Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They were invented decades ago.

On 2018-12-29 6:43 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.


no , " we " shouldn't because i don't want one

On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Bill

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

In article ,
Bill Gill writes:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Most commercial microwave ovens are higher power - typically twice
that of a domestic oven (they often use a pair of magnetrons).
We have them in the office kitchen areas (I think they are 2kW).
One problem is that retail food products do not state cooking
times in commercial microwave ovens - we have warnings posted on
the ovens that they are much more powerful. Also, not all food can
be heated faster - often heat conduction is still a critical part
of the process, and the ability of food to conduct heat limits
the power input some food products can absorb without burning
whilst other areas are still cold.

There's no problem with standard socket outlets in most countries.
In Europe and many other countries outside America, standard sockets
are designed to provide 3kW or 3.5kW (depending on country).
Many domestic microwaves in Europe are combination ovens with
convection, fan, and infra-red (grill) heating too, and often
run at 2.5kW when using combination heating (with a 1kW magnetron).
In a domestic environment, combination heating is generally more
useful than simply a more powerful microwave.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

I am not sure what you mean.
Surely the speed of heating depends on the absorption of the energy by what
is inside the machine.
If its not high enough in things that can get hot, like water content, you
can cook it as long as you like with little effect at all.

Brian

--
--
From the sofa of Brian Gaff -

Blind user, so no pictures please!
Today is Yesterdays Tomorrow.
"William Gothberg" wrote in message
news
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They were
invented decades ago.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 13:43:14 -0000, Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson",
"Steven ******","Bruce Farquar", "Fred Johnson, etc.), the pathological
resident idiot and attention whore of all the uk ngs, blathered again:

FLUSH the abnormal sociopathic attention whore's latest idiotic
attention-baiting bull**** unread again

--
about Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL)
trolling:
"He is a well known attention seeking troll and every reply you
make feeds him.
Starts many threads most of which die quick as on the UK groups anyone
with sense Kill filed him ages ago which is why he now cross posts to
the US groups for a new audience.
This thread was unusual in that it derived and continued without him
to a large extent and his silly questioning is an attempt to get
noticed again."
MID:

--
ItsJoanNotJoann addressing Birdbrain Macaw's (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"You're an annoying troll and I'm done with you and your
stupidity."
MID:

--
AndyW addressing Birdbrain:
"Troll or idiot?...
You have been presented with a viewpoint with information, reasoning,
historical cases, citations and references to back it up and wilfully
ignore all going back to your idea which has no supporting information."
MID:

--
Phil Lee adressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are too stupid to be wasting oxygen."
MID:

--
Phil Lee describing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I've never seen such misplaced pride in being a ****ing moronic motorist."
MID:

--
Tony944 addressing Birdbrain Macaw:
"I seen and heard many people but you are on top of list being first class
ass hole jerk. ...You fit under unconditional Idiot and should be put in
mental institution.
MID:

--
Pelican to Birdbrain Macaw:
"Ok. I'm persuaded . You are an idiot."
MID:

--
DerbyDad03 addressing Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"Frigging Idiot. Get the hell out of my thread."
MID:

--
Kerr Mudd-John about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"It's like arguing with a demented frog."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder Esquire about Birdbrain Macaw (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"the **** poor delivery boy with no hot running water, 11 cats and
several parrots living in his hovel."
MID:

--
Rob Morley about Birdbrain:
"He's a perennial idiot"
MID: 20170519215057.56a1f1d4@Mars

--
JoeyDee to Birdbrain
"I apologize for thinking you were a jerk. You're just someone with an IQ
lower than your age, and I accept that as a reason for your comments."
MID: l-september.org

--
Sam Plusnet about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson Sword" LOL):
"He's just desperate to be noticed. Any attention will do, no matter how
negative it may be."
MID:

--
asking Birdbrain:
"What, were you dropped on your head as a child?"
MID:

