Fluorescent lighting
Is there a wiki on how to install fluorescent lighting
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Fluorescent lighting
Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any
to install! Even I managed to install the old type, you just screw them up connect them up and they go! Brian -- ----- -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! "Weatherlawyer" wrote in message ... Is there a wiki on how to install fluorescent lighting |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 02:59:56 UTC, Weatherlawyer wrote:
Is there a wiki on how to install fluorescent lighting Screw the in place, connect the cable up. The only gotcha is don't run the cable over the hot ballast. But why use fluorescent now? It's mostly obsolete. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. -- *Do infants enjoy infancy as much as adults enjoy adultery? * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. -- from KT24 in Surrey, England "I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? the thin fls are very good, but don't perform ok if the room's cold. LEDs have overtaken general purpose T8s in efficacy. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. not significantly. LED tape can be run anywhere, generally giving better illumination. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. RGB LEDs give way more colour temp choice. Whites are more limited. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 15:00:09 UTC, charles wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. I used to spend time somewhere with magnetic ballasted fluorescents on 1930s variac dimmers. It worked. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. LEDs are slightly better than electronic ballast fluorescent lights. Some way better than switch start. Plus instant start. Several colours available. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 15:00:09 UTC, charles wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. And the electric car existed in about 1880. wasn't exactly a tesla or even a prima though. -- from KT24 in Surrey, England "I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle |
Fluorescent lighting
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 16:02:52 UTC, NY wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I waqsnt; sure so looked it up. https://www.etcconnect.com/Support/A...ures-Work.aspx I'd always thought that it was impossible, well I knew it was possible but a bit more difficult than just replacing a light switch with a dimmer switch. and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I had a brief look at how the stage lighting in the school worked in the late 70s, just seemed to be large covered rheostats covered in dust. A selection of coloured filters were in a cardboard box too. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. Yes most of us have evolved since those days, in most cases we have better kit and better ways of doing things now. |
Fluorescent lighting
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
... On Friday, 1 March 2019 16:02:52 UTC, NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I waqsnt; sure so looked it up. https://www.etcconnect.com/Support/A...ures-Work.aspx I'd always thought that it was impossible, well I knew it was possible but a bit more difficult than just replacing a light switch with a dimmer switch. and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I had a brief look at how the stage lighting in the school worked in the late 70s, just seemed to be large covered rheostats covered in dust. I helped with the lighting in the school hall (an older building with a proper proscenium arch, wings and a curtain) and they used huge wire-wound rheostats which were operated with a length of wood to fade many up or down at the same time. There was also a huge circular drum rheostat for dimming the house lights, and we were given strict instructions to make *certain* that the big circular handle was in the fully-anti-clockwise (min) position before turning on or off (to avoid turning them on/off suddenly) and when we started to fade them either way, do it *quickly*, taking no more than about 5 seconds to go from one end to the other (accompanied by a loud screeching of the contact on the wire!) to avoid running the rheostat at part-load for any longer than necessary. Even then, we could see the wire glowing in the dim light of the wings where the lighting board was. The lecture theatre was equipped with lots of theatrical lights, and a nice "new" (at the time) triac dimmer system with tiny sliders for diming the lights, but it was never used for plays because there were no wings (other than exiting through the fire doors either side into the playground) and there was no curtain. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. With old fashioned ballasts, possibly. But high frequency ones have been around for many years now. The light output does go down slightly with age, though. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. Many might prefer to have the colour temperature they want from the off without messing about. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) Dimming florries with electronic ballasts has also been around for many a year. The ones lighting my kitchen worktops - installed some 20 years ago. -- *A bartender is just a pharmacist with a limited inventory. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
