Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

Would it be possible to jig up something on a drill press or lathe
so that this could be done semi automatically?

If you mounted a three jaw on the center of a drill press table
that would hold the tube.

Then have a flap wheel in the normal chuck and run the tube up and down by
adjusting the table height.

Or perhaps if you mount a drill press at an angle you could run the tube
in and out by hand.

You'd need an extension on the flap wheel but I assume you can figure
out how to do that. :-)



DOC

Buy my junk! http://www3.sympatico.ca/doc/robotone/for-sale.html



"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He
does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

Wayne,

Curious if you ever ran across the idea of using a feed control unit to
minimize or even eliminate a burr while drilling rather than trying to
remove it afterwards?

I get calls from folks looking to do this all the time. We basically sell
them a feed control on the unit we provide so that when the bit is about to
break through, the feed rate either stays exactly the same or even slows
down so the tool doesn't punch through the last part. The burr is then much
smaller or even sometimes gone.

Check out this page:

http://www.autodrill.com/ser2100.htm

Doing this with a multispindle drill head or when holes are far enough
apart, some of our customers do a dozen holes at a time. I suppose the same
thing could be done with the deburr tool depending on how it works.

Here is a seven hole head:

http://www.multi-drill.com/multi-spindle-head-app7.htm

If your client has lots and lots of holes to do (1000 a month is not a lot
to me but may be for him), tell him to find someone who can sell him a
multiple spindle head to attach to his drill press or have him buy a whole
system from someone. He will save a lot of time and make money. If his
production numbers are not great, then it will probably be too expensive...
But he may learn something by talking to the company's application
specialist for free anyhow. Multiple spindle drill heads usually go for
around $200-400 a hole but need to be mounted on a drill press, a Bridgeport
style machine or something similar if not built into an all-in-one system
like this one which is Photoshopped but identical to what we put together
and sold:

http://www.multi-drill.com/multi-spindle-head-app2.htm

No advertisimg meant, just some ideas for you and your cleint... Feel free
to give me a call or leave your number on my machine (number listed on the
web pages above) and I'll be glad to have our application guy call you back
to see if I can help you find a solution.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He
does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation speed, and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back of a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 18:51:46 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:

Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

Perfect choice of words for the method I'll describe.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I was told about this by an old Swiss toolmaker who described it to
me. I never saw it in action. They needed to deburr some copper
parts they were making. They made up something they called "the
bomb". Essentiallly a big metal box. They put the parts inside along
with fuel (gasoline?) vapor and touched it off. The flash burned off
the burrs. We live in a pretty rural area and his business was way
back in the woods where most people didn't know it existed. In the
60's (I think that was the era) he was making parts for the cameras in
the U2 spy planes. He had to work to precision somewhere in the
millionths. The shop is across the river and about a mile from a
railroad yard as the crow flies. The trains induced vibrations in the
work which kept him from getting the precision he needed. He had to
do the work in the wee hours from Saturday through some time on Sunday
since that's the only time they weren't shifting trains around. At
any rate, the method certainly was earth shaking. I can't prove he
wasn't pulling my leg, but I don't think so; he just didn't impress me
as being that kind of guy. He's been dead for a number of years now
so I can't inquire about the bomb for you. NO - he didn't die in an
explosion.

Bob Lamparter


******* Remove NOSPAM to reply *******

"DOC" wrote in message
...
Would it be possible to jig up something on a drill press or lathe
so that this could be done semi automatically?

If you mounted a three jaw on the center of a drill press table
that would hold the tube.

Then have a flap wheel in the normal chuck and run the tube up and down by
adjusting the table height.

Or perhaps if you mount a drill press at an angle you could run the tube
in and out by hand.

You'd need an extension on the flap wheel but I assume you can figure
out how to do that. :-)



DOC

We are drilling the holes through one side of the tube, and not through the
tube. This part is done on a mill-drill machine where we crank in the 1"
spacing between holes while the tube is held in a standard vice on the
drill-mill table. The problem is when the whole is finished, there is a burr
on the inside of the tube and we can only use a 90 degree deburring knife to
kill the beasts.