--
Christie addressing endlessly driveling Birdbrain Macaw (now "James
Wilkinson" LOL):
"What are you resurrecting that old post of mine for? It's from last
month some time. You're like a dog who's just dug up an old bone they
hid in the garden until they were ready to have another go at it."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder's fitting description of Birdbrain Macaw:
"You are a well known fool, a tosser, a pillock, a stupid unemployable
sponging failure who will always live alone and will die alone. You will not
be missed."
MID:

--
Richard to pathetic ****** Hucker:
"You haven't bred?
Only useful thing you've done in your pathetic existence."
MID:

--
about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
""not the sharpest knife in the drawer"'s parents sure made a serious
mistake having him born alive -- A total waste of oxygen, food, space,
and bandwidth."
MID:

--
Mr Pounder exposing sociopathic Birdbrain:
"You will always be a lonely sociopath living in a ******** with no hot
running water with loads of stinking cats and a few parrots."
MID:

--
francis about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"He seems to have a reputation as someone of limited intelligence"
MID:

--
Peter Moylan about Birdbrain (now "James Wilkinson" LOL):
"If people like JWS didn't exist, we would have to find some other way to
explain the concept of "invincible ignorance"."
MID:

--
Lewis about nym-shifting Birdbrain:
"Typical narcissist troll, thinks his **** is so grand he has the right to
try to force it on everyone."
MID:

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 08:23:37 -0600, Bill Gill, another brain damaged,
troll-feeding, senile Yankietard, blathered:


Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Bill

....and troll-feeding senile idiot no.1 appeared to swallow the abnormal
Scottish attention whore's latest idiotic bait, hook, line and sinker again!
tsk

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 +0000, Andy Bennet, another mentally deficient,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, driveled:


High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

....and troll-feeding senile idiot no.2 couldn't resist taking the latest
silly bait set out by the abnormal Scottish ****** and attention whore!
tsk

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:23:37 -0000, Bill Gill wrote:

On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Not a problem in Europe where everything is 240V. Another reason you ought to stop that low voltage crap! Do you seriously have to hard wire all your washing machines, dishwashers, tumble dryers, etc, etc? And what on earth do you do with hoovers?

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating temperature. I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

On 2018-12-29 9:27 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:23:37 -0000, Bill Gill wrote:

On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Not a problem in Europe where everything is 240V.* Another reason you
ought to stop that low voltage crap!* Do you seriously have to hard wire
all your washing machines, dishwashers, tumble dryers, etc, etc?* And
what on earth do you do with hoovers?

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use.* Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea.* More speed is not always better.

It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating
temperature.* I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

don't use microwaves if you don't like them ,
use an oven , i want a fast freeze machine ,
i want to freeze things in 5 minutes

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 15:33:12 -0000, Brainless & Daft, the notorious,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blathered again:

I am not sure what you mean.

Right, but you'll feed him anyway, Brainless & Daft! tsk

On 29/12/2018 16:27, William Gothberg wrote:

It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating
temperature.* I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

Conduction

Bill

So Mr Mouth when will you have this product on the market and how
much will it cost??



"William Gothberg" wrote in message
news ::
: It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating temperature.
I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is pitiful. What's wrong with 2kW?

On 2018-12-29 10:26 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is
pitiful.* What's wrong with 2kW?

too expensive

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:56:26 -0000, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

In article ,
Bill Gill writes:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Most commercial microwave ovens are higher power - typically twice
that of a domestic oven (they often use a pair of magnetrons).
We have them in the office kitchen areas (I think they are 2kW).
One problem is that retail food products do not state cooking
times in commercial microwave ovens - we have warnings posted on
the ovens that they are much more powerful.

Is the average person not able to divide by two?

Also, not all food can
be heated faster - often heat conduction is still a critical part
of the process, and the ability of food to conduct heat limits
the power input some food products can absorb without burning
whilst other areas are still cold.

Then the oven needs to have a more even waveform.

There's no problem with standard socket outlets in most countries.
In Europe and many other countries outside America, standard sockets
are designed to provide 3kW or 3.5kW (depending on country).
Many domestic microwaves in Europe are combination ovens with
convection, fan, and infra-red (grill) heating too, and often
run at 2.5kW when using combination heating (with a 1kW magnetron).
In a domestic environment, combination heating is generally more
useful than simply a more powerful microwave.

