I tore down old No. 97 today, wondering what was up with the feed handle.
It's a very simple feed mechanism -- a vertical shaft fixed from rotating
by a keyway riding on a pin, with a rack machined into it. This part is
in excellent condition with no apparent damage to the gear teeth. The
mating part, however, is a 3/4" shaft with integral 12-tooth 12DP 14.5°PA
gear with a very wide face, well over 1" wide. This is functionally identical
to a wide 12-tooth steel spur gear mounted on a 3/4" shaft. The part of
this shaft that is machined as a spur gear is pretty mangled. It isn't that
the teeth are broken, rather in a couple places they have been overstressed
to the point where the metal has flowed. I could just grind off the excess,
leaving a very thin tooth, and it would once again go up and down smoothly,
but it would transmit very little force.

I don't have a 12DP 14.5PA 12 tooth cutter or I'd be looking at cutting my
first gear. I priced out a steel spur gear, figuring I could just turn this
gear off its shaft and machine a keyway and put on a replacement gear, but
it looks like I'd need an extra-wide one which is too much $$. This whole
machine isn't worth much even in perfect condition (a Champion No. 97
post drill with fast & loose flat belt drive pulleys) so it isn't worth
putting a lot of dollars into.

All of the spur gear teeth are badly worn, or I'd grind down the bad ones,
drill and tap for some set screws, and cast new teeth out of JB Weld. But
these teeth look like they have to take a pretty heavy load and I can't
get a good casting anywhere on this gear, so that's out.

Anyone got a spur gear excess to their needs? A gear cutter I can borrow?
A better idea?

I can post a pic if that would help.

Grant Erwin
Kirkland, Washington
To email me see http://www.tinyisland.com/email.html

On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:04:54 -0800, Grant Erwin
wrote:

I tore down old No. 97 today, wondering what was up with the feed handle.
It's a very simple feed mechanism -- a vertical shaft fixed from rotating
by a keyway riding on a pin, with a rack machined into it. This part is
in excellent condition with no apparent damage to the gear teeth. The
mating part, however, is a 3/4" shaft with integral 12-tooth 12DP 14.5°PA
gear with a very wide face, well over 1" wide. This is functionally identical
to a wide 12-tooth steel spur gear mounted on a 3/4" shaft. The part of
this shaft that is machined as a spur gear is pretty mangled. It isn't that
the teeth are broken, rather in a couple places they have been overstressed
to the point where the metal has flowed. I could just grind off the excess,
leaving a very thin tooth, and it would once again go up and down smoothly,
but it would transmit very little force.

I don't have a 12DP 14.5PA 12 tooth cutter or I'd be looking at cutting my
first gear. I priced out a steel spur gear, figuring I could just turn this
gear off its shaft and machine a keyway and put on a replacement gear, but
it looks like I'd need an extra-wide one which is too much $$. This whole
machine isn't worth much even in perfect condition (a Champion No. 97
post drill with fast & loose flat belt drive pulleys) so it isn't worth
putting a lot of dollars into.

All of the spur gear teeth are badly worn, or I'd grind down the bad ones,
drill and tap for some set screws, and cast new teeth out of JB Weld. But
these teeth look like they have to take a pretty heavy load and I can't
get a good casting anywhere on this gear, so that's out.

Anyone got a spur gear excess to their needs? A gear cutter I can borrow?
A better idea?

I can post a pic if that would help.

Grant Erwin
Kirkland, Washington
To email me see http://www.tinyisland.com/email.html


Grant:\

Let me look in the tool box on Monday morning to see if I might have
that cutter.

Errol Groff
Assuming of course that we don't get snowed out again!

Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses) is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE


Errol Groff wrote:
On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:04:54 -0800, Grant Erwin
wrote:


I tore down old No. 97 today, wondering what was up with the feed handle.
It's a very simple feed mechanism -- a vertical shaft fixed from rotating
by a keyway riding on a pin, with a rack machined into it. This part is
in excellent condition with no apparent damage to the gear teeth. The
mating part, however, is a 3/4" shaft with integral 12-tooth 12DP 14.5°PA
gear with a very wide face, well over 1" wide. This is functionally identical
to a wide 12-tooth steel spur gear mounted on a 3/4" shaft. The part of
this shaft that is machined as a spur gear is pretty mangled. It isn't that
the teeth are broken, rather in a couple places they have been overstressed
to the point where the metal has flowed. I could just grind off the excess,
leaving a very thin tooth, and it would once again go up and down smoothly,
but it would transmit very little force.

I don't have a 12DP 14.5PA 12 tooth cutter or I'd be looking at cutting my
first gear. I priced out a steel spur gear, figuring I could just turn this
gear off its shaft and machine a keyway and put on a replacement gear, but
it looks like I'd need an extra-wide one which is too much $$. This whole
machine isn't worth much even in perfect condition (a Champion No. 97
post drill with fast & loose flat belt drive pulleys) so it isn't worth
putting a lot of dollars into.

All of the spur gear teeth are badly worn, or I'd grind down the bad ones,
drill and tap for some set screws, and cast new teeth out of JB Weld. But
these teeth look like they have to take a pretty heavy load and I can't
get a good casting anywhere on this gear, so that's out.

Anyone got a spur gear excess to their needs? A gear cutter I can borrow?
A better idea?

