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On 18/06/18 17:38, Martin wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 16:35:18 +0100, Richard
wrote:

On 18/06/18 11:47, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 20:20:32 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
wrote:

On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 20:16:57 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

Fredxx wrote:
On 17/06/2018 19:56, Another Dave wrote:
On 17/06/18 15:42, DerbyBorn wrote:
Sometimes one sees ideas when on holiday and it makes you wonder why
the idea is not more commonplace. An obvious one to me has been
count-down displays on Traffic Lights (and/or the Pedestrian Light)

An idea I just saw in Italy was Pre-cast Curb Stones with a tongue
and groove a the end so they interlocked. Must make installation
easier.

In France they have stretches of motorway (10 to 20kms) where lorries
are not allowed to overtake each other. I think the police must take
offenders aside and shoot them because you don't get lorries passing
at the glacial pace the do here.

The 'glacial pace' is hardly the lorry drivers' fault, it's simply down
to the speed governor on the lorry.

So why overtake in the first place ?

A question I have asked myself over and over again :-)


Stop asking if you couldn't be bothered to reply then.


I did reply.


Well then, you couldn't have been satisfied with the answer.
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On 18/06/2018 13:52, tim... wrote:


"alan_m" wrote in message
...
On 17/06/2018 15:42, DerbyBorn wrote:
Sometimes one sees ideas when on holiday and it makes you wonder why the
idea is not more commonplace. An obvious one to me has been count-down
displays on Traffic Lights (and/or the Pedestrian Light)


Possibly with the consequence that people will jump the lights in a
car before going green and hit the car jumping the lights after red.


I don't think they put them in the driver's view, only pedestrians


In full view in Havana and in Ecuador several years ago.

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"Martin" wrote in message
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On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 07:48:55 +0100, "Brian Gaff"

wrote:

Who invented armadillos for lane segregation of a cycle lane? These look
apparently like bits of car tyre raised up through the road surface
designed not to damage vehicles.


The Dutch use large brick things that are placed every two metres along
the edge
of the cycle lane.


Must be great for the tyres if you run into one accidentally, say
when someone else does something stupid.

They also have raised lines instead of just white lines
marking the lanes on roundabouts. They make drivers take the right route
through
the roundabouts.



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"charles" wrote in message
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In article , Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article , Jethro_uk
wrote:
A while ago now (so not "new") on holiday in Cornwall, I noticed the
St. Austell ASDA had a clever car park design whereby the blue badge
spaces - despite being at the front of the store - could only be
accessed after driving through the entire car park.


That does sound a good idea.


It was telling that a chat with the security guard revealed they were
never abused (i.e. had cars with no BB parking). Which suggests most BB
abuse is because some people are lazy ****s.


The supermarket I use most has very easy parking mid week. But never
ceases to amaze me how many spend ages slotting into a space close to the
entrance. Back and forth. Rather than drive a few extra yards and drive
straight into a space. Must be some sort of competition they want to win.


Suits me, though. Having had cars damaged by having doors opened onto
them. Leaves the far end of the park nice and clear.


Because its an easy place to park and no restrictions other than a time
limit, it often gets used by van drivers on a break.


Our nearest Sainsbury has put a height barrier to stop vans doingb this.

Why do they always leave their engine running? Even on a day when neither
heating or cooling is needed? And why do so many husbands waiting for the
wife do the same?


so they can listen to the radio?


Don’t need to have the engine running to listen to the radio.

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On 18/06/2018 10:41, Tim+ wrote:
Chris Green wrote:
Fredxx wrote:
On 17/06/2018 19:56, Another Dave wrote:
On 17/06/18 15:42, DerbyBorn wrote:
Sometimes one sees ideas when on holiday and it makes you wonder why the
idea is not more commonplace. An obvious one to me has been count-down
displays on Traffic Lights (and/or the Pedestrian Light)

An idea I just saw in Italy was Pre-cast Curb Stones with a tongue and
groove a the end so they interlocked. Must make installation easier.

In France they have stretches of motorway (10 to 20kms) where lorries
are not allowed to overtake each other. I think the police must take
offenders aside and shoot them because you don't get lorries passing at
the glacial pace the do here.

The 'glacial pace' is hardly the lorry drivers' fault, it's simply
down to the speed governor on the lorry.