Not when I want to heat something in 2 minutes, conventional heating won't even get going in that time.

Most food is very high in water content. Double the microwaves, double the speed the water heats up.


On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 15:33:12 -0000, Brian Gaff wrote:

I am not sure what you mean.
Surely the speed of heating depends on the absorption of the energy by what
is inside the machine.
If its not high enough in things that can get hot, like water content, you
can cook it as long as you like with little effect at all.

Brian

On 2018-12-29 10:32 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:56:26 -0000, Andrew Gabriel
wrote:

In article ,
****Bill Gill writes:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use.* Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea.* More speed is not always better.

Most commercial microwave ovens are higher power - typically twice
that of a domestic oven (they often use a pair of magnetrons).
We have them in the office kitchen areas (I think they are 2kW).
One problem is that retail food products do not state cooking
times in commercial microwave ovens - we have warnings posted on
the ovens that they are much more powerful.

Is the average person not able to divide by two?

Also, not all food can
be heated faster - often heat conduction is still a critical part
of the process, and the ability of food to conduct heat limits
the power input some food products can absorb without burning
whilst other areas are still cold.

Then the oven needs to have a more even waveform.

There's no problem with standard socket outlets in most countries.
In Europe and many other countries outside America, standard sockets
are designed to provide 3kW or 3.5kW (depending on country).
Many domestic microwaves in Europe are combination ovens with
convection, fan, and infra-red (grill) heating too, and often
run at 2.5kW when using combination heating (with a 1kW magnetron).
In a domestic environment, combination heating is generally more
useful than simply a more powerful microwave.

Not when I want to heat something in 2 minutes, conventional heating
won't even get going in that time.


is that what your wife said

"William Gothberg" wrote:

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is pitiful. What's wrong with 2kW?

There are higher rating consumer units, but you have to look for them. I had a
1.2kw range hood type that worked much better than the 900w types. I think
commerical units (i.e. convenience store) can be found that are 1.8kw.

That said, what I find annoying is that the power control for every consumer
microwave I've seen is duty cycle based. That is, so many seconds of full power
followed by so many seconds of no power.

Some foods and defrosting would work much better if the actual power level could
be adjusted. Panasonic claims to make an inverter based design, but I'm not
convinced they actually adjust the outpout power.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:15:05 -0000, Bill Wright wrote:

On 29/12/2018 16:27, William Gothberg wrote:

It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating
temperature. I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

Conduction

Which would be way faster if the water content the microwaves were hitting was heated hotter. Plus, make the microwave waveform more even, and you would need less conduction.

I was just asking WHY. And people have already said that commercial ones are 2kW, so it's entirely possible.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:19:48 -0000, ..shadow, me & my wrote:

So Mr Mouth when will you have this product on the market and how
much will it cost??

"William Gothberg" wrote in message
news ::
: It can take 5 minutes to warm something from frozen to eating temperature.
I see no reason that couldn't be made into 2 minutes.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:29:50 -0000, William Gothberg wrote:

On 2018-12-29 10:26 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is
pitiful. What's wrong with 2kW?

too expensive

You can get a 700W microwave for £30. Surely 2kW would be less than triple that, so under £90.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:34:10 -0000, William Gothberg wrote:

On 2018-12-29 10:32 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:56:26 -0000, Andrew Gabriel
wrote:

In article ,
Bill Gill writes:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Most commercial microwave ovens are higher power - typically twice
that of a domestic oven (they often use a pair of magnetrons).
We have them in the office kitchen areas (I think they are 2kW).
One problem is that retail food products do not state cooking
times in commercial microwave ovens - we have warnings posted on
the ovens that they are much more powerful.

Is the average person not able to divide by two?

Also, not all food can
be heated faster - often heat conduction is still a critical part
of the process, and the ability of food to conduct heat limits
the power input some food products can absorb without burning
whilst other areas are still cold.

Then the oven needs to have a more even waveform.

