My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one was
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only
the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of
circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three
phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more.
Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered
equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got
three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind you I
believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it himself, so
maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the property?
The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower
fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one was old and
leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an
electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would
require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time
as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering
if he infact had more phases available.

That's a fairly mundane story, god knows what response you expect, there
isn't even a question. I'm confident that your higher degree will solve any
possible issue.
Not to worry though, Wodprick will surely be along to play, shortly.
Lets have a really long, stupid thread, for a change.

Maybe you could hurl yourself at the 3 phase busbars? Go on, give it a go,
you know you want to.

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote

My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only
the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of
circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three
phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more.

No reason why a 3 phase installation needs to have a lot more breakers.

Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered
equipment",

So he may well have a 3 phase system for the welder alone.

but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases
installed if he didn't absolutely have to

While he didn't have to, it does allow more choice
with what he can use. Everyone I know who has a
3 phase system has it for that reason.

- mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it
himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the
property?

It does cost a little more but not that much more.

The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower
fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one was old and
leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an
electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would
require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time
as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering
if he infact had more phases available.

There must be, it's the only way to get 415V in a normal house.

"Rod Speed" wrote in message
...
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote

My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of
circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three
phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more.

No reason why a 3 phase installation needs to have a lot more breakers.

Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered
equipment",

So he may well have a 3 phase system for the welder alone.

but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases
installed if he didn't absolutely have to

While he didn't have to, it does allow more choice
with what he can use. Everyone I know who has a
3 phase system has it for that reason.

- mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it
himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building
the property?

It does cost a little more but not that much more.

The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower
fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one was old and
leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an
electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would
require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same
time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was
wondering if he infact had more phases available.

There must be, it's the only way to get 415V in a normal house.

Go go Wod, tell us about your 6 phase supply.
LMFAO.
Wods house complete with breadmaker, duck pond coming soon -
http://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/derel...a-34470305.jpg

On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one was
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT

On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer. You could well be right, there
might or might not be 3 phase available. If the current electrician
cannot advise, then you need someone who works on (small) industrial
sites. Sounds like perhaps the 3 phase meter has been taken out and
replaced with a single phase one.

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high
powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would
have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind
you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it
himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building
the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW
electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that
one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer.

For a pointless question?

--
Adam

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high
powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would
have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind
you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it
himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building
the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW
electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that
one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted

You could well be right, there might or might not be 3 phase available.

It's very unlikely that there would be a 415V sticker if it wasn’t.

If the current electrician cannot advise, then you need someone who works
on (small) industrial sites.

Or he could just check if there is 3 phase there.

Sounds like perhaps the 3 phase meter has been taken out and replaced with
a single phase one.

Easy to prove.

"ARW" wrote in message
...
"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master
fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox
myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the
mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If
there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to
include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby
with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I
doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely
have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and
designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases
when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've
just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water
tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer.

For a pointless question?

Just another stupid thread starter as I see it.
Never mind, Wodney has joined in, now we'll get some sense.
Right?

"bm" wrote in message
web.com...

"ARW" wrote in message
...
"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master
fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox
myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the
mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If
there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to
include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby
with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I
doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely
have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and
designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases
when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've
just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water
tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer.

For a pointless question?

Just another stupid thread starter as I see it.
Never mind, Wodney has joined in, now we'll get some sense.



Right?

Yes.

--
Adam

"bm" wrote in message
web.com...

"ARW" wrote in message
...
"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master
fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox
myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the
mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If
there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to
include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby
with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I
doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely
have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and
designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases
when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've
just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water
tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer.

For a pointless question?

Just another stupid thread starter as I see it.
Never mind, Wodney has joined in, now we'll get some sense.
Right?



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you using
them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


--
Adam

On 29/08/2015 10:06, newshound wrote:
If the current electrician cannot advise, ...

.... ask one with greater potential.

On Saturday, 29 August 2015 11:12:21 UTC+1, nemo wrote:
On 29/08/2015 10:06, newshound wrote:
If the current electrician cannot advise, ...

... ask one with greater potential.

if your current one is resisting, or just lacks the capacity, induce a new one.


NT

On 29/08/2015 10:57, ARW wrote:



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you
using them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had a
single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase, but if these are in fact all
three phase to the master fuse then that would seem to give a relatively
easy solution to anyone who needs 100 amps (for whatever reason!)