charles wrote: Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. Even earlier than that, Charles. Our school hall had them in the 50s. Although not something that would fit in a one gang box. ;-) -- *When it rains, why don't sheep shrink? * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? -- *ONE NICE THING ABOUT EGOTISTS: THEY DON'T TALK ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. -- *Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites? * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
On 01/03/2019 16:30, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 1 March 2019 16:02:52 UTC, NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I waqsnt; sure so looked it up. https://www.etcconnect.com/Support/A...ures-Work.aspx I'd always thought that it was impossible, well I knew it was possible but a bit more difficult than just replacing a light switch with a dimmer switch. It is basically replacing the light switch with a dimmer (suitable for inductive loads), but you also need to add a separate pair of isolated supplies to keep the filaments hot enough to continue operating in thermionic emission mode when the tube current is too low to do it just by itself. This will also enable the tube to strike without a starter. Indeed, I made just such a light as a teenager. Commercially, Transtar was a well known manufacturer of dimming magnetic ballasts (and very high quality non-dimming ballasts). and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. One issue with banks of dimming fluorescents is all the tubes had to be replaced together, otherwise newer and older tubes are significantly different light output, and different makes can be different too. Also, you get colour shift and a significant drop in CRI when dimming fluorescents, as the ratio of light output from the different mercury line changes, which upsets the colour balance from the arc and the phosphor (tend to lose more green and end up with purple from the over balance of red and blue). Nowadays with microcontroller based electronic ballasts, adding dimming is trivial, although it's not done by using triac dimmers. 0-10V, DALI, switch-dim, or photocell to generate constant lux level are common, and many electronic ballasts support multiple of these. Indeed, many electronic ballasts support multiple different tubes that run at different currents, and having identified the tube in use from the electrical characteristics, effectively use the internal dimmer logic to limit the current to the max allowed for the identified tube. -- Andrew |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , charles wrote: Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. Even earlier than that, Charles. Our school hall had them in the 50s. Although not something that would fit in a one gang box. ;-) I can quite believe that, but I first met them in 1961. -- from KT24 in Surrey, England "I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 09:05:08 UTC, Brian Gaff wrote:
Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Even I managed to install the old type, you just screw them up connect them up and they go! Brian -- ----- -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! "Weatherlawyer" wrote in message ... Is there a wiki on how to install fluorescent lighting This may sound like a silly question What? |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? Because that's what the designers of the new lab said we need, you don't think they'll ask us users do you ? I didnlt think we needed auto on lights in teh toilets either, or the taps which use PIR , which means yuo canlt adjust teh water temperature for yourself up or down or the lifts where you have to tell it what floor before you get in it and then wait for the lift that goes to that floor. I wouldn't have spent the thousands on the smart AV lecture tables either. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 14:31:48 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Brian Gaff wrote: Could one ask why you would want to these days, assuming you could find any to install! Is it that far behind LEDs etc in terms of efficiency/life? I've heard they are, but not having testd them myself I can't say. A florry gives a more even illumination than a series of LEDs. That's not really true espeacily over time, the ends of florrys go black and start to flicker and get dimmer with time. With old fashioned ballasts, possibly. But high frequency ones have been around for many years now. The light output does go down slightly with age, though. All I know is the lighting was replaced in the mid 90s. with new florries. All teh electrics of the lab were redone. Also a better selection of colour temperature, etc. Not sure that is true, but it should be difficult for LED tubes to be desined like the phillips hues. Many might prefer to have the colour temperature they want from the off without messing about. And far more don;t get the choice we haven't the choice. When the florries go dim or start flashing we call maintaince (we wait until a few are on the blink) and within the month they come over and change them. We have new LED tubes in our new lab auto on and off, in my office they are also dimmable unlike the florrys in my present office, one of which is just flickering. One in the corridor is flickering and making a noise. It could wake the students up ;-) Dimming florries with electronic ballasts has also been around for many a year. The ones lighting my kitchen worktops - installed some 20 years ago. But we didn't have them installed here, I doubt we considered we had a need for dimmable, I didn't think we needed them, but it;s not like we were asked. All we wanted was better lighting than the 1980s lighting we had. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:03 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. Good for yuo all we have is 2 panels with 8 rocker switches on each to control the lights, not sure I could have replaced those 'rockers' with 16 pots just like that. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 11:31:20 UTC, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:03 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. Good for yuo all we have is 2 panels with 8 rocker switches on each to control the lights, not sure I could have replaced those 'rockers' with 16 pots just like that. If they're the old type that flash during starting, just loosen the starter on a fitting & it doesn't start. Easiest way to dim the room. Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:48:36 UTC, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
On 01/03/2019 16:30, whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 16:02:52 UTC, NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s.. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I waqsnt; sure so looked it up. https://www.etcconnect.com/Support/A...ures-Work.aspx I'd always thought that it was impossible, well I knew it was possible but a bit more difficult than just replacing a light switch with a dimmer switch. It is basically replacing the light switch with a dimmer (suitable for inductive loads), but you also need to add a separate pair of isolated supplies to keep the filaments hot enough to continue operating in thermionic emission mode when the tube current is too low to do it just by itself. This will also enable the tube to strike without a starter. Indeed, I made just such a light as a teenager. I'm not allowed to just replace the lighting in a teaching lab with something I did at home. I also have about 45 double tubes in the lab. Commercially, Transtar was a well known manufacturer of dimming magnetic ballasts (and very high quality non-dimming ballasts). Good for them but I leave that to those designing the spaces in the lab. Just has a academic asking for a 96V or higher PSU I politely laughed. I've been asked to suggest the purchase of some new bench supplies for the lab but I doubt I'll get permission to order ones that got up 96V. I'm not looking at anything about 30V at the moment. and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. One issue with banks of dimming fluorescents is all the tubes had to be replaced together, otherwise newer and older tubes are significantly different light output, and different makes can be different too. Yes we have that problem witout dimmering, 3 faulty in the lab at the moment with 1 or 2 on their last legs. Also, you get colour shift and a significant drop in CRI when dimming fluorescents, as the ratio of light output from the different mercury line changes, which upsets the colour balance from the arc and the phosphor (tend to lose more green and end up with purple from the over balance of red and blue). Makes me think that perhaps LED tubes are better. We did ask for them rather than florries but the cost would have be over £3k so was rejected. Nowadays with microcontroller based electronic ballasts, adding dimming is trivial, although it's not done by using triac dimmers. 0-10V, DALI, switch-dim, or photocell to generate constant lux level are common, and many electronic ballasts support multiple of these. why not use LEDs ? Indeed, many electronic ballasts support multiple different tubes that run at different currents, and having identified the tube in use from the electrical characteristics, effectively use the internal dimmer logic to limit the current to the max allowed for the identified tube. I think that's what our new LED tubes in the new lab do, on walking over to them after a few seconds they come on whether wanted on or not. WHich is going to be fun when they want the light out when using photocells in a lab experiment can't wait to have to explain that one the the 'designers' |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 11:43:43 UTC, wrote:
On Monday, 4 March 2019 11:31:20 UTC, whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:03 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. Good for yuo all we have is 2 panels with 8 rocker switches on each to control the lights, not sure I could have replaced those 'rockers' with 16 pots just like that. If they're the old type that flash during starting, just loosen the starter on a fitting & it doesn't start. Easiest way to dim the room. So I go around with a ladder messing about with upto 20 tube starters not thanks. Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. When the projection system is being used or they want to show slides or whatever I assume. I don't think we asked for dimmable lights. well it wasn't part of the things I wanted in the lab. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? Because that's what the designers of the new lab said we need, you don't think they'll ask us users do you ? I'm really not surprised given your replies to questions on here. ;-) I didnlt think we needed auto on lights in teh toilets either, or the taps which use PIR , which means yuo canlt adjust teh water temperature for yourself up or down or the lifts where you have to tell it what floor before you get in it and then wait for the lift that goes to that floor. I wouldn't have spent the thousands on the smart AV lecture tables either. -- *Never miss a good chance to shut up * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:03 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. Good for yuo all we have is 2 panels with 8 rocker switches on each to control the lights, not sure I could have replaced those 'rockers' with 16 pots just like that. I'm quite sure you couldn't. But this is a DIY group, so many obviously can. -- *A plateau is a high form of flattery* Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