I can post a pic if that would help.

Grant Erwin
Kirkland, Washington
To email me see http://www.tinyisland.com/email.html



Grant:\

Let me look in the tool box on Monday morning to see if I might have
that cutter.

Errol Groff
Assuming of course that we don't get snowed out again!

Grant Erwin wrote:

Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses) is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE

Nope, in direct sunlight I can read more writing. It's a No. 8 cutter but
for 14DP, dag nabbit. Close but no cigar.

Still looking for a No. 8 12DP 14.5° pressure angle cutter.

Grant

In article , Grant Erwin
wrote:

Grant Erwin wrote:

Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses) is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE

Nope, in direct sunlight I can read more writing. It's a No. 8 cutter but
for 14DP, dag nabbit. Close but no cigar.

Still looking for a No. 8 12DP 14.5° pressure angle cutter.

Grant

I could rebuild the teeth with bronze, using TIG.

On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:41:17 -0800, Grant Erwin
wrote:

Grant Erwin wrote:

Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses) is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE

Nope, in direct sunlight I can read more writing. It's a No. 8 cutter but
for 14DP, dag nabbit. Close but no cigar.

Still looking for a No. 8 12DP 14.5° pressure angle cutter.

Grant

I've read a lot of posts on the Yahoo shaper group about cutting gears
with a hand ground single point tool. Got a shaper?

Pete Keillor

Grant-
Yes, it would be fun to cut the gear portion on a shaper. The toolbit
could be ground to the shape of the tooth space as Peter points out. Also,
it's possible to generate the involute curve by using a cutter with straight
sides, shaped like a rack tooth, and rotating the gear under the cutter as
the table traverses. Here's a picture of the setup, cutting a 10 dp 40
tooth steel gear:
http://home.comcast.net/~b.fill/rg.jpg
A similar setup is possible on smaller shapers, but space becomes limited:
http://home.comcast.net/~b.fill/mg.jpg

If you want to come down to Olympia to make your part, just let me know.

-Bill Fill

Olympia, WA

"Peter T. Keillor III" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:41:17 -0800, Grant Erwin
wrote:

Grant Erwin wrote:

Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses)
is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE

Nope, in direct sunlight I can read more writing. It's a No. 8 cutter but
for 14DP, dag nabbit. Close but no cigar.

Still looking for a No. 8 12DP 14.5° pressure angle cutter.

Grant

I've read a lot of posts on the Yahoo shaper group about cutting gears
with a hand ground single point tool. Got a shaper?

Pete Keillor

I have a buddy up here who owns my old shaper and has a real slick method
of making a single-point involute gear cutting tool. I just don't want to
do all the work. I took a Swiss pattern file and sat in the sun the other
day for about an hour and filed off all the places where the gear teeth
were deformed into places they weren't supposed to be. Now it turns very
smoothly. I'm planning to put old No. 97 back together and set it up as a
sort of display item which could drill a hole e.g. in a board - but *not*
a 1" hole through 1" steel, for example.

A Champion No. 97 is a very cool old post drill. It is the kind that has
2 flat belt pulleys *and* the extra-cool Champion flywheel. The 2 flat belt
pulleys are intended to be set up in fast and loose mode. The machine has
self-actuated powerfeed down, manual retract, with lever-activated clutch.
It also has 2 hand-cranked gear ratios, not just one. It's simply a lovely
machine, too. Yet I don't want to go machining a complex precise pinion gear.
I have enough problems, oops, I mean projects. I'm going to put this guy
together enough so you can turn the handle and see it work, and move it
and have parts not fall off, and then lean it against the wall until the
next blacksmith's swap meet and then give somebody a good deal.

Only way I'd even think of making the pinion gear is if I found a regular
milling involute cutter.

Grant

Bill Fill wrote:

Grant-
Yes, it would be fun to cut the gear portion on a shaper. The toolbit
could be ground to the shape of the tooth space as Peter points out. Also,
it's possible to generate the involute curve by using a cutter with straight
sides, shaped like a rack tooth, and rotating the gear under the cutter as
the table traverses. Here's a picture of the setup, cutting a 10 dp 40
tooth steel gear:
http://home.comcast.net/~b.fill/rg.jpg
A similar setup is possible on smaller shapers, but space becomes limited:
http://home.comcast.net/~b.fill/mg.jpg

If you want to come down to Olympia to make your part, just let me know.

-Bill Fill

Olympia, WA

"Peter T. Keillor III" wrote in message
...

On Sat, 26 Feb 2005 15:41:17 -0800, Grant Erwin
wrote:


Grant Erwin wrote:


Well, I remembered another stack of cutters and one of them looks sort
of right. All it says on it (using a strong light and reading glasses)
is:
"8 14" -- so an optimistic guy might interpret that as a No. 8 cutter
(12-13 teeth) with 14.5° pressure angle. Then again, it might not be.
I hate it when I can't figure out what a cutter is. Anyone? - GWE

Nope, in direct sunlight I can read more writing. It's a No. 8 cutter but
for 14DP, dag nabbit. Close but no cigar.

Still looking for a No. 8 12DP 14.5° pressure angle cutter.

Grant

I've read a lot of posts on the Yahoo shaper group about cutting gears
with a hand ground single point tool. Got a shaper?

Pete Keillor