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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000
mogga wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


Where I lived in the States, they were so that a speeding Police
Cruiser or Fire Engine could signal them on approach to turn green in
its favour.
Or it could be some remote control, allowing individual shut-off,
instead of block by block.
Or, if you see black helicopters marked 'GCHQ' hanging around, they
could be something else entirely.......

There was also a local experiment in the US to provide WiFi for
residents, and they used street light poles to hold the antennae, but
the whole scheme foundered and died. The equipment is probably still
there, if anybody wants it.

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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000, mogga wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.

TOJ.
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On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Colin Bignell

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On 12/12/2013 19:38, Davey wrote:
There was also a local experiment in the US to provide WiFi for
residents, and they used street light poles to hold the antennae, but
the whole scheme foundered and died. The equipment is probably still
there, if anybody wants it.


Westminster council offer free wireless access in Central London using
wireless access points mounted on lamp post. This is with BT, they use
an SSID of BTWiFi and the service is not that fast (well, it's free).

Now some hospitality buildings I visit also have their guest wireless
provided by BT, and it's the same BTWifi SSID name that's advertised to
use. That one is faster (sometimes upto 20Mbps), but occasionaly I come
across a guest that's unwittedly connected to the lamp post outside the
window, and they are complaining that it's slow. Such fun :-|

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On 12/12/2013 19:38, Davey wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000
wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetector same as the
old ones too.


Where I lived in the States, they were so that a speeding Police
Cruiser or Fire Engine could signal them on approach to turn green in
its favour.


Er . . the OP was asking about street lights, not traffic lights.
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On Thursday 12 December 2013 19:47 The Other John wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000, mogga wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.


Let the hacking being!

I want to see a whole street be a Cylon!

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http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:31:35 +0000, Nightjar wrote:

On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Colin Bignell


There's a new system coming out for early detection of failing lamps for
seamless replacement by use of the 'distress signals' they emit in the RF
spectrum shortly before failure. These signals are visible on handheld
spectrum analyers which can be driven around in vans checking the
'health' of such lamps; the antennas enable the distress signals to be
detected from further away, thereby shortening the route taken.
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:57:45 -0000, Sam Plusnet wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Sensors.

When a micro-chipped dog gets too close, the base of the lamp post
generates a static charge.



That'd be interesting to see!
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:31:35 +0000, Nightjar
wrote:

On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Colin Bignell


Yes I suspected that'd be an answer from someone!

They've done them over in New Moston already - and there is some radio
interference on our street on the bit near there. Having read today
what frequency these radio things work at then it might be them
causing problems with people's car alarm fob things. Although worrying
as there aren't lights desperately close to the affected part of the
road.
Someone has been in touch with Ofcom already about this interference
and we're waiting to see what they find.
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:47:20 GMT, The Other John
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000, mogga wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.

TOJ.



So how much does that bit of the system cost? Does it balance out the
savings in energy at some point over the life of the PFI? (25 years)
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:41:10 +0000, Tim Watts
wrote:


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.


Let the hacking being!


Is that possible?


I want to see a whole street be a Cylon!



--
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On Friday, December 13, 2013 11:23:19 AM UTC+13, Cursitor Doom wrote:
There's a new system coming out for early detection of failing lamps for
seamless replacement by use of the 'distress signals' they emit in the RF
spectrum shortly before failure. These signals are visible on handheld
spectrum analyers which can be driven around in vans checking the
'health' of such lamps; the antennas enable the distress signals to be
detected from further away, thereby shortening the route taken.


Here in NZ we need a lot of light houses, some on small offshore islands. Even when they became automated, they still needed their lights changed and fuel supplies.
So an ingenious person designed solar powered lighthouses, and that have five lights on a rotating mechanism. When a light fails, it automatically changes to a new bulb. So every few years somebody puts some new bulbs in place. But there's no urgency to do that.
Why don't they have street lights that change their own bulbs? OK, someone will steal them.
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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 22:23:19 +0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:31:35 +0000, Nightjar wrote:

On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Colin Bignell


There's a new system coming out for early detection of failing lamps for
seamless replacement by use of the 'distress signals' they emit in the RF
spectrum shortly before failure. These signals are visible on handheld
spectrum analyers which can be driven around in vans checking the
'health' of such lamps; the antennas enable the distress signals to be
detected from further away, thereby shortening the route taken.



