Not my day today.

Siemens Chappie came around yesterday to replace our gas meter (they go
out of calibration). Harmless action - we joyfully let him in, he fixes
the new meter - cheerfully reignites the boiler, and refuses the coffee
(says he is allergic to caffine).

Today we noticed a wiff of a leak.

So Transco guy comes within the hour of an emergency call, finds and
fixes the leak. The leak is on our side of the meter, somehow made worse
by the meter refitting but since he is such a nice chap he does the
magic and the repair is free. Great. I offer him coffee. He declines
(what's wrong with my coffee?), and asks directions to the boiler for
reignition.

Ah... a problem. Not all the burners are lighting. Some of them are
covered in soot, says he. This boiler is a disgrace, it should not be
allowed to operate. Illegal. He'll have to cap it. We'll have no baths
'til it's fixed. Doom time. It's pub time in about an hour from now, and
my wiff will be more of an issue down there than the smell of gas. Cold
bath awaits electric kettle.... Arggghhhh! ;-(

The question. What's the chance a fifteen year old rarely serviced
(probably never since new) will need replacement? The boiler is a
Potterton Kingfisher II CF80. It's used all year for hot water and
heating as necessary through a standard heating header loft tank /
cylinder setup for a three bed house. Or will I get away by a Corgi
engineer cleaning and renewing parts?

Thinking back, if I laced the Siemens guy's coffee with something (and
made him drink it), the meter wouldn't have been compulsory changed and
I wouldn't be in this mess. :-(

--
The Wiff guy (allegedly Adrian C)

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Adrian C wrote:

Not my day today.

Siemens Chappie came around yesterday to replace our gas meter (they
go out of calibration). Harmless action - we joyfully let him in, he
fixes the new meter - cheerfully reignites the boiler, and refuses
the coffee (says he is allergic to caffine).

Today we noticed a wiff of a leak.

So Transco guy comes within the hour of an emergency call, finds and
fixes the leak. The leak is on our side of the meter, somehow made
worse by the meter refitting but since he is such a nice chap he does
the magic and the repair is free. Great. I offer him coffee. He
declines (what's wrong with my coffee?), and asks directions to the
boiler for reignition.

Ah... a problem. Not all the burners are lighting. Some of them are
covered in soot, says he. This boiler is a disgrace, it should not be
allowed to operate. Illegal. He'll have to cap it. We'll have no baths
'til it's fixed. Doom time. It's pub time in about an hour from now,
and my wiff will be more of an issue down there than the smell of
gas. Cold bath awaits electric kettle.... Arggghhhh! ;-(

The question. What's the chance a fifteen year old rarely serviced
(probably never since new) will need replacement? The boiler is a
Potterton Kingfisher II CF80. It's used all year for hot water and
heating as necessary through a standard heating header loft tank /
cylinder setup for a three bed house. Or will I get away by a Corgi
engineer cleaning and renewing parts?

Thinking back, if I laced the Siemens guy's coffee with something (and
made him drink it), the meter wouldn't have been compulsory changed
and I wouldn't be in this mess. :-(

Sounds like it's just in need of a service. No reason why a good de-coke
won't restore it to health and happiness.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

Adrian C wrote:

The leak is on our side of the meter, somehow made worse
by the meter refitting but since he is such a nice chap he does the
magic and the repair is free.

I once had a saga with BG/Transco about meter installations. They had
suspended their meter from the gas installation pipes, although their
service pipe was protected by a flexible connection. The dead-weight of
the meter wouldn't have been a problem;however, the gas isolating valve
was a plug-cock, which had probably never been serviced since it's
installation pre-war (WW2). It was stiff, requiring a huge 2-handed
heave to operate it. The steel gas pipe moved before the gas valve,
cracking the pipe jointing compound on the elbow below the floor and
starting a leak. Probably something similar happened with yours.;

The leak wouldn't have been a problem, it was less than 1% of the
permissible leakage rate. However, I had summoned BG to a smell of gas
in the meter cupboard & the fitter condemned my installation because he
could smell gas. He couldn't detect a leak with a manometer. In fact
the service pipe was leaking and BG knew the whole local distribution
system was rotten, having sprayed it internally with a sealant.

