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#1
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
The current rage for cold fill only machines is all very well for bio
powders and combi boilers, but some of us want a machine that has a hot fill. And before it is suggested that a machine never gets to draw hot water, that is not the case with my current machine which invariably fills up with hot water. Hence is it possible to convert a cold fill to a h & c fill machine??? Has anyone done it?? TVMIA |
#2
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#3
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#4
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
Palindrme wrote:
But it would be fairly straightforward to do - without interfering with the machine and/or invalidating its warranty. It's obviously not as good as a machine taking both supplies and able to set its own temperature for different cycles or parts of them. But without changing things round inside the machine it will take in hot water not just for the wash, but also for each rinse in the cycle (I think there are usually three). Using hot water to rinse isn't necessary, and the small amount you save from using gas-heated water to wash in will be eaten up several times over by doing hot rinses. |
#5
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
Martin Pentreath wrote:
Palindrme wrote: But it would be fairly straightforward to do - without interfering with the machine and/or invalidating its warranty. It's obviously not as good as a machine taking both supplies and able to set its own temperature for different cycles or parts of them. But without changing things round inside the machine it will take in hot water not just for the wash, but also for each rinse in the cycle (I think there are usually three). Using hot water to rinse isn't necessary, and the small amount you save from using gas-heated water to wash in will be eaten up several times over by doing hot rinses. As in, "It's obviously not as good as a machine taking both supplies and able to set its own temperature for different cycles or parts of them." My old thing actually appears to use hot (or at least warm) water for rinses, as the clothes are still pretty warm after the spin cycle. I can get the washing to the line and all pegged up without my fingers freezing off...so that is one economy measure I think that I will skip. -- Sue |
#6
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
wrote in message ups.com... The current rage for cold fill only machines is all very well for bio powders and combi boilers, but some of us want a machine that has a hot fill. And before it is suggested that a machine never gets to draw hot water, that is not the case with my current machine which invariably fills up with hot water. Hence is it possible to convert a cold fill to a h & c fill machine??? Has anyone done it?? I would look to the water inputs, rather than to the circuitry and valve control. A caveat - I do not know if the "no-hot-setting" machines use plastic that cannot take heat, e.g., hot water will soften the plastic hose connection and the hose will slowly come off the valve threads. ("How-to" follows the types of easily used valves) 1) If you are handy with plumbing, you could mount lever-type ball valves with spigots and use them to block cold water and pass through hot water into the cold water input. 2) There are wall-mounted manual "lever-throw" shutoff valves made specifically for washing machine input water control that take hose conenctions. I would use this type of shut-off because the lever is one motion, and many do not require "hard plumbing". To use it, it would be a "yes-no" kind of selection. Some use one lever to simultaneously control flow on both outputs, and some are two-lever types that control the hot and cold water separately. The two lever-type (one for hot and one for cold) is the easiest for your application -otherwise, you will need two one-lever wall-mount types. 3) There are also mixing valves (made to keep pipes in walls from sweating by mixing some hot water in with the cold) that could be used to get a "hot" wash from a cold machine. It would go in-line to the cold water input, but you would need to adjust the mixing proportions for the particular wash, usually with a screwdriver or wrench. Not as clean as the lever. 4) There are "selector" "Y"s that you could use, where you turn a small lever on the "Y" to open one side and shut off the other. Most are made to select without pressure on them, and the valve will be hot. And you are always holding it and moving the hose around ------- I have never seen a cold-only input machine, but less us assume there is no hot water input, just cold, for purposes of discussion. (The cold water input on a dual input machine will be connected in the same manner) The idea is to feed hot water only into the machine. Connect the non-machine end of the hose on the cold water connection of the machine to an open "Y". If the new wall-mounted valve is not so equipped, connect a back-flow valve on each free end of the "Y", so water can only flow into the wash machine. Connect one end of the backcheck valve on the "Y" through one side of the wall mounted one-throw shutoff valve, and connect the shutoff valve to the cold water spigot. Now you can turn off the cold water. Connect the other backcheck valve to the "second one-lever valve"/ "other side of the two lever valve", and connect the shutoff valve to the hot water spigot. Now you can turn on the hot water. Mark the valve-lever(s) position for hot wash and cold wash. To wash hot, turn off the cold water lever and turn on the hot water lever. Only hot water will be fed into the machine. To wash cold, reverse the levers. or something like that... TVMIA |