And that costs more than waiting for people to complain a light is
out?
(Which in itself saves energy whilst lamps aren't coming on)

http://www.planningportal.gov.uk/pla...s/basestations
Are they the equivalent of picocells or microcells?
do they require separate planning?

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En el artículo , mogga
escribió:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for?


It's so they can be switched on and off remotely.

There's also an area here undergoing testing where the lights are dimmed
to half brightness after midnight. Unfortunately, the control gear
doesn't seem to be too reliable - about half of them have died
altogether. Suppose it still achieves the objective of saving money...

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On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


New generation of miniature speed/number plate cameras mounted in the
lamp post that transmit the pictures directly back to base. They will
also be used to enforce parking restrictions 24/365.


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On 12/12/2013 23:39, alan wrote:
On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


New generation of miniature speed/number plate cameras mounted in the
lamp post that transmit the pictures directly back to base. They will
also be used to enforce parking restrictions 24/365.



I thought they were RFI tag readers so they can track the compulsory ID
cards coming soon.
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On Thursday 12 December 2013 22:32 mogga wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:41:10 +0000, Tim Watts
wrote:


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.


Let the hacking being!


Is that possible?


Probably...

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http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:41:51 +0000
Roger Mills wrote:

On 12/12/2013 19:38, Davey wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000
wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have
little antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetector same
as the old ones too.


Where I lived in the States, they were so that a speeding Police
Cruiser or Fire Engine could signal them on approach to turn green
in its favour.


Er . . the OP was asking about street lights, not traffic lights.


True. Senior moment.
--
Davey.


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On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 22:48:16 +0000, Mike Tomlinson
wrote:

En el artículo , mogga
escribió:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for?


It's so they can be switched on and off remotely.


From where?


There's also an area here undergoing testing where the lights are dimmed
to half brightness after midnight. Unfortunately, the control gear
doesn't seem to be too reliable - about half of them have died
altogether. Suppose it still achieves the objective of saving money...

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mogga scribbled...


On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:31:35 +0000, Nightjar
wrote:

On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? ...


Mind control - time for the tin foil hat.

Colin Bignell


Yes I suspected that'd be an answer from someone!

They've done them over in New Moston already - and there is some radio
interference on our street on the bit near there. Having read today
what frequency these radio things work at then it might be them
causing problems with people's car alarm fob things. Although worrying
as there aren't lights desperately close to the affected part of the
road.
Someone has been in touch with Ofcom already about this interference
and we're waiting to see what they find.



You know the tories have been selling off frequencies to mobile
companies some of which are buggering up everything close by?

eg
http://amdram.co.uk/articles/radio-m...ency-sell-off/

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In message om,
"dennis@home" writes
On 12/12/2013 23:39, alan wrote:
On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


New generation of miniature speed/number plate cameras mounted in the
lamp post that transmit the pictures directly back to base. They will
also be used to enforce parking restrictions 24/365.



I thought they were RFI tag readers so they can track the compulsory ID
cards coming soon.


ID cards? Old technology. We'll all have compulsory RFID implants.
--
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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 08:24:55 -0000, Artic wrote:



You know the tories have been selling off frequencies to mobile
companies some of which are buggering up everything close by?

eg
http://amdram.co.uk/articles/radio-m...ency-sell-off/



Interesting!
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In article , mogga
writes

From where?


Dunno. Just says "centrally controlled"

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/45...amps_trial_for
_Wirral_gets_the_green_light/?

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/92...or_computer_co
ntrolled_street_lamps/

I've tried and failed to find a link on Wirral Council's website. I do
remember seeing one at the time and have contacted them to see if they
can come up with it.

