This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.

Meanwhile, the seller accepted the notion that I'd been hacked and
said forget it, he'd repost, suggested that I cancel my account and
open a new one. I posted positive feedback for him on EBay for
being an honorable gentleman and A1 EBay citizen.

Hokay, that matter parked with honor and civility among gentlemen,
back to EBay. They'd told me twice to vet my household and change my
password. I told them that my household is provably secure, skipping
details since they demonstrably don't read or believe my responses.
There are only the two of us. Mary has held credentials and
clearances the pencilneck dweebs at Ebay never heard of. Her
trustworthyness is a matter of federal record after thorough vetting
by the FBI and Lord knows what other agency checks. Ditto me.

Cancelling the account would too easily let EBay off the hook
they're trying so hard to avoid with fancy dancing.

In my last response, I told them that I'd changed my password to one
produced by one of the several encryption algorithms generally
recognized as robust, nevermind which one. Mean time to crack by
hack at 100 tries per second would be many millions of years --
nevermind how many millions as a clue to sequence length other than it
is ten or less.

Any random password of given length would meet this test; it was
just easiest to generate it using an encryption algorithm since I had
one handy. Random is random, however done. I can blow smoke too.

I mentioned that if my identity is hacked again it would be clear
evidence that an insider at EBay is responsible. I cc'd the MN
Attorney General's office on that post.

I've received no smoke-o-grams from EBay in response to my last, not
even a roger. Go figure....

BTW, PayPal is a subsidiary of EBay. PayPal demands personal
financial info they shouldn't need to do what they purport to do.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride.

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Don Foreman wrote:
This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.

Meanwhile, the seller accepted the notion that I'd been hacked and
said forget it, he'd repost, suggested that I cancel my account and
open a new one. I posted positive feedback for him on EBay for
being an honorable gentleman and A1 EBay citizen.

Hokay, that matter parked with honor and civility among gentlemen,
back to EBay. They'd told me twice to vet my household and change my
password. I told them that my household is provably secure, skipping
details since they demonstrably don't read or believe my responses.
There are only the two of us. Mary has held credentials and
clearances the pencilneck dweebs at Ebay never heard of. Her
trustworthyness is a matter of federal record after thorough vetting
by the FBI and Lord knows what other agency checks. Ditto me.

Cancelling the account would too easily let EBay off the hook
they're trying so hard to avoid with fancy dancing.

In my last response, I told them that I'd changed my password to one
produced by one of the several encryption algorithms generally
recognized as robust, nevermind which one. Mean time to crack by
hack at 100 tries per second would be many millions of years --
nevermind how many millions as a clue to sequence length other than it
is ten or less.

Any random password of given length would meet this test; it was
just easiest to generate it using an encryption algorithm since I had
one handy. Random is random, however done. I can blow smoke too.

I mentioned that if my identity is hacked again it would be clear
evidence that an insider at EBay is responsible. I cc'd the MN
Attorney General's office on that post.

I've received no smoke-o-grams from EBay in response to my last, not
even a roger. Go figure....

BTW, PayPal is a subsidiary of EBay. PayPal demands personal
financial info they shouldn't need to do what they purport to do.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride.

Keywords:
In article , Don Foreman wrote:
This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.
snip

I use Firefox for my browser, and a couple days ago, I got a little pop
up window that a web site I had stumbled across had downloaded a
Javascript virus that was scanning my system for passwords. I don't know
if it was successful, but I went out & changed the few important
passwords I had saved. Several virus scans later, there is no sign of
it, so I don't know if it ran successfully and erased itself, or was
blocked by my software. The pop-up window didn't have another program
name associated with it, so I assume it was Firefox & not my virus
software or my firewall that spotted it. For all I know, it was looking
for IE & Outlook files & got nowhere.

I don't know if this could be what happended to you, but I thought I
would mention it. The 'Net is getting to be an increasingly nasty place
to wander around. In the future, I'm no longer going to allow my browser
to store any critical passwords. I already make it a policy not to let
any merchant save my credit card info.

Doug White

Don Foreman wrote:

This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

Speaking of Ebay, apparently a scam on sellers is happening (aps if this
is old news). Someone bids way over the price wanted and sends a
cheque/check for it. They want you to use a certain shipper to ship the
goods to them ASAP. Apparently includes emails & phone calls from both
(purchaser and shipping agent) wanting you to get your act together.