BG said they would never install meters without supports & the
householder must have removed the supports. When I moved house, I found
the meter was suspended from the gas service pipe. The gas isolating
valve was stiff and had probasbly never been serviced since etc....

The various gas ombudsmen/consumers councils/whatever are wholly
useless.

They've installed new meters around here &, on a house I looked at,
used the old 3" pitch/fibre sleeve through the cavity walls to run the
new service pipes. The sleeve doesn't extend through the cavity and
isn't sealed to the leaves. CORGI only deals with issues downstream of
the primary meters.


The Kingfisher boiler will probably clean up & go another 30 years.

On Fri, 12 Aug 2005 19:56:44 +0100, Set Square wrote:

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Adrian C wrote:

Not my day today.

Siemens Chappie came around yesterday to replace our gas meter (they
go out of calibration). Harmless action - we joyfully let him in, he
fixes the new meter - cheerfully reignites the boiler, and refuses
the coffee (says he is allergic to caffine).

Today we noticed a wiff of a leak.

So Transco guy comes within the hour of an emergency call, finds and
fixes the leak. The leak is on our side of the meter, somehow made
worse by the meter refitting but since he is such a nice chap he does
the magic and the repair is free. Great. I offer him coffee. He
declines (what's wrong with my coffee?), and asks directions to the
boiler for reignition.

Ah... a problem. Not all the burners are lighting. Some of them are
covered in soot, says he. This boiler is a disgrace, it should not be
allowed to operate. Illegal. He'll have to cap it. We'll have no baths
'til it's fixed. Doom time. It's pub time in about an hour from now,
and my wiff will be more of an issue down there than the smell of
gas. Cold bath awaits electric kettle.... Arggghhhh! ;-(

The question. What's the chance a fifteen year old rarely serviced
(probably never since new) will need replacement? The boiler is a
Potterton Kingfisher II CF80. It's used all year for hot water and
heating as necessary through a standard heating header loft tank /
cylinder setup for a three bed house. Or will I get away by a Corgi
engineer cleaning and renewing parts?

Thinking back, if I laced the Siemens guy's coffee with something (and
made him drink it), the meter wouldn't have been compulsory changed
and I wouldn't be in this mess. :-(

Sounds like it's just in need of a service. No reason why a good de-coke
won't restore it to health and happiness.

If it's just the result of total neglect and not corrosion then there is a
good chance that a _VERY_ thorough clean up may get the boiler working
safely again.

Once soot begins to build up it tend to get worse very rapidly and can
soon block a heat exchanger after that there'd be trouble.
This type of older style boiler really does need cleaning out each year,
you've now found out why.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

Ed Sirett wrote:
If it's just the result of total neglect and not corrosion then
there is a
good chance that a _VERY_ thorough clean up may get the boiler working
safely again.

Once soot begins to build up it tend to get worse very rapidly and can
soon block a heat exchanger after that there'd be trouble.
This type of older style boiler really does need cleaning out each year,
you've now found out why.

Yikes. The Transco man did mention a bit of corrosion. The boiler is
boxed in behind a difficult partition which I'll work at moving today.
If I give the repairer easier access to the unit we might get better
luck with the cleaning job. That is, if he is keen on helping us avoid
the need to purchase a new boiler & installation.

Anyone recommend someone good on regular Corgi servicing around the
Harrow/Stanmore area of NW London? Don't make me go to British Gas!!

Thanks :-)

--
Adrian C

Aidan wrote:
I once had a saga with BG/Transco about meter installations. They had
suspended their meter from the gas installation pipes, although their
service pipe was protected by a flexible connection. The dead-weight of
the meter wouldn't have been a problem

Our last Gas meter was a very small electronic affair, half the height
of a house brick. It's 5 years after replacement is a huge thing, volume
of three house bricks. And mechanical. Me thinks the last probably got
changed because it had a battery life to worry about. New Meter is
hanging on the pipes, no securement to the wall. I quizzed the Transco
guy about it when he was fixing the leak - he didn't have an issue with it.