There's no problem with standard socket outlets in most countries.
In Europe and many other countries outside America, standard sockets
are designed to provide 3kW or 3.5kW (depending on country).
Many domestic microwaves in Europe are combination ovens with
convection, fan, and infra-red (grill) heating too, and often
run at 2.5kW when using combination heating (with a 1kW magnetron).
In a domestic environment, combination heating is generally more
useful than simply a more powerful microwave.

Not when I want to heat something in 2 minutes, conventional heating
won't even get going in that time.

is that what your wife said

I'm not stupid enough to marry.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:34:22 -0000, Arthur Conan Doyle wrote:

"William Gothberg" wrote:

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is pitiful. What's wrong with 2kW?

There are higher rating consumer units, but you have to look for them. I had a
1.2kw range hood type that worked much better than the 900w types. I think
commerical units (i.e. convenience store) can be found that are 1.8kw.

That said, what I find annoying is that the power control for every consumer
microwave I've seen is duty cycle based. That is, so many seconds of full power
followed by so many seconds of no power.

Some foods and defrosting would work much better if the actual power level could
be adjusted. Panasonic claims to make an inverter based design, but I'm not
convinced they actually adjust the outpout power.

I'm unsure how magnetrons work, but what's the big deal with running them at half power? Do they have to be on full power, and also can't be cycled more quickly?

Anyway, I've never used a microwave on anything other than full power - even when defrosting, which for some reason people think you have to select "defrost". Why? It just takes longer. I can defrost food much faster on full power.

Another weird thing my current (Hyundai 800W) microwave does is to switch off the heating completely for the last 15 seconds but continue to run the fan, light, and turntable (if you've selected at least 4 minutes time). So er like why not just remove the food 15 seconds earlier? Which I often do. Funnily enough nothing ever exploded.

On 12/29/2018 11:29 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
On 2018-12-29 10:26 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is
pitiful.* What's wrong with 2kW?

too expensive

1200 watt consumer microwaves are widely available. Check your
Walmart or whatever you have.

Bill

William Gothberg wrote

Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?

We do.

They were invented decades ago.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:57:35 -0000, Bill Gill wrote:

On 12/29/2018 11:34 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 16:56:35 -0000, trader_4 wrote:

On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 11:27:53 AM UTC-5, William Gothberg
wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:23:37 -0000, Bill Gill wrote:

On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Not a problem in Europe where everything is 240V. Another reason you
ought to stop that low voltage crap! Do you seriously have to hard
wire all your washing machines, dishwashers, tumble dryers, etc,
etc? And what on earth do you do with hoovers?

No. Of those only a dishwasher is hardwired, typically. The rest are
plug
and cord, 240V in the case of electric dryers. Works for me.

So you do have sockets where you can plug in 240V 3kW devices, just like
in the UK. So no problem with a more powerful microwave then.
If you don't mind going to the garage/laundry room/etc. to use your
microwave.

In the UK we don't have that problem, my kitchen is full of 13A 240V sockets, just like every other room, it's what I plug my kettle, dishwasher, washing machine, bread maker, etc, etc into. All of which would be utterly useless on a 120V circuit. I thought the USA had 240V sockets in rooms where they're likely to be needed, like the kitchen? And where do you plug in a 2kW hoover? I plug mine in any room I'm hoovering.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 18:00:47 -0000, Bill Gill wrote:

On 12/29/2018 11:29 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
On 2018-12-29 10:26 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is
pitiful. What's wrong with 2kW?

too expensive

1200 watt consumer microwaves are widely available. Check your
Walmart or whatever you have.

1200W isn't much more than the 900W most are.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:37:48 -0000, trader_4 wrote:

On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 9:23:42 AM UTC-5, Bill Gill wrote:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Bill

+1

That about covers it. Not sure how useful more power would be. For example,
last night I was thawing out a tomato sauce in a quart plastic container.
The Panasonic has a defrost mode that uses about 30% power and cycles that.
Even so, after a couple mins you have to check, because the bottom gets
hotter and the plastic can soften or melt. Other things tend to heat unevenly
as well, eg you can have one area starting to spatter, while the other is
lower temp. If you had more power, those issues just become worse.

