My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On 28/11/15 15:41, Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

best solution is to hook PC up to it and use a DVB tuner dongle for TV
and radio over digital terrestrial plus internet radio.

This sort of thing is what a Raspberry pi is good for

Or get internet capable TV..



(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris



--
the biggest threat to humanity comes from socialism, which has utterly
diverted our attention away from what really matters to our existential
survival, to indulging in navel gazing and faux moral investigations
into what the world ought to be, whilst we fail utterly to deal with
what it actually is.

In article , Chris J Dixon
wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can take
inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all three
downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise downloaded
podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has been copied to
MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio tuner, with
something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even internet radio.

Main questions here a

A) Are you happy with the sound of your existing FM tuner? If so, is the
problem:

B) You want to hear stations that aren't on FM?

C) How much concern do you have for audio quality? You mention 'MP3' but
don't mention a bitrate.

D) Live or on demand?

The answers would determine your best course. If you're happy with what you
have, why change? (That is meant as a real question: e.g. do you think
there are other non-FM stations you might like well enough to buy new kit
before you know?)

Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is worth? Are things changing
so fast that anything I buy would risk being obsolete, or of little use,
in a short time.

In terms of sound quality the cutting edge tends to be BBC R3 via the
iplayer. You may find DAB OK, but it does use low bitrates at times, and
may be level compressed when iplayer isn't.

You may also find DAB or Freeview gives you mono at times when iplayer or
FM are stereo. (And if you're in Scotland, Freeview loses some BBC stations
in the late afternoon or evening.)

To avoid 'obsolescence' for iplayer/internet radio you'd need to sort out a
simple computer and DAC/network player. Then download from the iplayer or
use the BBC's web interface. I now use get_iplayer for the bulk of my radio
listening. Listen as and when you want, with good quality.

The advantage of using your own computer is you can update the software,
etc, to keep in step with developments. Buy a closed box for internet
access (or a 'smart TV/radio') and you may be stranded shortly afterwards.
Easier when it works... but then you hit the problem that the makers
'orphan' it because they'd prefer you to buy their new model when there is
a change that stops your existing one working. Caveat Emptor.

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html

In article ,
Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

A very cheap way is to use a FreeView tuner sound only. Usually has all
the stations you can't get on FM. Snag with most is the lack of display to
tell you which station it is on. But you can programme the remote to those
you actually want. And you've probably already got a UHF aerial.

DAB Often needs a decent external aerial to get the best results - and
even then doesn't really offer anything over FreeView. In most areas.

--
*Laugh alone and the world thinks you're an idiot.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 28/11/15 15:41, Chris J Dixon wrote:


I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3


Internet Radio Apps for the Roku?

http://radiotime.com/tv/roku

--
Adrian C

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

A very cheap way is to use a FreeView tuner sound only. Usually has
all
the stations you can't get on FM. Snag with most is the lack of
display to
tell you which station it is on. But you can programme the remote to
those
you actually want. And you've probably already got a UHF aerial.

DAB Often needs a decent external aerial to get the best results -
and
even then doesn't really offer anything over FreeView. In most
areas.

Freeview sound is no good if you want to listen to Classic FM - its in
mono only at low bit rate.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

"Chris J Dixon" wrote in message
...
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3



If you want to listen to Internet radio download Ramaradio and use
that as the source using your PC feed. It has the advantage that it
can handle HD radio - or it did last time I tried (I think.)
TapinRadio is another good listener.

However as others have said you can no longer listen to BBC national
stations by this method (local radio still works though.) I understand
get_iplayer is a Linux package so is no use for Windoze - the only way
in Windows is to go to either iPlayerRadio from the iPlayer page, or
go to the station page and select Listen now.

In terms of kit, if it still works OK and you like the sound of it why
change. For example I have a pair of Wharfedale Dentons from decades
ago but for a relaxed smooth sound they still take some beating.

If you want to update have a look see what Richers have to offer -
especially NAD amps as they have loads of inputs.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

On Saturday, 28 November 2015 15:41:56 UTC, Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris

Connect it to a computer & you've got it all. DAB I don't see the point of.


NT

On 28/11/15 18:59, Woody wrote:

snip
I understand
get_iplayer is a Linux package so is no use for Windoze

Just FYI get_iplayer is available for Windows and Linux and I use it
with both.