#8
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
In article , Ed Sirett
wrote: If on the occasion you really want a hot fill Just turn off the cold water at the faucet. Not elegant, but works. Chuck P. |
#9
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#10
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#11
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
In alt.engineering.electrical Martin Pentreath wrote:
| wrote: | | I cant think of any reason to do it though, especially as it'll give | you poorer wash results. | | Hi NT, | | The reason would be to save money and energy by heating the water by | gas rather then electricity. Technically speaking, it's the same energy. One might argue that gas heating more easily allows some heat to escape via the flue. The money it costs, however, can be altogether different matter. This assumes a utility energy supply. People with a natural free energy supply make different choices based on the supply and storage capacity. And usually, gas isn't among the free choices whereas electricity more commonly is. And gas is usually a fossil fuel (hydrogen generated from electricity of course is quite the opposite). | I don't understand why you think the result would be a poorer wash. So | long as the water in the machine during the wash phase is at the | temperature required by the powder (say 40?C) it doesn't matter how | you heat it. If always a cold rince is OK, go for it. -- |---------------------------------------/----------------------------------| | Phil Howard KA9WGN (ka9wgn.ham.org) / Do not send to the address below | | first name lower case at ipal.net / | |------------------------------------/-------------------------------------| |
#12
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 21 Nov 2006 15:11:28 GMT someone who may be
wrote this:- This assumes a utility energy supply. People with a natural free energy supply make different choices based on the supply and storage capacity. And usually, gas isn't among the free choices whereas electricity more commonly is. And gas is usually a fossil fuel (hydrogen generated from electricity of course is quite the opposite). However, the choice of having a hot and cold fill washing machine is being eliminated by the manufacturers, simply in order to make things easier for themselves. If hot water is available heated by a solar panel burning electricity to heat cold water is not a good idea on any grounds. -- David Hansen, Edinburgh I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54 |
#13
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#14
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
"Ed Sirett" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 01:06:54 -0800, Martin Pentreath wrote: wrote: The current rage for cold fill only machines is all very well for bio powders and combi boilers, but some of us want a machine that has a hot fill. And before it is suggested that a machine never gets to draw hot water, that is not the case with my current machine which invariably fills up with hot water. Hence is it possible to convert a cold fill to a h & c fill machine??? Has anyone done it?? TVMIA I think it would be a horribly complicated operation, involving not only replumbing the inside workings of the machine, but also reprogramming the circuit board! Are there really no machines left that have hot fill? I've not had cause to buy one in about 12 years, but I'm sure my current model is reaching the end of its natural life, and I'd like to have a hot fill one (even with my combi, I'm not sure why having a combi should make any difference). I installed an AEG today and even it did not have hot fill, what chance lesser machines? -- Whirlpool seem to be the only manufacturer to still fit hot and cold feeds, well according to the Sainsbury online electrical store. I would have thought with the increasing popularity of solar water heating there would be an increased demand for such machines not less. H |
#15
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
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#16
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:04:16 -0000 Hlah wrote :
I would have thought with the increasing popularity of solar water heating there would be an increased demand for such machines not less. The problem, IIRC, is that modern machines use a lot less water than older ones, and given the reaction time of thermostats there is reckoned to be a risk of dumping very hot water on clothes which need to be washed on a cool setting. I don't know about anyone else, but I never use a hotter wash than 50C. But no doubt cost saving comes into it too. -- Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk |
#17
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
Martin Pentreath wrote:
wrote: I cant think of any reason to do it though, especially as it'll give you poorer wash results. Hi NT, The reason would be to save money and energy by heating the water by gas rather then electricity. Well, with gas you've got boiler flue losses and pipe heat losses. OTOH the gas that makes the leccy probably uses even more energy. I don't understand why you think the result would be a poorer wash. So long as the water in the machine during the wash phase is at the temperature required by the powder (say 40C) it doesn't matter how you heat it. Heating from cold to target temp in the washtub gives the washpowder more time in the tub, as the wash timer doesnt start ticking till its heated. Second it gives the powder the chance to work at different temps, instead of all at the same temp. This is especially important with bio powders, fill the tub with 60C water and you get no bio action, fill it at 20 and heat it, and it will work in a different way at the different temp bands it goes thru, giving a better wash. So you've got 2 ways in which you'll see poorer results. The 3rd problem is that the hot fill water will be too hot for the clothes in many cases. But really far more important is just that its a waste of human time and energy. NT |