Only with a small number of things, where you'd just select half power. For example I often put in a large bowl of pasta or veg full of cold water, not covered. That water would easily handle 2kW. ONly packaged food in cheap plastic containers is a problem, and those will already melt in my 800W microwave. I always empty them into a real bowl first.

And for sure the fact that receptacles are 15 or 20 amps limits the practical
upside as well.

13A 240V in the UK, no problem to get 3kW. The USA has those too.

If people had a MW and it trips the breaker when they
use another small appliance, they wouldn't be very happy.

My socket circuit is 30A. More modern houses are 32A. Larger houses have two 32A circuits. At 240V, so enough for about 7kW.

"Bill Gill" wrote in message
...
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Yes, but that's only a problem in the USA and other 110V countrys.

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Any decent microwave fixes that problem already with you being able to
use other than full power for what works better at lower power settings.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:38:04 -0000, Clare Snyder wrote:

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 08:07:42 -0800, Bob F wrote:

On 12/29/2018 6:37 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Saturday, December 29, 2018 at 9:23:42 AM UTC-5, Bill Gill wrote:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use. Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea. More speed is not always better.

Bill

+1

That about covers it. Not sure how useful more power would be. For example,
last night I was thawing out a tomato sauce in a quart plastic container.
The Panasonic has a defrost mode that uses about 30% power and cycles that.


It gets the 30% power by cycling the 100% power on 30% of the time.

(By the way, adjusting the level does not actually change the wattage.
It simply means the microwave will pulse on and off at its fixed wattage
until the desired level is reached.)

https://lifehacker.com/5974788/famil...-cooking-a-joy
That was true of the first generation of Microwaves, but the current
"inverter" driver units actually CAN throttle the power. Inverter
microwaves are much better for defrosting AND cooking.

We've had ours for about 2 years now - replacing our original that we
bought in about 1985.

BIG difference (but the old one would likely still be working by the
time this one dies)

Why is it called an invertor? I thought an invertor was a device to increase the voltage - like running 240V devices off a 12V car battery.

And why on earth would you not want to cook on full power? I've never had a reason to lower the power from the maximum of 800W. I want the meal as soon as possible!

On 2018-12-29 10:43 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:34:10 -0000, William Gothberg wrote:

On 2018-12-29 10:32 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:56:26 -0000, Andrew Gabriel
wrote:

In article ,
*** Bill Gill writes:
On 12/29/2018 7:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.
Higher powered microwaves would require higher powered electric
outlets, probably 220VAC (in the USA).

Also it is questionable whether higher powered ovens would be
practical for use.* Getting warming times down to a couple of
seconds might not be a good idea.* More speed is not always better.

Most commercial microwave ovens are higher power - typically twice
that of a domestic oven (they often use a pair of magnetrons).
We have them in the office kitchen areas (I think they are 2kW).
One problem is that retail food products do not state cooking
times in commercial microwave ovens - we have warnings posted on
the ovens that they are much more powerful.

Is the average person not able to divide by two?

Also, not all food can
be heated faster - often heat conduction is still a critical part
of the process, and the ability of food to conduct heat limits
the power input some food products can absorb without burning
whilst other areas are still cold.

Then the oven needs to have a more even waveform.

There's no problem with standard socket outlets in most countries.
In Europe and many other countries outside America, standard sockets
are designed to provide 3kW or 3.5kW (depending on country).
Many domestic microwaves in Europe are combination ovens with
convection, fan, and infra-red (grill) heating too, and often
run at 2.5kW when using combination heating (with a 1kW magnetron).
In a domestic environment, combination heating is generally more
useful than simply a more powerful microwave.

Not when I want to heat something in 2 minutes, conventional heating
won't even get going in that time.

is that what your wife said

I'm not stupid enough to marry.

yes you are

On 2018-12-29 10:43 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 17:29:50 -0000, William Gothberg wrote:

On 2018-12-29 10:26 a.m., William Gothberg wrote:
On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 14:46:52 -0000, Andy Bennet wrote:

On 29/12/2018 13:43, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW?* They
were invented decades ago.