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 29/08/2015 10:57, ARW wrote:



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you
using them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had a
single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase,

It will not be SWA.

--
Adam

In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

--
*Is it true that cannibals don't eat clowns because they taste funny?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.


Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

--
Adam

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

But given the previous owner being into machinery,
its much more likely to be 3 phase than two.

"ARW" wrote in message
...
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

Mine isn't.

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

I know mine is 2 lines from a 3 phase because I wired the house myself.

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 13:42:47 +0100, ARW wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

This is in the Scottish Highlands and the house was built around 1985. Is it likely to have two phases there? It's not in the middle of nowhere, it's in a village with about 400 houses.

--
Those who jump off a bridge in Paris are in Seine.

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 10:06:26 +0100, newshound wrote:

On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water tank, but that one
wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer. You could well be right, there
might or might not be 3 phase available. If the current electrician
cannot advise, then you need someone who works on (small) industrial
sites. Sounds like perhaps the 3 phase meter has been taken out and
replaced with a single phase one.

If he (or I but I'm not up there) really wanted to know, it's easy enough to peek around and use a multimeter. But at the moment it's just a matter of interest for a possible future electric boiler installation. I was just wondering if houses ever had more than one phase installed or if you had to ask for it.

--
How come the dove gets to be the peace symbol? How about the pillow? It has more feathers than the dove, and it doesn't have that dangerous beak!

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 10:06:26 +0100, newshound
wrote:

On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master
fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox
myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the
mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If
there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to
include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby
with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I
doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely
have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and
designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases
when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've
just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water
tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer. You could well be right, there
might or might not be 3 phase available. If the current electrician
cannot advise, then you need someone who works on (small) industrial
sites. Sounds like perhaps the 3 phase meter has been taken out and
replaced with a single phase one.

If he (or I but I'm not up there) really wanted to know, it's easy enough
to peek around and use a multimeter. But at the moment it's just a matter
of interest for a possible future electric boiler installation. I was
just wondering if houses ever had more than one phase installed or if you
had to ask for it.

more attention seeking trolling from phuckerprick
he will have a wank over each reply

On 29/08/2015 12:39, ARW wrote:
"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 29/08/2015 10:57, ARW wrote:



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you
using them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had
a single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase,

It will not be SWA.

Well it looked fat enough to me to be SWA but it isn't magnetic, so fair
enough.

You still havn't answered the question, do you think I have three phases
coming into the master fuse block?

On 29/08/2015 14:28, Mick wrote:
"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 10:06:26 +0100, newshound
wrote:

On 29/08/2015 01:17, wrote:
On Saturday, 29 August 2015 00:13:19 UTC+1, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box. From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master
fuse, meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in 1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox
myself, only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the
mill row of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If
there were three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to
include a lot more. Now the previous owner did have an ironwork hobby
with "high powered equipment", but he was a very frugal sort and I
doubt he would have got three phases installed if he didn't absolutely
have to - mind you I believe he was the first owner of the house and
designed it himself, so maybe it's just as cheap to get three phases
when building the property? The reason this has come up is they've
just had a 10kW electric shower fitted (used to run from the hot water
tank, but that one wa
s
old and leaky) and are considering replacing their ageing oil boiler
with an electric one, which the electrician fitting the shower warned
would require a relay to switch off the boiler so it didn't run at the
same time as the shower as he'd run out of juice. When he saw 415V he
was wondering if he infact had more phases available.

clear piccy wanted


NT


Ignore BM, this is the right answer. You could well be right, there
might or might not be 3 phase available. If the current electrician
cannot advise, then you need someone who works on (small) industrial
sites. Sounds like perhaps the 3 phase meter has been taken out and
replaced with a single phase one.

If he (or I but I'm not up there) really wanted to know, it's easy enough
to peek around and use a multimeter. But at the moment it's just a matter
of interest for a possible future electric boiler installation. I was
just wondering if houses ever had more than one phase installed or if you
had to ask for it.

more attention seeking trolling from phuckerprick
he will have a wank over each reply

Stop judging others after your own actions when seeing weedyguy's posts.

On 29/08/2015 14:59, newshound wrote:
On 29/08/2015 12:39, ARW wrote:
"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 29/08/2015 10:57, ARW wrote:



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those
that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you
using them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had
a single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase,

It will not be SWA.