In article ,
wrote: Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. Why? The need to dim lights in a domestic setting easy to understand. But even then why make them more powerful than ever needed? -- *It is wrong to ever split an infinitive * Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 14:18:21 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? Because that's what the designers of the new lab said we need, you don't think they'll ask us users do you ? I'm really not surprised given your replies to questions on here. ;-) Well I was asked my views, but I never said I wanted auto lights I did say we wanted a section of the lab that could be made dark for visual experiments we had this 30 years ago for opto electronics experiments with lasers. I wanted a room where students could work on audio projects doesn't need to be completley soundproof. They ahve partly done that with a bit of sound proofing and an extra thick door. I asked for the lab to be a heated one and have got that with overhead heaters for some reason. I wanted indicidual cupboards for the desks, and got that. We even have temperature readouts and settable to 0.1C (I believe that once I're tried it) We didnlt want the expensive AV desks that are about £5k but apparenty that is the default now. We wanted second monototrs for AV as we have them in the old lab. They said we must have the newer 4K ones. We got to chose the carper and tiles too, the chairs and stools. They tried to get us to buy the expensive chairs that are adjustable at £200+ each we settled for the OK ones of about £45. We even thought about the opening ceromony and I said we should get Maggie Philbin to open it and they think that's a good idea and looking into it. Sometimes they listen to me/us other times they don't. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 14:18:22 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:03 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I'd always thought that it was impossible, and was surprised when the fluorescents in my school lecture theatre could be dimmed. They were probably installed in the early to mid 70s, which gives an idea of what technology was available then. I remember a huge cabinet about the size of a 6-foot high freezer in the projection unit which gave off a hell of a hum as the lights were going from full off to full on, which they did on a timer: the lecturer pressed a button and they dimmed/brightened automatically over the course of about 5 seconds. With the electronic ballasts I have here, all you need to add is a simple pot to dim them. Good for yuo all we have is 2 panels with 8 rocker switches on each to control the lights, not sure I could have replaced those 'rockers' with 16 pots just like that. I'm quite sure you couldn't. But this is a DIY group, so many obviously can. But couldn't. Even our maintance staff aren't allowed to install new instalations. I doubt you could manage it , you can't even tell AC from DC. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 13:03:34 UTC, whisky-dave wrote:
On Monday, 4 March 2019 11:43:43 UTC, tabby wrote: If they're the old type that flash during starting, just loosen the starter on a fitting & it doesn't start. Easiest way to dim the room. So I go around with a ladder messing about with upto 20 tube starters not thanks. if you're stupid enough to do it that way Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. When the projection system is being used or they want to show slides or whatever I assume. I don't think we asked for dimmable lights. well it wasn't part of the things I wanted in the lab. |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 14:18:22 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , tabbypurr wrote: Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. Why? The need to dim lights in a domestic setting easy to understand. But even then why make them more powerful than ever needed? 1. Ignorance. Some installers don't fully know what they're doing. 2. For cleaning some people want extra bright lighting 3. Variations in eyesight & perception cause variations in desired light level. NT |
Fluorescent lighting
On 04/03/2019 11:19, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? Because that's what the designers of the new lab said we need, you don't think they'll ask us users do you ? I didnlt think we needed auto on lights in teh toilets either, or the taps which use PIR , which means yuo canlt adjust teh water temperature for yourself up or down or the lifts where you have to tell it what floor before you get in it and then wait for the lift that goes to that floor. I assume that if several people are waiting to go to different floors they can all press different buttons, so why can't one person press all the buttons that go to all the floors on the way to the one he wants? -- Max Demian |