Its the €śglacial pace of overtaking€ť rather than absolute speed thats the
problem. Two lorries overtaking on a dual carriageway can form a rolling
roadblock that can last for miles if theyre really pig-headed.


Yes, I once had a pair like that on an otherwise empty road at 04:30,
for 8.5 miles!

SteveW


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On 18/06/18 21:23, pamela wrote:
On 18:44 18 Jun 2018, Richard wrote:

On 18/06/18 17:38, Martin wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 16:35:18 +0100, Richard
wrote:

On 18/06/18 11:47, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 20:20:32 -0000 (UTC), Jethro_uk
wrote:

On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 20:16:57 +0100, Chris Green wrote:

Fredxx wrote:
On 17/06/2018 19:56, Another Dave wrote:
On 17/06/18 15:42, DerbyBorn wrote:
Sometimes one sees ideas when on holiday and it makes you
wonder why the idea is not more commonplace. An obvious
one to me has been count-down displays on Traffic Lights
(and/or the Pedestrian Light)

An idea I just saw in Italy was Pre-cast Curb Stones with
a tongue and groove a the end so they interlocked. Must
make installation easier.

In France they have stretches of motorway (10 to 20kms)
where lorries are not allowed to overtake each other. I
think the police must take offenders aside and shoot them
because you don't get lorries passing at the glacial pace
the do here.

The 'glacial pace' is hardly the lorry drivers' fault, it's
simply down to the speed governor on the lorry.

So why overtake in the first place ?

A question I have asked myself over and over again :-)

Stop asking if you couldn't be bothered to reply then.

I did reply.


Well then, you couldn't have been satisfied with the answer.


Are you okay?


Yes thanks.

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On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.


You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.

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In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.


You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.


Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early would be
jumping the green.

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On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 14:12:29 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.

You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.


Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early would be
jumping the green.


Then what does "jumping" mean in this context, I thought about jumping the amber but that made me think of amber rud but then I'd prefer jumping her to the next thought which was orange and jumping D. Trump.
and what does jumping jack flash represent. :-0



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"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 14:12:29 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:


In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.

You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these
days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.


Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early would
be
jumping the green.


Then what does "jumping" mean in this context,


Moving forward before the light actually goes green.

reams of your silly **** flushed where it belongs




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On 17/06/2018 20:16, Chris Green wrote:
The 'glacial pace' is hardly the lorry drivers' fault, it's simply
down to the speed governor on the lorry.


It's their fault.

If they are driving at 56, and they catch a guy driving at 55.5 they
ought to slow down a tad and sit behind him, not pull out and stop
everyone else.

But that would show common sense and courtesy.

Andy
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On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 19:40:21 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 14:12:29 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.

You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these
days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.

Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early would
be
jumping the green.


Then what does "jumping" mean in this context,


Moving forward before the light actually goes green.


Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.


reams of your silly **** flushed where it belongs


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In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.


The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.

Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.

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"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 19:40:21 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 14:12:29 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.

You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these
days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.

Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early
would
be
jumping the green.

Then what does "jumping" mean in this context,


Moving forward before the light actually goes green.


Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw


Wrong, as always.

which indicated proceed with caution which you
are leagly able to do BEFORE the light goes green


Wrong, as always.

reams of your silly **** flushed where it belongs


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"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Then what does "jumping" mean in this context,

Moving forward before the light actually goes green.


Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw


Wrong, as always.


No, he's right: immediately before a green light there is a red+amber phase
for most lights, and before that is a red phase. Pedestrian lights are an
exception: I *think* the red light goes out, displaying no lights for a
brief interval, then the amber light alone appears as the beginning of the
flashing amber phase that precedes green.

which indicated proceed with caution which you
are leagly able to do BEFORE the light goes green


Wrong, as always.


Yes, as I understand the Highway Code, *any* light or light combination
other than red means STOP or DO NOT START. The reason that the amber phase
(stop if possible and not too close to stop in the remaining distance) is
present is to give ample warning that the red light is about to appear, so
that red can mean "stop - with no excuses about being too close to stop in
time because you've been warned".

