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Default Volvo gear changing

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?

Bill
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On 24/04/14 12:57, Bill Wright wrote:
Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?

Bill

...sound of clashing dog clutches if its got synchro on first.

let clutch out in neutral, then depress foot and engage first

How can you expect dog clutches to synch and mate if both halves are static.

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

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Default Volvo gear changing

On 24/04/2014 12:57, Bill Wright wrote:
Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?

Bill


When moving or stationary?

I'm assuming stationary.
If not going in first time, put stick back into neutral, lift clutch up
to spin layshaft, then depress clutch and try engaging first again.

Not that uncommon. I can't recommend grinding the gears too often!
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On Thu, 24 Apr 2014 13:04:33 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

How can you expect dog clutches to synch and mate if both halves are
static.


Both halves aren't static - there's always a bit of drag on the clutch,
so the input shaft'll be lazily spinning, with no real torque on it.

But even if you switch the engine off, select first, then try to push the
car, you should find it's gone in gear.
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On Thu, 24 Apr 2014 12:57:25 +0100, Bill Wright wrote:

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?


What if you try to select other gears? Does it do the same?


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On 24/04/14 13:11, Adrian wrote:
On Thu, 24 Apr 2014 13:04:33 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

How can you expect dog clutches to synch and mate if both halves are
static.


Both halves aren't static - there's always a bit of drag on the clutch,
so the input shaft'll be lazily spinning, with no real torque on it.


There SHOULD be a bit of drag on the clutch.

BUT I suspect that in this case there's a bit of drag in the
gearbox..worn bearings, low oil, something partially siezed..

The trick is to do what I said.

Or get a new gearbox.


But even if you switch the engine off, select first, then try to push the
car, you should find it's gone in gear.


Should.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

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Default Volvo gear changing

On Thursday, April 24, 2014 12:57:25 PM UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first.


not uncommon on old vehicles. Go into 2nd then retry first.

If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily.


normal for a clutchless change. You should only do clutchless changes when you can judge well enough to avoid any gear crunching

Does anyone know what the trouble is?
Bill


What trouble?


NT
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Default Volvo gear changing

"Bill Wright" wrote in message ...

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?




1. Low oil
2. Synchro wearing
3. Clutch dragging
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"Bill Wright" wrote in message
...
Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on the
gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the clutch out
there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then the lever
moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?

Bill



Look for easy things first.
If it is a hydraulic clutch.
Check fluid level in clutch reservoir. If very low may need filling &
bleeding.
It might be the seal in the clutch master cylinder is leaking a bit (ie back
into the master cylinder). Or some crap in the fluid.
Clutch is not disengaging properly so preventing you from getting it into
gear.

If it is a cable operated clutch, may need adjustment/replacement.


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In article ,
Bill Wright wrote:
Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?


Try it before you start the engine. Does it go into first each time easily?
If so, it sounds like excessive clutch drag.
At one time you could tell if this was the case because it would crunch
into reverse. But so many boxes have synchromesh on reverse too these days.

--
He who laughs last, thinks slowest*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.


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Default Volvo gear changing

On 2014-04-24 12:11:44 +0000, Fredxxx said:

then depress clutch


Wise not to do this - happy clutches work better.

E.

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Default Volvo gear changing

On Thursday, April 24, 2014 12:57:25 PM UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first.


not uncommon on old vehicles. Go into 2nd then retry first.


I second that, I had to do this with my old Volvo.

Mike
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On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 09:34:26 +0100, "Muddymike"
wrote:

On Thursday, April 24, 2014 12:57:25 PM UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first.


not uncommon on old vehicles. Go into 2nd then retry first.


I second that, I had to do this with my old Volvo.


My driving instructor taght me the trick of shifting back to neutral
and releasing the clutch briefly before repeating the slection of
first gear. The ' try another gear' (you're not just limited to 2nd
unless you just want to get the car moving straight away despite the
extra wear on the clutch and reduced acceleration) is usually the last
resort when dealing with recalcitrant gearboxes.
--
Regards, J B Good
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Default Volvo gear changing

On 24/04/2014 12:57, Bill Wright wrote:
Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first. If I cautiously let the
clutch out there is eventually the sound of clashing gear wheels, then
the lever moves into gear easily. Does anyone know what the trouble is?

Bill


Age of car? If it's old, it's because it is old. With the clutch down,
try going into second then back into first.
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"Johny B Good" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 25 Apr 2014 09:34:26 +0100, "Muddymike"
wrote:

On Thursday, April 24, 2014 12:57:25 PM UTC+1, Bill Wright wrote:

Sometimes (about every third time) there is considerable resistance on
the gear lever when I try to engage first.

not uncommon on old vehicles. Go into 2nd then retry first.


I second that, I had to do this with my old Volvo.


My driving instructor taght me the trick of shifting back to neutral
and releasing the clutch briefly before repeating the slection of
first gear. The ' try another gear' (you're not just limited to 2nd
unless you just want to get the car moving straight away despite the
extra wear on the clutch and reduced acceleration) is usually the last
resort when dealing with recalcitrant gearboxes.


Surprised no one has asked if the gearbox oil has ever been changed?

If never, it could be dirty, low or contaminated, or if it has been changed,
the wrong grade put in.


I had an Iveco based motorhome, and it was a bitch to get into second (first
was a crawler gear and hardly used unless pulling away up a very steep hill
full loaded, then engine was at 3.5k rpm at 7 mph in 1st gear, would sit at
2.6k rpm in top at 70mph)

I asked iveco what oil to buy as i wanted to change it, and they asked if i
was doing so because of difficulty getting into 2nd.