Wayne

"Joe" wrote in message
...
Wayne,

Curious if you ever ran across the idea of using a feed control unit to
minimize or even eliminate a burr while drilling rather than trying to
remove it afterwards?

I get calls from folks looking to do this all the time. We basically sell
them a feed control on the unit we provide so that when the bit is about
to
break through, the feed rate either stays exactly the same or even slows
down so the tool doesn't punch through the last part. The burr is then
much
smaller or even sometimes gone.

Check out this page:

http://www.autodrill.com/ser2100.htm

Thanks Joe, my response has been sent to you directly from your quick reply
to my problem in private.

Wayne

"carl mciver" wrote in message
nk.net...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side
and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation speed,
and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three
variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back of
a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

This looks interesting. I will pursuie through the Cogsdill site even though
my first blush is that a quarter inch dia hole is too small for their
tooling.

Wayne

"Tom" wrote in message
...
Wayne Lundberg wrote:

Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create
his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it
quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He
does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or
China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico
or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe
we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he
is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

Perhaps one of the Cogsdill Deburr tools would provide an answer?

http://www.cogsdill.com/pdf%20files/...20Products.pdf

Tom

Thanks Tom... am pursuing this idea as we speak.

"RWL" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 18:51:46 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:

Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

Perfect choice of words for the method I'll describe.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I was told about this by an old Swiss toolmaker who described it to
me. I never saw it in action. They needed to deburr some copper
parts they were making. They made up something they called "the
bomb". Essentiallly a big metal box. They put the parts inside along
with fuel (gasoline?) vapor and touched it off. The flash burned off
the burrs. We live in a pretty rural area and his business was way
back in the woods where most people didn't know it existed. In the
60's (I think that was the era) he was making parts for the cameras in
the U2 spy planes. He had to work to precision somewhere in the
millionths. The shop is across the river and about a mile from a
railroad yard as the crow flies. The trains induced vibrations in the
work which kept him from getting the precision he needed. He had to
do the work in the wee hours from Saturday through some time on Sunday
since that's the only time they weren't shifting trains around. At
any rate, the method certainly was earth shaking. I can't prove he
wasn't pulling my leg, but I don't think so; he just didn't impress me
as being that kind of guy. He's been dead for a number of years now
so I can't inquire about the bomb for you. NO - he didn't die in an
explosion.

Bob Lamparter

I had the pleasure of working alongside Gil Cadwell who pioneered explosive
fabrication and several other methods for smashing thin sheet metals into
compound irregular shapes. One of them was the use of a sparkplug submerged
in water and detonated by a bank of capacitors that created such a huge
spark that the water was decomposed into oxygen and hydrogen and in that
millisecond exploded to create a miniature atomic bomb in the water. The
part itself was set next to a tool which received the now very plastic sheet
metal to form it perfectly. The first time they tested the idea the shed
blew up. Fortunately he and his crew triggered the explosion from some
distance. It became known as Hydroforming.

I don't think gasoline or a well combined air/gas mix would be hot enough to
evaporate the burrs from inside the aluminum tube. But it's worth thinking
about perhaps as an EDM.

You got me thinking!

Thanks Joe, my response has been sent to you directly from your quick
reply
to my problem in private.

You get my private response to your response?
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

Yep

"Joe" wrote in message
...
Thanks Joe, my response has been sent to you directly from your quick
reply
to my problem in private.

You get my private response to your response?
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 20:50:41 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:


"carl mciver" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side
and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation speed,
and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three
variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back of
a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

This looks interesting. I will pursuie through the Cogsdill site even though
my first blush is that a quarter inch dia hole is too small for their
tooling.