I sometimes stop a couple of yards short of the stop line, and when the
lights turn red+amber, I start moving, judging it so I will reach the line
just as the lights turn green. That's legal: and causes great consternation
if there is a fast sports car alongside, where the lights have two lanes,
because a low-powered car, already moving at 5 mph as it passes the stop
line, can out-accelerate a powerful car that is starting from rest at the
line.



How about this situation https://goo.gl/maps/H6F3ndyoji62 which I
encountered the other day: a side road which is right next to traffic lights
(to enforce single-alternate traffic on a narrow [1] bridge). I wanted to
turn right. The only view I had of lights was obliquely, looking at the
light intended for traffic coming from my left. I stopped, checked the
lights and for oncoming traffic in either direction. Since the lights were
green and there was no traffic coming from the left, I pulled out. After I'd
started moving, the lights went amber.

Should I have continued, passing the lights at amber although I could stop
in time because I was moving slowly; or should I have stopped, blocking both
sides of the road because there is insufficient room to straighten the car?

I chose the latter, turning slightly left before hard right, mounting the
kerb slightly and stopping slightly beyond the stop line - so as to
straighten as much as possible in the space available, but still partially
blocking the exit from the bridge. I'd already assessed that the situation
might arise, when I originally turned right into the road earlier on, and
had thought "there is a risk that the lights may change after I've started
moving". I'd already decided that if it happened, I'd try to reverse back
into the side road; in the event, I couldn't do that because there was a car
behind me.

The lights are too close to the side road [2] and have not been designed
with this eventuality in mind: to allow a car that has started to pull out
from the side road when it sees a green light, room to straighten and stop
at the line if the lights change after the car has committed to pulling out.
If they were moved a car-length closer to the bridge, the problem would not
have arisen. https://goo.gl/maps/Ff4Zig9xjWr shows that there is a looong
gap between the junction (St Margaret's Road) and the start of the bridge
parapet, with another driveway in between. https://goo.gl/maps/DUy63rRfQyy
shows that the stop line is roughly level with the right-hand kerb on the
side road.


[1] The bridge looks to have been built to be wide enough for two-way
traffic but subsequently the pavement has been widened and the road
narrowed, presumably to give pedestrians and push-chair/wheelchair users
more room so cars do not pass them so closely.

[2] Though the main road, Stockwell Road, narrows immediately after the side
turning, so moving the lights any closer to the bridge would narrow the exit
for wide vehicles.



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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.


The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.


Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.


as with amber before green you can continue up to the line.

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"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.


The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.


The fact that some people *do* cross the line before the green light shows
that it (physically) can be jumped, even though it must not be. That assumes
that you interpret "jump a green light" as meaning "set off before the green
light appears", subtly different from "jump a red light" which means "set
off after the red light appears and after the green has disappeared".

Of course, all of this discussion does not apply to cyclists, some of whom
don't just go through lights immediately after they have turned amber/red or
before they have turned green but also at *any* stage while the lights are
red, have been for some time and are not likely to turn green any time soon.
Some cyclists seem to think that they are allowed to go through red lights
and then expect other road users (who have a green light) to give way to
them. Or am I being cynical?

I cycle as I drive, obeying all the same rules of stopping at non-green
lights or at zebra crossings with people on. Sadly I appear to be in the
minority.

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In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.


The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.



Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.


as with amber before green you can continue up to the line.


What are you on today?

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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 13:18:18 UTC+1, NY wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.

The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.


The fact that some people *do* cross the line before the green light shows
that it (physically) can be jumped,


NO it can't in the same context of jumping a red light.
if you pass the red light which is beyond the line indicated then it means you have crossed that line while the light is still red which is illegal.
Crossing the same line while the traffic light is green is NOT illegal so I don't see how the term jumped can be used if the term jump is to mean breaking the law.
But then again every single time I jump the lights not caring what colour they decide to be as a pedestrain.



even though it must not be. That assumes
that you interpret "jump a green light" as meaning "set off before the green
light appears",


which I don't.
If I did I'd have to assume that jumping a red light would mean moving before the red light appears which is actually legal and even encouraged isn't it.

subtly different from "jump a red light" which means "set
off after the red light appears and after the green has disappeared".


which is illegal.