Nick

Woody wrote:

However as others have said you can no longer listen to BBC national
stations by this method (local radio still works though.) I
understand get_iplayer is a Linux package so is no use for Windoze -
the only way in Windows is to go to either iPlayerRadio from the
iPlayer page, or go to the station page and select Listen now.

Use vlc or similar. The urls for the hls 320kbit 48kHz streams are all
around with a bit of searching.

http://www.radiofeeds.co.uk/hifi.asp

In message ,
writes
On Saturday, 28 November 2015 15:41:56 UTC, Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris

Connect it to a computer & you've got it all. DAB I don't see the point of.


Depends if you want to listen to any of the stations that are on DAB,
and when and where you want to listen.. I quite often listen to R4 extra
or Radio 6 Music, eldest likes to listen to music stations Yes I can
stream them, but it is convenient to just press a button.

using a computer works, but always seems a slight faff (we have one
attached to the TV). What has been a useful recent addition here is a
Chromecast Audio. It's easy and convenient to grab a phone or tablet and
stream Internet radio, spotify, iplayer radio etc.

Chris French

On 28/11/2015 15:41, Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1).
I added a Sony ('Micro hifi component system') all-in-one box that does
internet, DAB, FM, CD, USB, and it's just fine. Nice and simple.

Bill

"Nick Odell" wrote in message
...
On 28/11/15 18:59, Woody wrote:

snip
I understand
get_iplayer is a Linux package so is no use for Windoze

Just FYI get_iplayer is available for Windows and Linux and I use it
with both.


I stand corrected. Its what happens when you don't put the full
requirement - 'for windows' - in a search engine!!


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

Bill Wright wrote:
On 28/11/2015 15:41, Chris J Dixon wrote:
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1).
I added a Sony ('Micro hifi component system') all-in-one box that does
internet, DAB, FM, CD, USB, and it's just fine. Nice and simple.

How can a "Micro hifi component system" be "all-in-one"? :-)

--
Chris Green
·

In article , Chris J Dixon
scribeth thus
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB,

Only if you like bit reduced audio. BBC Radio 3 is OK most of the time
but as to the rest wouldn't give them house room for decent audio
quality.

However some Internet stations do broadcast at high rates and are worth
listening to....


maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris

--
Tony Sayer

On Saturday, 28 November 2015 21:48:05 UTC, wrote:
How can a "Micro hifi component system" be "all-in-one"? :-)

because at the front it appears to be multiple separate components, but at the back it's apparent that it's either one box, or multiple boxes but they all need the main box to operate because they don't have their own power supplies or standard inputs/outputs.

Owain

On Sat, 28 Nov 2015 15:41:55 +0000, Chris J Dixon wrote:

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth?

Do you actually have any DAB signal where you are?

Internet radio, well there is so much out there that finding
something worth listening to, even with genre/sub-genre based indexes
it more of a station hoping excercise than just "having the radio
on".

--
Cheers
Dave.

Well, I still do as you say, tough I have to say mp3s are pretty naff
compared to a good CD or vinyl recording. There are lossless codecs now and
together with cheap storage, many find home servers the way to go. I'm not
so sure as although formats change the problem is that data on a drive can
be totally lost very easily.
I'm thinking tat at the moment, DAB tuners exist and most can cope with
DAB+, so may be valid. The sad part is that the quality and station choice
on DAB is looking more like a replacementfor medium wave these days as its
mostly mono and compressed.
Other sources. I'd suggest a decent computer to get internet content,
rather than an internet radio as feeds change so often its a real pain to
set it up anew after its suddenly been moved. Freeview, and to some extent
Freesat is often a reasonable source of good quality, and at least radio 4
extra on Freeview is in stereo, unlike DAB, but for how long one wonders.
A relatvly cheap pvr or set top box is all you need, but steer clear of the
really cheap ones as if you want analogue out I often find that they are a
bit lacking on bass and plugging things in and out definitely affects levels
elsewhere. Seems to be no buffering. DVD and blue ray players can be good as
they play cds and mp3 cds as well, and its often the case that audio visual
devices can play content on sd cards and ramsticks too.

If you are into mp3 players or apple devices then obviously some kind of
input for those is handy as well.
Marantz do some nice recorders that sound quite good working on ram
sticks, but not cheap.