Yep, the cheque/check is rubber.

Thanks, Don! My ebay suspicions reconfirmed.

Bob Swinney
"Don Foreman" wrote in message
...
This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.

Meanwhile, the seller accepted the notion that I'd been hacked and
said forget it, he'd repost, suggested that I cancel my account and
open a new one. I posted positive feedback for him on EBay for
being an honorable gentleman and A1 EBay citizen.

Hokay, that matter parked with honor and civility among gentlemen,
back to EBay. They'd told me twice to vet my household and change my
password. I told them that my household is provably secure, skipping
details since they demonstrably don't read or believe my responses.
There are only the two of us. Mary has held credentials and
clearances the pencilneck dweebs at Ebay never heard of. Her
trustworthyness is a matter of federal record after thorough vetting
by the FBI and Lord knows what other agency checks. Ditto me.

Cancelling the account would too easily let EBay off the hook
they're trying so hard to avoid with fancy dancing.

In my last response, I told them that I'd changed my password to one
produced by one of the several encryption algorithms generally
recognized as robust, nevermind which one. Mean time to crack by
hack at 100 tries per second would be many millions of years --
nevermind how many millions as a clue to sequence length other than it
is ten or less.

Any random password of given length would meet this test; it was
just easiest to generate it using an encryption algorithm since I had
one handy. Random is random, however done. I can blow smoke too.

I mentioned that if my identity is hacked again it would be clear
evidence that an insider at EBay is responsible. I cc'd the MN
Attorney General's office on that post.

I've received no smoke-o-grams from EBay in response to my last, not
even a roger. Go figure....

BTW, PayPal is a subsidiary of EBay. PayPal demands personal
financial info they shouldn't need to do what they purport to do.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride.

Terry Collins wrote:
Don Foreman wrote:

This is "negative feedback" for EBay.


Speaking of Ebay, apparently a scam on sellers is happening (aps if this
is old news). Someone bids way over the price wanted and sends a
cheque/check for it. They want you to use a certain shipper to ship the
goods to them ASAP. Apparently includes emails & phone calls from both
(purchaser and shipping agent) wanting you to get your act together.

Yep, the cheque/check is rubber.

See the link in the security tips for "Busted up Cowgirl" (Second
security tip).
Has to be the funniest site ever for the "419" or the "Nigerian Scam"

http://pmccl.com/security/security.html

Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.



--
Will R.
Jewel Boxes and Wood Art
http://woodwork.pmccl.com

You have to watch your butt on eBay transactions - I recently bid on a hot
water pressure washer, and didn't meet the reserve (which was over $2000).
Then I got an email saying that the seller decided to sell it to me at my
highest bid. I sent them my phone number so we could discuss picking it up.
They kept emailing me back wanting a western union money order payment. I
told them I'd bring the funds with me when I picked it up as it was within
driving distance. They still wanted the advance payment. I finally
realized it was a total scam - these weren't the sellers of the pressure
washer - just some scammers looking for unsold eBay items and contacting
bidders. I never would have sent the cash, but I'm ****ed at myself for
supplying my phone number.

John

"Don Foreman" wrote in message
...
This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.

Meanwhile, the seller accepted the notion that I'd been hacked and
said forget it, he'd repost, suggested that I cancel my account and
open a new one. I posted positive feedback for him on EBay for
being an honorable gentleman and A1 EBay citizen.

Hokay, that matter parked with honor and civility among gentlemen,
back to EBay. They'd told me twice to vet my household and change my
password. I told them that my household is provably secure, skipping
details since they demonstrably don't read or believe my responses.
There are only the two of us. Mary has held credentials and
clearances the pencilneck dweebs at Ebay never heard of. Her
trustworthyness is a matter of federal record after thorough vetting
by the FBI and Lord knows what other agency checks. Ditto me.

Cancelling the account would too easily let EBay off the hook
they're trying so hard to avoid with fancy dancing.

In my last response, I told them that I'd changed my password to one
produced by one of the several encryption algorithms generally
recognized as robust, nevermind which one. Mean time to crack by
hack at 100 tries per second would be many millions of years --
nevermind how many millions as a clue to sequence length other than it
is ten or less.

Any random password of given length would meet this test; it was
just easiest to generate it using an encryption algorithm since I had
one handy. Random is random, however done. I can blow smoke too.