Wayne


Greetings Wayne,
I use the Cogsdill tools a lot. One brand of their tooling is called
"Burraway" These tools go as small as .078". And they are adjustable
for pressure. Because of the way they work they will follow the edge
of a hole drilled in a cylinder-which is exactly what you want. For a
1/4" hole go to www.mscdirect.com and look at part number 05755129.
That's the MSC part number. The price is 50 bucks and well worth it.
Replacement blades are available if yours get dull. Also, the leading
cutting edge can be rounded off if you just want to deburr the
inside. So your best route will be to drill a hole with as small a
burr as possible and then use the Burraway tool. You can make a setup
where the tube is laid into a slot in a piece of wood or plastic that
is centered under the spindle. Then use the quill to feed the
deburring tool in and out. This will give you great control and will
keep the hole centered.
Eric R Snow,
E T Precision Machine

Explosive deburring is done all the time commercially. Put parts in a
chamber, add natural gas or propane, spark ignition, flash the flame out
a venting port.

I've toured this plant, they have all sorts of ways to get all the burrs.
http://www.arrowcryo.com/

RWL wrote:

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 18:51:46 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:


Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.


Perfect choice of words for the method I'll describe.


Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?


I was told about this by an old Swiss toolmaker who described it to
me. I never saw it in action. They needed to deburr some copper
parts they were making. They made up something they called "the
bomb". Essentiallly a big metal box. They put the parts inside along
with fuel (gasoline?) vapor and touched it off. The flash burned off
the burrs. We live in a pretty rural area and his business was way
back in the woods where most people didn't know it existed. In the
60's (I think that was the era) he was making parts for the cameras in
the U2 spy planes. He had to work to precision somewhere in the
millionths. The shop is across the river and about a mile from a
railroad yard as the crow flies. The trains induced vibrations in the
work which kept him from getting the precision he needed. He had to
do the work in the wee hours from Saturday through some time on Sunday
since that's the only time they weren't shifting trains around. At
any rate, the method certainly was earth shaking. I can't prove he
wasn't pulling my leg, but I don't think so; he just didn't impress me
as being that kind of guy. He's been dead for a number of years now
so I can't inquire about the bomb for you. NO - he didn't die in an
explosion.

Bob Lamparter


******* Remove NOSPAM to reply *******

Thank you. Am forwarding your note to my client who will follow up on this
solution.

Wayne

"Eric R Snow" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 20:50:41 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:


"carl mciver" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did
extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to
find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how
to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your
drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side
and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation
speed,
and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work
too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while
inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using
these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three
variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your
client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back
of
a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

This looks interesting. I will pursuie through the Cogsdill site even
though
my first blush is that a quarter inch dia hole is too small for their
tooling.

Wayne


Greetings Wayne,
I use the Cogsdill tools a lot. One brand of their tooling is called
"Burraway" These tools go as small as .078". And they are adjustable
for pressure. Because of the way they work they will follow the edge
of a hole drilled in a cylinder-which is exactly what you want. For a
1/4" hole go to www.mscdirect.com and look at part number 05755129.
That's the MSC part number. The price is 50 bucks and well worth it.
Replacement blades are available if yours get dull. Also, the leading
cutting edge can be rounded off if you just want to deburr the
inside. So your best route will be to drill a hole with as small a
burr as possible and then use the Burraway tool. You can make a setup
where the tube is laid into a slot in a piece of wood or plastic that
is centered under the spindle. Then use the quill to feed the
deburring tool in and out. This will give you great control and will
keep the hole centered.
Eric R Snow,
E T Precision Machine

Thank you Eric! I am forwarding this to my client.


"Eric R Snow" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 20:50:41 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:


"carl mciver" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did
extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to
find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how
to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your
drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side
and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation
speed,
and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work
too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while
inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using
these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three
variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your
client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back
of
a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

This looks interesting. I will pursuie through the Cogsdill site even
though
my first blush is that a quarter inch dia hole is too small for their
tooling.