I still keep the ability to use cassettes with dbx and dolby, and I'd like
to also have reel to reel as well and of course having a computer as part of
the system does mean one can make digital media out of analogue recordings
too.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"Chris J Dixon" wrote in message
...
My hi-fi system dates way back, and is built of separates (1). It
includes an FM tuner, and by means of an additional selector can
take inputs from TV (2) or computer. There are speakers in all
three downstairs rooms.

Much of the time I am listening live to R4 or R2, otherwise
downloaded podcasts or my own music collection, all of which has
been copied to MP3. R6 music (via TV) only on Sunday morning for
Cerys.

I am wondering if it is time to replace or add to the radio
tuner, with something that will also cope with DAB, maybe even
internet radio. Is this worthwhile, or more bother than it is
worth? Are things changing so fast that anything I buy would risk
being obsolete, or of little use, in a short time.

(1) Though in truth record deck and tape player are pretty much
retired now.

(2) Freeview plus Roku 3

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

In article , Andy
Furniss spam@spam wrote:
Woody wrote:

However as others have said you can no longer listen to BBC national
stations by this method (local radio still works though.) I
understand get_iplayer is a Linux package so is no use for Windoze -
the only way in Windows is to go to either iPlayerRadio from the
iPlayer page, or go to the station page and select Listen now.

Use vlc or similar. The urls for the hls 320kbit 48kHz streams are all
around with a bit of searching.

http://www.radiofeeds.co.uk/hifi.asp

Also:

As has already been pointed out, get_iplayer is NOT "only for Linux". Its
actually a set of perl scripts so can be used on any OS which can run the
relevant version of perl. The email list for get_iplayer includes people
who run get_iplayer on Windows and Macs.

And ffmpeg can now fetch hls streams. This matters more for 'TV' from
iplayer, but it is worth noting as it shows ffmpeg can get streams and
convert them for you. May take some furtling about, though, so can be
easier to have get_iplayer employ ffmpeg on your behalf. :-)

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html

In message , Brian-Gaff
writes:
Well, I still do as you say, tough I have to say mp3s are pretty naff
compared to a good CD or vinyl recording. There are lossless codecs now and

I disagree. _Low bitrate_ mp3 are pretty naff; given enough bits, they
can be indistinguishable from the original to _most_ listeners,
especially older ones who've lost their upper frequencies (and also
depending on the equipment used). What an acceptable bitrate _is_ is of
course a source of endless debate, and also - if carefully chosen -
dependent on source material. (I have some 1950s mono material [early
Tom Lehrer] that is fine at 32k; encoded at lower sample rate, and mono.
I have other material [1980s pop for example] that I can still hear the
_odd_ artefact at 96k. I very much doubt there is much material - or
ears or equipment - that could tell 320k mp3 from the original.)

together with cheap storage, many find home servers the way to go. I'm not
so sure as although formats change the problem is that data on a drive can
be totally lost very easily.

Yes. Needs to be backed up - in the cloud, on another drive, or on
optical media. For audio only, you can get many hours on even a CD, and
days - possibly even weeks - on DVD, then BluRay. (Though I'd say for
backup only.)

I'm thinking tat at the moment, DAB tuners exist and most can cope with
DAB+, so may be valid. The sad part is that the quality and station choice
on DAB is looking more like a replacementfor medium wave these days as its
mostly mono and compressed.

Agreed (though it depends on what you're listening to; speech is
probably OK most of the time).

Not that it's relevant to the original enquirer, but are there DAB
add-ons for computers? Many years ago I had an FM tuner card, then there
was of course the original Psion (I think it was) Wavemaster, a
futuristic-looking blue thing that received DAB and plugged into a USB
socket. Is anything similar still made? (I've just had a look, and there
aren't _any_ wavemasters on ebay! Either I've remembered the name wrong,
or they've all either failed or are being kept by those who have them.)

Other sources. I'd suggest a decent computer to get internet content,
rather than an internet radio as feeds change so often its a real pain to
set it up anew after its suddenly been moved. Freeview, and to some extent

Yes, though the resetting may be more difficult for Brian than some,
since electronics manufacturers do seem to persistently refuse to cater
properly to the VH. But it is still a good point - setting up such
devices isn't trivial.

Freesat is often a reasonable source of good quality, and at least radio 4
extra on Freeview is in stereo, unlike DAB, but for how long one wonders.