The trial wasn't entirely successful, I think, as a lot of the new
control gear seemed to fail prematurely.

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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 10:20:54 +0000, Mike Tomlinson
wrote:

In article , mogga
writes

From where?


Dunno. Just says "centrally controlled"

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/45...amps_trial_for
_Wirral_gets_the_green_light/?

http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/92...or_computer_co
ntrolled_street_lamps/

I've tried and failed to find a link on Wirral Council's website. I do
remember seeing one at the time and have contacted them to see if they
can come up with it.

The trial wasn't entirely successful, I think, as a lot of the new
control gear seemed to fail prematurely.


Ta chuck!
Have a friend who reckons if they're centrally controlled then it'll
need an ofcom licence...
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Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian

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"Roger Mills" wrote in message
...
On 12/12/2013 19:38, Davey wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000
wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetector same as the
old ones too.


Where I lived in the States, they were so that a speeding Police
Cruiser or Fire Engine could signal them on approach to turn green in
its favour.


Er . . the OP was asking about street lights, not traffic lights.
--
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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian



How far are they sending a signal and how much does it cost?

The logical thing for a council to do is wait til people report a
street light is out. If no one does then it's not needed.
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Well, could someone explain what these look like? I did see some lamps with
a couple of spiky things on the top, well a friend spotted them, and the guy
who was fitting it told us they were to stop pigeons pooping on the
photocells, which I find hard to believe myself.
If they are they would need to have 10,000 volts on them and we wouldno
doubt find the birds falling on our heads dead as we walked down the street,
as these birds are incredibly stupid on one level, ie perching on dangerous
things.
Brian

--
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"Ian Jackson" wrote in message
...
In message om,
"dennis@home" writes
On 12/12/2013 23:39, alan wrote:
On 12/12/2013 19:12, mogga wrote:
We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


New generation of miniature speed/number plate cameras mounted in the
lamp post that transmit the pictures directly back to base. They will
also be used to enforce parking restrictions 24/365.



I thought they were RFI tag readers so they can track the compulsory ID
cards coming soon.


ID cards? Old technology. We'll all have compulsory RFID implants.
--
Ian



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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 08:39:29 +0000, Ian Jackson
wrote:



I thought they were RFI tag readers so they can track the compulsory ID
cards coming soon.


ID cards? Old technology. We'll all have compulsory RFID implants.



Enough to make you paranoid..

http://www.oldham.gov.uk/downloads/f...u siness_case

section three is all blanked out!
(remote monitoring and switching)
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On 13/12/2013 11:14, mogga wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian



How far are they sending a signal and how much does it cost?

The logical thing for a council to do is wait til people report a
street light is out. If no one does then it's not needed.


Er, that may have been a joke.
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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:17:23 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Well, could someone explain what these look like? I did see some lamps with
a couple of spiky things on the top, well a friend spotted them, and the guy
who was fitting it told us they were to stop pigeons pooping on the
photocells, which I find hard to believe myself.
If they are they would need to have 10,000 volts on them and we wouldno
doubt find the birds falling on our heads dead as we walked down the street,
as these birds are incredibly stupid on one level, ie perching on dangerous
things.
Brian



http://www.flickr.com/photos/25345470@N02/11351514855/

That should work.

You might not notice if you didn't suddenly have one outside your
window.
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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:21:05 +0000, newshound
wrote:

On 13/12/2013 11:14, mogga wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian



How far are they sending a signal and how much does it cost?

The logical thing for a council to do is wait til people report a
street light is out. If no one does then it's not needed.


Er, that may have been a joke.



No it does actually say it on one of the links - perhaps the Wirral
one

Night inspection of lights controlled by the central management system
would no longer be required, as faulty lights would be reported by the
computer.
http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/45...mps_trial_for/

--
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In message , mogga
writes
On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:17:23 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Well, could someone explain what these look like? I did see some lamps with
a couple of spiky things on the top, well a friend spotted them, and the guy
who was fitting it told us they were to stop pigeons pooping on the
photocells, which I find hard to believe myself.
If they are they would need to have 10,000 volts on them and we wouldno
doubt find the birds falling on our heads dead as we walked down the street,
as these birds are incredibly stupid on one level, ie perching on dangerous
things.
Brian



http://www.flickr.com/photos/25345470@N02/11351514855/

That should work.