Wayne


Greetings Wayne,
I use the Cogsdill tools a lot. One brand of their tooling is called
"Burraway" These tools go as small as .078". And they are adjustable
for pressure. Because of the way they work they will follow the edge
of a hole drilled in a cylinder-which is exactly what you want. For a
1/4" hole go to www.mscdirect.com and look at part number 05755129.
That's the MSC part number. The price is 50 bucks and well worth it.
Replacement blades are available if yours get dull. Also, the leading
cutting edge can be rounded off if you just want to deburr the
inside. So your best route will be to drill a hole with as small a
burr as possible and then use the Burraway tool. You can make a setup
where the tube is laid into a slot in a piece of wood or plastic that
is centered under the spindle. Then use the quill to feed the
deburring tool in and out. This will give you great control and will
keep the hole centered.
Eric R Snow,
E T Precision Machine

Thank you! Am forwarding to my client.


"Eric R Snow" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 20:50:41 GMT, "Wayne Lundberg"
wrote:


"carl mciver" wrote in message
ink.net...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
| Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did
extensive
| research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to
find
| anything really earth-shaking.
|
| I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how
to
| deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing

SNIP

Cogsdill deburring tool. It's a hollow rod that you chuck into your
drill
motor. Near the end it has a slot with a "tooth" sticking out the side
and
by adjusting the set screw in that end you adjust the spring providing
tension on the tooth. You simply push it in and out of the hole while
spinning the drill and depending on the tension you set, rotation
speed,
and
how long you linger the hole will be deburred, and if you let it work
too
long you even get a chamfer. The tooth moves out of the way while
inside
the hole. Very cool tool.

Get 'em on ebay or do a search on the web for sellers. I love using
these
things, but they take some getting used to because there are three
variables
that control how much gets cut off. I don't think that for your
client's
application it will be a big deal, but for mine, a chamfer on the back
of
a
close tolerance hole is a very bad thing.

This looks interesting. I will pursuie through the Cogsdill site even
though
my first blush is that a quarter inch dia hole is too small for their
tooling.

Wayne


Greetings Wayne,
I use the Cogsdill tools a lot. One brand of their tooling is called
"Burraway" These tools go as small as .078". And they are adjustable
for pressure. Because of the way they work they will follow the edge
of a hole drilled in a cylinder-which is exactly what you want. For a
1/4" hole go to www.mscdirect.com and look at part number 05755129.
That's the MSC part number. The price is 50 bucks and well worth it.
Replacement blades are available if yours get dull. Also, the leading
cutting edge can be rounded off if you just want to deburr the
inside. So your best route will be to drill a hole with as small a
burr as possible and then use the Burraway tool. You can make a setup
where the tube is laid into a slot in a piece of wood or plastic that
is centered under the spindle. Then use the quill to feed the
deburring tool in and out. This will give you great control and will
keep the hole centered.
Eric R Snow,
E T Precision Machine

--Cogsdill makes an excellent tool, but if a blade breaks, don't
try to insert a new one and get it to work right; better to send the
broken one back to the factory and let them do it.
--In addition to this method there's always a Rout-a-burr; a
little hand-intensive but it works..
--Another method might be abrasive slurry injection or whatever
the correct terminology is; don't know much about it but it sure makes
for purdy parts at trade shows..
--And finally, assuming you're attaching a second tube at the
place where you're making the hole there's a weird little gizmo called the
Aushalser, altho at the moment I can't find a link to it; will google a
bit more and see if I can find an image..

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Heartily sick of
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : "oldies" stations!
http://www.nmpproducts.com/intro.htm
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in
:



We are drilling the holes through one side of the tube, and not
through the tube. This part is done on a mill-drill machine where we
crank in the 1" spacing between holes while the tube is held in a
standard vice on the drill-mill table. The problem is when the whole
is finished, there is a burr on the inside of the tube and we can only
use a 90 degree deburring knife to kill the beasts.

Wayne



Wayne,
Try switching over to Black & Decker "Bullet" drills. These have a small
pilot bit ground in the nose, then a relief angle out to the major
cutting dia. They make a clean hole, as the outside cuts ahead of the
center.




--
Anthony

You can't 'idiot proof' anything....every time you try, they just make
better idiots.

Remove sp to reply via email

Perhaps one of the Cogsdill Deburr tools would provide an answer?
http://www.cogsdill.com/pdf%20files/...20Products.pdf

Funny thing is that I use their product on a daily basis (burnishing tool)
and never knew they made the deburring tool... Gotta get me one of those
and try it out.