I don't _think_ it will go anytime soon, though you can never tell.

A relatvly cheap pvr or set top box is all you need, but steer clear of the
really cheap ones as if you want analogue out I often find that they are a
bit lacking on bass and plugging things in and out definitely affects levels
elsewhere. Seems to be no buffering. DVD and blue ray players can be good as
they play cds and mp3 cds as well, and its often the case that audio visual
devices can play content on sd cards and ramsticks too.

All good points (and interesting about cheap STBs, though I wouldn't
have thought the levels will be a problem for a setup where you, er, set
it up and leave it).

If you are into mp3 players or apple devices then obviously some kind of
input for those is handy as well.

Yes, it's always good to have an extra analogue input or two (and
possibly digital one, though there are still few such sources).

Marantz do some nice recorders that sound quite good working on ram
sticks, but not cheap.

There are quite a lot of solid-state recorders around. Olympus do a
range of qualities (mainly to internal RAM).

I still keep the ability to use cassettes with dbx and dolby, and I'd like
to also have reel to reel as well and of course having a computer as part of
the system does mean one can make digital media out of analogue recordings
too.
Brian

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Thankfully, I know where the bodies are buried (the abandoned Television
Centre, in the /Blue Peter/ Garden), ... - Eddie Mair, RT 2015/4/25 to 5/1

In message , "J. P. Gilliver
(John)" writes:
[]
Not that it's relevant to the original enquirer, but are there DAB
add-ons for computers? Many years ago I had an FM tuner card, then
there was of course the original Psion (I think it was) Wavemaster, a
futuristic-looking blue thing that received DAB and plugged into a USB
socket. Is anything similar still made? (I've just had a look, and
there aren't _any_ wavemasters on ebay! Either I've remembered the name
wrong, or they've all either failed or are being kept by those who have them.)
[]
Oops, Wave_Finder_, Though there are still none on ebay! (One power
supply.)
--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

The best way to achieve immortality is by not dying.

In article ,
Woody wrote:
Freeview sound is no good if you want to listen to Classic FM - its in
mono only at low bit rate.

It's in stereo here.

--
*Two many clicks spoil the browse *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Woody wrote:
Freeview sound is no good if you want to listen to Classic FM - its in
mono only at low bit rate.

It's in stereo here.

It may vary at different times of day, but now (12:30 on Sunday) from
Bilsdale it's 128 kbps in stereo with a sample rate of 48 kHz - according to
VLC's "Current Media Information | Codec" from a test recording made using
Windows Media Centre.

128 kbps is a bit low: I'd tend to say that 192 or 256 is the minimum for
good sound. BBC1 uses 256 and Channel 5 uses 192 for the audio part of the
TV broadcasts.

In article , NY
wrote:

It may vary at different times of day, but now (12:30 on Sunday) from
Bilsdale it's 128 kbps in stereo with a sample rate of 48 kHz -
according to VLC's "Current Media Information | Codec" from a test
recording made using Windows Media Centre.

128 kbps is a bit low: I'd tend to say that 192 or 256 is the minimum
for good sound. BBC1 uses 256 and Channel 5 uses 192 for the audio part
of the TV broadcasts.

At times DAB R4 is down to 80 kbps mono.

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html

Re bit rate of mp3. The problem is not the frequency response its phase and
possitional information I find that suffers.
The very fast rates over 300 kbits second can be very good, but by the time
you get to that resolution you are not really saving much over a lossless
codec.
I can clearly hear 128kbits sec swizzling on complex sounds and acoustic
environments. it reveales itself because its really regular and fast, a bit
like the phase jitter you got on some cassette machines as the tape weaved a
little.

192 is not bad, but still a bit muddled on a very good recording. The
problem is today that one gets to feel that somewhere in the production of
content, digital bit rates have been compromised or maybe converted from one
format to another and not very well, making the end result less good than it
could have been.
I also suspect that some distribution systems also tends toward lossy or
severely error corrected systems of squeezing more down the pipe so to
speak.

