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| UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
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Removing limescale
All,
We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? Cheers Chris |
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#2
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Chris Styles wrote:
We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? Get some brick cleaner from Jewsons, which is dilute hydrochloric acid (check the label). Bale out the pan, top up with the cleaner, leave for a few hours, flush repeatedly, repeat if you need to. Don't try & chisel the scale off, or you may damage the glaze. |
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#3
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"Chris Bacon" wrote in message Get some brick cleaner from Jewsons, which is dilute hydrochloric acid (check the label). Bale out the pan, top up with the cleaner, leave for a few hours, flush repeatedly, repeat if you need to. Don't try & chisel the scale off, or you may damage the glaze. No don't !!!!! Strong Hydrochloric acid can damage the glaze! I know, I've done it! Look in Yellow Pages under Janitorial Supplies to find your nearest commercial cleaning supplies place, Call in & buy a good toilet descaler. Hydrochloric is good, but in a toilet cleaner it will be the right strength and it will be buffered to make it less aggressive. Might take repeated applications but it will work without damage. Dave |
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#4
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We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the
previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. I use two techniques. Depending on the deposit, either one or other of these techniques should work. Open the windows and keep children away. 1. Pour in a good sized slug of brick acid. Scrub with toilet brush. Flush several times. 2. Scoop out the water with a disposal plastic cup. Pour loads of standard thick bleach all over the toilet bowl, allowing loads to drain into bowl. Using old style Double Bleach Ajax scouring powder, sprinkle it liberally over the thick bleach. Allow to soak for an hour. Scrub off. Flush. Note that these techniques have considerable dangers from the materials used. Alos, if you use the wrong bleach, you might produce chlorine gas, which is poisonous. Christian. |
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#5
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In article , Chris
Styles writes All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? The blue harpic toilet cleaner is the best thing I have found (without resorting to raw chemicals), if you ladle the water out of the u bend first. Put the stuff on and leave for 1/2hr then scrub off with brush. -- Tim Mitchell |
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#6
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In article ,
"David Lang" writes: No don't !!!!! Strong Hydrochloric acid can damage the glaze! I know, I've done it! I know it wrecks the glaze on enamelled metalwork (e.g. baths), but on glazed porcelain? Also wondered what damage it does to the cemented joins in sewer pipes... -- Andrew Gabriel |
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#7
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Andrew Gabriel wrote:
"David Lang" writes: Strong Hydrochloric acid can damage the glaze! I know, I've done it! I know it wrecks the glaze on enamelled metalwork (e.g. baths), but on glazed porcelain? I've never seen glaze damaged from this treatment - maybe very old sanitary ware with different glaze might suffer? Brick cleaner isn't "strong" hydrochloric acid, anyway. What of cleaners available from supermarkets that contain hydrochloric acid? I can't recall seeing any warnings on the labels about this.... Also wondered what damage it does to the cemented joins in sewer pipes... That's why you flush the lavatory a few times after! |
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#8
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Chris Styles wrote:
All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? BRICK ACID. Cheers Chris |
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#9
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To de-fur a kettle I have used Phosphoric Acid. I've seen this acid refered
to as "A Food Acid" as it is contained in Coca Cola. Coca Cola is food????? Never mind. You could even try a litre of Coca Cola in a dry toilet bowl, it is cheap enough. Phophoric Acid is also a good rust remover. I saw a formula made of... 50% Phosphoric Acid. 50% Acetone. A squirt of Fairy Liquid to act as a surfactant. Chris. x-- 100 Proof News - http://www.100ProofNews.com x-- 30+ Days Binary Retention with High Completion x-- Access to over 1.9 Terabytes per Day - $8.95/Month x-- UNLIMITED DOWNLOAD |
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#10
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The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Chris Styles wrote: All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? BRICK ACID. Cheers Chris I find it best to block the WC with a plastic bag and fill the bowl right up to the rim with 5-10% sulfamic acid crystals (Fernox descaler). Leave overnight. Best way I know to get the whole thing clean with the minimum of effort. Anyone who wants to mess with hydrochloric is welcome. ================================================== ======== Sulfamic acid is a dry, non-volatile, non-hygroscopic, odorless, white crystalline, stable solid acid. It is moderately soluble in water by forms strongly acidic aqueous solution that is comparable in acidity to the common strong mineral acids but may be easily handled and stored in the dry form. At room temperature, dilute aqueous sulfamic acid solution is stable for a long time but rapid hydrolysis occurs at elevated temperatures. Its solution is less corrosive towards metals than other mineral acids. Salts of sulfamic acid are very soluble in water. Because of advantages such as handling ease, solubility and low corrosiveness, sulfamic acid has many diversified uses. ================================================== ============= |
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#11
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In article ,
"Chris Styles" writes: All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? Furnox DS-3 (Sulphamic Acid) will do the job, with less potential dangers than brick acid. Add some washing up liquid as well to act as a surficant, which might also help if any organic matter is mixed in with the limescale. You can normally nearly empty the trap by using the loo brush to make the water oscillate up and down round the U. Dissolve some Sulphamic Acid acid in warm water (or hot water if you think there's no risk of it cracking the loo), and then pour in, toping up if necessary to get to the normal water level in the trap. Elbow grease doesn't help much unless there's a lot of organic matter mixed in with the limescale -- just leave the acid to do its work, over night if possible. Clean round with the brush before flushing away. You may need to repeat for really bad cases. If it's thick brown and not clearing, then you probably have a layer of organic matter protecting the limescale. To clear this, use dishwasher detergent dissolved in hot water in the same way. Don't mix the two chemicals together though -- alternate treatments if necessary. -- Andrew Gabriel |