I mentioned that if my identity is hacked again it would be clear
evidence that an insider at EBay is responsible. I cc'd the MN
Attorney General's office on that post.

I've received no smoke-o-grams from EBay in response to my last, not
even a roger. Go figure....

BTW, PayPal is a subsidiary of EBay. PayPal demands personal
financial info they shouldn't need to do what they purport to do.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride.

Terry Collins wrote:

Don Foreman wrote:

This is "negative feedback" for EBay.


Speaking of Ebay, apparently a scam on sellers is happening (aps if this
is old news). Someone bids way over the price wanted and sends a
cheque/check for it. They want you to use a certain shipper to ship the
goods to them ASAP. Apparently includes emails & phone calls from both
(purchaser and shipping agent) wanting you to get your act together.

Yep, the cheque/check is rubber.

And I might note that you don't always get "total protection" by
delaying delivery of the goods for ten days or so after you've deposited
the check. If it's a fraudulent check written against a real account
with adequate funds in it, it can take a month or more before the
checking account holder realizes that their account has been debited for
a check they never wrote or signed and starts complaining to their bank
about it.

When that check eventually bounces its way back to your bank they'll
probably debit your account for it and leave you having to fight them
over it. In most states the laws basically come down to "Bank wins, you
lose".

I do use PayPal for eBay purchases, but I opened up a separate savings
account in a small local bank I drive by every day, one in which we have
no other accounts. I can easily zip by the drive up window and plop some
funds into it when I want to pay for something through PayPal, but
there's never more than a couple of hundred bucks in it, limiting my
exposure if my PayPal account is hacked. I picked a "different" bank
'cause I heard that some banks will try and grab funds from any of
several accounts you may have with them under the same tax ID number if
any one of those accounts gets in trouble.

If it's any consolation Don, I had my identity swiped about four years
ago by some young swine in New York who went around opening up "instant"
charge accounts in several New York City department stores during the
Xmas holiday season. That's the time of year when stores have folks at
desks at their entrances trying to get you to open an account with them
so they can get your business before some other store does.

Since my identity and social security number had to be given to G-d
knows how many banks and brokerage firms over the past few years, it's
no big suprise that someone in one of their back rooms had ample
opportunity to sell that data for pennies a pound to those grisly guys
who do that wicked work.

It wasn't 'till April of the following year that I got a call from
Macy's credit department asking me why I hadn't paid my bill for a
couple of grand for three months. The perp had used our real (Boston)
address as his "previous address" and gave Macy's the address of a bagel
shop in Brooklyn as his current one. That "previous address" is how
Macy's eventually tracked me down. I told Macy's our account with them
was current, as it had been for over 25 years, and I feared they'd been
scammed They were about as helpful to me about it as eBay was to Don.

I told them I couldn't do anything about the problem until they sent me
copies of the original credit application and also the charge slips for
the jewelry purchased from them the day after the account was opened.
Why they were silly enough to do that I don't know, but when they
arrived, I had a good laugh. On the credit application the perp had
clearly misspelled my last name and also the name of the street we live
on and then corrected those errors by writing over them. He also listed
his age as about 45 years younger than mine, to match his appearance.
(Don't I wish that was true.G)

To make a short story longer and more boring, I pulled fresh credit
reports from the three main bureaus and spotted several more chain store
accounts we knew nothing about; all reported as being in arrears.

I got most everything calmed down with just a few well written letters,
save for Macy's, whose credit people must have all been injected with
some serum which turns them into total idiots. I finally got them to
give up only after they had me get certified copies of our utility bills
for the previous two years to "prove" we lived in Boston, not Brooklyn.
All in all, I spent more time getting Macy's off my back than the other
stores (and New York Bell too, the perps had also gotten a phone in my
name at a Brooklyn address and run up one hell of a long distance bill
before they bailed out of the place.)

The story had a funny ending though. SWMBO was reading some ladies'
magazine and came across an article on identity fraud. She said, "Come
read this!" There was a bit in it about a woman in New York who got so
****ed at Macy's for letting someone open an account in her name that
she sued them for the time and trouble it caused her.

