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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

I'm taking advantage of the weather to paint my garage doors - long
overdue.

The doors are hung on hinges like these:
http://products.ironcdn.co/570883.jpg
Unfortunately they never got painted when originally fitted and are now
very rusty (surface rust only; they are perfectly intact and strong.

I know that the best way to sort this out would be to remove the doors
altogether and unscrew the hinges, however that's really not practical for
several reasons and isn't happening, So, given that the hinges are
definitely staying on and want painting (black), what's the best way
forward? Hammerite, which says to paint straight on to rusty steel without
brushing first? Or treat the steel with some chemical, and then prime and
paint as usual?

Thanks

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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sat, 23 Jul 2016 16:38:22 +0000 (UTC), Lobster
wrote:

I'm taking advantage of the weather to paint my garage doors - long
overdue.

The doors are hung on hinges like these:
http://products.ironcdn.co/570883.jpg
Unfortunately they never got painted when originally fitted and are now
very rusty (surface rust only; they are perfectly intact and strong.

I know that the best way to sort this out would be to remove the doors
altogether and unscrew the hinges, however that's really not practical for
several reasons and isn't happening, So, given that the hinges are
definitely staying on and want painting (black), what's the best way
forward? Hammerite, which says to paint straight on to rusty steel without
brushing first? Or treat the steel with some chemical, and then prime and
paint as usual?

Thanks


"very rusty" wants brushing whatever you use.

Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly, it can be prmed and painted in the usual fashion. Halfords
used to do a range of treatments for rust, virtually all of them used
phosphoric acid in their makeup and some acted as primer too.

Cars have improved over the years, but Halfords may still stock a few
lines.

Hammerite will do the job also, but "very rusty" means brushing I'm
afraid. If the rust isn't securely affixed to the metal, then the
Hammerite will not be firmly bonded either.

The doors should'nt have to be removed to remove those hinges, just
don't do them all at once.

AB

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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly


Can be bought cheaply on ebay.
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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On 23/07/2016 17:38, Lobster wrote:

Or treat the steel with some chemical, and then prime and
paint as usual?

Thanks


Paint first with Phoshoric acid and leave for 12 hours and then oil
based paint.

http://tinyurl.com/hadsuls

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rust_converter


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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly


Can be bought cheaply on ebay.


Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal


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that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."

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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On 7/23/2016 6:16 PM, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

The doors should'nt have to be removed to remove those hinges, just
don't do them all at once.


It might be cheaper to buy new hinges than to treat the old ones.



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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sunday, 24 July 2016 09:18:09 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly


Can be bought cheaply on ebay.


Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal


But converted loose rust doesn't mysteriously bond itself well to the metal. I last used HCl it removes everything, but you can use phosphoric acid. As said, painting onto the rust won't work, it has to be removed.


NT
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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On 7/24/2016 1:19 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, 24 July 2016 09:18:09 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly

Can be bought cheaply on ebay.


Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal


But converted loose rust doesn't mysteriously bond itself well to the metal. I last used HCl it removes everything, but you can use phosphoric acid. As said, painting onto the rust won't work, it has to be removed.


On a practical issue, can you use this acid when the hinges are attached
to the door?



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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 17:11:25 +0100, GB
wrote:

On 7/24/2016 1:19 PM, wrote:
On Sunday, 24 July 2016 09:18:09 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly

Can be bought cheaply on ebay.

Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal


But converted loose rust doesn't mysteriously bond itself well to the metal. I last used HCl it removes everything, but you can use phosphoric acid. As said, painting onto the rust won't work, it has to be removed.


On a practical issue, can you use this acid when the hinges are attached
to the door?


Well you probably drink the stuff, or should be doing so if your water
authourity hasn't replaced the lead pipework yet.


It makes your fingers black in high concentrations and takes the
enamel off Ones teeth, but wood should survive a brief splash or two.