#18
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
I noticed most of the replies were from Britain - so a question about these
cold water machines... (We tend to "Warm wash" here) So what do asthmatics in Britain/Europe do when (per doctor's instructions) they have to wash their bedding in hot water to kill the house mites that aggravate asthma? Are there machines available on prescription, or bedding services for them? Do you add 3x-4x more chlorine and oxide bleach, since they are much less chemically active in cold water? Is all cold water softened in Britain, or do you always add some borax or other softener, or do you just throw clothes away when the fibers have built up with soap residue after a couple years? What do you do about diapers ("nappies")? (Cold water washing diapers in high efficiency machines here is a sure road to e-coli, in those and subsequent loads, and soap residue is a leading source of diaper rash here.) Just curious. wrote in message ups.com... The current rage for cold fill only machines is all very well for bio powders and combi boilers, but some of us want a machine that has a hot fill. And before it is suggested that a machine never gets to draw hot water, that is not the case with my current machine which invariably fills up with hot water. Hence is it possible to convert a cold fill to a h & c fill machine??? Has anyone done it?? TVMIA |
#19
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
hob wrote:
I noticed most of the replies were from Britain - so a question about these cold water machines... (We tend to "Warm wash" here) So what do asthmatics in Britain/Europe do when (per doctor's instructions) they have to wash their bedding in hot water to kill the house mites that aggravate asthma? Are there machines available on prescription, or bedding services for them? Do you add 3x-4x more chlorine and oxide bleach, since they are much less chemically active in cold water? Is all cold water softened in Britain, or do you always add some borax or other softener, or do you just throw clothes away when the fibers have built up with soap residue after a couple years? What do you do about diapers ("nappies")? (Cold water washing diapers in high efficiency machines here is a sure road to e-coli, in those and subsequent loads, and soap residue is a leading source of diaper rash here.) Just curious. They are cold *fill* machines. They still hot wash (very hot if you wish) - using an electric element in the machine to heat the water. They just don't connect to both the hot and cold water supply in order to fill. Many machines now use a very tiny amount of water - so the heating requirement is much, much less than times gone by - and they use much, much less water than the US machines I have seen. -- Sue |
#20
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
"Palindr?me" wrote in message ... hob wrote: I noticed most of the replies were from Britain - so a question about these cold water machines... (We tend to "Warm wash" here) So what do asthmatics in Britain/Europe do when (per doctor's instructions) they have to wash their bedding in hot water to kill the house mites that aggravate asthma? Are there machines available on prescription, or bedding services for them? Do you add 3x-4x more chlorine and oxide bleach, since they are much less chemically active in cold water? Is all cold water softened in Britain, or do you always add some borax or other softener, or do you just throw clothes away when the fibers have built up with soap residue after a couple years? What do you do about diapers ("nappies")? (Cold water washing diapers in high efficiency machines here is a sure road to e-coli, in those and subsequent loads, and soap residue is a leading source of diaper rash here.) Just curious. They are cold *fill* machines. They still hot wash (very hot if you wish) - using an electric element in the machine to heat the water. They just don't connect to both the hot and cold water supply in order to fill. Many machines now use a very tiny amount of water - so the heating requirement is much, much less than times gone by - and they use much, much less water than the US machines I have seen. ok - thanks -- Sue |
#21
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input
by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. -- For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...ll-306005-.htm |
#22
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 14/11/2020 22:15, Potrice wrote:
I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. Cold water only fill is used these days so that you don't "cook" in common stains. If you fill with hot water you could make stains permanent. -- mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk |
#23
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On Saturday, 14 November 2020 at 23:22:50 UTC, alan_m wrote:
Cold water only fill is used these days so that you don't "cook" in common stains. If you fill with hot water you could make stains permanent. Not much change from fourteen years ago! :-) |
#24
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
