Anyone know the best way to remove and replace either the upstairs or downstairs newel post without hacking and butchering the staircase, which I want to retain?

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Cordless Crazy wrote:

Anyone know the best way to remove and replace either the upstairs or
downstairs newel post without hacking and butchering the staircase,
which I want to retain?

If at all possible, keep the bottom foot of so of the old newel post which
is firmly attached to the staircase. Cut it off at the appropriate level,
bevel the top, and fit a new upper section. You'll find lots of good
information and "How to" guides on the Richard Burbidge site at
http://www.richardburbidge.co.uk/main.asp?page=270

Burbidge also do a video which most sheds sell for about a fiver which shows
you how to renew newels and bannisters etc. Well worth the money - and
refundable if you buy your kit from them.
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Cheers,
Set Square
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Set Square wrote:
Burbidge also do a video which most sheds sell for about a fiver which shows
you how to renew newels and bannisters etc. Well worth the money - and
refundable if you buy your kit from them.

Refundable? I'm not surprised! That's about the cost of a single
spindle from them (they are, IMO, *very* expensive).

Set Square wrote:

If at all possible, keep the bottom foot of so of the old newel post which
is firmly attached to the staircase. Cut it off at the appropriate level,
bevel the top, and fit a new upper section.

Not easy to get a square cut at this angle. It's worth clamping a
section of 4 x 2 to the base as a saw guide.

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Chris Bacon wrote:

Set Square wrote:
Burbidge also do a video which most sheds sell for about a fiver
which shows you how to renew newels and bannisters etc. Well worth
the money - and refundable if you buy your kit from them.

Refundable? I'm not surprised! That's about the cost of a single
spindle from them (they are, IMO, *very* expensive).

It's expensive if you buy from the sheds. I got all my stuff from a
Builder's Merchant at nearly 40% below the retail price.

The video is worth a fiver - even if you don't get it refunded - or even if
the do the job with non-Burbidge products. The principles are the same.
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Cheers,
Set Square
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In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Stuart Noble wrote:

Set Square wrote:

If at all possible, keep the bottom foot of so of the old newel post
which is firmly attached to the staircase. Cut it off at the
appropriate level, bevel the top, and fit a new upper section.

Not easy to get a square cut at this angle. It's worth clamping a
section of 4 x 2 to the base as a saw guide.

I cut through 2 sides of mine with a circular saw, using a clamped-on piece
of wood as a guide for each cut - and then finished off with a hand saw.
This gave a nice square cut. Then I put a suitably sized polish tin against
each vertical face and drew round it to get a nice rounded top shape - which
I achieved with a hand plane. You can see the general effect in this rather
grainy photo.
http://www.hampton-magna.freeserve.co.uk/after.JPG
If anyone is interested, I could take a close-up of the relevant bit of the
newel post.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
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http://www.hampton-magna.freeserve.co.uk/after.JPG
If anyone is interested, I could take a close-up of the relevant bit of
the
newel post.
--
Cheers,
Set Square


Very flash, I haven't seen spindles like that before. Do they come pre-cut
to size and you fit the handrail accordingly? I wouldn't like to have to cut
each one. How about the spindles on the landing, would they be the same
length as the stairs?

Grumble

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Grumble wrote:


Very flash, I haven't seen spindles like that before. Do they come
pre-cut to size and you fit the handrail accordingly? I wouldn't like
to have to cut each one. How about the spindles on the landing, would
they be the same length as the stairs?

Grumble

It's Burbidge's Fusion system, and comes in chrome or gold finish - with the
wood in a choice of pine, beech or oak. You can get pine spindles, too -
rather than metal if you prefer.

The spindles are supplied at a fixed length - with the end fixings attached.
The landing spindles are longer, and their fixings are perpendicular -
whereas the stair fixings are angled - and slightly flexible to accommodate
a range of stair gradients.

To get the handrail at the right height for the spindles, you have to cut
the old bottom newel off in the right place - although you could shorten the
new top section of the bottom newel a bit if necessary. The bracket for the
top end of the handrail fits round the top newel - so you slide it up and
down to suit.

This is what it looks like from the top:
http://www.mills37.plus.com/stairs.jpg

And, for good measure, this is what it used to look like:
http://www.mills37.plus.com/before-up.jpg
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Cheers,
Set Square
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My main concern would be structural strength of the newel post when connecting the new piece to it.

