Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed, the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off. Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now, for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Tim Walters wrote:
Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed,
the lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched
off. Dad used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he
wanted. Now, for some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider
with S at the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the
buttons where the time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.


You dad isn't David is he ?

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

In article , Tim Walters
writes
Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed, the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off. Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now, for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where the
time appears.

A fair number of these mechanical timers use standard microswitches to
switch the load. If yours has one of these then it's easy to test if the
contacts have welded closed and is should be easy to replace if you can
solder. Pop the top off and have a look.
--
fred
BBC3, ITV2/3/4, channels going to the DOGs

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 15, 7:59*pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed, the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off. Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now, for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.


crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed, the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off. Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now, for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.


crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.


Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 19, 2:11*pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed, the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off. Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now, for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sat, 19 Sep 2009 06:31:49 -0700 (PDT), NT wrote:

However, I'll say this once again: we cant possibly fault find it
without knowing the details of how it works, blind, remotely, and
without being able to test it. Either fault find it yourself, or as you
cant, at the very least post a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type
of timer it is.

Aye "Ancient Smiths" doesn't really help a lot.

The only thing that I can help with is the function of the "Overide"
button. It "overides" the timer action, switching the thing off if
it's on or on if it's off.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Tim Walters wrote:

I hope these are good enough to be useful.

I hope someone takes you outside and kicks your ******** into your
pelvis, you ****witted wankstain. FFS learn how to use Usenet properly,
in particular learn not to post binaries to non-binary groups.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
. ..
Tim Walters wrote:

I hope these are good enough to be useful.

I hope someone takes you outside and kicks your ******** into your
pelvis, you ****witted wankstain. FFS learn how to use Usenet properly,
in particular learn not to post binaries to non-binary groups.


Wasn't there a way to say that without being so offensive?

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On 20/09/09 10:56, Tim Walters wrote:

Off-topic? I was asked for photos. Can you direct me to the rulebook
which explains how and where to post photographs? Thank you.

yes, but you shouldn't post them here, upload them to somewhere (e.g.
photobucket if you don't already have web hosting or flickr/picasa account)

then post the URL here ...

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
On 20/09/09 10:56, Tim Walters wrote:

Off-topic? I was asked for photos. Can you direct me to the rulebook
which explains how and where to post photographs? Thank you.

yes, but you shouldn't post them here, upload them to somewhere (e.g.
photobucket if you don't already have web hosting or flickr/picasa
account)

then post the URL here ...


Thanks for this info. And apologies.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.


Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010113.JPG
http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010114.JPG
http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010115.JPG

Thanks

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Tim Walters wrote:

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
. ..
Tim Walters wrote:

I hope these are good enough to be useful.

I hope someone takes you outside and kicks your ******** into your
pelvis, you ****witted wankstain. FFS learn how to use Usenet properly,
in particular learn not to post binaries to non-binary groups.


Wasn't there a way to say that without being so offensive?

Absolutely not, if you're clever enough to find Altopia then you're also
clever enough to realise that posting binaries to a non-binary group is
a hanging offence. If you don't then you are ****witted wankstain.

Had you been standing before me at the time I would have delivered the
kicking necessary.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Huge wrote:

All hail news.individual.net, which kindly discarded Tim's off-topic
binaries.

Worth every penny of E10/yr.

I post via NIN but I also receive feeds from other sources and one of
those carried the binaries, sadly.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 20, 11:22*am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off..
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...t/P1010115.JPG

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...t/P1010115.JPG

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.



Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...t/P1010118.JPG

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 20, 5:24*pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

....
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

....
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted. Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...


"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls
some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is
programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched
off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted.
Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider
with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons
where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a
standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and
L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent
guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable
timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is
switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...


"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."


That's odd. I uploaded thse in exactly the same way as the first lot. The
links work fine for me. I see they got bunched together. Could that be it?
Separating them...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On 21/09/09 01:47, NT wrote:
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim wrote:

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

Oh come on. It's obvious how to fix that.

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On 20 Sep, 03:28, (Steve Firth) wrote:
Tim Walters wrote:
I hope these are good enough to be useful.

[rant]
in particular learn not to post binaries to non-binary groups.

Still the charmer, Steve...

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

Andy Dingley wrote:

On 20 Sep, 03:28, (Steve Firth) wrote:
Tim Walters wrote:
I hope these are good enough to be useful.