Of course, all of this discussion does not apply to cyclists,


Does any law apply to cyclists in their world ?

some of whom
don't just go through lights immediately after they have turned amber/red or
before they have turned green but also at *any* stage while the lights are
red, have been for some time and are not likely to turn green any time soon.
Some cyclists seem to think that they are allowed to go through red lights
and then expect other road users (who have a green light) to give way to
them. Or am I being cynical?


Sounds like you've watched such things.


I cycle as I drive, obeying all the same rules of stopping at non-green
lights or at zebra crossings with people on. Sadly I appear to be in the
minority.


I agree with that.

But what does the word jump mean in this context ?

There's nothing wrong with moving off when the GREEN light is lit and you may also cross the line.
There's nothing wrong with moving off when the AMBER light is lit providing you do so with caution, and you may also cross the line.
The ONLY colour light that may move but NOT cross the line is RED.





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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 13:36:14 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.

The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.



Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.


as with amber before green you can continue up to the line.


What are you on today?


I'm on a chair typical sort of office chair what are you on if yuo see cars jumping over traffic lights ?



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In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 13:36:14 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which
indicated proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do
BEFORE the light goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping
green lights is this some sort of sex thing you aussie do while
the sheep rest.

The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to
move off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.



Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.


as with amber before green you can continue up to the line.


What are you on today?


I'm on a chair typical sort of office chair what are you on if yuo see
cars jumping over traffic lights ?


Didn't realise you were such and expert on cars and driving. Remind us of
what sort of car you own and how many miles you drive a year in towns with
traffic lights.

Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.

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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 14:58:04 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 13:36:14 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which
indicated proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do
BEFORE the light goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping
green lights is this some sort of sex thing you aussie do while
the sheep rest.

The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to
move off when the green light shows.

Hence a green light can not be jumped.


Amber before red means stop - unless unsafe to do so.

as with amber before green you can continue up to the line.

What are you on today?


I'm on a chair typical sort of office chair what are you on if yuo see
cars jumping over traffic lights ?


Didn't realise you were such and expert on cars and driving.


You should have.

Remind us of
what sort of car you own and how many miles you drive a year in towns with
traffic lights.


There's this thing called the higway code maybe you should read it now it has come out in book form rather than the reel of parchment paper you read back in the day.



Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.


We do, our lives depend on them much more.
Pedestrians don't jump traffic light either.


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"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.


We do, our lives depend on them much more.
Pedestrians don't jump traffic light either.


Actually, the majority *do* jump the lights. If the pedestrian "red/green
man" lights show red and there is clearly no traffic coming for a safe
distance, most of us will cross even if though the "man" says stop. I
believe in some countries this is an offence (jaywalking) but not in the UK.

Cyclists try to use the same excuse with road traffic lights - and if there
is clearly nothing coming and it's safe, I can see their point of view in
treating it as a "proceed with caution" (*). The problem is the cyclists
(and I see them every day) who think that a red light only applies to motor
vehicles and that cyclists may go through a red light *even if a car is
coming* and that the car will/should/must give way to the cyclist. Likewise
for zebra crossings where cyclists ride unabated at the crossing and think
that pedestrians will get out of their way - and yes, I have witnessed this
on two occasions, once as a pedestrian and once when overtaken on my bike by
another cyclist while slowing down for the zebra. Both times, pedestrians
had to scuttle out of the way; on one occasion he rode off, on the other he
skidded as he tried to swerve around a pedestrian on the crossing, went
skating across the road on his bum and narrowly escaped going under an
oncoming bus before leaping up and threatening the pedestrian who had "made"
him swerve - a passer-by detained him until the police arrived. It is those
lunatics who give cyclists a bad name.

I'm unusual in obeying all red traffic lights (if I get fed up, I get off
and walk round the lights, crossing a side road as a pedestrian before
remounting on the far side - the only concession that is allowed to
cyclists) and I *never* overtake a vehicle on the side that it is indicating
to turn; if there's someone ahead of me I *wait* (im)patiently rather than
trying to pass it on its blind side, just as I would if I was driving a car.


(*) Though if they are allowed to do it, other vehicles should be allowed to
do so too :-)

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In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
There's this thing called the higway code maybe you should read it now
it has come out in book form rather than the reel of parchment paper you
read back in the day.


Then I'd suggest you read it on the subject of traffic lights. What they
mean rather than what you think they mean.



Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.