I couldn't resist that temptation, so I sent Macy's credit department a
bill for $500 for four hours of my preemptive time spent straightening
out something that never should have happened if they'd taken a modicum
of caution; listing as what they'd missed:

1. I'm the only person named Jeff Wisnia in the USA and already HAD an
account with Macy's which had been active for over 25 years, (Thanks
mainly to SWMBO's frequent retail therapy sessions.)

2, The perp couldn't even spell my name correctly when he filled out his
credit application, and then corrected the mistake by writing over it.

3. My DOB is known to the credit bureaus, the perp's listed DOB was off
by more than 40 years.

Not unexpectedly, they didn't bother to respond to that letter or pay my
bill, so I dropped a small claims suit in against their Massachusetts'
regional office. That got almost immediate results in the form of a
phone call from their local counsel. In less than three minutes we'd
become friends, had a laugh over it, and settled the matter for a credit
of $250 to our "real" Macy's account, which was placed there two days
later. Ha!

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia

(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)

"As long as there are final exams, there will be prayer in public
schools"

Will wrote:

See the link in the security tips for "Busted up Cowgirl" (Second
security tip).
Has to be the funniest site ever for the "419" or the "Nigerian Scam"

http://pmccl.com/security/security.html

Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.

I did! Thanks for the laugh

--
- -
Rex Burkheimer
WM Automotive
Fort Worth TX

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader wrote:
Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Or, as good as avoiding social engineering/phishing schemes that _look like_
they come from one place but don't. Many people use the same password
for everything. Don doesn't seem like that sort, but it's not uncommon.

A spyware scan is definately in order. Keyloggers were created for just
this purpose, and they're quite common on Windows machines. adaware
from www.lavasoft.de is probably the best spyware scanner to start with.
AVG antivirus from www.grisoft.com is free and excellent.

On 15 Mar 2005 15:19:27 GMT, Ignoramus24806 wrote:
I routinely ship items sold on ebay without even depositing checks first...

The thing is, you're expecting others to be as honorable as you are.
They're not all worthy of that trust.

Ignoramus24806 wrote:
I routinely ship items sold on ebay without even depositing checks first...

I do the same, hasn't been a problem.
My theory is that people who buy machine tools and parts are probably
not the class of citizen who screws strangers. So far that's proven sound.

--
- -
Rex Burkheimer
WM Automotive
Fort Worth TX

Dave Hinz wrote:
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.


Or, as good as avoiding social engineering/phishing schemes that _look like_
they come from one place but don't. Many people use the same password
for everything. Don doesn't seem like that sort, but it's not uncommon.

A spyware scan is definately in order. Keyloggers were created for just
this purpose, and they're quite common on Windows machines. adaware
from www.lavasoft.de is probably the best spyware scanner to start with.
AVG antivirus from www.grisoft.com is free and excellent.

I use Adaware and Spybot. ONe will catch a couple that the other misses.
Be sure to update the data file regularly.

--
- -
Rex Burkheimer
WM Automotive
Fort Worth TX

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:10:39 -0600, Rex B wrote:



I use Adaware and Spybot. ONe will catch a couple that the other misses.
Be sure to update the data file regularly.

Me too.

Don Foreman wrote:
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:


Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.


Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.

Where's your old computer? If you sold it, did you completly wipe the
old harddrive in it?

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:30:20 -0600, Don Foreman wrote:
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.

Read this:
http://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...honeypot_x.htm

Also, this:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20041130-4426.html

Basically, if you're at XP Service pack 1, your unhacked life expectancy
when connected to the internet is measured in minutes. Four minutes,
in this case.

On 15 Mar 2005 17:32:06 GMT, Ignoramus24806 wrote:
On 15 Mar 2005 16:57:43 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:
On 15 Mar 2005 15:19:27 GMT, Ignoramus24806 wrote:
I routinely ship items sold on ebay without even depositing checks first...

The thing is, you're expecting others to be as honorable as you are.
They're not all worthy of that trust.

My logic is this.

First, in my auctions, I say (lie) that items paid for with checks,
will ship only after the check clears. This is untrue. I have no time
to deposit checks, check if they cleared etc. Sometimes I deposit
checks, but most of the time, with small enough checks, I do
not. Right now I have a $200 check that I need to deposit after
shipping the item. Amusingly, they are the transistors from the UPS
that you could get for free if you took it

I was going to ask how that went. I'm very glad that someone got
use (and cash) out of it. Just too big for my situation.