The steel gas pipe moved before the gas valve,
cracking the pipe jointing compound on the elbow below the floor and
starting a leak. Probably something similar happened with yours.;

Yes, an elbow joint on our side below the meter was the leak. Tightened
up now. :-)

The Kingfisher boiler will probably clean up & go another 30 years.

Well, I certainly hope so!!!

--
Adrian C

Aidan wrote:


BG said they would never install meters without supports & the
householder must have removed the supports. When I moved house, I found
the meter was suspended from the gas service pipe. The gas isolating
valve was stiff and had probasbly never been serviced since etc....

Yep, same here, (although the valve works ok so it's not too bad).
When the meter was replaced a couple of years ago they just replaced as
is, so the meter is still supported only by the supply pipe...

Lee
--
Email address is valid, but is unlikely to be read.

In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
The question. What's the chance a fifteen year old rarely serviced
(probably never since new) will need replacement? The boiler is a
Potterton Kingfisher II CF80. It's used all year for hot water and
heating as necessary through a standard heating header loft tank /
cylinder setup for a three bed house. Or will I get away by a Corgi
engineer cleaning and renewing parts?

It should simply need a good clean. It's quite DIY possible, but you'll
likely need new gaskets and of course flue brushes and a decent industrial
style vacuum. But if you don't feel competent, it shouldn't cost more than
100 quid or so.

They tend to go from working perfectly to totally sooted up very quickly -
and I don't know what actually starts this cycle after many years of not
being touched but working fine. But I'd say you've been very lucky if a
CF type has lasted 15 years without a service, and I wouldn't recommend
this as they can emit dangerous fumes into the room when things get
blocked up.


--
*Snowmen fall from Heaven unassembled*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
Yikes. The Transco man did mention a bit of corrosion.

The Kingfishers have O rings between the heat exchanger sections, and
these can need replacing after this sort of age. And if it's been leaking,
it's possible the linings to the burner box are damaged too and need
replacement.

They are pretty simple boilers to strip down totally, but I'm not sure
what spares are still available.

--
*Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:02:00 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
Yikes. The Transco man did mention a bit of corrosion.

The Kingfishers have O rings between the heat exchanger sections, and
these can need replacing after this sort of age. And if it's been leaking,
it's possible the linings to the burner box are damaged too and need
replacement.

They are pretty simple boilers to strip down totally, but I'm not sure
what spares are still available.


I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently and
it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger .They
are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access ,then
removing the plates on either side .The gaskets on mine were totally
hard ..I scraped them off and cleaned up the surfaces and replaced
them( also using Heat Resistand Silicone) after brushing out the
boiler .I also replaced the ceramic rope thats seals the casing round
the pilot light as it had got wet with the leak....£16 a metre
tho'...ouch!!!.....spares are still readily available .
Check the website at
http://www.potterton.co.uk/aftersales/spares/index.html


Stuart ...




--

Shift THELEVER to reply.

In article ,
Stuart wrote:
I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently and
it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger .They
are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access ,then
removing the plates on either side

Ah - mine has end and centre sections to the heat exchanger, so no end
plates. Between each section, 4 'O' rings. It's over 25 years old, and an
RS floor stander.

.The gaskets on mine were totally
hard ..I scraped them off and cleaned up the surfaces and replaced
them( also using Heat Resistand Silicone) after brushing out the
boiler .I also replaced the ceramic rope thats seals the casing round
the pilot light as it had got wet with the leak....£16 a metre
tho'...ouch!!!.....spares are still readily available .
Check the website at
http://www.potterton.co.uk/aftersales/spares/index.html

Good to know they still sell spares. I used generic 'rope' from my PM for
the seals.

--
*I'm already visualizing the duct tape over your mouth

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stuart wrote:
I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently and
it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger .They
are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access ,then
removing the plates on either side

Ah - mine has end and centre sections to the heat exchanger, so no end
plates. Between each section, 4 'O' rings. It's over 25 years old, and an
RS floor stander.