AB

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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sunday, 24 July 2016 17:11:31 UTC+1, GB wrote:
On 7/24/2016 1:19 PM, tabbypurr wrote:
On Sunday, 24 July 2016 09:18:09 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly

Can be bought cheaply on ebay.

Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal


But converted loose rust doesn't mysteriously bond itself well to the metal. I last used HCl it removes everything, but you can use phosphoric acid. As said, painting onto the rust won't work, it has to be removed.


On a practical issue, can you use this acid when the hinges are attached
to the door?



Since I have HCl, I would use it, it's way better, but be most careful to keep it off the wood. Pickling acid eats almost everything, including teeth & eyeballs.

Often hinge screws can be loosened so the hinge sits a little off the wood - then HCl could be used all over.


NT


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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 13:03:11 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Sunday, 24 July 2016 17:11:31 UTC+1, GB wrote:
On 7/24/2016 1:19 PM, tabbypurr wrote:
On Sunday, 24 July 2016 09:18:09 UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 23/07/16 21:53, ss wrote:
On 23/07/2016 18:16, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
Phosphoric acid will then convert the rust to something paint
friendly

Can be bought cheaply on ebay.

Iron phosphate.

Tough and stable.

"It can be used in steel and metal manufacturing processes. When bonded
to a metal surface, iron phosphate prevents further oxidation of the
metal. Its presence is partially responsible for the corrosion
resistance of the Iron pillar of Delhi.

Iron phosphate coatings are also primarily used as base coatings for
paint in order to increase adhesion to the iron or steel substrate, and
is often used in rustproofing as well. It can also be used for bonding
fabrics, wood, and other materials to these surfaces as well. Iron
phosphate coatings are usually applied as part of a painting or powder
coating process."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron(III)_phosphate

In fact rusty iron/steel that has been phosphated with acid will
probably be more resistant to corrosion than bare metal

But converted loose rust doesn't mysteriously bond itself well to the metal. I last used HCl it removes everything, but you can use phosphoric acid. As said, painting onto the rust won't work, it has to be removed.


On a practical issue, can you use this acid when the hinges are attached
to the door?



Since I have HCl, I would use it, it's way better, but be most careful to keep it off the wood. Pickling acid eats almost everything, including teeth & eyeballs.

Often hinge screws can be loosened so the hinge sits a little off the wood - then HCl could be used all over.


NT

HCL + Iron oxide = ferric chloride. Not nice, still very corrosive.

Posphoric acid + Iron oxide = iron phosphate, stable solid material.

As far as the reaction with bits of me goes, I would prefer phosphoric
any day.

I seem to recollect that Coca Cola was once used for derusting
purposes, no doubt before the company found they could get through the
same number of teeth by reducing the acid levels and upping the sugar.

Might still be worth a try though :-)


AB

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Default Painting rusty garage door hinges in situ

On Sunday, 24 July 2016 22:40:57 UTC+1, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:
On Sun, 24 Jul 2016 13:03:11 -0700 (PDT), tabbypurr wrote:
On Sunday, 24 July 2016 17:11:31 UTC+1, GB wrote:


On a practical issue, can you use this acid when the hinges are attached
to the door?



Since I have HCl, I would use it, it's way better, but be most careful to keep it off the wood. Pickling acid eats almost everything, including teeth & eyeballs.

Often hinge screws can be loosened so the hinge sits a little off the wood - then HCl could be used all over.


HCL + Iron oxide = ferric chloride. Not nice, still very corrosive.


but rinses off

Posphoric acid + Iron oxide = iron phosphate, stable solid material.


there's the problem, it sticks to the workpiece but not that well.

As far as the reaction with bits of me goes, I would prefer phosphoric
any day.


For sure Such is diy.

I seem to recollect that Coca Cola was once used for derusting
purposes, no doubt before the company found they could get through the
same number of teeth by reducing the acid levels and upping the sugar.

Might still be worth a try though :-)


I assume it's too weak by far.


NT
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