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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#201
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Emergence of Re-leavers
Tim Streater posted
In article , Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Handsome Jack wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" posted In article , Handsome Jack wrote: But I thought mass immigration was good for a country's economy, bringing a vibrant and flexible new workforce that invariably contributes more to the public finances than it takes out? You plainly don't understand the difference between EU workers (and others) coming here to work, and those fleeing oppression. What is the difference (as far as benefitting the economy) between an unskilled, penniless Romanian peasant and an unskilled, penniless Syrian peasant? Which type of UK peasant are you? Are you the sort that can take over the work on farms etc currently done by EU workers? If so, join the non existent queue. I haven't followed the broader point you are both arguing, Briefly: Rod summarised EU migration policy as spreading illegal migrants across the EU instead of leaving them all in Greece whose economy can't handle them. I replied by citing some of the claims we've seen in the past year or two, that uncontrolled mass immigration has been beneficial to the UK's economy, so the Greeks should welcome it (I was being ironic). Dave replied by saying (I paraphrase) that it's only Eastern European immigration that's so beneficial, not Syrian refugee immigration. I asked him why, and he gave the above nonsensical reply ("Which type of UK peasant are you?...") but it is certainly the case that a Kent fruit farm I visited 3 or 4 years ago needed migrant workers (Poles in this case, although their origin was not important. These folk move to the UK for the fruit picking season and then return home at the end of it, and there is decent on-site living facilities while they are there. The issue is that this type of manual work requires that you do it regularly, even if fit. Otherwise your muscles can't take it over an extended period, as a British couple, keen to make a go of it, found out when they were hired on this farm for this work. They lasted a week. In fact these workers are not unskilled. You have to know how to pick fruit which is the correct ripeness, and without damaging it then or letting it get bruised in the basket later. And without dislodging other fruit which may or may not be ready for picking. These may not be earth-shattering skills but are nonetheless important. This is just a special case of the standard "We haven't got enough people with skill X to do jobs Y, so we have to import them from abroad" argument. It suffers from the same deficiency as all of them. Namely, importing skilled workers is not the only answer: we can train people who are already here to give them these skills, just as we always used to do before mass immigration began. -- Jack |
#202
Posted to uk.d-i-y
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Emergence of Re-leavers
"Handsome Jack" wrote in message ... Tim Streater posted In article , Dave Plowman (News) wrote: In article , Handsome Jack wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" posted In article , Handsome Jack wrote: But I thought mass immigration was good for a country's economy, bringing a vibrant and flexible new workforce that invariably contributes more to the public finances than it takes out? You plainly don't understand the difference between EU workers (and others) coming here to work, and those fleeing oppression. What is the difference (as far as benefitting the economy) between an unskilled, penniless Romanian peasant and an unskilled, penniless Syrian peasant? Which type of UK peasant are you? Are you the sort that can take over the work on farms etc currently done by EU workers? If so, join the non existent queue. I haven't followed the broader point you are both arguing, Briefly: Rod summarised EU migration policy as spreading illegal migrants across the EU instead of leaving them all in Greece whose economy can't handle them. I replied by citing some of the claims we've seen in the past year or two, that uncontrolled mass immigration has been beneficial to the UK's economy, so the Greeks should welcome it (I was being ironic). Dave replied by saying (I paraphrase) that it's only Eastern European immigration that's so beneficial, not Syrian refugee immigration. I asked him why, and he gave the above nonsensical reply ("Which type of UK peasant are you?...") but it is certainly the case that a Kent fruit farm I visited 3 or 4 years ago needed migrant workers (Poles in this case, although their origin was not important. These folk move to the UK for the fruit picking season and then return home at the end of it, and there is decent on-site living facilities while they are there. The issue is that this type of manual work requires that you do it regularly, even if fit. Otherwise your muscles can't take it over an extended period, as a British couple, keen to make a go of it, found out when they were hired on this farm for this work. They lasted a week. In fact these workers are not unskilled. You have to know how to pick fruit which is the correct ripeness, and without damaging it then or letting it get bruised in the basket later. And without dislodging other fruit which may or may not be ready for picking. These may not be earth-shattering skills but are nonetheless important. This is just a special case of the standard "We haven't got enough people with skill X to do jobs Y, so we have to import them from abroad" argument. It suffers from the same deficiency as all of them. Namely, importing skilled workers is not the only answer: we can train people who are already here to give them these skills, just as we always used to do before mass immigration began. You lot always had mass migration. Vast amounts of it just after the war, plenty between the wars, heaps before WW1 too, most obviously with the Irish. |
#203
Posted to uk.d-i-y
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Emergence of Re-leavers
In article ,
Handsome Jack wrote: Dave replied by saying (I paraphrase) that it's only Eastern European immigration that's so beneficial, not Syrian refugee immigration. I asked him why, and he gave the above nonsensical reply ("Which type of UK peasant are you?...") Should have expected it would go over your head. But then you think every immigrant to the UK is a peasant. -- *I didn't say it was your fault, I said I was blaming you. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
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