Second, I deal with items that are unlikely to attract interest of
scammers. Electronic test equipment, industrial stuff, parts etc.

Probably a good point. As someone else said, the kind of person bidding
on machine tools probably won't screw you. Kind of like accepting a check
from a total stranger, at a gun show. You just don't get screwed by
that sort of person.

Third, even though it is possible that one day I will encounter a
scammer, I think that the chance is low enough that it makes saving
time worthwhile.

Seems reasonable. If you're just selling the sort of stuff I see you
mention here, you're not as vulnerable as if you were selling, say,
beanie babies.

So far, not a single check that I received, bounced.

Last bouncy check I was given was when I was 14 and had a paper route.
I learned the "Sorry, you need to pay in advance" game pretty early.

Ignoramus24806 wrote:
On 15 Mar 2005 16:57:43 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:
Right now I have a $200 check that I need to deposit after
shipping the item. Amusingly, they are the transistors from the UPS
that you could get for free if you took it

You got $200 for some transistors from a UPS??
I'd love to know what the deal is there.
What was the item number?



--
- -
Rex Burkheimer
WM Automotive
Fort Worth TX

In article ,
says...
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.


Don, are you aware that this auction was advertised on this
group? The posting was titled "A Fine St. Patty's Day Metal
Item", posted by SteveB on 3/01.

I remember thinking it was an odd thing to flog here, so I
followed the link, and thought it even more odd when I saw
your bid. It struck me as very strange that someone who
enjoys making gold plated versions of common items would
choose to buy a couple cookie cutters. The fact that, based
on your feedback, you don't do much on ebay made the whole
thing seem stranger still. My first reaction was likely to
give you a ribbing. I should have followed through.

Ned Simmons

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 12:43:31 -0600, Rex B wrote:
Ignoramus24806 wrote:
On 15 Mar 2005 16:57:43 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:
Right now I have a $200 check that I need to deposit after
shipping the item. Amusingly, they are the transistors from the UPS
that you could get for free if you took it

You got $200 for some transistors from a UPS??
I'd love to know what the deal is there.
What was the item number?

It was a big fricking UPS. Had the tech manual here but I think it's
been recycled now. Half-refrigerator sized (not the problem)
and very loud (was the problem). That and, at the time, the free space
in my shop was zero. Now it's just "close to zero".

On 15 Mar 2005 18:09:09 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 11:30:20 -0600, Don Foreman wrote:
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.

Read this:
http://www.usatoday.com/money/indust...honeypot_x.htm

Also, this:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20041130-4426.html

Basically, if you're at XP Service pack 1, your unhacked life expectancy
when connected to the internet is measured in minutes. Four minutes,
in this case.

I have firewalls and I keep XP up to date.

I don't sell old puters. It's more trouble to wipe them and reload
Windows than it's worth. It's a laptop, so I'll keep it in case I
ever need the mobility.

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 13:54:03 -0500, Ned Simmons
wrote:

In article ,
says...
On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 09:51:28 +0000 (UTC), Crow Leader
wrote:

Maybe your computer is backdoored. Passwords are only part of a good security scheme.

Never say never, but it's highly unlikely. I've only had this puter
for two weeks, and I've never made a bid on Ebay with it. I did
regular spyware sweeps on the previous computer.


Don, are you aware that this auction was advertised on this
group? The posting was titled "A Fine St. Patty's Day Metal
Item", posted by SteveB on 3/01.

I remember thinking it was an odd thing to flog here, so I
followed the link, and thought it even more odd when I saw
your bid. It struck me as very strange that someone who
enjoys making gold plated versions of common items would
choose to buy a couple cookie cutters. The fact that, based
on your feedback, you don't do much on ebay made the whole
thing seem stranger still. My first reaction was likely to
give you a ribbing. I should have followed through.

Yeah, that migh have been fun. Why would I buy stainless
cookiecutters for $9.99 when I could spend 3X that on rawstock! G

I missed the staff meeting but the minutes show Dave Hinz
wrote back on 15 Mar 2005 18:11:50 GMT in
rec.crafts.metalworking :

Second, I deal with items that are unlikely to attract interest of
scammers. Electronic test equipment, industrial stuff, parts etc.

Probably a good point. As someone else said, the kind of person bidding
on machine tools probably won't screw you. Kind of like accepting a check
from a total stranger, at a gun show. You just don't get screwed by
that sort of person.

