Oven - RCD or not?
 

My original plan was to have 2 ring mains in the kitchen - one NOT protected
by the RCD which would carry just 4 things - the CH boiler, the fridge, the
freezer and the oven (which needs a 13A supply). The other ring would carry
everything else - kettle, washing machine, toaster, telly, etc., etc.

The guy has dropped a b*****k and made the NON-protected circuit a radial,
feeding just the boiler, the fridge and the freezer. He's used 2.5mm cable
and I know that as long as the MCB is 20A rated, that, in itself, is OK. The
oven is now on the protected circuit and I know that that circuit - even
given the extra loading of the oven - is, in itself, OK.

But it's not what I planned and it's not what I asked for.

To put it right would mean that he would need to use 4 junction boxes, which
would be under the floorboards in the bathroom - the same floorboards that
are going to be sheeted over with hardboard or thin ply before having vinyl
cushionfloor lain on top - in other words, not easy to get to them if needed
later on. OR, the other way to put it right would mean hacking chases in 3
of the kitchen walls - 2 of which have been newly plastered, the other newly
tiled :o(

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not (get
him to put things right)??

TIA
John.

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not
(get
him to put things right)??

I reckon you'd get the fridge, freezer, oven and CH on the 20A radial, which
will run in 2.5mm cable.

Most ovens are 2.2kW plus a bit for the fan. Fridge and freezer won't run
continuously and are probably only about 300W each when firing. CH will take
very little. Even if the oven takes 3kW, there's still 1.6kW to run the
other appliances, which is easily enough.

Christian.

Christian McArdle wrote:
So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or
not (get him to put things right)??

I reckon you'd get the fridge, freezer, oven and CH on the 20A
radial, which will run in 2.5mm cable.

Most ovens are 2.2kW plus a bit for the fan. Fridge and freezer won't
run continuously and are probably only about 300W each when firing.
CH will take very little. Even if the oven takes 3kW, there's still
1.6kW to run the other appliances, which is easily enough.

Christian.

I think he knew that and that was his original plan - however as I
understand it, the sparky ( or he forgot to communicate properly to the
sparky?) has forgotten about the oven and put it on the RCD side of the
circuit - he want to know if people have had problems with the oven on the
RCD side of the circuit - Our oven is on the RCD side and so far we've not
had any problems

Jon

I think he knew that and that was his original plan - however as I
understand it, the sparky ( or he forgot to communicate properly to the
sparky?) has forgotten about the oven and put it on the RCD side of the
circuit - he want to know if people have had problems with the oven on the
RCD side of the circuit - Our oven is on the RCD side and so far we've not
had any problems

Ah. I thought the original plan was to put a ring on the non-RCD side and
the sparky only put the oven on the RCD side because he thought the 20A
radial wasn't man enough, even though actually it is.

Christian.

Christian McArdle wrote:
I think he knew that and that was his original plan - however as I
understand it, the sparky ( or he forgot to communicate properly to
the sparky?) has forgotten about the oven and put it on the RCD side
of the circuit - he want to know if people have had problems with
the oven on the RCD side of the circuit - Our oven is on the RCD
side and so far we've not had any problems

Ah. I thought the original plan was to put a ring on the non-RCD side
and the sparky only put the oven on the RCD side because he thought
the 20A radial wasn't man enough, even though actually it is.

Christian.

Yes when I read it at first, it was the same thing that jumped into my head
also, mainly as we've been through the same sort of thing!

jon

"Jonathan Pearson" wrote in message
...
Christian McArdle wrote:
I think he knew that and that was his original plan - however as I
understand it, the sparky ( or he forgot to communicate properly to
the sparky?) has forgotten about the oven and put it on the RCD side
of the circuit - he want to know if people have had problems with
the oven on the RCD side of the circuit - Our oven is on the RCD
side and so far we've not had any problems

Ah. I thought the original plan was to put a ring on the non-RCD side
and the sparky only put the oven on the RCD side because he thought
the 20A radial wasn't man enough, even though actually it is.

Christian.

