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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#41
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
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#42
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"michael adams" Wrote in message:
"jim" k wrote in message ... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. michael adams ... Read the thread. I have. Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted. So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? michael adams ... Read it again you dullard! -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#43
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"michael adams" Wrote in message:
"jim" k wrote in message ... Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did. That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl. The water flows down the back of the bowl from the rim depositing tiny amounts of limescale as it does so which build up over time. For you perhaps. Good to know you clean your own ****ter now & again. Or do you just watch the Polish maid do it? -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#44
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
Fredxxx Wrote in message:
On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote: "jim" k wrote in message ... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. michael adams ... Read the thread. I have. Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted. So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? I think he's forgotten? I think you're being lazy. -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#45
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"michael adams" Wrote in message:
"jim" k wrote in message .. . "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message ... Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did. That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl. The water flows down the back of the bowl from the rim depositing tiny amounts of limescale as it does so which build up over time. For you perhaps. Not just for me. Not for me :-) Why did you snip the second paragraph I wonder ? Questions questions I thought your solution to this problem, something which will dissolve limescale overnight with no need for scraping covered all typical situations. Not only your own where apparently you only get limescale under the waterline. Your thoughts are a large part of your confusion. If only you'd stuck to the septic tank end of this discussion you might have stood a better chance but you allowed me to side track you into a discussion of acids and toilet bowls which are clearly your weak points. Are they your strong points? So much so that you're now feigning amnesia and a highly untypical pattern of limescale deposits around your bowl Where do I "feign amnesia"? You need to clean your ****ter more often -sack the Polish maid! Do you live in a hard water area? I only ask as you already admitted you've never had a septic tank & know nothing about them yet still *felt* qualified to profer & defend your own advice to others.... Gotcha! Now you are claiming you have expertise about limescale deposits in toilet bowls...what a life you you've led of is it just more bull****? :-D I suppose I should also ask if you actually use a toilet :-D PS Have you read the thread yet and answered your other question you keep (somewhat desperately) bleating about? Chin chin -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#46
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"michael adams" Wrote in message:
wrote in message ... On Thursday, 25 May 2017 20:47:05 UTC+1, michael adams wrote: Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, That's so dumb it warrants a repost just for the sake of it. I know that you're still bitter about my showing that you totally contradicted yourself in the pump action screwdriver thread*, but you really shouldn't allow that bitterness to affect your judgement. Had you actually taken the trouble to read the thread before ooh pots & kettles! Roflmao :-D -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#47
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
Fredxxx Wrote in message:
On 25/05/2017 23:40, jim wrote: Fredxxx Wrote in message: On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote: "jim" k wrote in message ... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. michael adams ... Read the thread. I have. Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted. So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? I think he's forgotten? I think you're being lazy. No, just illustrating the onset of dementia. Sorry to hear that old boy. H A V E Y O U R E A D T H E T H R E A D Y E T ? Hope that assists you :-) -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ |
#48
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On Friday, 26 May 2017 00:25:59 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote:
On 25/05/2017 23:49, tabbypurr wrote: On Thursday, 25 May 2017 23:04:19 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote: Can you still get ammonia? yep. eBay and the like certainly, but I haven't seen it supermarkets like you used to. Where did you have in mind? ebay, amazon etc. NT |
#49