[rant]
in particular learn not to post binaries to non-binary groups.

Still the charmer, Steve...

Care to place odds on the chances of him doing it again?

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 21, 2:12*am, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

....
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls
some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is
programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched
off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted.
Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider
with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons
where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a
standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and
L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red. The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off, I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent
guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable
timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is
switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t....

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

That's odd. I uploaded thse in exactly the same way as the first lot. The
links work fine for me. I see they got bunched together. Could that be it?

yes :) I didnt look.

Separating them...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 21, 2:12 am, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:



"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls
some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is
programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched
off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted.
Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row
on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider
with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons
where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a
standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and
L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of
the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red.
The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off,
I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn
mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a
local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent
guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that
work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable
timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is
switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing
in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

That's odd. I uploaded thse in exactly the same way as the first lot. The
links work fine for me. I see they got bunched together. Could that be it?

yes :) I didnt look.

Separating them...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.


I've never soldered anything before but I'll give it a try. I'll let you
know how I get on.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Much appreciated.

Tim

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

The message
from Andy Dingley contains these words:

Still the charmer, Steve...

It's all that consumption of adulterated olive oil that does it
................ :-)

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 21, 5:57*pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 21, 2:12 am, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

....
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

....
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which controls
some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is
programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually switched
off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted..
Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row
on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical slider
with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons
where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a
standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1 and
L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of
the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red..
The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back off,
I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn
mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a
local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very competent
guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that
work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable
timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is
switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing
in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider? What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it..
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t....

"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

That's odd. I uploaded thse in exactly the same way as the first lot. The
links work fine for me. I see they got bunched together. Could that be it?

yes :) I didnt look.

Separating them...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.

I've never soldered anything before but I'll give it a try. I'll let you
know how I get on.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Much appreciated.

Tim

First you'll need to practice for an afternoon first, soldering is a
skill. Secondly those will most likely be soldered in using HMP
solder, for which HMP solder and an HMP iron is needed. If you don't
want to go the hmp route, follow the tracks on the PCB and solder to
another pad further along with ordinary lead solder (electronics, not
plumbers) and connect to your Rs using some other type of connection.

But you need to work out what value resistors you need first.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 21, 5:57 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 21, 2:12 am, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 5:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 20, 11:22 am, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 19, 2:11 pm, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

"NT" wrote in message

...
On Sep 15, 7:59 pm, "Tim Walters"
wrote:

Hello. My parents have got an ancient Smiths timer which
controls
some
outside lights. At the moment, no matter how the timer is
programmed,
the
lights are on all the time, unless the timer is actually
switched
off.
Dad
used to fiddle with it and, miraculously, it did what he wanted.
Now,
for
some reason, it won´t.

The timer has an override button on the left. Then there's a row
on
three
buttons (hours, minutes, and set). Then there´s a vertical
slider
with
S
at
the top and N at the bottom. There's a window above the buttons
where
the
time appears.

Thanks for any suggestions.

crikey, dont give us anything to work on. Get a multimeter, open
the
timer and see whats going on.

Ok. There are three screw-type contacts (like the ones inside a
standard
3-pin plug). One is labelled COM, the other teo are labelled L1
and
L2.
(There´s actually a mirror-image arrangement on the other side of
the
timer
but these are all dead.) There are only two wires - black and red.
The
red
goes into the COM and the black into L1. After taking the back
off,
I
could
see three small cylinders connected to the contacts. A black burn
mark
showed that something had burnt out. I took the thing down to a
local
electrical supplies wholesale shop and showed it to a very
competent
guy
there. Getting a new timer wasn't an option because the ones that
work
with
just 2 wires are limited to four hours. Getting a new programmable
timer
would mean re-wiring the system.

The guy suggested I try putting the black wire into L2, and maybe
I
would
have to reverse program the thing (on = off and vice versa). I
tried
this
but it didn't work. The lights stay on when the timer itself is
switched
on.
The difficulty is I'm not completely sure how to program the thing
in
the
first place. For instance, what do N and S mean on the slider?
What
exactly
is the purpose of the Override button?

Can anyone suggest anything?

that the use of L2 hasnt worked indicates something more serious
than
a fried switch contact (the most common cause). However, I'll say
this
once again: we cant possibly fault find it without knowing the
details
of how it works, blind, remotely, and without being able to test it.
Either fault find it yourself, or as you cant, at the very least
post
a bunch of pics so we've a clue what type of timer it is.