This might have something to do with them knowing you have guns, and
now their address. :-)


"Such a deal, I wouldn't give my own brother!" (To self- "'cause he
knows where I live.") From my days in the Casbah.

--
pyotr filipivich.
as an explaination for the decline in the US's tech edge, James
Niccol wrote "It used to be that the USA was pretty good at
producing stuff teenaged boys could lose a finger or two playing with."

"Jeff Wisnia" wrote in message
...

BIG SNIP

Not unexpectedly, they didn't bother to respond to that letter or pay my
bill, so I dropped a small claims suit in against their Massachusetts'
regional office. That got almost immediate results in the form of a phone
call from their local counsel. In less than three minutes we'd become
friends, had a laugh over it, and settled the matter for a credit of $250
to our "real" Macy's account, which was placed there two days later. Ha!

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia

Good for you Jeff! Glad to hear you got some satisfaction out of such an
ordeal. That happens all to infrequently. The sad state of affairs in
regards to credit and identity theft means that we all pay the price in the
form of higher interest to make up for such fraud.

Lane

"Robert Swinney" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Don! My ebay suspicions reconfirmed.

This is pure sillyness...
Do you not drive because of the occasional accident on the roads. Of course
not! Do you not eat at restaurants because of the occasional food poisoning?
Of course not! I've worked with eBay and Paypal both for years without any
problems what-so-ever. And there are thousands more that could say the same
thing.
Can you spell paranoid?

Lane

"Gene Kearns" wrote in message

I can spell..... been there, done that..... PayPal, as far as I am
concerned, is more liability than is worthwhile. Certainly, eBay
purchases carry some manageable risk, and I, myself, have only been
burned once by a crooked seller. PayPal, on the other hand, carries
much more liability and is much less manageable than eBay.....

It is a bit of a lottery, just because you number hasn't come up
doesn't mean that it won't.....

Truly..... caveat emptor......
--

Gene,
Of course someone could say the same thing about automobile accidents, or
just about any other "bad thing" that someone else has endured. I suppose
you wouldn't have flown anywhere just after 9/11 too. I don't understand how
people can live in todays world with this kind of paranoia. Isn't life hard
enough without thinking everyone is out to get you? Plus, clearly the
evidence proves otherwise.

My inlaws will not drive on I5, even after my wife pointed out to them a
newspaper article saying that side roads are like 5-10 times more dangerous
than freeways.

I clicked on your link in your other post and got a "The page cannot be
displayed" error message. So I'm unable to read about your problems with
Paypal.

I know that if I've been screwed by PayPal I'd have a different outlook. But
just because it happened to one doesn't mean it happens to everyone. This is
my opinion, worth exactly what you paid for it. Thanks for reading.
Lane

'S ok. I have an on-line-purchase-only MC with a $1000.00 limit. Usually
pretty much charged out. My bank account listed with PayPal is pretty
much dormant; throw a few bucks in it now and then. They can hack all
they want, try to charge my accounts- good luck.
Only a sucker would provide PayPal an account# with any real money in it.
JR
Dweller in the cellar

Don Foreman wrote:
This is "negative feedback" for EBay.

I recently got an email notifying me that I had won an auction on some
cookie cutters. WTF, over? I've made no bids on anything on EBay
for many months.

Shortly thereafter I got an email "invoice" from the seller.

I notified both seller and EBay that I had not bid on the item and did
not want it. I initially suspected the seller, but upon visit to
EBay it did look like I'd bid and the seller has plenty of positive
feedback.

EBay stonewalled me. My inquiry was first met with all the ways it
could be my bad: other members of my household, using a public
computer at school, library or internet cafe, yada yada. Yeah, OK, I
told them none of the above applied. Their response to that was
much of the same canned stuff from the first response.

Meanwhile, the seller accepted the notion that I'd been hacked and
said forget it, he'd repost, suggested that I cancel my account and
open a new one. I posted positive feedback for him on EBay for
being an honorable gentleman and A1 EBay citizen.

Hokay, that matter parked with honor and civility among gentlemen,
back to EBay. They'd told me twice to vet my household and change my
password. I told them that my household is provably secure, skipping
details since they demonstrably don't read or believe my responses.
There are only the two of us. Mary has held credentials and
clearances the pencilneck dweebs at Ebay never heard of. Her
trustworthyness is a matter of federal record after thorough vetting
by the FBI and Lord knows what other agency checks. Ditto me.