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"jim" k wrote in message o.uk... I only ask as you already admitted you've never had a septic tank & know nothing about them Where did I say that ? There's plenty of information about septic tanks on the net. All of which contradict your advice. A contributor to this very thread suggested that the OP should neutralise the acid by adding sodium carbonate or bicarbonate before flushing it away. Something you clearly consider totally uneccsssary. yet still *felt* qualified to profer & defend your own advice to others.... Gotcha! Whereas your "advice" is based on the following statement "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid or bleach seems a trifle ott." Now I know you're categorically refusing to identify the acid you were referring to. But just out of interest can you fill in the missing word - the one with the ****,s in the following sentence ? Just because a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, that doesn't necessarily mean that it actually c******s 2.5k litres or anything like it, at any one time. So that basically the OPs septic tank could be almost empty, for all you know. and yet despite this you're advising him to flush five bog loads of non neutralised dilute acid into it. It's at this point I suppose that you're also going to claims you've got no limescale around the inside of your rim, so that theres nothing there for this acid of yourse to dissolve overnight, either. michael adams .... |
#50
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 23:04, Fredxxx wrote:
On 25/05/2017 10:12, newshound wrote: On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote: wrote in message ... Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the water in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this is thought necessary. michael adams A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier. If using brick acid, neutralise with washing soda or ammonia first. Can you still get ammonia? Yep. (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Home-Care-A.../dp/B0041WCVXM) And brick acid (https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bond-Brick-.../dp/B004SGIA54) And caustic soda crystals ( https://www.amazon.co.uk/NCS-Caustic...DE84SFEQB908FM ) In short everything you need for bog and drain cleaning exists And if you want sodium Chlorate weedkiller, just boil up this lot https://www.amazon.co.uk/d/Pools-Hot...K60BCYYP09K5N4 and it will turn into sodium chlorate solution and salt. Do this outside though. -- It is hard to imagine a more stupid decision or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong. Thomas Sowell |
#51
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 22:38, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. If you remember, I originally suggested that the application of chemicals only softened the limescale and it would still be necessary to remove some of it manually. You were of course completely wrong. As usual You objected to this and said no. It was possible to dissolve it all. This is correct, though mechanical disturbance of the broken up surface speeds the process Now please explain how you intend to dissolve the limescale on the back of the bowl all the way down from the rim, such that no scraping of any kind will be necessary, without filling the bowl to the rim. Oh dear. That's precisely what the gel formulations of surfactants and acids are there to do. They cling to the bowl. Of course blowing up a balloon inside the U-bend will allow you to fill up the rim fairly easily...as will putting acid in the cistern: after all if the scale arrived in the cistern water, so too will its demise.. HOWEVER the original question was about limescale below the surface of the normal water level. Just use a plunger to empty the bog, then fill it up with brick acid, and leave it for an hour or two agitating occasionally to ensure dispersal of the calcium chloride. Then flush, hold the ballcock up, and tip the rest of the acid stuff into the cistern. That will give a power flush next time you do it. For normal maintenance simply spraying limescale remover under the rim every week or so will keep it all in check michael adams -- "What do you think about Gay Marriage?" "I don't." "Don't what?" "Think about Gay Marriage." |
#52
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 22:45, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? well any of sulphuric (battery acid) hydrochloric (brick acid) phosphoric (coca cola) acetic (vinegar) formic (often used in de scalers) sulphamic, muriatic etc will do. In fact I cant think of an acid that wont. LSD perhaps wont. It will just make the lime scale more interesting. If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. This is of course correct as anyone who has tipped brick acid on limestone will tell you. 2HCl + CaCO3- H2O + CaCl2 + CO2. CaCl2, calcium chloride, is soluble in water and the reaction produces water. So that diffuses away. The problem is rate of diffusion: at the acid-limescale interface the acid concentration falls especially with low acid concentrations where the fizz factor doesn't stir things up too good That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. Ah, the mandatory ad hominem. michael adams ... -- "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift. |
#53
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 23:09, Fredxxx wrote:
On 25/05/2017 23:00, jim wrote: "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. michael adams ... Read the thread. It would be so much easier if you just named the acid you were suggesting. Any acid works. Provide that when it changes ions with the carbonate, the resulting calcium salt is soluble. Calcium Chloride: Soluble (brick acid) Calcium sulphate: Not so great, but better than carbonate (batrtery acid) Calcium acetate: Soluble (vinegar) Calcium phosphate: Reasonably soluble (coca cola) Calcium formate: reasonably soluble (formic aciud: used in some descalers) In general the best acid is hydrochloric - its powerful cheap and available, but it can when reacting with other household chemicals give off chlorine, which is why sulphamic acid is more common for the Numpty market. -- Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not. Ayn Rand. |
#54