What a totally pointless response.

"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
Not my day today.

Siemens Chappie came around yesterday to replace our gas meter (they go
out of calibration). Harmless action - we joyfully let him in, he fixes
the new meter - cheerfully reignites the boiler, and refuses the coffee
(says he is allergic to caffine).

Today we noticed a wiff of a leak.

So Transco guy comes within the hour of an emergency call, finds and
fixes the leak. The leak is on our side of the meter, somehow made worse
by the meter refitting but since he is such a nice chap he does the
magic and the repair is free. Great. I offer him coffee. He declines
(what's wrong with my coffee?), and asks directions to the boiler for
reignition.

Ah... a problem. Not all the burners are lighting. Some of them are
covered in soot, says he. This boiler is a disgrace, it should not be
allowed to operate. Illegal. He'll have to cap it. We'll have no baths
'til it's fixed. Doom time. It's pub time in about an hour from now, and
my wiff will be more of an issue down there than the smell of gas. Cold
bath awaits electric kettle.... Arggghhhh! ;-(

The question. What's the chance a fifteen year old rarely serviced
(probably never since new) will need replacement? The boiler is a
Potterton Kingfisher II CF80. It's used all year for hot water and
heating as necessary through a standard heating header loft tank /
cylinder setup for a three bed house. Or will I get away by a Corgi
engineer cleaning and renewing parts?

Thinking back, if I laced the Siemens guy's coffee with something (and
made him drink it), the meter wouldn't have been compulsory changed and
I wouldn't be in this mess. :-(

The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a new
good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to 40%. What
are your requirements? Baths, showers, heating etc?

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stuart wrote:
I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently
and it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger
.They are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access
,then removing the plates on either side

Ah - mine has end and centre sections to the heat exchanger, so no
end plates. Between each section, 4 'O' rings. It's over 25 years
old, and an RS floor stander.

What a totally pointless response.

Whereas your response was full of erudition, as usual?
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

"Doctor Drivel" wrote:

The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a new
good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to 40%. What
are your requirements? Baths, showers, heating etc?

His requirements? Just a boiler service, time for you to show us
"amateurs" how an expert like you would do it.

Any gas fired boiler, simple annual service, talk us through it.


--

"Matt" wrote in message
news
"Doctor Drivel" wrote:

The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a new
good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to 40%.
What
are your requirements? Baths, showers, heating etc?

His requirements?

You are not him.

snip senseless drivel

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stuart wrote:
I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently
and it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger
.They are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access
,then removing the plates on either side

Ah - mine has end and centre sections to the heat exchanger, so no
end plates. Between each section, 4 'O' rings. It's over 25 years
old, and an RS floor stander.

What a totally pointless response.

Whereas your response was full of erudition, as usual?

And your post id pointless too.

"Stuart" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 13 Aug 2005 12:02:00 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
Yikes. The Transco man did mention a bit of corrosion.

The Kingfishers have O rings between the heat exchanger sections, and
these can need replacing after this sort of age. And if it's been
leaking,
it's possible the linings to the burner box are damaged too and need
replacement.

They are pretty simple boilers to strip down totally, but I'm not sure
what spares are still available.


I have a CF60- of similar vintage and it started leaking recently and
it was the gaskets that fit to each side of the heat exchanger .They
are simply replaceable by removing the casing to get access ,then
removing the plates on either side .The gaskets on mine were totally
hard ..I scraped them off and cleaned up the surfaces and replaced
them( also using Heat Resistand Silicone) after brushing out the
boiler .I also replaced the ceramic rope thats seals the casing round
the pilot light as it had got wet with the leak....£16 a metre
tho'...ouch!!!.....spares are still readily available .
Check the website at
http://www.potterton.co.uk/aftersales/spares/index.html

A water of time. Should ditched it and bought a proper good quality
condensing boiler.

Doctor Drivel wrote:

"Matt" wrote in message
news
"Doctor Drivel" wrote:

The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a new
good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to 40%.