We do, our lives depend on them much more.
Pedestrians don't jump traffic light either.


You'd certainly make an excellent witness to an accident. Not.

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On 17/06/2018 20:24, Brian Reay wrote:
(They cope fine with narrow streets etc in France.)


They don't cope with any narrow streets that are also
infested with too many cars and other vehicles.

Do they use them in central Paris ?.
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On 18/06/2018 11:39, Martin wrote:
On Sun, 17 Jun 2018 19:41:13 +0100, ARW wrote:

On 17/06/2018 15:42, DerbyBorn wrote:
Sometimes one sees ideas when on holiday and it makes you wonder why the
idea is not more commonplace. An obvious one to me has been count-down
displays on Traffic Lights (and/or the Pedestrian Light)


Doncaster has them on some pedestrian crossing.

An idea I just saw in Italy was Pre-cast Curb Stones with a tongue and
groove a the end so they interlocked. Must make installation easier.


Just goes to show how lazy the Italians are.


WTF has that got to do with laziness?


Too lazy to lay proper kerb stones set in the floor with concrete..

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On 19/06/2018 12:31, Martin wrote:
On Tue, 19 Jun 2018 04:35:50 +1000, "Jim Ross" wrote:



"Martin" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 07:48:55 +0100, "Brian Gaff"

wrote:

Who invented armadillos for lane segregation of a cycle lane? These look
apparently like bits of car tyre raised up through the road surface
designed not to damage vehicles.

The Dutch use large brick things that are placed every two metres along
the edge
of the cycle lane.


Must be great for the tyres if you run into one accidentally, say
when someone else does something stupid.


Better than running over a cyclist?


Only sex and alcohol are better than running over a cyclist.

It's my third favourite pastime.



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On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 20:39:32 +1000, cantankerous geezer Rot Speed blabbered,
again:

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 19:40:21 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 19 June 2018 14:12:29 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
On Mon, 18 Jun 2018 13:31:15 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
I don't recall noticing any issue with cars jumping the red.

You're very lucky round your way, then. Happens all the time these
days.
Making it even slower for traffic waiting to turn right.


That was a big snip from what I was saying.

Jumping a red means failing to stop when told. Starting off early
would
be
jumping the green.

Then what does "jumping" mean in this context,

Moving forward before the light actually goes green.


Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw


Wrong, as always.


ONLY in your senile "mind", senile cretin!


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MID:


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On 20/06/2018 16:24, NY wrote:

It is those lunatics who give
cyclists a bad name.


And those who ride on crowed pavements.

And those who believe that they don't need lights at night or beleive
that motorists can see the whites of their eyes as the only clue to them
being on the road in hours of darkness.

And those in Lycra organising miles of traveling road blocks on busy
roads, especially in hilly areas of the country. It helps if those
tackling that demanding 2 mile hill climb don't randomly wander across
both lanes or attempt to ride 4 abreast.



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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 16:36:31 UTC+1, NY wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.


We do, our lives depend on them much more.
Pedestrians don't jump traffic light either.


Actually, the majority *do* jump the lights.


What does the word jump mean in this contexted is it lioke the cow jumping over the moon, or more like jump starting your car ?

Because unless you come up with some sort of indication of what the expesion means I can't help you to understand.



If the pedestrian "red/green
man" lights show red and there is clearly no traffic coming for a safe
distance, most of us will cross even if though the "man" says stop. I
believe in some countries this is an offence (jaywalking) but not in the UK.


Correct because in the UK people have the rights not the cars.


Cyclists try to use the same excuse with road traffic lights


cyclists they are a differnt kettle of fish.


- and if there
is clearly nothing coming and it's safe, I can see their point of view in
treating it as a "proceed with caution" (*). The problem is the cyclists
(and I see them every day) who think that a red light only applies to motor
vehicles and that cyclists may go through a red light *even if a car is
coming* and that the car will/should/must give way to the cyclist. Likewise
for zebra crossings where cyclists ride unabated at the crossing and think
that pedestrians will get out of their way - and yes, I have witnessed this
on two occasions, once as a pedestrian and once when overtaken on my bike by
another cyclist while slowing down for the zebra. Both times, pedestrians
had to scuttle out of the way; on one occasion he rode off, on the other he
skidded as he tried to swerve around a pedestrian on the crossing, went
skating across the road on his bum and narrowly escaped going under an
oncoming bus before leaping up and threatening the pedestrian who had "made"
him swerve - a passer-by detained him until the police arrived. It is those
lunatics who give cyclists a bad name.


