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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
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#2
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 It was claimed that it will be possible to charge a supercap in an electric car in one minute. I wonder what the current would be, and what size cables and connectors would be needed. Also I wonder what the charging station infrastructure would be. Bill |
#3
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 00:25, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Dribble as usual was extrapolating too far without actually thinking through the implications. While a high capacity super cap would be good new for all sorts of electronic gadgets, it would simply bring a different problem should you apply it to (longer range) transport. If you have a 50kWh battery and want to charge it, what charge rate do you need to use to charge it in a minute (or even ten)? (there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity) -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#4
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 00:25:59 +0000, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Second one as well. Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. |
#5
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 01:38, Bill Wright wrote:
Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 It was claimed that it will be possible to charge a supercap in an electric car in one minute. I wonder what the current would be, and what size cables and connectors would be needed. Also I wonder what the charging station infrastructure would be. Bill of course its possible. The car would get about 3 miles on it though. And imagine shorting it.. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#6
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 02:51, John Rumm wrote:
On 17/02/2013 00:25, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Dribble as usual was extrapolating too far without actually thinking through the implications. While a high capacity super cap would be good new for all sorts of electronic gadgets, it would simply bring a different problem should you apply it to (longer range) transport. If you have a 50kWh battery and want to charge it, what charge rate do you need to use to charge it in a minute (or even ten)? (there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity) NOT to increase capacity. To decrease internal resistance. faster charging, no more miles per charge. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#7
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote:
On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 00:25:59 +0000, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Second one as well. Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. People are so easy to mislead where green things are concerned. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#8
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
John Rumm wrote: there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity NOT to increase capacity. To decrease internal resistance. faster charging, no more miles per charge. 3x the capacity, 10 minute charging time ... still in the research labs. http://scitechdaily.com/new-lithium-ion-battery-design-uses-silicon-nanoparticles |
#9
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/000.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/001.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/002.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/003.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/004.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/005.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/006.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/007.png |
#10
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 08:14, Andy Burns wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] They're even dumber than that actually: have a free pdf file: http://www.thenanoresearch.com/upload/justPDF/0293.pdf -- David |
#11
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 09:46, Lobster wrote:
On 17/02/2013 08:14, Andy Burns wrote: The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] They're even dumber than that actually: have a free pdf file: http://www.thenanoresearch.com/upload/justPDF/0293.pdf .... oh, actually to be fair on the publisher, that's deliberately free: "Tsinghua University Press (TUP) provides Just Accepted as an optional and free service which allows authors to make their results available to the research community as soon as possible after acceptance. After a manuscript has been technically edited and formatted, it will be removed from the Just Accepted Web site and published as an ASAP article." -- David |
#12
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
I think the answer has to be 'very large'
Brian -- From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active "Bill Wright" wrote in message ... Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 It was claimed that it will be possible to charge a supercap in an electric car in one minute. I wonder what the current would be, and what size cables and connectors would be needed. Also I wonder what the charging station infrastructure would be. Bill |
#13