Well it looked fat enough to me to be SWA but it isn't magnetic, so fair
enough.

You still havn't answered the question, do you think I have three phases
coming into the master fuse block?

If you hacksaw into it, you might be able to see how many conductors
there are.

Report back when you've counted them.

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 13:42:47 +0100, ARW
wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a
lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V
on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

This is in the Scottish Highlands and the house was built around 1985.
Is it likely to have two phases there? It's not in the middle of
nowhere, it's in a village with about 400 houses.

It is possible that the original owner had 3 phase installed complete
with appropriate meter to power his interests. A subsequent owner would
have then been faced with a higher standing charge and possibly reduced
options when shopping around for lower tariffs and so it would have been
economic (and possibly free) to have the meter changed to single phase.
The way to tell would be to look for three phase and neutral coming in
and the probability of two empty fuse carriers with wires going in and
none coming out.
One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:25:50 +0100, Bob Minchin wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 13:42:47 +0100, ARW
wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a
lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V
on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

This is in the Scottish Highlands and the house was built around 1985.
Is it likely to have two phases there? It's not in the middle of
nowhere, it's in a village with about 400 houses.

It is possible that the original owner had 3 phase installed complete
with appropriate meter to power his interests. A subsequent owner would
have then been faced with a higher standing charge and possibly reduced
options when shopping around for lower tariffs and so it would have been
economic (and possibly free) to have the meter changed to single phase.

My father is the second owner. He didn't do such a thing, the first owner must have removed it to sell the house if it was there.

The way to tell would be to look for three phase and neutral coming in
and the probability of two empty fuse carriers with wires going in and
none coming out.

I don't think there are empty fuse carriers lying about, my father would have said something. The only thing I can gather that's different from a normal installation is a 415V sticker on the incoming feed. I think he also said the meter says 240V.

One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!

I have no reason to believe a sparky went in there, all a sparky did was fit an electric shower, switching off the master switch on the fusebox inside the house would have sufficed. I'm passing on what my father looked at in the meter box when I was discussing with him the possibility of an electric boiler should his oil boiler break in the near future, and whether he'd have enough juice.

--
If there's one thing I can't stand, it's intolerance.

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:

I don't think there are empty fuse carriers lying about, my father would
have said something.
Well in that case, changing to 3 phase will likely be expensive and not
necessarily based on actual cost from what I've heard others mention.

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 16:14:24 +0100, Bob Minchin wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:

I don't think there are empty fuse carriers lying about, my father would
have said something.
Well in that case, changing to 3 phase will likely be expensive and not
necessarily based on actual cost from what I've heard others mention.

If the feed wire coming into his fusebox really is 415V, then a second phase is just sat there. A second fuse holder and another meter won't cost much will it?

--
In the event that all else has failed, and it seems tempting to actually read the instructions, don't panic: Get a bigger hammer!

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:25:50 +0100, Bob Minchin wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 13:42:47 +0100, ARW
wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a
lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V
on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

This is in the Scottish Highlands and the house was built around 1985.
Is it likely to have two phases there? It's not in the middle of
nowhere, it's in a village with about 400 houses.

It is possible that the original owner had 3 phase installed complete
with appropriate meter to power his interests. A subsequent owner would
have then been faced with a higher standing charge and possibly reduced
options when shopping around for lower tariffs and so it would have been
economic (and possibly free) to have the meter changed to single phase.

The way to tell would be to look for three phase and neutral coming in
and the probability of two empty fuse carriers with wires going in and
none coming out.

One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!

I've just checked my own meter box, and my master fuse has a 415V rating on it! I definitely only have one phase. Very strange. Why would a master fuse need a 415V rating? If I had three phases, surely I'd have three fuses, one on each phase, so they'd still only need to be rated at 240V each.

--
If there's one thing I can't stand, it's intolerance.

On 29/08/2015 15:07, Fredxxx wrote:
On 29/08/2015 14:59, newshound wrote:
On 29/08/2015 12:39, ARW wrote:
"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 29/08/2015 10:57, ARW wrote:



BTW rental properties with a 3 phase supply are in demand for those
that
like to grow plants.

There are two unmetered phases available and all that is stopping you
using them is two meter seals and a two missing fuses.


Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had
a single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase,

It will not be SWA.

Well it looked fat enough to me to be SWA but it isn't magnetic, so fair
enough.

You still havn't answered the question, do you think I have three phases
coming into the master fuse block?