Yes but the issue was often that in many homes where the water is only
heated by an immersion heater, switching to hot might not actually give hot water, so then the machine would still need to heat the water itself, and also of course the control equipment to create the exact temp needed would not work if scolding hot water came in first. I suspect these variables are why they went over to cold fill, they then have full control. Brian -- This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from... The Sofa of Brian Gaff... Blind user, so no pictures please Note this Signature is meaningless.! "Potrice" wrote in message groupdirect.com... I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. -- For full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...ll-306005-.htm |
#25
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On Sun, 15 Nov 2020 00:45:52 -0800 (PST), polygonum_on_google
wrote: On Saturday, 14 November 2020 at 23:22:50 UTC, alan_m wrote: Cold water only fill is used these days so that you don't "cook" in common stains. If you fill with hot water you could make stains permanent. Not much change from fourteen years ago! :-) Except I couldn't find the author Potrice there, adding to the puzzle of why we get these posts. -- Dave W |
#26
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
Στις 15/11/2020 12:15 π.μ., ο/η Potrice *γραψε:
I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. In Europe, all washing machinew have been and are cold fill. They all are now computer controlled, with a microcontroller obviously, and a PCB, of course. Why would you want to make it hot fill as you're not saving up anything, here most houses have solar water heaters so hot water is practically free, even with minimum sunshine in winter.it's also very usual in Israel (in hebrew it's dud shemesh- דיד (שמש in greek it's heliothermo-ηλιόθερμο. there are many types of cold fill washing machines here. from 5 kilos up to 10 and with the usual universal brushed motors for AC to brushless direct drive motors. traditionally they had asynchronous motors with run capacitors and electromechanical programmers. very durable.you could even take the motor for rewinding. now the whole motor-tacho assembly must be exchanged if defective. |
#27
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
"Dimitris Tzortzakakis" wrote in message ...
Στις 15/11/2020 12:15 π.μ., ο/η Potrice *γραψε: I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. In Europe, all washing machinew have been and are cold fill. They all are now computer controlled, with a microcontroller obviously, and a PCB, of course. Why would you want to make it hot fill as you're not saving up anything, here most houses have solar water heaters so hot water is practically free, even with minimum sunshine in winter.it's also very usual in Israel (in hebrew it's dud shemesh- דיד (שמש in greek it's heliothermo-ηλιόθερμο. there are many types of cold fill washing machines here. from 5 kilos up to 10 and with the usual universal brushed motors for AC to brushless direct drive motors. traditionally they had asynchronous motors with run capacitors and electromechanical programmers. very durable.you could even take the motor for rewinding. now the whole motor-tacho assembly must be exchanged if defective. So, it seems that the common opinion is that body oil stains on sheets,pillowcases, socks, underwear, etc and oil and grease stains in clothes will come out cleaner with COLD than with HOT water? I find that very hard to believe. -- Buffalo |
#28
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 01/12/2020 00:17, Buffalo wrote:
So, it seems that the common opinion is that body oil stains on sheets,pillowcases, socks, underwear, etc and oil and grease stains in clothes will come out cleaner with COLD than with HOT water? I find that very hard to believe. No, its that washing machines are designed to take out the majority of common stains which for some require a cold wash and for others maybe a hotter wash so they start with cold and then gradually heat the water. It is the detergent doing most of the work rather than the hot water. For instance, try getting blood out using hot water first. Consider hand washing dinner plates and cooking utensils - you are not going to plunge your hands into 90C water but you can still get all the fat etc. off with much colder water and some washing up liquid. If you take a bath or shower what temperature water do you use to clean yourself of all the bodily fats etc.? You'd probably have to give yourself a boil wash if you didn't use soap, gel or shampoo. 95% of machine washes in my household are with cold water, no heating, in my washing machine. -- mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk |
#29
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 01 Dec 2020, Buffalo wrote