Here are 3 pictures. I hope they're good enough.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

Thanks

Great. So
1. its a digital timer
2. the power ratings indicate its almost certainly triac switching,
not relay
3. the black patch on the pcb should have a fried component on the
other side - it would be usful to get a pic of the whole of that
board, component side.
4. Since this is a triac switcher, the using the L2 trick wont work.

Here are three shots of the underside.

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/...www.eurotrad-t...

"Not Found
The requested object does not exist on this server. The link you
followed is either outdated, inaccurate, or the server has been
instructed not to let you have it."

That's odd. I uploaded thse in exactly the same way as the first lot.
The
links work fine for me. I see they got bunched together. Could that be
it?

yes :) I didnt look.

Separating them...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.

I've never soldered anything before but I'll give it a try. I'll let you
know how I get on.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Much appreciated.

Tim

First you'll need to practice for an afternoon first, soldering is a
skill. Secondly those will most likely be soldered in using HMP
solder, for which HMP solder and an HMP iron is needed. If you don't
want to go the hmp route, follow the tracks on the PCB and solder to
another pad further along with ordinary lead solder (electronics, not
plumbers) and connect to your Rs using some other type of connection.

But you need to work out what value resistors you need first.


Very strange. I took the timer to an electronics store and the guy behind
the counter tested all the components and says they're ok. (He knows zilch
about timers but a lot about circuit boards.)

So, we've got a timer apparently in working order, and outside lights that
work, but when you try to programme the thing, the lights stay on all the
time.

What now?

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

On Sep 22, 6:24*pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 21, 5:57 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message
....

80s smiths timer...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.

I've never soldered anything before but I'll give it a try. I'll let you
know how I get on.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Much appreciated.

Tim

First you'll need to practice for an afternoon first, soldering is a
skill. Secondly those will most likely be soldered in using HMP
solder, for which HMP solder and an HMP iron is needed. If you don't
want to go the hmp route, follow the tracks on the PCB and solder to
another pad further along with ordinary lead solder (electronics, not
plumbers) and connect to your Rs using some other type of connection.

But you need to work out what value resistors you need first.


Very strange. I took the timer to an electronics store and the guy behind
the counter tested all the components and says they're ok. (He knows zilch
about timers but a lot about circuit boards.)

So, we've got a timer apparently in working order, and outside lights that
work, but when you try to programme the thing, the lights stay on all the
time.

What now?

so the fault in the timer isnt the resistors, its something else. Time
to get your fault finding skills out. One option is to replace the
triac, but theres no gtee that'll fix it.


NT

Ancient Smiths timer for outside lights
 

"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 22, 6:24 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message
...
On Sep 21, 5:57 pm, "Tim Walters" wrote:
"NT" wrote in message
...

80s smiths timer...

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010116.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010117.JPG

http://www.eurotrad-traductores.net/P1010118.JPG

Looks like those resistors form part of a rectifier and reservoir cap
supply, and excess current has flown causing them to fry open circuit.
So you need to fix the problem and replace the Rs, preferably with
slightly higher power rated ones. Or maybe there's no other circuit
problem, only inadequately specced Rs. Going to be fun working out
what value they should be.

I've never soldered anything before but I'll give it a try. I'll let you
know how I get on.

Thanks a lot for all your help. Much appreciated.

Tim

First you'll need to practice for an afternoon first, soldering is a
skill. Secondly those will most likely be soldered in using HMP
solder, for which HMP solder and an HMP iron is needed. If you don't
want to go the hmp route, follow the tracks on the PCB and solder to
another pad further along with ordinary lead solder (electronics, not
plumbers) and connect to your Rs using some other type of connection.

But you need to work out what value resistors you need first.


Very strange. I took the timer to an electronics store and the guy behind
the counter tested all the components and says they're ok. (He knows zilch
about timers but a lot about circuit boards.)

So, we've got a timer apparently in working order, and outside lights that
work, but when you try to programme the thing, the lights stay on all the
time.

What now?

so the fault in the timer isnt the resistors, its something else. Time
to get your fault finding skills out. One option is to replace the
triac, but theres no gtee that'll fix it.


Fault finding skills? I barely know how to spell that.

I've looked up triac on wikipedia, so I know vaguely what it does, but I'm
not sure what it looks like. The pictures given don't help much. Where
exactly is the triac in the timer pix I posted?