If you hacksaw into it, you might be able to see how many conductors
there are.

Report back when you've counted them.

I think I asked a perfectly reasonable question. Adam seemed to be
asserting that the cabling was there to the board, which surprised me a
little.

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 16:32:08 +0100, Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:25:50 +0100, Bob Minchin wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 13:42:47 +0100, ARW
wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
My father has said he has a 415V sticker on the feed into his meter
box.
From what he's told me there is the normal arrangement of master fuse,
meter, then into the house to the consumer unit. The house was
built in
1985ish and is detached. I've never seen inside the meterbox myself,
only the consumer unit, which looked like a normal run of the mill row
of circuit breakers with one master at the end, 100A. If there were
three phases in the meterbox I'd expect his description to include a
lot
more.

You don't need three phase for 415v - only two. And at one point it was
common to install two phases to allow electric heating.

Was that not split phase?

It is not the same thing as two lines from a 3 phase as you have 460V
on a
split line.

Rarer than a 15 year old virgin in Rotherham but they do exist.

This is in the Scottish Highlands and the house was built around 1985.
Is it likely to have two phases there? It's not in the middle of
nowhere, it's in a village with about 400 houses.

It is possible that the original owner had 3 phase installed complete
with appropriate meter to power his interests. A subsequent owner would
have then been faced with a higher standing charge and possibly reduced
options when shopping around for lower tariffs and so it would have been
economic (and possibly free) to have the meter changed to single phase.

The way to tell would be to look for three phase and neutral coming in
and the probability of two empty fuse carriers with wires going in and
none coming out.

One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!

I've just checked my own meter box, and my master fuse has a 415V rating on it! I definitely only have one phase. Very strange. Why would a master fuse need a 415V rating? If I had three phases, surely I'd have three fuses, one on each phase, so they'd still only need to be rated at 240V each.

Answering my own question, I guess those fuses can also be used for three phase installations, with one fuse for each phase. If someone had a big three phase motor that shorted out across two phases, you'd have 415V across two of those fuses in series. One would burst first unless they were absolutely identical, leaving the burst one with 415V across it, so it's designed not to create a spark or an arc inside it with that much voltage.

--
How do you play Iraqi bingo?
B-52...F-16...B-2

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...

Is that right? My house (and the others in the street) originally had
a single phase overhead supply, it now has an underground one.

I'd assumed that this SWA was single phase,

It will not be SWA.

Well it looked fat enough to me to be SWA but it isn't magnetic, so fair
enough.

You still havn't answered the question, do you think I have three phases
coming into the master fuse block?


I doubt you have 3 phase or an SWA supply.

I was just asserting the fact that 3 phase supplies have a following for
those with green fingers.

The cable to your house will probably be concentric (just like SWA) but it
will use copper not steel for the armoring. It will be single phase.


We have some pictures on the wiki that should show your type of cable ( and
it does look like SWA)

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Earthing_Types

The TNS has two cores in the outer sheath (the armour) and the TN-C-S has
just bare copper in the armour which acts as both the neutral and the earth.


--
Adam

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:25:50 +0100, Bob Minchin
wrote:


One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!



I have no reason to believe a sparky went in there, all a sparky did was
fit an electric shower, switching off the master switch on the fusebox
inside the house would have sufficed.

Well the sparks would need to see what sort of supply it was if he was going
to fill in an electrical installation certificate for the shower.

--
Adam

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:20:18 +0100, ARW wrote:

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 15:25:50 +0100, Bob Minchin
wrote:


One has to wonder at the abilities of the sparky who could not have seen
that for himself!!

I have no reason to believe a sparky went in there, all a sparky did was
fit an electric shower, switching off the master switch on the fusebox
inside the house would have sufficed.

Well the sparks would need to see what sort of supply it was if he was going
to fill in an electrical installation certificate for the shower.

What information could he possibly get from the meter box that would be applicable to installing a shower? Everything he needs to connect to is in the consumer unit, and labelled for him.

--
His wife had been killed in an accident and the police were questioning Finnegan.
"Did she say anything before she died?" asked the sergeant.
"She spoke without interruption for about forty years," said the Irishman.

"newshound" wrote in message
o.uk...
You still havn't answered the question, do you think I have three phases
coming into the master fuse block?

If you hacksaw into it, you might be able to see how many conductors
there are.

Report back when you've counted them.

I think I asked a perfectly reasonable question. Adam seemed to be
asserting that the cabling was there to the board, which surprised me a
little.