High power microwaves (1MW) are used in industry in for example ore
extraction/rock pulverizing.
1MW into a cup of water is not pretty, explodes the water contents and
breaks the cup.

I don't need a MW, but the usual 600W to 900W in domestic ovens is
pitiful.* What's wrong with 2kW?

too expensive

You can get a 700W microwave for £30.* Surely 2kW would be less than
triple that, so under £90.

and then re wire the house and when you use it ,
you can watch the hydro disk spin like a top

"William Gothberg" wrote:

Anyway, I've never used a microwave on anything other than full power - even when defrosting, which for some reason people think you have to select "defrost". Why? It just takes longer. I can defrost food much faster on full power.

The idea is not to cook the food as its defrosting. Full power is fine if you
want the end item hot. It's not good if you want something room tempurature or
slightly cooler to use as a part of preparation of something else.

"William Gothberg" wrote:

I thought the USA had 240V sockets in rooms where they're likely to be needed, like the kitchen?

In the US 240v sockets are typically found in the kitchen for use by an electric
range, or in a dedicated laundry room for use by an electric dryer. Sometimes
they can be found in a garage. The interior outlets are typicaly located behind
the appliance - in effect dedicated for that appliance and not intended for
general use.

"William Gothberg" wrote:

Why is it called an invertor?

Typical microwaves use fixed AC power to drive the magnetron. Inverter driven
magnetrons use DC power, which can be variable.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 18:21:45 -0000, Arthur Conan Doyle wrote:

"William Gothberg" wrote:

Anyway, I've never used a microwave on anything other than full power - even when defrosting, which for some reason people think you have to select "defrost". Why? It just takes longer. I can defrost food much faster on full power.

The idea is not to cook the food as its defrosting. Full power is fine if you
want the end item hot. It's not good if you want something room tempurature or
slightly cooler to use as a part of preparation of something else.

Then I just use less cooking time. Full power will defrost to room temperature much faster than that pointless defrost mode. And if you're about to say it won't be even, so what? If it's for part of preparation of something else, it has plenty time to even out.

On Sat, 29 Dec 2018 18:25:05 -0000, Arthur Conan Doyle wrote:

"William Gothberg" wrote:

I thought the USA had 240V sockets in rooms where they're likely to be needed, like the kitchen?

In the US 240v sockets are typically found in the kitchen for use by an electric
range, or in a dedicated laundry room for use by an electric dryer. Sometimes
they can be found in a garage. The interior outlets are typicaly located behind
the appliance - in effect dedicated for that appliance and not intended for
general use.

I'd find that severely limiting. 2kW hoover, 2kW kettle, breadmaker, toaster, etc, etc.

On 12/29/2018 06:43 AM, William Gothberg wrote:
Shouldn't we have faster microwaves by now giving out a few kW? They
were invented decades ago.

I worked for a company around 1970 that developed a few high power
microwaves that were placed in area restaurants. The idea, now
completely familiar, was the restaurant could prepare quantities of
food, freeze them, and thaw on demand. Other companies had similar
industrial ovens.

The core business of the company was industrial plastics preheaters
which functioned at around 100 MHz rather than microwave frequencies.
They completely missed the consumer microwave market that was to grow in
the later '70s.

We always had a couple of the smaller preheaters hanging around
engineering. They did wonders for stale donuts. Even the factory workers
in the molding plants caught on. 'I bet if that thing can heat a
phenolic biscuit to 300 degrees it would work on my sandwich.' We didn't
explicitly mention it when installing new equipment other than vague
cautions about not putting aluminum foil in the cavity. The larger
models were 15 KW and could generate some Tesla quality fireworks.

As the various RF technologies like heat sealers made it to the
workplace a whole folklore grew up. Working around them could either
make you sterile or incredibly fertile, take your pick.

The technology has been around for over 50 years. What you find at Tesco
is what sells.