We are never told of course so people think what they are hearing iswhat
they are going to hear in real life.
I can remember being shocked at the clarity and dynamics of, for examply,
The James Last Orchestra when I went to a concert with my Mother once.
You could really hear percussion and everything else where it actually was
no kind of defocussing cos it was in front of you.
Of course electronic instruments can be distorted and of course distortion
is part of some music deliberately, but its when the recording medium
intervenes that things get very awkward. The over use of the digital pitch
enhancers and digital auto double track is irking me a lot.
They use it imappropriately like on a recent concert by Carole King where
half the sound that appeals is that she rasps slides and croks. You don't
want it to sound pure after all its called emotion!

Sorry these things wind me up.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"J. P. Gilliver (John)" wrote in message
...
In message , Brian-Gaff
writes:
Well, I still do as you say, tough I have to say mp3s are pretty naff
compared to a good CD or vinyl recording. There are lossless codecs now
and

I disagree. _Low bitrate_ mp3 are pretty naff; given enough bits, they can
be indistinguishable from the original to _most_ listeners, especially
older ones who've lost their upper frequencies (and also depending on the
equipment used). What an acceptable bitrate _is_ is of course a source of
endless debate, and also - if carefully chosen - dependent on source
material. (I have some 1950s mono material [early Tom Lehrer] that is fine
at 32k; encoded at lower sample rate, and mono. I have other material
[1980s pop for example] that I can still hear the _odd_ artefact at 96k. I
very much doubt there is much material - or ears or equipment - that could
tell 320k mp3 from the original.)

together with cheap storage, many find home servers the way to go. I'm not
so sure as although formats change the problem is that data on a drive can
be totally lost very easily.

Yes. Needs to be backed up - in the cloud, on another drive, or on optical
media. For audio only, you can get many hours on even a CD, and days -
possibly even weeks - on DVD, then BluRay. (Though I'd say for backup
only.)

I'm thinking tat at the moment, DAB tuners exist and most can cope with
DAB+, so may be valid. The sad part is that the quality and station
choice
on DAB is looking more like a replacementfor medium wave these days as its
mostly mono and compressed.

Agreed (though it depends on what you're listening to; speech is probably
OK most of the time).

Not that it's relevant to the original enquirer, but are there DAB add-ons
for computers? Many years ago I had an FM tuner card, then there was of
course the original Psion (I think it was) Wavemaster, a
futuristic-looking blue thing that received DAB and plugged into a USB
socket. Is anything similar still made? (I've just had a look, and there
aren't _any_ wavemasters on ebay! Either I've remembered the name wrong,
or they've all either failed or are being kept by those who have them.)

Other sources. I'd suggest a decent computer to get internet content,
rather than an internet radio as feeds change so often its a real pain to
set it up anew after its suddenly been moved. Freeview, and to some extent

Yes, though the resetting may be more difficult for Brian than some, since
electronics manufacturers do seem to persistently refuse to cater properly
to the VH. But it is still a good point - setting up such devices isn't
trivial.

Freesat is often a reasonable source of good quality, and at least radio 4
extra on Freeview is in stereo, unlike DAB, but for how long one wonders.

I don't _think_ it will go anytime soon, though you can never tell.

A relatvly cheap pvr or set top box is all you need, but steer clear of
the
really cheap ones as if you want analogue out I often find that they are a
bit lacking on bass and plugging things in and out definitely affects
levels
elsewhere. Seems to be no buffering. DVD and blue ray players can be good
as
they play cds and mp3 cds as well, and its often the case that audio
visual
devices can play content on sd cards and ramsticks too.

All good points (and interesting about cheap STBs, though I wouldn't have
thought the levels will be a problem for a setup where you, er, set it up
and leave it).

If you are into mp3 players or apple devices then obviously some kind of
input for those is handy as well.

Yes, it's always good to have an extra analogue input or two (and possibly
digital one, though there are still few such sources).

Marantz do some nice recorders that sound quite good working on ram
sticks, but not cheap.

There are quite a lot of solid-state recorders around. Olympus do a range
of qualities (mainly to internal RAM).

I still keep the ability to use cassettes with dbx and dolby, and I'd like
to also have reel to reel as well and of course having a computer as part
of
the system does mean one can make digital media out of analogue recordings
too.
Brian

--
J. P. Gilliver. UMRA: 1960/1985 MB++G()AL-IS-Ch++(p)Ar@T+H+Sh0!:`)DNAf

Thankfully, I know where the bodies are buried (the abandoned Television
Centre, in the /Blue Peter/ Garden), ... - Eddie Mair, RT 2015/4/25 to 5/1

On 29/11/2015 12:38, NY wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Woody wrote:
Freeview sound is no good if you want to listen to Classic FM - its in
mono only at low bit rate.