I think this may be the answer Wayne's client needs... Now if it could be
made as a one piece unit with a drill bit, he could do both operations at
the same time... Or if he can somehow space the tool so he can do two at a
time, he could drill with a single spindle and deburr with a second on a
multi-spindle head... Maybe even all 15 at a time with a large enough
machine and then just move the piece 1" and finish off the proicess in a
total of two steps...
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

Wayne Lundberg wrote:

Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

Perhaps one of the Cogsdill Deburr tools would provide an answer?

http://www.cogsdill.com/pdf%20files/...20Products.pdf

Tom

Thanks!


"Anthony" wrote in message
...
"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in
:



We are drilling the holes through one side of the tube, and not
through the tube. This part is done on a mill-drill machine where we
crank in the 1" spacing between holes while the tube is held in a
standard vice on the drill-mill table. The problem is when the whole
is finished, there is a burr on the inside of the tube and we can only
use a 90 degree deburring knife to kill the beasts.

Wayne



Wayne,
Try switching over to Black & Decker "Bullet" drills. These have a small
pilot bit ground in the nose, then a relief angle out to the major
cutting dia. They make a clean hole, as the outside cuts ahead of the
center.




--
Anthony

You can't 'idiot proof' anything....every time you try, they just make
better idiots.

Remove sp to reply via email

Thanks... looking forward to your research.


"steamer" wrote in message
...
--Cogsdill makes an excellent tool, but if a blade breaks, don't
try to insert a new one and get it to work right; better to send the
broken one back to the factory and let them do it.
--In addition to this method there's always a Rout-a-burr; a
little hand-intensive but it works..
--Another method might be abrasive slurry injection or whatever
the correct terminology is; don't know much about it but it sure makes
for purdy parts at trade shows..
--And finally, assuming you're attaching a second tube at the
place where you're making the hole there's a weird little gizmo called the
Aushalser, altho at the moment I can't find a link to it; will google a
bit more and see if I can find an image..

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Heartily sick of
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : "oldies" stations!
http://www.nmpproducts.com/intro.htm
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

I love the multiple spindle idea!

"Joe" wrote in message
...
Perhaps one of the Cogsdill Deburr tools would provide an answer?
http://www.cogsdill.com/pdf%20files/...20Products.pdf

Funny thing is that I use their product on a daily basis (burnishing tool)
and never knew they made the deburring tool... Gotta get me one of those
and try it out.

I think this may be the answer Wayne's client needs... Now if it could be
made as a one piece unit with a drill bit, he could do both operations at
the same time... Or if he can somehow space the tool so he can do two at
a
time, he could drill with a single spindle and deburr with a second on a
multi-spindle head... Maybe even all 15 at a time with a large enough
machine and then just move the piece 1" and finish off the proicess in a
total of two steps...
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

I love the multiple spindle idea!

What type of HP does the drilling machine have?

What type of clearance do you have at the end of the tube? Can you shift
the tool 1" and have the last bit drill / deburr air or is there a clearance
issue?

It may come down to the fact that you can do most of teh holes in a single
shot and then have to either drill or clean up a hole or two by hand because
you can't simply move the head to where it needs to be...

Of course, there is the option of a 30 spindle head that has 15 spindels
across from another 15 spindles spaced at 2" so all you have to do is drill,
stroke the table in the X or Y access across the holes to clear the tube and
deburr... But we are talking about a serious drilling machine now. Not
even sure an old Bridgepirt could handle the stresses involved. Might have
to build a custom machine to do that. Maybe direct drive the head with a
motor or two and build a manual slide aparatus?


--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

Wayne,

Another way of avoiding burr inside the tubing, is to punch the holes
rather than drill them.
You will need to make a shoe horn type die. I have seen them to give
amazing results.


Rathin Sinha
San Stampings Pvt. Ltd.

Wayne,

Another way of avoiding burr inside the tubing, is to punch the holes
rather than drill them.
You will need to make a shoe horn type die. I have seen them to give
amazing results.