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#12
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On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 08:09:29 +0000 (UTC), "Chris Styles"
wrote: All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Remove as much water as you can and spray with Cillit Bang. Leave for 30 mins, rinse and repeat as required. sponix |
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#13
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Chris Styles wrote:
All, We've just moved to an area with very hardwater, and I dont think the previous occupants did anything to compbat limescale in the loo :-( Despite scrubbing and using a few of the off-the-shelf-from-teso limescale removers, the deposits havent budged. Google seems to suggest using vinegar - anyone got any experience of this? Alternatively, can anyone recommend some super industrial-strength limescale eater? Cheers Chris The advantage with Hydrochloric acid is it attacks both limescale and organic matter. Typically the 2 are mixed together, each one protecting the other, since different cleaners are needed for each. I would definitely use HCl, but bear in mind it is a relatively high risk cleaner. Wear goggles in case of a splashed droplet, if it gets on skin rinse it off. HCl is also far faster than all the others. Tesco lime scale removing toilet cleaner contains hcl. Brick acid is somewhat stronger HCl, and thus riskier. Never use anything with bleach around acids. Flush a few times to rinse the HCl through the pipework if you sue any significant quantity, as it will attack mortar joints etc. You can either apply a bit between loo uses, or fill and leave overnight. NT |
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#14
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#16
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In article ,
Stuart Noble writes: Rubbish. What organic matter? Some people chuck all sorts of **** down there... -- Andrew Gabriel |
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#18
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Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article , Stuart Noble writes: Rubbish. What organic matter? Some people chuck all sorts of **** down there... Blimey that was a quick reply. Nothing on the box then? |
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#19
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In message , David
Lang writes "Chris Bacon" wrote in message Get some brick cleaner from Jewsons, which is dilute hydrochloric acid (check the label). Bale out the pan, top up with the cleaner, leave for a few hours, flush repeatedly, repeat if you need to. Don't try & chisel the scale off, or you may damage the glaze. No don't !!!!! Strong Hydrochloric acid can damage the glaze! I know, I've done it! Same here - if you remove the glaze it goes porous and you end up with a much bigger problem -- geoff |
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#20
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In message , raden
writes In message , David Lang writes "Chris Bacon" wrote in message Get some brick cleaner from Jewsons, which is dilute hydrochloric acid (check the label). Bale out the pan, top up with the cleaner, leave for a few hours, flush repeatedly, repeat if you need to. Don't try & chisel the scale off, or you may damage the glaze. No don't !!!!! Strong Hydrochloric acid can damage the glaze! I know, I've done it! Same here - if you remove the glaze it goes porous and you end up with a much bigger problem .... I was talking about enamel on a bath there -- geoff |
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#21
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On Mon, 25 Jul 2005 11:29:52 +0100, Chris Bacon
wrote: I've never seen glaze damaged from this treatment Ah, therefore it doesn't happen. |
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#22
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Andrew Gabriel wrote:
If it's thick brown and not clearing, then you probably have a layer of organic matter protecting the limescale. To clear this, use dishwasher detergent dissolved in hot water in the same way. Don't mix the two chemicals together though -- alternate treatments if necessary. I usually have started with strong caustic to remove organics, and then acid to attack the scale. I wasn't aware you could buy sulphamic in 'pure' form cheaply. If so, then I withdraw the brick acid recommendation in favour of sulphamic. Its a good descaler. |
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#23
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In article ,
The Natural Philosopher writes: I wasn't aware you could buy sulphamic in 'pure' form cheaply. If so, DS-3 is pure, as in not mixed with sand or any of the other things you find added to kettle descaler sachets to make the active ingredient in the things fill more horribly over-priced packets. However, it has a coloured dye and a smell added, so you don't mistake it for something else. The dye is also an indicator, changing colour when the acid is exhausted. I have noticed the dye stain plastic brush bristles -- I guess there's a possibility of it staining some more important plastics. It's not suitable for use on enamelled baths. -- Andrew Gabriel |
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#24
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In message , The Natural
Philosopher writes Andrew Gabriel wrote: If it's thick brown and not clearing, then you probably have a layer of organic matter protecting the limescale. To clear this, use dishwasher detergent dissolved in hot water in the same way. Don't mix the two chemicals together though -- alternate treatments if necessary. I usually have started with strong caustic to remove organics, and then acid to attack the scale. I wasn't aware you could buy sulphamic in 'pure' form cheaply. If so, then I withdraw the brick acid recommendation in favour of sulphamic. Its a good descaler. I've got a 20 kilo drum of it at work -- geoff |
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#25
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Stuart Noble wrote:
wrote: Rubbish. What organic matter? Either you must have an unusual diet, or you are using your wc as a dustbin. How so when its PH is virtually identical to sulphamic? Why do you always lead with your chin? Try something like "IMO (and having only tried brick acid and supermarket limescale removers)...." Quite the little chemist aren't we? And this from someone who thinks oxygen bleach is hydrogen peroxide, and is fine for the laundry. I'm no chemist either but then I don't launch FAQs on the subject. welcome to the idiot filter. NT |
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#26
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