So do cyclist jump lights and if they do what colours do they choose to jump ?
are they the same colours as motorists jump ?



I'm unusual in obeying all red traffic lights


So what colour lights do you jump just amber and green ?


(if I get fed up, I get off
and walk round the lights, crossing a side road as a pedestrian before
remounting on the far side -


Most cyclist I've seen don't unmount.

the only concession that is allowed to
cyclists) and I *never* overtake a vehicle on the side that it is indicating
to turn; if there's someone ahead of me I *wait* (im)patiently rather than
trying to pass it on its blind side, just as I would if I was driving a car.





(*) Though if they are allowed to do it, other vehicles should be allowed to
do so too :-)


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On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 16:51:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
There's this thing called the higway code maybe you should read it now
it has come out in book form rather than the reel of parchment paper you
read back in the day.


Then I'd suggest you read it on the subject of traffic lights. What they
mean rather than what you think they mean.


I suggest you do tbhey same and show me the section on jumping the lights.

Definition of jump the light
of a vehicle
: to start moving before the traffic light turns green

The car ahead of me jumped the light.




Note:- Being a pedestrian or cyclist doesn't count. Neither understands
traffic lights.


We do, our lives depend on them much more.
Pedestrians don't jump traffic light either.


You'd certainly make an excellent witness to an accident. Not.


Far better than you it seems.

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On 20/06/2018 12:28, NY wrote:


I sometimes stop a couple of yards short of the stop line, and when the
lights turn red+amber, I start moving, judging it so I will reach the
line just as the lights turn green. That's legal: and causes great
consternation if there is a fast sports car alongside, where the lights
have two lanes, because a low-powered car, already moving at 5 mph as it
passes the stop line, can out-accelerate a powerful car that is starting
from rest at the line.


But you run the risk that if you don't pull up to the line that the
sensors embedded in the road may not detect that you are waiting and
give priority to the other directions without turning your light green

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In article ,
alan_m wrote:
On 20/06/2018 16:24, NY wrote:


It is those lunatics who give
cyclists a bad name.


And those who ride on crowed pavements.


And those who believe that they don't need lights at night or beleive
that motorists can see the whites of their eyes as the only clue to them
being on the road in hours of darkness.


And those in Lycra organising miles of traveling road blocks on busy
roads, especially in hilly areas of the country. It helps if those
tackling that demanding 2 mile hill climb don't randomly wander across
both lanes or attempt to ride 4 abreast.


++++1

--
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"alan_m" wrote in message
...
And those in Lycra organising miles of traveling road blocks on busy
roads, especially in hilly areas of the country. It helps if those
tackling that demanding 2 mile hill climb don't randomly wander across
both lanes or attempt to ride 4 abreast.


I live in Yorkshire and we get the Tour de Yorkshire each year. We look
fearfully at the route, to see which routes are going to get blighted by
cyclists for several years afterwards. The problem is not the race itself,
although it is intensely annoying to have to work around the very long road
blocks on the day (*); no, it is the organised cycling club outings
afterwards who ride with no sympathy for motorists who want to get back: two
abreast (with the right hand one as far to the right as possible so as to
block the whole road) and in long groups with no gaps in between which would
allow cars to get past a few at a time and then pull in until it's safe to
go past the next group.

Small groups of a couple of friends are no problem; it's the organised
groups which are the problem. Cyclists have every right to use the roads,
but they need to be sympathetic to vehicles that can go faster than them. In
the same way that cyclists ask cars to pass them wide, we ask them to move
into single file when there are cars wanting to get past, and to break into
smaller groups with plenty of space between then to allow car to leapfrog
them.

I don't agree with the principle of closing roads to allow cycling or
running races, or street parties, to take place, but our lords and masters
have decided that this is acceptable so how can a mere mortal say "I oppose
this"?



(*) In this summer's TdY, one race passed both ends of our road about half
an hour apart, so we had to make sure we either stayed in until at least the
"earlier" end of the road re-opened, or else we had to go out and stay out
before the start of the race.