Rathin Sinha
San Stampings Pvt. Ltd.

Wayne,

Another way of avoiding burr inside the tubing, is to punch the holes
rather than drill them.
You will need to make a shoe horn type die. I have seen them to give
amazing results.


Rathin Sinha
San Stampings Pvt. Ltd.

An Aushalser is known as a Tee drill in English. Clever (and expensive)
device made in Finland and distributed just up the road out of Norcross GA.
http://www.t-drill.com/t60cuengdeu.pdf

--
Glenn Ashmore

I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack
there of) at: http://www.rutuonline.com
Shameless Commercial Division: http://www.spade-anchor-us.com

"steamer" wrote in message
...
--Cogsdill makes an excellent tool, but if a blade breaks, don't
try to insert a new one and get it to work right; better to send the
broken one back to the factory and let them do it.
--In addition to this method there's always a Rout-a-burr; a
little hand-intensive but it works..
--Another method might be abrasive slurry injection or whatever
the correct terminology is; don't know much about it but it sure makes
for purdy parts at trade shows..
--And finally, assuming you're attaching a second tube at the
place where you're making the hole there's a weird little gizmo called the
Aushalser, altho at the moment I can't find a link to it; will google a
bit more and see if I can find an image..

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Heartily sick of
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : "oldies" stations!
http://www.nmpproducts.com/intro.htm
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

I've used the handheld deburring tools for years, and they're great for most
tasks, but the internal edges of holes in tubing are a little too complex to
allow them to be very effective.
I can't help but wonder (about well, lots of things), if a spinning wire
brush wouldn't clean up the holes nicely. Check with Tom at Ohio Brush for
the availability of different bristle materials and sizes.
This would be relatively severe duty for the longevity of the brush, so
cheap imported retail store brushes wouldn't provide good results.
This would be a second operation, but a brush (those spiraled tube brushes)
mounted in a spinning drill press chuck and poked into the drilled holes,
would probably do a good job of deburring, and possibly add a small radius
to the edges of the holes in aluminum tubing.

Ideally, you'd want to drill the holes with a method to minimize the
break-through burrs if at all possible.
Steel or SS bristles would probably clean the holes fairly efficiently. I
would think that poking the brush into the holes would be more effective
than running it thru the length of the tube.

If I were confronted with this problem in *steel* tubing, I'd probably use a
Dremel stone or sanding drum, but if a miniature flap wheel was available,
that'd probably work better.

WB
.............

"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He
does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne







----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 100,000 Newsgroups
---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

"Wild Bill" wrote in
:

I've used the handheld deburring tools for years, and they're great
for most tasks, but the internal edges of holes in tubing are a little
too complex to allow them to be very effective.
I can't help but wonder (about well, lots of things), if a spinning
wire brush wouldn't clean up the holes nicely. Check with Tom at Ohio
Brush for the availability of different bristle materials and sizes.
This would be relatively severe duty for the longevity of the brush,
so cheap imported retail store brushes wouldn't provide good results.
This would be a second operation, but a brush (those spiraled tube
brushes) mounted in a spinning drill press chuck and poked into the
drilled holes, would probably do a good job of deburring, and possibly
add a small radius to the edges of the holes in aluminum tubing.

Ideally, you'd want to drill the holes with a method to minimize the
break-through burrs if at all possible.
Steel or SS bristles would probably clean the holes fairly
efficiently. I would think that poking the brush into the holes would
be more effective than running it thru the length of the tube.

If I were confronted with this problem in *steel* tubing, I'd probably
use a Dremel stone or sanding drum, but if a miniature flap wheel was
available, that'd probably work better.

WB
............


That got me thinking. Weiler Corporation " http://www.weilercorp.com/ "
makes abrasive brushes that are designed specifically for deburring
parts. I've used them in auto operations on a machining center with great
success. Running them by hand would be just as effective.

Dave

That got me thinking. Weiler Corporation " http://www.weilercorp.com/ "
makes abrasive brushes that are designed specifically for deburring
parts. I've used them in auto operations on a machining center with great
success. Running them by hand would be just as effective.