Fluorescent lighting
On 04/03/2019 14:15, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , wrote: Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. Why? The need to dim lights in a domestic setting easy to understand. Indeed 1min 22 seconds https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r26krlXFmOI And we swapped all candles for LED battery operated ones. I have worked on to many fire damaged houses where the fire was caused by a candle. -- Adam |
Fluorescent lighting
On 04/03/2019 11:47, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:48:36 UTC, Andrew Gabriel wrote: On 01/03/2019 16:30, whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 16:02:52 UTC, NY wrote: "whisky-dave" wrote in message ... Dimmable fluorescent fittings have been around since the early 1960s. Nothing new there. How are fluorescents dimmed? I waqsnt; sure so looked it up. https://www.etcconnect.com/Support/A...ures-Work.aspx I'd always thought that it was impossible, well I knew it was possible but a bit more difficult than just replacing a light switch with a dimmer switch. It is basically replacing the light switch with a dimmer (suitable for inductive loads), but you also need to add a separate pair of isolated supplies to keep the filaments hot enough to continue operating in thermionic emission mode when the tube current is too low to do it just by itself. This will also enable the tube to strike without a starter. Indeed, I made just such a light as a teenager. I'm not allowed to just replace the lighting in a teaching lab with something I did at home. I also have about 45 double tubes in the lab. Commercially, Transtar was a well known manufacturer of dimming magnetic ballasts (and very high quality non-dimming ballasts). Good for them but I leave that to those designing the spaces in the lab. Just has a academic asking for a 96V or higher PSU I politely laughed. I've been asked to suggest the purchase of some new bench supplies for the lab but I doubt I'll get permission to order ones that got up 96V. I'm not looking at anything about 30V at the moment. I remember, aged about 12, doing experiments with a CRT tube during physics. The tube was made with male banana plugs sticking out directly from the glass on each side, so you had to connect up a 3500V supply (IIRC) using reverse stacked banana plugs, still leaving the live pins sticking out on each side - while 3 ft away, the next pupil was doing experiments with water! SteveW |
Fluorescent lighting
On 04/03/2019 14:15, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article , wrote: Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. Why? The need to dim lights in a domestic setting easy to understand. But even then why make them more powerful than ever needed? Very handy to have much brighter than normal lights when working on fiddly objects. I'd love to have multiple fluorescent lights in the living room (best place to fix things in comfort) - but only if they could be completely hidden when normal lighting was in use. SteveW |
Fluorescent lighting
On Monday, 4 March 2019 21:07:36 UTC, Steve Walker wrote:
On 04/03/2019 14:15, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , tabbypurr wrote: Why dim? IME nearly all commercial & school fluorescent installs are heavily overpowered. Why? The need to dim lights in a domestic setting easy to understand. But even then why make them more powerful than ever needed? Very handy to have much brighter than normal lights when working on fiddly objects. I'd love to have multiple fluorescent lights in the living room (best place to fix things in comfort) - but only if they could be completely hidden when normal lighting was in use. SteveW trough fittings NT |
Fluorescent lighting
"Max Demian" wrote in message ... On 04/03/2019 11:19, whisky-dave wrote: On Friday, 1 March 2019 19:35:02 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , whisky-dave wrote: This lab was build in the 1960s last electrical refurbishment was in the mid 90s. But still never seen any dimmable florescant in the dept or uni, there must be a reason. Generally, florries in a lab are working lights. Why would you need to dim them? Because that's what the designers of the new lab said we need, you don't think they'll ask us users do you ? I didnlt think we needed auto on lights in teh toilets either, or the taps which use PIR , which means yuo canlt adjust teh water temperature for yourself up or down or the lifts where you have to tell it what floor before you get in it and then wait for the lift that goes to that floor. I assume that if several people are waiting to go to different floors they can all press different buttons, so why can't one person press all the buttons that go to all the floors on the way to the one he wants? What would be the point of doing that ? |
Lonely Psychotic Senile Ozzie Troll Alert! LOL
On Tue, 5 Mar 2019 11:30:49 +1100, cantankerous trolling senile geezer Rot
Speed blabbered, again: What would be the point of doing that ? Nobody was talking to you, you psychopathic obnoxious senile pest! -- Richard addressing Rot Speed: "**** you're thick/pathetic excuse for a troll." MID: |
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