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"Huge" wrote in message
...
and in particular to the tw*t furiously gesticulating at me to overtake
him in my car on a blind bend because he thinks the isle of Purbeck is
his own private f*cking velodrome."


I've had this: on a narrow single-track road, a lycra cyclist was doing his
best, but generally was doing about 20 mph, slowing to 10 or 5 on hills. But
he never pulled into any of the numerous farm gateways to let me past. There
were straight sections, but he rode in the middle of the road on those.
Whenever we came to a bend, he moved slightly left and beckoned me to
overtake; there was just about room to squeeze by, but it would have been
tight - and of course I'd no idea what might be coming round the bend. On
one occasion he furiously waved me on, annoyed that I wasn't overtaking, and
a couple of seconds later a lorry came round the bend towards us. *That's*
why I wasn't overtaking on the bends :-)

They're in their own little world, unaware of the needs of other road users.
When I go out cycling, I try to keep as far left as I can (without riding in
the verge where it's bumpy) to make it as easy as possible for vehicles to
get past, and if I hear a car behind me on a single-track road I speed up as
much as possible to get quickly to the next farm gateway where I can pull
off for a second - which gives me a rest as well! And I also signal that I'm
going to do it, so the car knows that I'm aware and will get out of his way
as soon as possible,

Single track roads are a nuisance, whatever you're driving. In a car, you
get people who pull into a space on the wrong side of the road, instead of
stopping in the road just before the space until I've got there, letting me
into the space so they can proceed and I can pull out again. Or you get
those who stop and pull over, but from such a long way off, and without
flashing you, that you don't realise they've stopped so you pull over,
thinking that they are still coming - leading to the "after you" / "no,
after you" time-wasting. If I meet a car on a single track road, and it's
still some distance away, and I can see a pulling in spot close ahead, I
indicate left and then flash him when I'm safely off the road - this
*communicates* to him, rather than letting him guess "is he? / isn't he?"

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On Wed, 20 Jun 2018 13:18:17 +0100, "NY" wrote:

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 11:10:24 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Before they go green, either yellow or amber is shonw which indicated
proceed with caution which you are leagly able to do BEFORE the light
goes green so WTF are you talking about jumping green lights is this
some sort of sex thing you aussie do while the sheep rest.

The amber before green does not mean move off. It means prepare to move
off when the green light shows.


Hence a green light can not be jumped.


The fact that some people *do* cross the line before the green light shows
that it (physically) can be jumped, even though it must not be. That assumes
that you interpret "jump a green light" as meaning "set off before the green
light appears", subtly different from "jump a red light" which means "set
off after the red light appears and after the green has disappeared".


To clarify I first saw the system in use in Indonesia. The norm was
for drivers and motorcyclists in particular to start to edge across
the red light to get the best "getaway" once green showed. Of course
this led to some mingly with the cross-traffic who had not yet had
their red light or were jumping it.

The introduction of the timer seemed to stop the edging forward in
anticipation as there was no anticipation - there was a
straightforward countdown which appeared to be obeyed and there was a
"Grand Prix" start when zero was reached.

I presume knowing that this was going to happen cut down the red light
jumpers from the other direction.

It's all psychological and there's no reason that drivers couldn't
start edging at 3 or 2 or 1 but they didn't, they waited till zero.

This was a couple of years ago and it will be interesting to see if
there's any change when I go back there next year.


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In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Actually, the majority *do* jump the lights.


What does the word jump mean in this contexted is it lioke the cow
jumping over the moon, or more like jump starting your car ?


Because unless you come up with some sort of indication of what the
expesion means I can't help you to understand.


Given you've already pontificated on jumping the lights, I assumed you
understood what it meant. Silly me.

--
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On 21/06/2018 10:22, whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 20 June 2018 16:51:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
There's this thing called the higway code maybe you should read it now
it has come out in book form rather than the reel of parchment paper you
read back in the day.


Then I'd suggest you read it on the subject of traffic lights. What they
mean rather than what you think they mean.


I suggest you do tbhey same and show me the section on jumping the lights.

Definition of jump the light
of a vehicle
: to start moving before the traffic light turns green

The car ahead of me jumped the light.


Isn't the point that this is only practicable in countries with four
phase traffic signals?

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