It's in stereo here.

It may vary at different times of day, but now (12:30 on Sunday) from
Bilsdale it's 128 kbps in stereo with a sample rate of 48 kHz -
according to VLC's "Current Media Information | Codec" from a test
recording made using Windows Media Centre.

Interesting, back in February when Classic FM and LBC joined DTT, they
were both 64k Mono.

Something must have moved off COM 5 since then to allow Classic FM up
the food chain ?

What rate/mode is LBC at present ?


--
Mark
Please replace invalid and invalid with gmx and net to reply.

"Mark Carver" wrote in message
...
On 29/11/2015 12:38, NY wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Woody wrote:
Freeview sound is no good if you want to listen to Classic FM -
its in
mono only at low bit rate.

It's in stereo here.

It may vary at different times of day, but now (12:30 on Sunday)
from
Bilsdale it's 128 kbps in stereo with a sample rate of 48 kHz -
according to VLC's "Current Media Information | Codec" from a test
recording made using Windows Media Centre.

Interesting, back in February when Classic FM and LBC joined DTT,
they
were both 64k Mono.

Something must have moved off COM 5 since then to allow Classic FM
up the food chain ?

What rate/mode is LBC at present ?



You could be right Mark - since I first heard it in mono I haven't
bothered to listen on Freeview.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

On 29/11/2015 13:32, Jim Lesurf wrote:
At times DAB R4 is down to 80 kbps mono.

Yes, and that's MP2, not MP3...
80kbit AAC or WMA would be marginal to me. It's just too low for those
formats - and I kind of like having stereo. For me DAB is nearly dead -
we never bother to record anything for later now, which we used to, as
it's easier to stream it in higher quality.

Andy

On 29/11/2015 13:32, Jim Lesurf wrote:


At times DAB R4 is down to 80 kbps mono.

Jim

You can still hear the left/liberal/greeny******** bias though.

Bill

On 29/11/2015 13:38, Brian-Gaff wrote:

I can remember being shocked at the clarity and dynamics of, for examply,
The James Last Orchestra when I went to a concert with my Mother once.

I didn't know you were a nun.

Bill

On 29/11/2015 16:41, Mark Carver wrote:

Interesting, back in February when Classic FM and LBC joined DTT, they
were both 64k Mono.
I like LBC.

Bill

On 29/11/15 21:08, Bill Wright wrote:
On 29/11/2015 13:32, Jim Lesurf wrote:


At times DAB R4 is down to 80 kbps mono.

Jim

You can still hear the left/liberal/greeny******** bias though.


yeah. Even Sky this morning had a bit on the climate conference in Paris
- in the studio an incoherent dork dweebling along the lines of 'heads
of state wouldn't be there unless it was important' and then a FOE - I
mean really, nit even Greenpeace, FOE - wittering on about how
governments are failing to do what almost all of their electorates want
.....as if.


Bill


--
the biggest threat to humanity comes from socialism, which has utterly
diverted our attention away from what really matters to our existential
survival, to indulging in navel gazing and faux moral investigations
into what the world ought to be, whilst we fail utterly to deal with
what it actually is.

Neither did I. I've often wondered what the folk did in the convent.


Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
On 29/11/2015 13:38, Brian-Gaff wrote:

I can remember being shocked at the clarity and dynamics of, for
examply,
The James Last Orchestra when I went to a concert with my Mother once.

I didn't know you were a nun.

Bill

Jim Lesurf wrote:

If you're happy with what you
have, why change? (That is meant as a real question: e.g. do you think
there are other non-FM stations you might like well enough to buy new kit
before you know?)

The advantage of using your own computer is you can update the software,
etc, to keep in step with developments.

I suppose I was imagining the impossible - being able to summon
up whatever source I wanted, from wherever I was, but with
minimum technology, which clearly isn't going to happen.

Looks like my existing setup will do the trick for a good while
yet.

J. P. Gilliver (John) wrote:

Yes. Needs to be backed up - in the cloud, on another drive, or on
optical media.

No problem - I have an Office 365 subscription, which comes with
far more storage than I will fill. It took a while to get the
initial data uploaded, but updates are much more manageable.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

On 01/12/2015 10:44, Chris J Dixon wrote:
Jim Lesurf wrote:

Yes. Needs to be backed up - in the cloud, on another drive, or on
optical media.