Yes when I read it at first, it was the same thing that jumped into my
head also, mainly as we've been through the same sort of thing!

jon


Yep, your right Jon. Initially wanted two rings, the oven being on the
non-protected one. Sparky has put oven on protected ring and yes, I was just
wondering if that will be a problem regarding nuisance tripping or other
problem. If it's OK for an oven to be protected by the RCD then I'll leave
it as it is, thereby avoiding lots of hassle.

Thanks,
John.

On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:35:00 +0100,it is alleged that "John"
spake thusly in uk.d-i-y:

[snip tale of best laid plans etc]

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not (get
him to put things right)??

TIA
John.

The oven being on the RCD side of things shouldn't matter. _Some_
stoves/cookers/ovens can trip an RCD, especially if not used for a
period of time and the element gets damp. However we have one on a
30mA protected circuit and it has never tripped.

--
There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home.
- Ken Olson, President of DEC, 1977

Yep, your right Jon. Initially wanted two rings, the oven being on the
non-protected one. Sparky has put oven on protected ring and yes, I was
just
wondering if that will be a problem regarding nuisance tripping or other
problem. If it's OK for an oven to be protected by the RCD then I'll leave
it as it is, thereby avoiding lots of hassle.

There shouldn't be a problem with nuisance tripping, at least not after it
has been used once to prove that the element doesn't need drying out. The
main problem is that a single kitchen ring with all the major appliances
could be overloaded, if you have a tumble dryer, washing machine, dishwasher
and microwave already on it.

Christian.

John wrote:
If it's OK for an oven to be protected by the RCD then I'll leave
it as it is, thereby avoiding lots of hassle.

I've a whole-house 30mA RCD. It hasn't ever tripped. I've
an electric oven, hob, kettle and immersion heater on it.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
I think he knew that and that was his original plan - however as I
understand it, the sparky ( or he forgot to communicate properly to the
sparky?) has forgotten about the oven and put it on the RCD side of the
circuit - he want to know if people have had problems with the oven on
the
RCD side of the circuit - Our oven is on the RCD side and so far we've
not
had any problems

Ah. I thought the original plan was to put a ring on the non-RCD side and
the sparky only put the oven on the RCD side because he thought the 20A
radial wasn't man enough, even though actually it is.

Christian.


Reading my own post again, I suppose it does sound confusing - sorry :o)

I never wanted a radial circuit in the first place, but rather two rings -
one RCD protected and one not, the UNprotected ring to take the oven,
fridge, freezer and boiler. Sparky made mistake and ran a 2.5 from
CUboilerfridgefreezer and ended it there, forgetting about oven and then
back to CU.

So, oven is now on protected ring and I'm wondering if I'm going to get lots
of nuisance tripping or some other problem because of that. The house is
going to be let out so I don't want the tenants ringing every fart's end
saying that they can't use the oven.

Given the hassle it'll be to get him to put his mistake right, should I just
leave the oven on the protected circuit?

John.

"Chip" wrote in message
n.net...
On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:35:00 +0100,it is alleged that "John"
spake thusly in uk.d-i-y:

[snip tale of best laid plans etc]

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not
(get
him to put things right)??

TIA
John.

The oven being on the RCD side of things shouldn't matter. _Some_
stoves/cookers/ovens can trip an RCD, especially if not used for a
period of time and the element gets damp. However we have one on a
30mA protected circuit and it has never tripped.

--
There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home.
- Ken Olson, President of DEC, 1977

I can't type fast enough - messages are appearing before I've even replied
to another :o)

Thanks everybody, I'll leave it as it is.

John.

Given the hassle it'll be to get him to put his mistake right, should I
just
leave the oven on the protected circuit?

How many of the following devices are there (or expected to be) on the RCD
side:

1. Washing machine.
2. Tumble Dryer
3. Dishwasher
4. Microwave.
5. Kettle.
6. Oven.

Christian.

John wrote:

I was just wondering if that will be a problem regarding nuisance tripping or other
problem. If it's OK for an oven to be protected by the RCD then I'll leave
it as it is, thereby avoiding lots of hassle.