Because he is working with a tube that will accept another tube immediately
after the holes are drilled, I suggested he use either a drill or preferably
a reamer from the end of the tube with a tool extension rod as needed...
That way the inside of the tube is guaranteed to match the ID he needs and
the burr is effectively removed.

As someone else also mentioned, making sure the feed rate of the drilling
machine is controlled could almost eliminate the burr as well. The bit
wants to "jump" through the last little bit of material and that cuases a
heavy burr. If the bit was kept at a constant (slow) feed rate, then the
bit would not "plow" through and the burr would be wafer thin and minimized.
Even a solid "cleanout" rod could probably be used to deburr the pieces at
that point rather than a reamer...

Poor tube is gonna be sanded, drilled, reamed, poked and burned to a crisp
by the time we all get done with it, huh?

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

http://www.cogsdill.com/deburring.html

The one-pass tool will do front side and backside deburring in one shot.
I've seen them in action, and they do work.
Unsure of cost.

--
Replies to group please.

Tom Needham



"Wayne Lundberg" wrote in message
...
Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He
does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne

The one-pass tool will do front side and backside deburring in one shot.
I've seen them in action, and they do work.
Unsure of cost.

I know these work well on flat or almost flat surfaces, but he is doing the
drilling in a rathe small tube. These devices don't really work well in
those circumstances.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/4hpnc

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 14:03:18 -0500, "Joe"
wrote:

The one-pass tool will do front side and backside deburring in one shot.
I've seen them in action, and they do work.
Unsure of cost.

I know these work well on flat or almost flat surfaces, but he is doing the
drilling in a rathe small tube. These devices don't really work well in
those circumstances.
Joe, I disagree. Im my experience the cogsdill burraway tools work
well when deburring holes that go into or out of a curved surface. In
fact, my first experienvc with these tools was using them to deburr
holes in tubing.
ERS

I know these work well on flat or almost flat surfaces, but he is doing
the
drilling in a rathe small tube. These devices don't really work well in
those circumstances.

Joe, I disagree. Im my experience the cogsdill burraway tools work
well when deburring holes that go into or out of a curved surface. In
fact, my first experienvc with these tools was using them to deburr
holes in tubing.

Eric,

I can agree that they work well on some tubing, but I think this application
is a rather small tube. In other words, the ID curve is probably small
enough to make the deburring tool hit only on the "sides" of the hole but
not the "top" and "bottom" if viewing the tube horizontally.

The cutter works on a spring action if we are both talking about the same
device... And more pressure is applied to the thin wall aluminum tube when
it is sprung in farther as would happen on a tight radius of a small
diameter tube...

Then again, I've been known to be wrong often so all of my theory-thinking
above may be worthless. grin

Regardless, I think the best bet to deburr the inside of a small tube is to
run a precision reamer or drill down the tube from the open end. As long as
that tool is .001 to .002 oversized as compared to the second tube that will
be inserted into the first that was drilled, you will get a great fit and
all the burrs should disappear more quickly.

That method will work on any tube that has a semi-smooth interior as long as
you can get a reamer or drill with an extension long enough... And it won't
really matter what the burr size is so a feed controlled drilling machine
might not even be necessary.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/3n8gj

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 16:34:05 -0500, "Joe"
wrote:

I know these work well on flat or almost flat surfaces, but he is doing
the
drilling in a rathe small tube. These devices don't really work well in
those circumstances.

Joe, I disagree. Im my experience the cogsdill burraway tools work
well when deburring holes that go into or out of a curved surface. In
fact, my first experienvc with these tools was using them to deburr
holes in tubing.

Eric,

I can agree that they work well on some tubing, but I think this application
is a rather small tube. In other words, the ID curve is probably small
enough to make the deburring tool hit only on the "sides" of the hole but
not the "top" and "bottom" if viewing the tube horizontally.

The cutter works on a spring action if we are both talking about the same
device... And more pressure is applied to the thin wall aluminum tube when
it is sprung in farther as would happen on a tight radius of a small
diameter tube...

