on the payment terminal with the ref number, then I went home and keyed-in to the meter, then I took the key back to the shop and got some credit.


It might be what she will have to do in the morning with Bulb CS but
over the phone (the TAG code thing)?

It might be worth (and probably won't do any harm) taking the key to the shop again and asking them to put it in the terminal, then back to the meter ...


I think she's going to try to call Bulb first thing tomorrow, they
might suggest that etc.

She can also try Power Cuts on 105 and reporting loss of supply due to faulty meter. They might refer it back to the Bulb or they might come and legitimately bypass the meter to put her back on supply temporarily.


She is down to ~70p tonight (from £1.16, not £1.60 last night) and has
been out all day herself.

Cheers, T i m


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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 19:50:06 +0100, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Good idea Brian ... ;-)

Cheers, T i m

With regard to the freezer, maybe a neighbour has an extension lead and that
can be used. It should only cost her the price of a drink and use an
extension cable. Be fine for a couple of days till its sorted.



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On Sun, 7 Jul 2019 12:56:22 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

T i m wrote:

Support isn't open until Monday and she only has £1.60 credit


does it cut her off at zero, or have a bit of leeway?

(as of
last night) and so is a bit worried about the fridge freezer


That much credit would run the FF alone for about a week


I wasn't aware of the 20.44p/day standing charge. ;-(

13.587p/kWh.

All sorted now though after Bulb c/s sent her a code that she gave to
the PayPoint shop and they re-synched the key. Credit then added to
meter with no probs.

That got me thinking about getting her a wireless energy monitor
thing, even if only their current usage, rather than anything that
would indicate the costs etc?

Cheers, T i m

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On Monday, 8 July 2019 14:01:47 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
That got me thinking about getting her a wireless energy monitor
thing, even if only their current usage, rather than anything that
would indicate the costs etc?


Better would be to put the property onto a standard credit tariff.

Apart from anything else it will save the executor accounting for cash to pay for the top-ups.

NB Bulb is "pay in advance" on credit tariffs too.

Owain

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On Monday, 8 July 2019 14:38:18 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
Better would be to put the property onto a standard credit tariff.

That was one of my thoughts. ~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


Actually no, the key meters are cheaper for the power co to use than the old coin or card payment meters, and they're under pressure to be seen to not exploit vulnerable people. Also, electricity tariffs are now capped, so prepay isn't really any more expensive than most standard variable tariffs.

British Gas standard tariff on direct debit is 18.321p per kWh, 23.523p per day, so you're quite a lot cheaper than that If that's what you're paying on Bulb Prepay. Bulb don't list a prepay tariff on their site. Maybe it's the same as DD.

The drawback is the credit running out when the property is unoccupied (which I assume a probate property is) and the freezer flooding, etc.

The account should also be in the name of The Executor of... rather than your daughter, as it's the estate that's liable, not your daughter.

Owain



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On Mon, 08 Jul 2019 14:38:19 +0100, T i m wrote:

That was one of my thoughts. ~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


I'm on 11.93p/kWhr 11.025p/day with Utility Point. She really needs
to have a preety good idea of her consumption. If it's low it can be
worth looking at the "no standing charge" tariffs (EBICO for one?).
You pay a bit more for the energy but can save a lot on the standing
charge.

--
Cheers
Dave.



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On Mon, 08 Jul 2019 15:09:44 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Mon, 08 Jul 2019 14:38:19 +0100, T i m wrote:

That was one of my thoughts. ~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


I'm on 11.93p/kWhr 11.025p/day with Utility Point. She really needs
to have a preety good idea of her consumption. If it's low it can be
worth looking at the "no standing charge" tariffs (EBICO for one?).
You pay a bit more for the energy but can save a lot on the standing
charge.


Thanks for the feedback Dave, I'll look into it with her.

Cheers, T i m

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wrote in message
...
On Monday, 8 July 2019 14:38:18 UTC+1, T i m wrote:
Better would be to put the property onto a standard credit tariff.

That was one of my thoughts. ~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


Actually no, the key meters are cheaper for the power co to use than the
old coin or card payment meters, and they're under pressure to be seen to
not exploit vulnerable people. Also, electricity tariffs are now capped,
so prepay isn't really any more expensive than most standard variable
tariffs.

British Gas standard tariff on direct debit is 18.321p per kWh, 23.523p
per day, so you're quite a lot cheaper than that If that's what you're
paying on Bulb Prepay. Bulb don't list a prepay tariff on their site.
Maybe it's the same as DD.

The drawback is the credit running out when the property is unoccupied
(which I assume a probate property is) and the freezer flooding, etc.


Why would you leave a freezer in a probate property full of food?

I assure you, it's a real turn off to prospective purchasers

tim



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T i m wrote:

~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


currently paying
Unit rate 12.115p per kWh
Standing charge 11.024p per day
but fix comes to an end in August.



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On Monday, 8 July 2019 17:05:22 UTC+1, tim... wrote:
Why would you leave a freezer in a probate property full of food?


Because you don't have space in your freezer at home and you're eating it slowly?

I assure you, it's a real turn off to prospective purchasers


It's okay as long as the freezer's still running...

Owain


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wrote in message
...
On Monday, 8 July 2019 17:05:22 UTC+1, tim... wrote:
Why would you leave a freezer in a probate property full of food?


Because you don't have space in your freezer at home and you're eating it
slowly?


but if the house is being left empty

who's there to eat it?


I assure you, it's a real turn off to prospective purchasers


It's okay as long as the freezer's still running...


and as long as it obvious to prospective purchasers that it will be emptied

tim



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On Mon, 8 Jul 2019 17:16:02 +0100, Andy Burns
wrote:

T i m wrote:

~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


currently paying
Unit rate 12.115p per kWh
Standing charge 11.024p per day
but fix comes to an end in August.


Thanks for that Andy.

Cheers, T i m
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"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
T i m wrote:

~20p day standing charge and ~13.6p/kWh
is that bad?


currently paying
Unit rate 12.115p per kWh
Standing charge 11.024p per day
but fix comes to an end in August.


more to the point

the opportunity to fix at that prices ended last August (or even the August
before)

Utility prices have increased considerably in the past 12/24 months and any
price available from 12 months ago is not available now (even for the
remaining period of the fix)

Partly because the cap has stopped the companies from using people who don't
switch subsidies those who do

which FTAOD I consider a very good thing

tim


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tim... wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

currently paying
Unit rate 12.115p per kWh
Standing charge 11.024p per day
but fix comes to an end in August.


more to the point
the opportunity to fix at that prices ended last August


Nobody has been cheaper (for me) than UtilityPoint for the past year,
they are now offering a 15 month fix with £60 combined cancellation fees

Unit rate 13.74p per kWh
Standing charge 13.87p per day

or an 18 month fix with no cancellation fees (their default)

Unit rate 13.97p per kWh
Standing charge 13.87p per day

For the extra fiver, I'll probably drop onto the default tariff and see
if anything cheaper comes along ... e.on seems to be edging closer
recently (disregarding outfox as I'd never trust them).

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