So they sold me a synthetic oil to replace the mineral oil in the box, an
official iveco solution for stiff 2nd gear, of which about 95% of the vans
suffered,

i got enough oil to do 2 changes, so i first changed the oil and drove for a
a few hundred miles, so to mix the dregs of the mineral oil with the
synthetic (or not mix as i believe happens) then drained the oil again and
put in fresh synthetic,

The difference in gear changes was amazing, every single gear became lighter
to engage, and i could now select 2nd at a stand still with the clutch down,
or even go into 2nd whilst slowing to a stop at lights,
2nd was still the hardest of the gears to engage, but it was a million times
better than before..... 1st couldnt be selected whilst moving (crawler gear
thing again, and it was located with the stick right over to the left and
back) but with the mineral oil in the box, even if i started off in 1st,
changing to 2nd was a fight no matter what i did... like going into third
then 2nd,

i really was ready to strip the box down expecting to find the syncro chewed
to pieces, and honestly didn't expect an oil change to do much, but i was
glad i did try it, a 10 litre bottle of synthetic oil was better than a
gearbox strip.... and likely to find nothing wrong anyway



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Gazz wrote:

I had an Iveco based motorhome, and it was a bitch to get into second ...
So they sold me a synthetic oil to replace the mineral oil in the box,


The difference in gear changes was amazing, every single gear became lighter
to engage, and i could now select 2nd at a stand still with the clutch down,
or even go into 2nd whilst slowing to a stop at lights,


i really was ready to strip the box down expecting to find the syncro chewed
to pieces, and honestly didn't expect an oil change to do much, but i was
glad i did try it, a 10 litre bottle of synthetic oil was better than a
gearbox strip.... and likely to find nothing wrong anyway


That takes me back to an Austin 1800 which really didn't like to
engage 1st when cold. I fiddled with the cable gear selectors for
a while, to no avail.

I happened to change to one of the (then) new multigrade oils
(engine and gearbox shared the same oil) and suddenly the problem
disappeared.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.
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Chris J Dixon wrote:
Gazz wrote:

I had an Iveco based motorhome, and it was a bitch to get into second ...
So they sold me a synthetic oil to replace the mineral oil in the box,


The difference in gear changes was amazing, every single gear became lighter
to engage, and i could now select 2nd at a stand still with the clutch down,
or even go into 2nd whilst slowing to a stop at lights,


i really was ready to strip the box down expecting to find the syncro chewed
to pieces, and honestly didn't expect an oil change to do much, but i was
glad i did try it, a 10 litre bottle of synthetic oil was better than a
gearbox strip.... and likely to find nothing wrong anyway


That takes me back to an Austin 1800 which really didn't like to
engage 1st when cold. I fiddled with the cable gear selectors for
a while, to no avail.

I happened to change to one of the (then) new multigrade oils
(engine and gearbox shared the same oil) and suddenly the problem
disappeared.

Chris


Surely the 1800 came after the introduction of yer basic 20/50?

Tim
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Tim+ wrote:

Chris J Dixon wrote:


That takes me back to an Austin 1800 which really didn't like to
engage 1st when cold. I fiddled with the cable gear selectors for
a while, to no avail.

I happened to change to one of the (then) new multigrade oils
(engine and gearbox shared the same oil) and suddenly the problem
disappeared.


Surely the 1800 came after the introduction of yer basic 20/50?


You are quite right, but it was certainly something different
that I tried. I don't think it was simply a winter grade. The
intervening 36 years have blurred all details of the cure, whilst
memory of the difficulties of negotiating the evening traffic
without a full complement of gears remains vivid.

That aspect was OK when I traded it in, though a good few other
problems remained. The battery connections were a bit loose, and
it didn't want to start when it came to let the salesman have a
test drive. I popped the bonnet and prodded the solenoid,
whereupon it burst into life. He was more than a little
surprised. Turned out he had been a golf pro and knew less about
cars than I did about golf.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.
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In article ,
Chris J Dixon wrote:
Surely the 1800 came after the introduction of yer basic 20/50?


You are quite right, but it was certainly something different
that I tried. I don't think it was simply a winter grade. The
intervening 36 years have blurred all details of the cure, whilst
memory of the difficulties of negotiating the evening traffic
without a full complement of gears remains vivid.


I had an Austin 1800 MkII for many a year - and don't remember selecting
first being anymore difficult than other BMC cars (or others of that era)
It was a cable change one too - later cars had a rod change. Which wore
out quickly. ;-)

--
*Real men don't waste their hormones growing hair

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.
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On 27/04/14 13:12, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Chris J Dixon wrote:
Surely the 1800 came after the introduction of yer basic 20/50?


You are quite right, but it was certainly something different
that I tried. I don't think it was simply a winter grade. The
intervening 36 years have blurred all details of the cure, whilst
memory of the difficulties of negotiating the evening traffic
without a full complement of gears remains vivid.


I had an Austin 1800 MkII for many a year - and don't remember selecting
first being anymore difficult than other BMC cars (or others of that era)
It was a cable change one too - later cars had a rod change. Which wore
out quickly. ;-)

I do remember having to change a gearbox casing on one though. IN
reverse, if you dropped the clutch with a bang, and they hadn't bothered
to fit the locking washer, the big nut on the layshaft would spin off
the shaft and mill its way through the gearbox casing..

I vividly remember borrowing a socket and LONG torque wrench and fitting
scaffold pipe over it to get the new nut back on at the most torque -
150in lb- that I have ever done a nut up to. And then banging the new
lock washer (there wasn't an old one of course) back to lock the
nut...before refitting the new casing, bearing and seal..






--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

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