Then again, I've been known to be wrong often so all of my theory-thinking
above may be worthless. grin

Regardless, I think the best bet to deburr the inside of a small tube is to
run a precision reamer or drill down the tube from the open end. As long as
that tool is .001 to .002 oversized as compared to the second tube that will
be inserted into the first that was drilled, you will get a great fit and
all the burrs should disappear more quickly.

That method will work on any tube that has a semi-smooth interior as long as
you can get a reamer or drill with an extension long enough... And it won't
really matter what the burr size is so a feed controlled drilling machine
might not even be necessary.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/3n8gj

Hey Joe, not to be contrary or anything but I just finished a job that
had .244" dia holes going through a .500 dia aluminum part. Deburring
the hole with a regular countersink doesn't work bery well. But the
spring loaded Cogsdill Burraway worked great. The secret is using a
tool that fits the drilled closely and messing with the setscrew that
controls tension on the blade. These joles were on the O.D. of the
part. I.D. holes can be harder to deburr right so your suggestion of
having as small a burr as possible by controlling the feed is a good
one. I have rounded the first cutting edge on the Burraway tool. This
is so I can deburr the inside of the hole without doing anything the
the outside. Sometimes the jobs I do require minimal visible edge
breaks for cosmetic reasoms.
ERS

Hey Joe, not to be contrary or anything but I just finished a job that
had .244" dia holes going through a .500 dia aluminum part. Deburring
the hole with a regular countersink doesn't work bery well. But the
spring loaded Cogsdill Burraway worked great. The secret is using a
tool that fits the drilled closely and messing with the setscrew that
controls tension on the blade. These joles were on the O.D. of the
part. I.D. holes can be harder to deburr right so your suggestion of
having as small a burr as possible by controlling the feed is a good
one. I have rounded the first cutting edge on the Burraway tool. This
is so I can deburr the inside of the hole without doing anything the
the outside. Sometimes the jobs I do require minimal visible edge
breaks for cosmetic reasoms.

Great to learn about these tools from someone who has used them! Thank you
for the insight. We are always getting inquiries on hole drilling (that's
what we do!) and deburring operations... One of these days, I'll simply buy
one of their tools and test it on various materials, tubes, etc. for some
first-hand experience too.

Cogsdill makes a burnishing tool which is pretty cool. We use ot for some
oil impregnated bushings on our machine... I am pretty sure they are made
to be used on a drill press, etc. but I've put a handle on them and use them
manually. Great quality tooling IMHO.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
http://www.autodrill.com
http://www.multi-spindle-heads.com

V8013

My eBay: http://tinyurl.com/3n8gj

Wayne Lundberg wrote:
Back when I was a practicing Mfg. Eng. at Solar Turbines I did extensive
research into deburring the inside hole made in tubing. I failed to find
anything really earth-shaking.

I'm faced with the problem again in advising a client of mine on how to
deburr the 15 holes he is drilling in 1" od aluminum tubing to create his
telescopic affair for his cargo net for pickup trucks. He bought a neat
deburring tool from McMaster, on my recommendation, and is using it quite
well, but his hand and wrist gets tired after about the 100th hole. He does
not want to follow the logical step in taking the work to Mexico or China.
He wants his product to be made in the USA.

Any burr left on the inside of the tube screws up the easy telescoping
movement and scratches the inner tube as well.

Anybody have any proven success with this kind of problem?

I told him this is one reason so many manufacturers have gone to Mexico or
China because deburring is really one of those pesky problems requiring
human hands. Of course he could do the work on a CNC machine and maybe we
could find a shop to do it but the cost is going to be enormous when he is
only dealing with a thousand holes a month. Now.

Wayne


we use a company that uses a electro-chemical process.
www.vectron-69.com

"Wild Bill" wrote in message
...
I've used the handheld deburring tools for years, and they're great for
most
tasks, but the internal edges of holes in tubing are a little

Thanks, you make me think of a reamer type device... must try it.

Wayne