If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to. If
it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs of
the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with the cast
iron lump.

What
are your requirements? Baths, showers, heating etc?

His requirements?

You are not him.


I'm am he. OK diMM, so what are the elements of work involved in a
typical gas boiler service? What should I as a punch blind seeker of gas
service in the yellow pages be asking of shady characters coming to see
my Boiler? What should I see taking place for my £90/hour wallet tease?

--
Adrian C

"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

"Matt" wrote in message
news
"Doctor Drivel" wrote:

The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a
new
good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to 40%.

If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to. If
it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs of
the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with the cast
iron lump.

What afre these "future ongoing repair/replacement costs", you are on about?


What
are your requirements? Baths, showers, heating etc?

His requirements?

You are not him.

I'm am he. OK diMM, so what are the elements of work involved in a
typical gas boiler service? What should I as a punch blind seeker of gas
service in the yellow pages be asking of shady characters coming to see
my Boiler? What should I see taking place for my £90/hour wallet tease?

What are you on about, idiot?

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Adrian C wrote:


If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to.
If it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs
of the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with
the cast iron lump.

Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to* 40% -
which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless you've got
a literally 'stone age' boiler. As long as the 'iron lump' can be restored
to reliable operation, stick with it - by the time a new boiler has paid for
itself in fuel savings, *that* will need replacing.
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

Doctor Drivel wrote:

I'm am he. OK diMM, so what are the elements of work involved in a
typical gas boiler service? What should I as a punch blind seeker of gas
service in the yellow pages be asking of shady characters coming to see
my Boiler? What should I see taking place for my £90/hour wallet tease?

What are you on about, idiot?

Simple question, it was. Response completely as expected ;-)
You are a masterpiece...

--
Adrian C

"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

I'm am he. OK diMM, so what are the elements of work involved in a
typical gas boiler service? What should I as a punch blind seeker of gas
service in the yellow pages be asking of shady characters coming to see
my Boiler? What should I see taking place for my £90/hour wallet tease?

What are you on about, idiot?

Simple question, it was. Response completely as expected ;-)
You are a masterpiece...

Write like an idiot, insult and idiot, then you get treated like an idiot.
Haven't you figured that out yet?

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Adrian C wrote:


If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to.
If it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs
of the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with
the cast iron lump.

Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% -
which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless you've
got
a literally 'stone age' boiler.

Nope. 33% is the least you should expect.

As long as the 'iron lump' can be restored
to reliable operation, stick with it

You are totally mad. You don't know much about this game do you?

- by the time a new boiler has paid for
itself in fuel savings, *that* will need replacing.

3 to 5 years?

In article , Set Square wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to* 40% -
which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless you've got
a literally 'stone age' boiler.


The OP's description was "a fifteen year old rarely serviced (probably never
since new)" boiler so the new boiler may well save 40% on the present gas
usage. But servicing the existing boiler might produce a double-digit saving.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk
Free SEDBUK boiler database browser http://www.sda.co.uk/qsedbuk.htm
[Latest version QSEDBUK 1.10 released 4 April 2005]

In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:
What a totally pointless response.

What a totally pointless response.

--
*If love is blind, why is lingerie so popular?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a
new good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to
40%.

If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to. If
it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs of
the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with the cast
iron lump.

Note it's now changed to 'up to 40%'

Drivel gets all his figures from adverts. Think of him as a double glazing
salesman and you won't be far out.

--
*You can't teach an old mouse new clicks *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:
Write like an idiot, insult and idiot, then you get treated like an
idiot.

Tee hee.

Haven't you figured that out yet?

Got any mirrors in your flat?

--
*Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% - which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless
you've got a literally 'stone age' boiler.

Nope. 33% is the least you should expect.

And this simply gives proof that you're not a pro, but simply a reader of
adverts.

If you gave this in writing, you'd be out of business.

--
*The modem is the message *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Tony Bryer wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% - which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless
you've got a literally 'stone age' boiler.


The OP's description was "a fifteen year old rarely serviced (probably
never since new)" boiler so the new boiler may well save 40% on the
present gas usage. But servicing the existing boiler might produce a
double-digit saving.