No problem - I have an Office 365 subscription, which comes with
far more storage than I will fill. It took a while to get the
initial data uploaded, but updates are much more manageable.

You actually trust Microsoft with all your data?

I checked on whether Office 365 would do what I want and it turned out
that if I couldn't get an internet connection, I had no access to my
data. The same with Outlook.com. So I paid for a decent system that
keeps all my data local and secure, unless I deliberately let it out.
Even my phone doesn't use the cloud for anything even remotely private.

I just synchronise my computer with a network attached HD or another
computer every time I close down, and haven't lost any data due to
hardware failure in 30 years or so. In fact, my system makes it almost
impossible to *deliberately* lose any data, as it gets restored the next
time my sync software connects to a copy anywhere on the network.


--
Tciao for Now!

John.

John Williamson wrote:

On 01/12/2015 10:44, Chris J Dixon wrote:

No problem - I have an Office 365 subscription, which comes with
far more storage than I will fill. It took a while to get the
initial data uploaded, but updates are much more manageable.

You actually trust Microsoft with all your data?

I checked on whether Office 365 would do what I want and it turned out
that if I couldn't get an internet connection, I had no access to my
data. The same with Outlook.com. So I paid for a decent system that
keeps all my data local and secure, unless I deliberately let it out.
Even my phone doesn't use the cloud for anything even remotely private.

I just synchronise my computer with a network attached HD or another
computer every time I close down, and haven't lost any data due to
hardware failure in 30 years or so. In fact, my system makes it almost
impossible to *deliberately* lose any data, as it gets restored the next
time my sync software connects to a copy anywhere on the network.

Do I trust MS not to do something unwanted with the data I have
uploaded? It is a risk I am willing to take.

Is it my only backup? Certainly not. I have both NAS and USB HD
for regular backups.

In the event of the unthinkable (I suppose I have actually
thought it) then whatever I can get back from off site is
worthwhile.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.

In message , Chris J Dixon
writes

I suppose I was imagining the impossible - being able to summon
up whatever source I wanted, from wherever I was, but with
minimum technology, which clearly isn't going to happen.

You and me both, Chris. Just one requirement to add - the ability to
play the same thing all over the house without wires everywhere, so that
I can wander from room to room without missing whatever is playing.

We have had fun with a Chromecast Audio [1], and the above would be at
least partially solved if one could cast to more than one device
simultaneously. Anyone know whether that is possible?

[1] Except when that little scote who calls me Dad sits there quietly
playing with his phone, and I discover he has deleted my queue and added
all his old crap :-)

--
Graeme

On Tue, 01 Dec 2015 12:30:00 +0000, Chris J Dixon
wrote:

Do I trust MS not to do something unwanted with the data I have
uploaded? It is a risk I am willing to take.

Find DropBox very good.

--
Alan White
Mozilla Firefox and Forte Agent.
By Loch Long, twenty-eight miles NW of Glasgow, Scotland.
Webcam and weather:- http://windycroft.co.uk/weather

In article ,
pamela wrote:
Another option is to buy a £100 Android tablet and play Internet radio
by "casting" the audio to your PC or stereo via a £30 Chromecast audio
stick which plays through your stereo. This wouldn't cost much more
than a decent DAB radio.

This arrangement gives you a portable device with a far better user
interface than any DAB radio plus.

I'm not convinced by the audio quality of many of these sort of devices.
The digital to analogue side often leaves a lot to be desired.

--
*A conscience is what hurts when all your other parts feel so good *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 01/12/2015 12:38, News wrote:
In message , Chris J Dixon
writes

I suppose I was imagining the impossible - being able to summon
up whatever source I wanted, from wherever I was, but with
minimum technology, which clearly isn't going to happen.

You and me both, Chris. Just one requirement to add - the ability to
play the same thing all over the house without wires everywhere, so that
I can wander from room to room without missing whatever is playing.

A tablet running any decent media player programme, linked to a wifi NAS
box which also works as a router. Works for me anywhere at home, within
the NAS device count limit, which exceeds the number I use at home. As
the NAS box is also linked to the internet, I can also use the system to
stream radio and TV stations.

--
Tciao for Now!

John.