I think you asked a very sensible question and clearly set out that it was
theoretical because you aren't actually at your father's house to look at
the installation and answer further questions - so you wanted to be armed
with the things to look out for when you next see him. In the meantime you
were asking a theoretical "how is it normally done" question, with the
proviso that there are bound to be exceptions to any rule.

I'm shocked at the amount of flak that you've had from some people who have
nothing to contribute except to strengthen my opinion that they exist on the
newsgroup just to be prize ****s and to indulge in private vendettas.
Mentioning no names...


Is three-phase (or at least two-phase or split-phase) wiring common in
domestic UK environments? I've only ever seen it in the US where their
normal wall-socket voltage is so puny that heavy-duty appliances like tumble
driers, electric fires and even electric kettles (for those people who use a
kettle to make coffee or tea) are fed from phase-to-phase rather than the
normal phase-to-neutral, to avoid needing heavier-duty wiring to supply the
large amount of power from 120V.

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 16:14:24 +0100, Bob Minchin
wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:

I don't think there are empty fuse carriers lying about, my father would
have said something.
Well in that case, changing to 3 phase will likely be expensive and not
necessarily based on actual cost from what I've heard others mention.

If the feed wire coming into his fusebox really is 415V, then a second
phase is just sat there. A second fuse holder and another meter won't
cost much will it?

But you need 3 phases. If the fuse holders are not there to terminate
the original cables. The two ways you have atm are neutral and one fused
live which provides 240v. The 415 sticker is a left over from before.

As I tried to suggest before, the Price for three phase connection is
NOT related to the Cost of doing the work.
Supply and demand at work here.

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:20:18 +0100, ARW
wrote:

I have no reason to believe a sparky went in there, all a sparky did was
fit an electric shower, switching off the master switch on the fusebox
inside the house would have sufficed.

Well the sparks would need to see what sort of supply it was if he was
going
to fill in an electrical installation certificate for the shower.

What information could he possibly get from the meter box that would be
applicable to installing a shower? Everything he needs to connect to is
in the consumer unit, and labelled for him.

Let's see.

Type of supply (ie earthing arrangements), number and type of live
conductors, details of protective device.

More than you think.


--
Adam

On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 18:15:32 +0100, ARW wrote:

"Tough Guy no. 1265" wrote in message
news
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:20:18 +0100, ARW
wrote:

I have no reason to believe a sparky went in there, all a sparky did was
fit an electric shower, switching off the master switch on the fusebox
inside the house would have sufficed.

Well the sparks would need to see what sort of supply it was if he was
going
to fill in an electrical installation certificate for the shower.

What information could he possibly get from the meter box that would be
applicable to installing a shower? Everything he needs to connect to is
in the consumer unit, and labelled for him.

Let's see.

Type of supply (ie earthing arrangements),

The earth will be available in the consumer unit. He connects to that, not in the meter box.

number and type of live conductors,

You can see in the consumer unit what is available. In this case, one 100A 240V conductor.

details of protective device.

Which is in the consumer unit.

--
Two fish are in a tank. One says to the other, "I'll man the guns, you drive".

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 17:53:20 +0100, Bob Minchin
wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:
On Sat, 29 Aug 2015 16:14:24 +0100, Bob Minchin
wrote:

Tough Guy no. 1265 wrote:

I don't think there are empty fuse carriers lying about, my father
would
have said something.
Well in that case, changing to 3 phase will likely be expensive and not
necessarily based on actual cost from what I've heard others mention.

If the feed wire coming into his fusebox really is 415V, then a second
phase is just sat there. A second fuse holder and another meter won't
cost much will it?

But you need 3 phases.

No he doesn't. He just wants more amps at 240V. So using a second
phase for the boiler as though it were in a second house would do.

If the fuse holders are not there to terminate
the original cables. The two ways you have atm are neutral and one fused
live which provides 240v. The 415 sticker is a left over from before.

As I tried to suggest before, the Price for three phase connection is
NOT related to the Cost of doing the work.
Supply and demand at work here.

If the wire is already there, you pay for an Electricity Board
electrician to come and do some wiring, it would cost the same as any
other wiring by them which took that amount of time. They would
probably charge the same for reinstating a disconnected connection that
needs a new meter etc. Supply and Demand does not make sense in this
context.

I was forgetting that you know everything. But wait why did you ask the
question in the first place???