Cancelling the account would too easily let EBay off the hook
they're trying so hard to avoid with fancy dancing.

In my last response, I told them that I'd changed my password to one
produced by one of the several encryption algorithms generally
recognized as robust, nevermind which one. Mean time to crack by
hack at 100 tries per second would be many millions of years --
nevermind how many millions as a clue to sequence length other than it
is ten or less.

Any random password of given length would meet this test; it was
just easiest to generate it using an encryption algorithm since I had
one handy. Random is random, however done. I can blow smoke too.

I mentioned that if my identity is hacked again it would be clear
evidence that an insider at EBay is responsible. I cc'd the MN
Attorney General's office on that post.

I've received no smoke-o-grams from EBay in response to my last, not
even a roger. Go figure....

BTW, PayPal is a subsidiary of EBay. PayPal demands personal
financial info they shouldn't need to do what they purport to do.
Pick yer pony, take yer ride.





--
--------------------------------------------------------------
Home Page: http://www.seanet.com/~jasonrnorth
If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes
Doubt yourself, and the real world will eat you alive
The world doesn't revolve around you, it revolves around me
No skeletons in the closet; just decomposing corpses
--------------------------------------------------------------
Dependence is Vulnerability:
--------------------------------------------------------------
"Open the Pod Bay Doors please, Hal"
"I'm sorry, Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.."

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 18:07:59 -0800, "Lane" lane (no spam) at
copperaccents dot com wrote:


"Robert Swinney" wrote in message
...
Thanks, Don! My ebay suspicions reconfirmed.

This is pure sillyness...
Do you not drive because of the occasional accident on the roads. Of course
not! Do you not eat at restaurants because of the occasional food poisoning?
Of course not! I've worked with eBay and Paypal both for years without any
problems what-so-ever. And there are thousands more that could say the same
thing.
Can you spell paranoid?

"Due care" requires fewer letters and is more to the point. By golly
there were two trojans on the old machine! I thought I had it set
to scan periodically but apparently not.
---
After Ned Simmon's comment, it occurs to me that this event looks more
like a prank than anyone's intent to steal or defraud. Nobody but
the seller would gain by bidding for my account and I'm satisfied that
the seller is legit. Further evidence is that trivial $ were
involved.

I know for sure that EBay logs the IP and ISP source of incoming, so
I'm seeing if I can get them (perhaps with a little agency nudge for
motivation) ) to check their logs. I don't seek revenge, merely
exposure.

In article , no spam says...


Do you not drive because of the occasional accident on the roads. Of course
not! Do you not eat at restaurants because of the occasional food poisoning?

It's a lot faster to drive rather than walk, and the roads
are regulated and policed by the state. Public health
deparments are in place to inspect resturants, to see that
folks *don'* get salmonella.

What kind of regulation and enforcement is in place to see that
ebay/paypal deals fairly with the public? From the comments
seen here, the answer is "slim-ta-none."

Most sellers take a personal check or cash. Those who don't,
don't get my business. Not paranoia.

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

I use PayPal for eBay sales and purchases and love its convenience. I
wish it was used by more people. For example, when I'm short of cash it
would be convenient to PayPal the woman who cleans our house.

Like Jeff, I use a dedicated bank account to fund my PayPal account and
keep a small balance in it. The back-up funding is a canceled credit card.

Sure, there are horror stories about PayPal. There are also eBay horror
stories (Harold?). If an eBay seller has a 99% positive feedback most
buyers will proceed without worry. What do you suppose PayPal's
feedback would be if there were such a thing? I'd guess better than
99.9% If you would trust a 99% eBay seller with a couple of hundred
dollars, why wouldn't you trust the 99.9% PayPal with the same amount?

Bob

Keywords:
In article , Bob Engelhardt wrote:
I use PayPal for eBay sales and purchases and love its convenience. I
wish it was used by more people. For example, when I'm short of cash it
would be convenient to PayPal the woman who cleans our house.

Like Jeff, I use a dedicated bank account to fund my PayPal account and
keep a small balance in it. The back-up funding is a canceled credit card.