I believe the argument is that the construction of cooker elements can
lead to a small amount of leakage, it really depends on how bad this is
and how much other equipment is sharing the same RCD.
And the rating of the RCD of course ;)

Our oven and hob is on a 30ma RCD protected circuit though ;)

Lee
--
Email address is valid, but is unlikely to be read.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
Given the hassle it'll be to get him to put his mistake right, should I
just
leave the oven on the protected circuit?

How many of the following devices are there (or expected to be) on the RCD
side:

1. Washing machine.
2. Tumble Dryer
3. Dishwasher
4. Microwave.
5. Kettle.
6. Oven.

Christian.

One each of 1, 4, 5, and 6.

John.

1. Washing machine.
2. Tumble Dryer
3. Dishwasher
4. Microwave.
5. Kettle.
6. Oven.

One each of 1, 4, 5, and 6.

I wouldn't worry, then. 32A ring, yes?

Christian.

"Christian McArdle" wrote in message
. net...
1. Washing machine.
2. Tumble Dryer
3. Dishwasher
4. Microwave.
5. Kettle.
6. Oven.

One each of 1, 4, 5, and 6.

I wouldn't worry, then. 32A ring, yes?

Christian.

Yep, that's right Christian.

J.

John wrote:
My original plan was to have 2 ring mains in the kitchen - one NOT protected
by the RCD which would carry just 4 things - the CH boiler, the fridge, the
freezer and the oven (which needs a 13A supply). The other ring would carry
everything else - kettle, washing machine, toaster, telly, etc., etc.

The guy has dropped a b*****k and made the NON-protected circuit a radial,
feeding just the boiler, the fridge and the freezer. He's used 2.5mm cable
and I know that as long as the MCB is 20A rated, that, in itself, is OK. The
oven is now on the protected circuit and I know that that circuit - even
given the extra loading of the oven - is, in itself, OK.

But it's not what I planned and it's not what I asked for.

To put it right would mean that he would need to use 4 junction boxes, which
would be under the floorboards in the bathroom - the same floorboards that
are going to be sheeted over with hardboard or thin ply before having vinyl
cushionfloor lain on top - in other words, not easy to get to them if needed
later on. OR, the other way to put it right would mean hacking chases in 3
of the kitchen walls - 2 of which have been newly plastered, the other newly
tiled :o(

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not (get
him to put things right)??

TIA
John.



just wondered why you planed the job and don't trust the electrician you
employed to do the work?

"mitchd" wrote in message
...
John wrote:
My original plan was to have 2 ring mains in the kitchen - one NOT
protected by the RCD which would carry just 4 things - the CH boiler, the
fridge, the freezer and the oven (which needs a 13A supply). The other
ring would carry everything else - kettle, washing machine, toaster,
telly, etc., etc.

The guy has dropped a b*****k and made the NON-protected circuit a
radial, feeding just the boiler, the fridge and the freezer. He's used
2.5mm cable and I know that as long as the MCB is 20A rated, that, in
itself, is OK. The oven is now on the protected circuit and I know that
that circuit - even given the extra loading of the oven - is, in itself,
OK.

But it's not what I planned and it's not what I asked for.

To put it right would mean that he would need to use 4 junction boxes,
which would be under the floorboards in the bathroom - the same
floorboards that are going to be sheeted over with hardboard or thin ply
before having vinyl cushionfloor lain on top - in other words, not easy
to get to them if needed later on. OR, the other way to put it right
would mean hacking chases in 3 of the kitchen walls - 2 of which have
been newly plastered, the other newly tiled :o(

So, should the oven be RCD-protected (leave things as they are) or not
(get him to put things right)??

TIA
John.
just wondered why you planed the job and don't trust the electrician you
employed to do the work?


Because he's not actually an electrician. He's a builder who's doing lots of
other stuff for us and who also does wiring as well - building control have
been informed Part P, of course.

John.

On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 20:51:45 +0100, "John"
scrawled:

He's a builder who's doing lots of
other stuff for us and who also does wiring as well

Oh dear. Probably best if its all on a 30mA RCD then.
--
Stuart @ SJW Electrical

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