They installed new lights along the main road in a nearby village,
Driving through today I paid a bit more attention to them and noticed
that whilst they had what I had assumed was a photocell type lump on
top, there was an aerial type thing sticking out of the top of that as
well
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On Friday 13 December 2013 11:37 mogga wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:17:23 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Well, could someone explain what these look like?


http://www.flickr.com/photos/25345470@N02/11351514855/


(Brian's blind BTW)

It looks like a little ( 10cm ) WIFI antenna - short, stubby and plastic
looking, sticking up vertically from the very top of the lamp casing.

--
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http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage



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On Friday 13 December 2013 09:35 Huge wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On 2013-12-12, mogga wrote:
On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:41:10 +0000, Tim Watts
wrote:


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.


Let the hacking being!


Is that possible?


SCADA systems are usually poorly protected.



And if "they" cannot apply solid network security to pumping stations and
the like, I very much doubt if anyone has bothered much about some street
lamps!

One of the reasons I do not want a smartmeter for electricity...

--
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http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

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On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, Brian Gaff wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian


Maybe it's just to control the timer?

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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:38:56 -0000, mogga wrote:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:21:05 +0000, newshound
wrote:

On 13/12/2013 11:14, mogga wrote:
On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian


How far are they sending a signal and how much does it cost?

The logical thing for a council to do is wait til people report a
street light is out. If no one does then it's not needed.


Er, that may have been a joke.



No it does actually say it on one of the links - perhaps the Wirral
one

Night inspection of lights controlled by the central management system
would no longer be required, as faulty lights would be reported by the
computer.
http://www.wirralglobe.co.uk/news/45...mps_trial_for/


Why not wait for complaints? I emailed my council when the light here went out, they replaced the bulb in 2 days.

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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

On Friday 13 December 2013 11:14 mogga wrote in uk.d-i-y:

On Fri, 13 Dec 2013 11:12:14 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Yes I noticed this.
Maybe they can phone home to let them know the bulb blew?

Brian



How far are they sending a signal and how much does it cost?

The logical thing for a council to do is wait til people report a
street light is out. If no one does then it's not needed.


Without knowing any details, I would not mind betting they form a simple
mesh network - so in the best case, each one only has to reach as far as the
next, or the one after that in the case of single unit failure.

Occasionally one would have a proper uplink.

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Default Radio Antenna on street lights

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 20:15:33 -0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:47:20 GMT, The Other John
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 19:12:58 +0000, mogga wrote:

We're getting some new street lights and have noticed they have little
antennas on the top.

What is it for? They look like they have a light detetctor same as the
old ones too.


They are remote controlled and dim-able, we've got them too.

TOJ.


We have them here also (West Cornwall). Many years ago, say in the
early 1960's, the street lights here were switched on from a control
centre in Redruth. A pulsing audio-frequency signal was sent through
the mains supply (about 1 pulse per second IIRC), which set a sort of
balance-wheel arrangement oscillating in the control box in the
lamp-post, until the amplitude got large enough to close a contact,
switching on an individual light or short sections of lights. The
slight variation in characteristics of the oscillating switch meant
that the lights didn't all come on together, but over a period of a
few seconds, so reducing the sudden drain on the mains supply, AIUI. I
used to have a Cossor CR100 communications receiver*, and obviously
something in the power supply wasn't very well screened, as I could
always hear when the street lights were being switched on. There was a
greatly enlarged model of this oscillating switch on display in the
Science Museum, which worked when you pressed one of the buttons that
were on every display case.

* http://www.shopingathome.com/images/B28.jpg


Adding crap to the mains supply is not a good idea, as you found out.

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