Sure, there are horror stories about PayPal. There are also eBay horror
stories (Harold?). If an eBay seller has a 99% positive feedback most
buyers will proceed without worry. What do you suppose PayPal's
feedback would be if there were such a thing? I'd guess better than
99.9% If you would trust a 99% eBay seller with a couple of hundred
dollars, why wouldn't you trust the 99.9% PayPal with the same amount?

My problem with PayPal is that their "protection" is a joke. If you get
stiffed by somebody who skips town and PayPal can't recover your money,
you are out of luck. This is why you should NEVER use a bank account to
pay for things. The only way I got my money back on a recent
deal-gone-bad was through my credit card company.

PayPal & Ebay don't bother policing things very well, so there are
getting to be more & more scam artists around. I also know for a fact
that Ebay makes it very difficult to post negative feedback. I ended up
recovering some stolen merchandise (long story), and had my wife do the
purchase on her account so the thief wouldn't realize it was me. When
she tried to post negative feedback along the lines of "this guy deals in
stolen property", it mysteriously never got posted. Twice.

Doug White

In article , Doug White says...

PayPal & Ebay don't bother policing things very well, so there are
getting to be more & more scam artists around.

This is the real issue. Ebay/paypal is interested in only one
thing - making money.

If they cleaned up their house a bit more folks would use
paypal but for now it's too risky.

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

jim rozen wrote:
....
If they cleaned up their house a bit more folks would use
paypal but for now it's too risky.

But my point was: how are you *risking* anything more with PayPal than
you would by sending a money order, check, or cash to an eBay seller??
I consider PayPal to be much more reliable/risk free than your average
random eBay seller.

Bob

But my point was: how are you *risking* anything more with PayPal than
you would by sending a money order, check, or cash to an eBay seller?? I
consider PayPal to be much more reliable/risk free than your average
random eBay seller.

Bob

ditto

not to say that ebay shouldn't clean up its act, bu tpaypal is pretty
pain free for a buyer, and most sellers do take it.

On 16 Mar 2005 08:00:12 -0800, the inscrutable jim rozen
spake:

In article , Doug White says...

PayPal & Ebay don't bother policing things very well, so there are
getting to be more & more scam artists around.

This is the real issue. Ebay/paypal is interested in only one
thing - making money.

If they cleaned up their house a bit more folks would use
paypal but for now it's too risky.

Yeah, according to Ebay yesterday, only 90% of Ebay sellers use it
now. I got smart and set up a free bank account specifically for
Paypal.


-
Yea, though I walk through the valley of Minwax, I shall stain no Cherry.
http://diversify.com

In article , Bob Engelhardt says...

jim rozen wrote:
...
If they cleaned up their house a bit more folks would use
paypal but for now it's too risky.

But my point was: how are you *risking* anything more with PayPal than
you would by sending a money order, check, or cash to an eBay seller??

Using it requires a second blind account and credit card.
Just seems like too much work for the occasional buyer - like
me.

And there's no way I'd give ebay/paypal account information for
my real account.

Jim


--
==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at pkmfgvm4 (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================

On Tue, 15 Mar 2005 01:55:09 -0600, Don Foreman
wrote:


I had this happen to me too, not once, twice.

In article ,
Don Foreman wrote:

[ ... ]

"Due care" requires fewer letters and is more to the point. By golly
there were two trojans on the old machine! I thought I had it set
to scan periodically but apparently not.
---
After Ned Simmon's comment, it occurs to me that this event looks more
like a prank than anyone's intent to steal or defraud. Nobody but
the seller would gain by bidding for my account and I'm satisfied that
the seller is legit. Further evidence is that trivial $ were
involved.

I know for sure that EBay logs the IP and ISP source of incoming, so
I'm seeing if I can get them (perhaps with a little agency nudge for
motivation) ) to check their logs. I don't seek revenge, merely
exposure.

Note that one of the trojans may have installed backdoors in the
computer, and thus someone *could* have used your computer to place the
bid, in which case, the IP addresses would point to *you*.

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

yourname wrote:

But my point was: how are you *risking* anything more with PayPal than
you would by sending a money order, check, or cash to an eBay seller??
I consider PayPal to be much more reliable/risk free than your average
random eBay seller.
If you open a PayPal account, they link it to your checking account. If
someone penetrates your account, they can empty out your checking
account! I know people this has happened to. It is scary.

Jon