Well, the boiler is unlikely to use that much gas when sooted up - if you
continue to try and use it - and it does fire up - it will probably
explode. ;-)

However, until that point I doubt the efficiency changed at all during the
many years where it was working properly.

--
*All men are idiots, and I married their King.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Doctor Drivel wrote:
What are you on about, idiot?

Simple question, it was. Response completely as expected ;-)
You are a masterpiece...

Write like an idiot, insult and idiot, then you get treated like an idiot.
Haven't you figured that out yet?


OK, fine, whatever....

--
Adrian C

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Doctor Drivel wrote:


You are totally mad. You don't know much about this game do you?

I know enough to know that your 3-5 year payback period is totally false.

A realistic fuel saving is nearer 20% - say £80 p.a. on a £400 bill. That
will give a payback period of *at least* 10 years - and even that ignores
the increased servicing costs of complex condensing boilers.

I will leave it to other contributors to judge which of us is the madder!
--
Cheers,
Set Square
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

"Tony Bryer" wrote in message
...
In article , Set Square wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% -
which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless you've
got
a literally 'stone age' boiler.


The OP's description was "a fifteen year old rarely serviced (probably
never
since new)" boiler so the new boiler may well save 40% on the present gas
usage. But servicing the existing boiler might produce a double-digit
saving.

I have a 24 year old boiler that's 84% efficient so it would take ages to
get the costs of a new one back.
There is not a lot to service either, just vac it out occasionally and check
the flame is burning OK.

Were other boilers of that era significantly different?


PS. Can I move it to a new location if I build an extension or do I have to
fit a new condensing boiler?
Its only 50,000 btu so I might just keep it as a water heater (storage) and
run the heating off a new one
(in the attic?).

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Tony Bryer wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% - which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless
you've got a literally 'stone age' boiler.


The OP's description was "a fifteen year old rarely serviced (probably
never since new)" boiler so the new boiler may well save 40% on the
present gas usage. But servicing the existing boiler might produce a
double-digit saving.

Well, the boiler is unlikely to use that much gas when sooted up - if you
continue to try and use it - and it does fire up - it will probably
explode. ;-)

It is clear you know this from experience. Took down a few houses in the
street.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

What a totally pointless response.

What

snip idiotic babble

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Adrian C wrote:
The mess was already there. Best ditch this cast iron lump and get a
new good quality condensing boiler and reduce your gas bills by up to
40%.

If it actually comes to *needing* replacement, then we will have to. If
it seems the 40% saving on gas will neatly pay for the seem to be
required breakdown cover and future ongoing repair/replacement costs of
the new fangled wotsit, then frankly i'd much rather stick with the cast
iron lump.

Note it's now changed to 'up to 40%'

10/10. Very good. Did someone tell you that at the home?

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Write like an idiot, insult and idiot, then you get treated like an
idiot.

Tee hee.

Did someone tell you to laugh?

snip tomfoolery

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ws.net,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% - which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless
you've got a literally 'stone age' boiler.

Nope. 33% is the least you should expect.

And this simply ...

snip idiotic senile drivel

"dennis@home" wrote in message
. uk...

"Tony Bryer" wrote in message
...
In article , Set Square wrote:
Even Drivel didn't say you'd get a 40% saving on gas - he said *up to*
40% -
which is a bit different - and grossly optimistic at that unless you've
got
a literally 'stone age' boiler.


The OP's description was "a fifteen year old rarely serviced (probably
never
since new)" boiler so the new boiler may well save 40% on the present
gas
usage. But servicing the existing boiler might produce a double-digit
saving.

I have a 24 year old boiler that's 84% efficient so it would take ages to
get the costs of a new one back.

Greater than 84% efficient and 24 years old? Make and model please? More
like 55% if that.

"Set Square" wrote in message
...
In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Doctor Drivel wrote:

You are totally mad. You don't know much about this game do you?

I know enough to know that your 3-5 year payback period is totally false.

Stop making things up. Also you would be saving the planet.