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 06:31, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 17/02/13 02:51, John Rumm wrote: On 17/02/2013 00:25, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Dribble as usual was extrapolating too far without actually thinking through the implications. While a high capacity super cap would be good new for all sorts of electronic gadgets, it would simply bring a different problem should you apply it to (longer range) transport. If you have a 50kWh battery and want to charge it, what charge rate do you need to use to charge it in a minute (or even ten)? (there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity) NOT to increase capacity. To decrease internal resistance. faster charging, no more miles per charge. That statement seems mutually contradictory... Even just a reduction in internal resistance would make more of the stored energy usefully available, and result in less dissipation in the cell itself. However what I was reading also suggested an increase in capacity as well: http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...ithium-battery -- Cheers, John. /================================================== ===============\ | Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk | |-----------------------------------------------------------------| | John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk | \================================================= ================/ |
#14
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On Sunday, February 17, 2013 12:25:59 AM UTC, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote:
http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Where is Drivel? He hasn't been around recently. Sectioned? Dead? Recovered? |
#15
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 07:50, Andy Burns wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: John Rumm wrote: there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity NOT to increase capacity. To decrease internal resistance. faster charging, no more miles per charge. 3x the capacity, 10 minute charging time ... still in the research labs. http://scitechdaily.com/new-lithium-ion-battery-design-uses-silicon-nanoparticles If you chase the source down, it really isn't some super breakthrough, its just about getting all that can be got out of lithium. I.e. instead of approximately 30-40% of theoretical power and energy density from cheap batteries made with various anodes, they can get nearer the real theoretical limits. So maybe a factor of two on energy density and several times higher on power density. Befoire you wrarp the battery in a crashproof safety housing. When I did the calculations of leccycars about 4-5 years ago, I realised that the batteries I was able to source for models were about 3 times heavier than the theory said the should be. However even a 3 times lighter battery wasn't going to make cars with 600 mile ranges practicable, or cheap. This might in ten years mean you have a 150 mile car, instead of a 50 mile car, that costs £15,000, instead of £30,000 and actually does 200k miles on one battery before its ****ed. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#16
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 08:14, Andy Burns wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). compared with carbon electrodes. But I have never seen carbon electrodes in any battery its been my misfortune to destroy. And plenty of other people are getting better than that using other ways: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithium-ion_batteries Note about twice the energy density of this 'new' research using ..air!. Something is missing, because lets say that standard today technology is capable of say 1Ah/gm at 3.7v That's 3.7watt hours per gram, or 3.7kwh hours per kilogram, or 37kwh per 10kg. So an EXISTING car better ought to be around 10kg!! No WAY is ANY commercial lithium battery anything LIKE that. e.g. an uncased pack of lithium cobalt technology http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...po_ Pack.html gets around 25watt hours in 200 grams. so about 125 watt hours per kilogram. A factor of at least 10, possibly 37 ...different from these 'claims' So something is not adding up. milliampere hours per gram is not power density and its not energy density. Its current density, and something is not making sense here. viz "At the meeting, Au said that his research group has demonstrated a coin-sized rechargeable lithium-air battery with a current density of 600 mAh/g, which is much higher than the current densities of 100 to 150 mAh/g of lithium-ion batteries. Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2011-02-lithium-air-batteries-high-energy-density.html#jCp" But again, without knowing what the terminal voltage is, its impossible to know what the energy density is. My 'what a BEV needs' boil down top at least 200Kwh in a battery weighing no more than 200kg. That should give you an all day driving sort of range. So a watt hour per gram essentially. For the complete battery. current state of the model world batteries are achieving an eighth of that. Nickel probably less than 1/15th of that. The world is full of wonderful claims that are couched in terms that hide the actuality. I have no doubt these guys have done good research, but by starting from a **** poor place and using terms that don't mean much in the real world, its hard to see that the claims amount to much. As I said, current batteries are about 8 times worse than they need to be. Even if these are three times better, its still not good enough. And the question remains. Three times better than what, and in what way? http://wiki.xtronics.com/index.php/Energy_density is worth a read. Petrol 12,200 Wh/kg So at 30% efficiency that's still around 4Kwh per kg. Lithium ion 130 - 1200 Wh/kg Even at 90% efficiency that's not cutting the mustard. And nowhere have I seen a 1.2Kwh/kg battery. The lower figure of around 130Wh per kg is more like what's around. [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/000.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/001.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/002.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/003.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/004.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/005.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/006.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/007.png Read em all and still no answers. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#17