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 23:14, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message ... Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did. That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl. No. it isn't. 99% of all staining is where water collects and deposits calcium carbonate. That is under the usual water level. The water flows down the back of the bowl from the rim depositing tiny amounts of limescale as it does so which build up over time. Not half as fast as the water collected in the bowl does. I thought your solution to this problem, something which will dissolve limescale overnight with no need for scraping covered all typical situations. It does. The problem with the bowl cleaning (and under rim cleaning) is getting the acid to stick. That's where gel preparations do better than Hcl. Not only your own where apparently you only get limescale under the waterline. michael adams ... -- Jim K ----Android NewsGroup Reader---- http://usenet.sinaapp.com/ -- To ban Christmas, simply give turkeys the vote. |
#55
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 25/05/17 23:48, michael adams wrote:
"Fredxxx" wrote in message news On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote: "jim" k wrote in message ... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... "michael adams" Wrote in message: "jim" k wrote in message o.uk... Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into the septic tank. Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier ways than you apparently can. I never said use hydrochloric acid did you? You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell. Your first reference "Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of occasional litres of dilute acid" "Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts." I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any? Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear *I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who did? So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was necessary. That's assuming that you or the other members of your household do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least once a day, of course. michael adams ... Read the thread. I have. Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted. So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable of dissolving limescale overnight ? I think he's forgotten? He should have stuck with the septic tanks and not allowed himself to get sidetracked into a discussion of toilet bowls and acid which are clearly his weaker points. michael adams You should have stuck with the septic tanks and not allowed yourself to get sidetracked into a discussion of toilet bowls and acid which are clearly your weaker points. -- "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift. |
#56
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 00:25, Fredxxx wrote:
On 25/05/2017 23:49, wrote: On Thursday, 25 May 2017 23:04:19 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote: Can you still get ammonia? yep. eBay and the like certainly, but I haven't seen it supermarkets like you used to. Where did you have in mind? I have. Tucked away in IIRC waitrose -- "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift. |
#57
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 11:26, michael adams wrote:
Just because a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, that doesn't necessarily mean that it actually c******s 2.5k litres or anything like it, at any one time. my god, your supreme ignorance is on display once more If, by septic tank, you simply mean a bloody great tank full of **** that does no treatment whatsoever, then of course you are right, because it has no outflow and must be emptied - generally every monthh or two - by a truck and a pump. Of course since there are no bugs to kill you can sling what you like in it. OTOH if you are talking about a private sewage treatment plant with settlement tanks that use the actual bacteria to digest the **** into acceptable fertiliser and purify the water that is then discharged on a continuous basis, then of course they are ALWAYS FULL of water. I can see now why you didn't stick with the septic tanks and sidetracked the thread into discussion of toilet bowls and acids. Sadly you turned out to be just as ignorant on these matters. -- "When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him." Jonathan Swift. |
#58
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/2017 13:47, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 26/05/17 00:25, Fredxxx wrote: On 25/05/2017 23:49, wrote: On Thursday, 25 May 2017 23:04:19 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote: Can you still get ammonia? yep. eBay and the like certainly, but I haven't seen it supermarkets like you used to. Where did you have in mind? I have. Tucked away in IIRC waitrose A search on their website failed to find any ammonia: http://www.waitrose.com/shop/HeaderS...ultSearch=G R |
#59
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 14:03, Fredxxx wrote:
On 26/05/2017 13:47, The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 26/05/17 00:25, Fredxxx wrote: On 25/05/2017 23:49, wrote: On Thursday, 25 May 2017 23:04:19 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote: Can you still get ammonia? yep. eBay and the like certainly, but I haven't seen it supermarkets like you used to. Where did you have in mind? I have. Tucked away in IIRC waitrose A search on their website failed to find any ammonia: http://www.waitrose.com/shop/HeaderS...ultSearch=G R yep. It wasn't IIRC sold as ammonia but that's what it was, and I was in store, not on the web site. Simethinbg like EzyKleen or some ******** anyway ammonia is getting to be one of the things like caustic soda that you have to snap up from independent hardware shops or buy on line -- If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State. Joseph Goebbels |
#60