"Dimitris Tzortzakakis" wrote in message ... Στις 15/11/2020 12:15 π.μ., ο/η Potrice *γραψε: I have just bought a single fill washing machine and modified the water input by using a switched 3/4 inch switched tap splitter. I have to turn the hot water on by hand, and when it's full turn it off and turn the cold on.--- But I have noticed when it is filling it automatically switches from the left hand fill in the soap dispenser, to the middle one. Meaning the two solenoids (hot and cold) are still fitted and working. All they've done is blank off the hot fitting and siamesed the two pipes internally. So all that would be need to make it dual fill would be One pipe fitting and two bits of hose. In Europe, all washing machinew have been and are cold fill. They all are now computer controlled, with a microcontroller obviously, and a PCB, of course. Why would you want to make it hot fill as you're not saving up anything, here most houses have solar water heaters so hot water is practically free, even with minimum sunshine in winter.it's also very usual in Israel (in hebrew it's dud shemesh- דיד (שמש in greek it's heliothermo-ηλιόθερμο. there are many types of cold fill washing machines here. from 5 kilos up to 10 and with the usual universal brushed motors for AC to brushless direct drive motors. traditionally they had asynchronous motors with run capacitors and electromechanical programmers. very durable.you could even take the motor for rewinding. now the whole motor-tacho assembly must be exchanged if defective. So, it seems that the common opinion is that body oil stains on sheets,pillowcases, socks, underwear, etc and oil and grease stains in clothes will come out cleaner with COLD than with HOT water? I find that very hard to believe. You seem to be confusing the terms "cold fill" and "cold wash": the machine will heat the cold-fill water when you set it for a hot wash. Given the reduced amount of water used by modern washing machines and the distance in most houses between the HW tank and the washing machine, most of the "hot fill" will be what's currently sitting in the pipes, and the machine will have to heat it up anyway if you're going to run a hot wash. -- Cheers, Harvey |
#30
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 01/12/2020 11:49, HVS wrote:
On 01 Dec 2020, Buffalo wrote So, it seems that the common opinion is that body oil stains on sheets,pillowcases, socks, underwear, etc and oil and grease stains in clothes will come out cleaner with COLD than with HOT water? I find that very hard to believe. You seem to be confusing the terms "cold fill" and "cold wash": the machine will heat the cold-fill water when you set it for a hot wash. Given the reduced amount of water used by modern washing machines and the distance in most houses between the HW tank and the washing machine, most of the "hot fill" will be what's currently sitting in the pipes, and the machine will have to heat it up anyway if you're going to run a hot wash. I had a hot+cold fill machine and it took 30 minutes to fill with hot, so I started off with a programme that did a cold fill and pushed the knob in and turned it round to the right programme and pulled it out again to do what I wanted it to do (which started by heating the water up). I think they are supposed to have valves to equalise the pressure of hot and cold which was probably not set right. (Y-hoses were provided for if you only had a cold tap.) I have noted that the big clanky knob method, which turns round during operation was continued even when they obviously used microcontrollers to sequence the operations. Now the big knob (if present) stays still. -- Max Demian |
#31
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
On 01/12/2020 11:49, HVS wrote:
You seem to be confusing the terms "cold fill" and "cold wash": the machine will heat the cold-fill water when you set it for a hot wash. Not really confusing the issues. I was pointing out that a modern machine doesn't need to do a boil wash to remove certain contaminants from clothes and that the temperature of the water possibly plays a lesser part in the total washing process. Irrespective of the final temperature of the water and/or the selected program the wash will start with a cold wash with detergent to try and remove common stains that may be cooked in if hotter water is first used. With this initial cold wash the machine has enough water to complete the wash. It doesn't discard this water or detergent for the rest of the wash - it just heats the water, if required. There is no point at which a hot feed would be used on a modern machine. Given the reduced amount of water used by modern washing machines and the distance in most houses between the HW tank and the washing machine, most of the "hot fill" will be what's currently sitting in the pipes, and the machine will have to heat it up anyway if you're going to run a hot wash. Especially as modern machines are also designed to use a lot less water than their counter parts of yesteryear. The last machine I've owned that had a (working) hot feed was 30 years ago! -- mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk |
#32
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Convert cold fill washing machine to hot and cold fill
"alan_m" wrote in message ...
On 01/12/2020 00:17, Buffalo wrote: So, it seems that the common opinion is that body oil stains on sheets,pillowcases, socks, underwear, etc and oil and grease stains in clothes will come out cleaner with COLD than with HOT water? I find that very hard to believe. No, its that washing machines are designed to take out the majority of common stains which for some require a cold wash and for others maybe a hotter wash so they start with cold and then gradually heat the water. It is the detergent doing most of the work rather than the hot water. For instance, try getting blood out using hot water first. Consider hand washing dinner plates and cooking utensils - you are not going to plunge your hands into 90C water but you can still get all the fat etc. off with much colder water and some washing up liquid. If you take a bath or shower what temperature water do you use to clean yourself of all the bodily fats etc.? You'd probably have to give yourself a boil wash if you didn't use soap, gel or shampoo. 95% of machine washes in my household are with cold water, no heating, in my washing machine. Ever do your dishes in cold water? -- Buffalo |
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