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 09:46, Lobster wrote:
On 17/02/2013 08:14, Andy Burns wrote: The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] They're even dumber than that actually: have a free pdf file: http://www.thenanoresearch.com/upload/justPDF/0293.pdf Much better. Now try searching on the all important word 'voltage' "The voltage range is set to 0.012.0 V" is The ONLY mention of voltage with an actual NUMBER and hence power, and energy, at all! needless to say 4 ampere hours per gram at 0.01 volts is not exactly a huge energy density. but 2v - 8 watt hours per gram - would have investors leaping for their chequebooks. 8 kilowatts per kilogram is an 800Kwh per tonne battery. That's a 110bhp (average) 30 tonne truck all day! I see no investors leaping for their chequebooks. Ergo I conclude there is something more here than meets the eye. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#18
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 11:26, Brian Gaff wrote:
I think the answer has to be 'very large' Brian work on a tank of fuel being a couple of hundred kwh in electrical terms. 200kwh in 1/60th of an hours is 12MW. So about 13,000 amps at 240V.. Of course the supercap is only enough to get you five miles.. so probably about 130 amps realistically it should be possible to supply those sorts of peak loads at 'filling stations' but it wont be easy..or cheap. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#19
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 13:49, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 17/02/13 11:26, Brian Gaff wrote: I think the answer has to be 'very large' Brian work on a tank of fuel being a couple of hundred kwh in electrical terms. 200kwh in 1/60th of an hours is 12MW. So about 13,000 amps at 240V.. Of course the supercap is only enough to get you five miles.. so probably about 130 amps realistically it should be possible to supply those sorts of peak loads at 'filling stations' but it wont be easy..or cheap. But if the recharge station itself has mega-super-caps that it charges up relatively slowly, then the delivery of power to the charging station might be very achievable. (Can't help thinking that filling stations canopies represent a huge area desperate to be populated by solar cells. Though being built next-door to nuclear power stations would be more likely to fulfill the electricity requirement.) -- Rod |
#20
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 12:34, John Rumm wrote:
On 17/02/2013 06:31, The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 02:51, John Rumm wrote: On 17/02/2013 00:25, Grimly Curmudgeon wrote: http://www.upworthy.com/see-the-scie...-battery-l?g=2 Dribble as usual was extrapolating too far without actually thinking through the implications. While a high capacity super cap would be good new for all sorts of electronic gadgets, it would simply bring a different problem should you apply it to (longer range) transport. If you have a 50kWh battery and want to charge it, what charge rate do you need to use to charge it in a minute (or even ten)? (there are actually some even more interesting developments using hybrid LiPoly batteries with carbon nano tubes to increase capacity) NOT to increase capacity. To decrease internal resistance. faster charging, no more miles per charge. That statement seems mutually contradictory... Even just a reduction in internal resistance would make more of the stored energy usefully available, and result in less dissipation in the cell itself. Not significantly. WE get about 20% capacity loss from the 10 hour rate with models draining them in 5-10 minutes. travelling for a couple of *hours* they are already as good as they need to be. The key things is *recharge* losses when being banged full of electrons in a hurry. They get hot and that's where you lose power and edge up towards 'unsafe'.. realistically a safe if not especially efficient charge is 20 minutes or so on existing technology. I've seen prototypes quotes as being safe for 5 minutes. However what I was reading also suggested an increase in capacity as well: http://www.scientificamerican.com/ar...ithium-battery Boost of power is not boost of capacity. As I said, power is not that hard. model aircraft batteries are edging towards at 3 minute discharge times something like a horsepower per pound weight, or more. giving an overall performance level with airframe and motors stuff of around 500bhp-800bhp per tonne. Which is formula one (fuelled up) levels of performance. The problem is that its a wild ride, but it only lasts a couple of minutes. -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#21
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 13:57, polygonum wrote:
On 17/02/2013 13:49, The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 11:26, Brian Gaff wrote: I think the answer has to be 'very large' Brian work on a tank of fuel being a couple of hundred kwh in electrical terms. 200kwh in 1/60th of an hours is 12MW. So about 13,000 amps at 240V.. Of course the supercap is only enough to get you five miles.. so probably about 130 amps realistically it should be possible to supply those sorts of peak loads at 'filling stations' but it wont be easy..or cheap. But if the recharge station itself has mega-super-caps that it charges up relatively slowly, then the delivery of power to the charging station might be very achievable. (Can't help thinking that filling stations canopies represent a huge area desperate to be populated by solar cells. Though being built next-door to nuclear power stations would be more likely to fulfill the electricity requirement.) Actually the way I would do it is big **** off mechanical converters containing loads of rotational energy. I flew once in a research plane of Decca's. Massive rotary inverters powering the kit 'why do you not use transistorised inverters?' 'Well we tried. And when they pulled the gear up, it all stopped for 15 seconds' :-) Supercaps are nowhere near good enough yet. And the thing that makes em so fast charging - very low resistance - also makes them bloody dangerous. Imaging a screwdriver through a supercap with a few kwh of energy in it. You are talking serious amounts of TNT equivalent.at least a kg. Blow your bloody doors off! -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#22
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/13 08:14, Andy Burns wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: On 17/02/13 03:46, Ericp wrote: Uni of California announced they stuffed nanotubes in a lithium battery and found it lasted longer, held three times as much and charged in ten minutes. No,. they didn't. read the thing carefully. It had three times the POWER density, not three times the ENERGY density. Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). at what voltage though. 3 times the mah is not much point if the cell voltage drops a factor of 3 :-) I can do you a lot of mah per gram in a 2v battery.. :-) [Sorry the links are images, the Nano Research journal is dumb enough to think they can charge £30 for access to their online articles while giving a free peek at the first page] http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/000.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/001.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/002.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/003.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/004.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/005.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/006.png http://link.springer.com/static-content/0.6134/lookinside/935/art%253A10.1007%252Fs12274-013-0293-y/007.png -- Ineptocracy (in-ep-toc-ra-cy) a system of government where the least capable to lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a diminishing number of producers. |
#23
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
On 17/02/2013 13:49, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 17/02/13 11:26, Brian Gaff wrote: I think the answer has to be 'very large' Brian work on a tank of fuel being a couple of hundred kwh in electrical terms. 200kwh in 1/60th of an hours is 12MW. So about 13,000 amps at 240V.. Only 13A at 240 kV though! (smiles at the thought) |
#24
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
Onetap wrote:
Where is Drivel? He hasn't been around recently. Sectioned? Dead? Recovered? As a matter of irrelevance, an elderly friend of mine who sadly developed dementia has gone for a year with the NHS refusing to pay for his care. On investigation it turns out that he was down as having been sectioned and consequently they assumed he was in a special care home where charges go automatically to the NHS. In fact he has been in a private care home, at great cost to the family. There's now a barney going on about reimbursement. They thought he'd been sectioned because he very nearly was, a year ago, when he was playing up rather a lot and wouldn't take his meds or leave his home to go to hospital. Bill |
#25
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
newshound wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote: work on a tank of fuel being a couple of hundred kwh in electrical terms. 200kwh in 1/60th of an hours is 12MW. So about 13,000 amps at 240V.. Only 13A at 240 kV though! Simples ... convert all pylons next to roads into charge stations :-) |
#26
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Good gawd, Drivel was right, after all.
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 17/02/13 08:14, Andy Burns wrote: Yes, they *are* talking about 3x energy density in milliamp hours per gram (as well as discussing charge rates in amps per gram). at what voltage though. Seems the common 3.7V flavour of Lithium ion batteries are lithium nickel manganese cobalt oxide cathode with graphite anodes 3 times the mah is not much point if the cell voltage drops a factor of 3 :-) Sure. I've been trying to see what effect they say substituting a silicon anode for a graphite one would have on battery voltage, I think the graphite anodes are "inactive" within the the normal 3.7V Li-ion battery chemistry, so perhaps none at all. They do sprinkle in encouraging phrases such as "no significant effect on the battery working voltage" but I daresay the chemistry of rechargeable Lithium cells is well beyond schoolboy Zn/Cu red-ox equations. |
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