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did. That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl. No. it isn't. 99% of all staining is where water collects and deposits calcium carbonate. That is under the usual water level. Depends on where you aim as well :-) If you are good at peeing close to the rim, more "water" will flow higher up the bowl. Mind you, that is probably a small proportion of the water that flows over the bowl, when compared with the flushing water. My experience is that you get tidemark staining/encrustation at the normal level of water in the U trap, plus random staining/encrustation below the water line. The you get some tear-stain streaking down the side of the bowl at points where most water flows down the side having emerged from the holes in the rim. All of them are very difficult to remove with normal limescale removal solutions which are weak acids such as formic and oxalic. It usually takes a lot of repeated applications, especially if the acid is not mixed with a gel to keep it in contact with vertical surfaces, and usually all it does is to loosen the scale enough that it can be scrubbed off with a cloth, stiff brush or pan scrub (not for food use afterwards!) etc. As a matter of interest, why is HCl called "brick acid"? I've not heard that term before. |
#61
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/2017 14:37, NY wrote:
As a matter of interest, why is HCl called "brick acid"? I've not heard that term before. Cleaning lime/cement off brick? (just a guess based on the picture on my bottle). |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 14:37, NY wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message news Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did. That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl. No. it isn't. 99% of all staining is where water collects and deposits calcium carbonate. That is under the usual water level. Depends on where you aim as well :-) If you are good at peeing close to the rim, more "water" will flow higher up the bowl. Mind you, that is probably a small proportion of the water that flows over the bowl, when compared with the flushing water. My experience is that you get tidemark staining/encrustation at the normal level of water in the U trap, plus random staining/encrustation below the water line. The you get some tear-stain streaking down the side of the bowl at points where most water flows down the side having emerged from the holes in the rim. All of them are very difficult to remove with normal limescale removal solutions which are weak acids such as formic and oxalic. It usually takes a lot of repeated applications, especially if the acid is not mixed with a gel to keep it in contact with vertical surfaces, and usually all it does is to loosen the scale enough that it can be scrubbed off with a cloth, stiff brush or pan scrub (not for food use afterwards!) etc. As a matter of interest, why is HCl called "brick acid"? I've not heard that term before. Because its main (DIY) use is in cleaning mortar/efflorescence off bricks Or grout off paving slabs 'patio acid' -- "I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently. This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and all women" |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
news If, by septic tank, you simply mean a bloody great tank full of **** that does no treatment whatsoever, then of course you are right, because it has no outflow and must be emptied - generally every monthh or two - by a truck and a pump. Of course since there are no bugs to kill you can sling what you like in it. OTOH if you are talking about a private sewage treatment plant with settlement tanks that use the actual bacteria to digest the **** into acceptable fertiliser and purify the water that is then discharged on a continuous basis, then of course they are ALWAYS FULL of water. As far as I am aware, the first is called a cesspit and the second is called a septic tank. My parents have a septic tank (well, the standard arrangement of two enormous round-bottomed flasks in the ground, where one drains into the other) at their holiday cottage. Admittedly it doesn't get as much use as a family house that is lived in all the time, but as far as I know it has never been emptied in the 40 years that they have owned the cottage. The treated outlet flows into the communal rainwater drain that is shared by all the houses in a terrace and eventually flows into a nearby stream. I presume all the other houses' septic tanks do the same. Funny story: when we bought the cottage, it had been badly modernised on the cheap. It had the septic tank but we also found a huge breeze-block lined chamber, with no roof on it (just a huge hole in the ground) in the back garden. There was a T-shaped sewer pipe protruding from the side of one wall in the chamber. It had never been used. We tried to work out why and I did some measurements and concluded that the outlet into the tank was a foot or so *higher* than the downstairs loo. I wonder if the previous owners actually connected up the pipes and tried to use it, only to discover that sewage doesn't flow uphill, and then abandoned it and had the septic tank installed instead. Why is it that owners of septic tanks are warned not to use plungers (only rodding) to clear any blockage? |
#64
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 14:47, NY wrote:
"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message news If, by septic tank, you simply mean a bloody great tank full of **** that does no treatment whatsoever, then of course you are right, because it has no outflow and must be emptied - generally every monthh or two - by a truck and a pump. Of course since there are no bugs to kill you can sling what you like in it. OTOH if you are talking about a private sewage treatment plant with settlement tanks that use the actual bacteria to digest the **** into acceptable fertiliser and purify the water that is then discharged on a continuous basis, then of course they are ALWAYS FULL of water. As far as I am aware, the first is called a cesspit and the second is called a septic tank. That is my understanding also. My parents have a septic tank (well, the standard arrangement of two enormous round-bottomed flasks in the ground, where one drains into the other) at their holiday cottage. Admittedly it doesn't get as much use as a family house that is lived in all the time, but as far as I know it has never been emptied in the 40 years that they have owned the cottage. The treated outlet flows into the communal rainwater drain that is shared by all the houses in a terrace and eventually flows into a nearby stream. I presume all the other houses' septic tanks do the same. Funny story: when we bought the cottage, it had been badly modernised on the cheap. It had the septic tank but we also found a huge breeze-block lined chamber, with no roof on it (just a huge hole in the ground) in the back garden. There was a T-shaped sewer pipe protruding from the side of one wall in the chamber. It had never been used. We tried to work out why and I did some measurements and concluded that the outlet into the tank was a foot or so *higher* than the downstairs loo. I wonder if the previous owners actually connected up the pipes and tried to use it, only to discover that sewage doesn't flow uphill, and then abandoned it and had the septic tank installed instead. Why is it that owners of septic tanks are warned not to use plungers (only rodding) to clear any blockage? No idea. I rodded all mine cos thats all I had -- Canada is all right really, though not for the whole weekend. "Saki" |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 14:49, Huge wrote:
On 2017-05-25, Martin Brown wrote: On 24/05/2017 20:18, wrote: I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper? You can use brick acid - just get it approximately neutral again by adding sodium carbonate or bicarbonate before flushing it away. What you mustn't do is use chlorine bleach - that will kill the bugs. Nonsense. well it does, but only some of them Septic tanks are bloody big and full of water And the Ph soon neutralises and **** is full of new bugs -- Canada is all right really, though not for the whole weekend. "Saki" |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 26/05/17 15:20, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 26/05/17 11:26, michael adams wrote: Just because a decent septic tank worth having probably has a capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, that doesn't necessarily mean that it actually c******s 2.5k litres or anything like it, at any one time. my god, your supreme ignorance is on display once more If, by septic tank, you simply mean a bloody great tank full of **** that does no treatment whatsoever, then of course you are right, because it has no outflow and must be emptied - generally every monthh or two - by a truck and a pump. Of course since there are no bugs to kill you can sling what you like in it. Not really a septic tank, more of a cess pit. OTOH if you are talking about a private sewage treatment plant with settlement tanks that use the actual bacteria to digest the **** into acceptable fertiliser and purify the water that is then discharged on a continuous basis, then of course they are ALWAYS FULL of water. Right, you've just described a septic tank. Sometimes these apparently have two chambers, but I'm not sure why. Mine had THREE. And it was still crap. The replacement Klargester that ensures aerobic breakdown is infinitely superior. The tanks are a crude way of getting better and better settlement of inorganic sediments and such solids as may form. -- The theory of Communism may be summed up in one sentence: Abolish all private property. Karl Marx |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
The Natural Philosopher posted
Just use a plunger to empty the bog, then fill it up with brick acid, and leave it for an hour or two agitating occasionally to ensure dispersal of the calcium chloride. Then flush, hold the ballcock up, and tip the rest of the acid stuff into the cistern. That will give a power flush next time you do it. Is there not a risk that the acid will erode the siphon washer and cause a leak? -- Jack |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On 27/05/17 08:06, Handsome Jack wrote:
The Natural Philosopher posted Just use a plunger to empty the bog, then fill it up with brick acid, and leave it for an hour or two agitating occasionally to ensure dispersal of the calcium chloride. Then flush, hold the ballcock up, and tip the rest of the acid stuff into the cistern. That will give a power flush next time you do it. Is there not a risk that the acid will erode the siphon washer and cause a leak? Yeah, but are you a DIY-er or a snowflakery wuss? -- "When one man dies it's a tragedy. When thousands die it's statistics." Josef Stalin |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
replying to The Natural Philosopher, Guru wrote:
Check out Vulcan, its a German product around for some 40 years in industry. Its NOT magnetic and works for my whole house. I installed it and its brilliant, saw huge improvements with limescale in the toilet pans, shower nozzles and heating as well. Its totally safe to use with septic tanks - no chemicals or descalers ever -- for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...k-1211127-.htm |
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How to de-scale a loo that is connected to a Septic tank?
On Wednesday, 23 May 2018 18:44:05 UTC+1, Guru wrote:
replying to The Natural Philosopher, Guru wrote: Check out Vulcan, its a German product around for some 40 years in industry. Its NOT magnetic and works for my whole house. I installed it and its brilliant, saw huge improvements with limescale in the toilet pans, shower nozzles and heating as well. Its totally safe to use with septic tanks - no chemicals or descalers ever It's the old wire round pipe scam. Despite being magnetic it claims to not be magnetic. NT |
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