Surely a good ole swing or bash from the pesky kids will have it bent double and busted in no time?

What sort of fixing detail is there from old to new?

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
wrote:

On 14 Sep,
"Set Square" wrote:


And, for good measure, this is what it used to look like:
http://www.mills37.plus.com/before-up.jpg

Is that how the house builders left it? I very much doubt if that
complies with building regs.

I must get round to doing mine when I get a spare round tuit.

It's how it was built in the 60's. It presumably complied with the regs at
that time - before anyone started worrying about not having any gaps which a
100mm sphere could fall through.
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Cheers,
Set Square
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Set Square wrote:

http://www.mills37.plus.com/before-up.jpg

Nice hat

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Stuart Noble wrote:

Set Square wrote:

http://www.mills37.plus.com/before-up.jpg

Nice hat

Thanks! g
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Set Square
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In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Cordless Crazy wrote:

My main concern would be structural strength of the newel post when
connecting the new piece to it.

Surely a good ole swing or bash from the pesky kids will have it bent
double and busted in no time?

What sort of fixing detail is there from old to new?

Not quite sure what you're replying to, because you didn't quote any
previous messages.

If you're referring to the Burbidge Fusion system in my photo, the socket
bolts *very* firmly to the top of the sawn-off base. You have to drill into
the side of the base, 2 or 3 inches from the top (there's a precise
measurement, which I forget) and also drill down from the centre of the top.
You then insert a barrel nut into the horizontal hole, and a length of 1/2"
or so threaded bar goes down the vertical hole, and screws into the barrel
nut. The base for the new upper section then goes onto this threaded bar and
is held in place by a big nut. It ain't going to move!
You can see the idea in Figure 5 of
http://www.richardburbidge.co.uk/PDF/fusionfitting.pdf
The wooden - almost circular - newel top is quite a tight fit in the socket,
and is held in with a couple of screws. I see no reason why you couldn't put
some gripfill in the socket for added security.

The alternative system - with a more conventional turned upper newel post -
uses a substantial spigot on the bottom of the upper part which fits into a
hole drilled down the centre of the base. The spigot has a hole in the
middle, and two cuts which divide it into four quadrants. A tapered dowel
tapped into the hole spreads these quadrants until the whole thing is a
tight fit in the base. It is then all glued together.

Obviously, neither system is quite as robust as the original solid newel -
but they ain't bad!
--
Cheers,
Set Square
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Set Square wrote:
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Cordless Crazy wrote:


My main concern would be structural strength of the newel post when
connecting the new piece to it.

Surely a good ole swing or bash from the pesky kids will have it bent
double and busted in no time?

What sort of fixing detail is there from old to new?


Not quite sure what you're replying to, because you didn't quote any
previous messages.


[deleted]

The alternative system - with a more conventional turned upper newel post -
uses a substantial spigot on the bottom of the upper part which fits into a
hole drilled down the centre of the base. The spigot has a hole in the
middle, and two cuts which divide it into four quadrants. A tapered dowel
tapped into the hole spreads these quadrants until the whole thing is a
tight fit in the base. It is then all glued together.


Do you tap the dowel into the hole & then have to try & squeeze the
newel post on? Or does the doweling move into the hole as you tap the
newel post down onto the bottom newel?


Obviously, neither system is quite as robust as the original solid newel -
but they ain't bad!

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Hamie wrote:

Set Square wrote:

The alternative system - with a more conventional turned upper newel
post - uses a substantial spigot on the bottom of the upper part
which fits into a hole drilled down the centre of the base. The
spigot has a hole in the middle, and two cuts which divide it into
four quadrants. A tapered dowel tapped into the hole spreads these
quadrants until the whole thing is a tight fit in the base. It is
then all glued together.


Do you tap the dowel into the hole & then have to try & squeeze the
newel post on? Or does the doweling move into the hole as you tap the
newel post down onto the bottom newel?

I've never fitted one of these - I used the Fusion system, which is
different.

But the Burbidge instructions seem to indicate that you tap the dowel in
*before* fitting the spigot into the base - tapping it in bit by bit and
repeatedly trying it for size - and cutting off the excess dowel once the
spigot is the right size.

Although it doesn't tell you to do this, I suppose you could set a short
length of dowel into the bottom centre of the hole - which would push the
tapered dowel in a bit further as the spigot went in. Could be a bit hit or
miss, though!
--
Cheers,
Set Square
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