I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it. Unless I get ambitious
and build a giant oven (thanks to the great design pointers
I've seen here!), I'll probably have the sections done by a
local company that is equipped for large items. I've
heard prices between $5 and $10 per foot for fences and
railings, which sounds reasonable.

The problem comes during installation: after welding the
sections together, I would need to touch up the powder coat.

Is this feasible? What heat sources would be suitable?
Can you get a good match (assuming the same powder) between
the original and the touch-up? What do the "big boys" do
on jobs like this?

As an alternative, what brand and type (available in
California) of paint would be best for this kind of
outdoor use? I don't want to have to be repainting it
every few years.

Thanks,
Alan

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 09:23:41 -0800, Alan Frisbie
wrote:

I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it. Unless I get ambitious
and build a giant oven (thanks to the great design pointers
I've seen here!), I'll probably have the sections done by a
local company that is equipped for large items. I've
heard prices between $5 and $10 per foot for fences and
railings, which sounds reasonable.

The problem comes during installation: after welding the
sections together, I would need to touch up the powder coat.

Is this feasible? What heat sources would be suitable?
Can you get a good match (assuming the same powder) between
the original and the touch-up? What do the "big boys" do
on jobs like this?

As an alternative, what brand and type (available in
California) of paint would be best for this kind of
outdoor use? I don't want to have to be repainting it
every few years.

Truck bed liner. 5 gal bucket and a couple of brushes at wallmart was
about $40.00. Used it on the frame of a '38 Buick Special four years
ago. Tough stuff and you won't likely have to ever repaint it.

Big boys who make cheap fences powder coat, and use mechanical
fasteners. Field powdercoating is not very feasible. I have never heard
of anyone doing it. Big boys who make high end fences dont powdercoat-
its not a good longterm finish for outdoor metalwork. One of the
reasons is you cant touch it up, but there are others. Once rust starts
on powdercoating, and it can start if someone scratches the surface
accidentally or intentionally, it will cause the powder finish to peel
up like a bad sunburn.
Then, the only answer is to take the whole fence back down, put it in a
2500 degree burnout oven, then sandblast, then repaint.
I sometimes build very expensive fences. I either use hot dip
galvanizing, or stainless steel. I dont trust powder for exterior uses.

I have sent several powdercoaters kids to college on what I have paid
for finishing furniture, and other things to be used indoors, but I
dont use it outside. I just dont want the callbacks. Plus, some colors
will fade in the sun, and some powders will chalk up outdoors.
The truck liner paint is not a bad idea- that stuff is bulletproof.
Normal painting protocol for a fence would be
Sandblast
Prime twice
Finish coat with a very high quality enamel, or a two part epoxy
system.
Not sure what is still available in California. Many industrial
suppliers like Grainger may still sell industrial enamels, even though
you cant get it from home depot.

wrote in message
oups.com...
Big boys who make cheap fences powder coat, and use mechanical
fasteners. Field powdercoating is not very feasible. I have never heard
of anyone doing it. Big boys who make high end fences dont powdercoat-
its not a good longterm finish for outdoor metalwork. One of the
reasons is you cant touch it up, but there are others. Once rust starts
on powdercoating, and it can start if someone scratches the surface
accidentally or intentionally, it will cause the powder finish to peel
up like a bad sunburn.
Then, the only answer is to take the whole fence back down, put it in a
2500 degree burnout oven, then sandblast, then repaint.
I sometimes build very expensive fences. I either use hot dip
galvanizing, or stainless steel. I dont trust powder for exterior uses.

I have sent several powdercoaters kids to college on what I have paid
for finishing furniture, and other things to be used indoors, but I
dont use it outside. I just dont want the callbacks. Plus, some colors
will fade in the sun, and some powders will chalk up outdoors.
The truck liner paint is not a bad idea- that stuff is bulletproof.
Normal painting protocol for a fence would be
Sandblast
Prime twice
Finish coat with a very high quality enamel, or a two part epoxy
system.
Not sure what is still available in California. Many industrial
suppliers like Grainger may still sell industrial enamels, even though
you cant get it from home depot.

Check this stuff out:
http://www.si-coat.com/section_anti-corr/about.html

It's about $80 a gallon, but if it performs as promised, it's worth it's
weight in gold. I'm trying out a sample on some pretty brutal equipment
applications. They have some pretty big pipeline and tank jobs referenced.

"ATP" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
Big boys who make cheap fences powder coat, and use mechanical
fasteners. Field powdercoating is not very feasible. I have never heard
of anyone doing it. Big boys who make high end fences dont powdercoat-
its not a good longterm finish for outdoor metalwork. One of the
reasons is you cant touch it up, but there are others. Once rust starts
on powdercoating, and it can start if someone scratches the surface
accidentally or intentionally, it will cause the powder finish to peel
up like a bad sunburn.
Then, the only answer is to take the whole fence back down, put it in a
2500 degree burnout oven, then sandblast, then repaint.
I sometimes build very expensive fences. I either use hot dip
galvanizing, or stainless steel. I dont trust powder for exterior uses.

I have sent several powdercoaters kids to college on what I have paid
for finishing furniture, and other things to be used indoors, but I
dont use it outside. I just dont want the callbacks. Plus, some colors
will fade in the sun, and some powders will chalk up outdoors.
The truck liner paint is not a bad idea- that stuff is bulletproof.
Normal painting protocol for a fence would be
Sandblast
Prime twice
Finish coat with a very high quality enamel, or a two part epoxy
system.
Not sure what is still available in California. Many industrial
suppliers like Grainger may still sell industrial enamels, even though
you cant get it from home depot.

Check this stuff out:
http://www.si-coat.com/section_anti-corr/about.html

It's about $80 a gallon, but if it performs as promised, it's worth it's
weight in gold. I'm trying out a sample on some pretty brutal equipment
applications. They have some pretty big pipeline and tank jobs referenced.

they don't seem to mention where you can actually buy the product on the
website, do you have any more information on where to get it at?

"Blackout" wrote in message
...

"ATP" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
oups.com...
Big boys who make cheap fences powder coat, and use mechanical
fasteners. Field powdercoating is not very feasible. I have never heard
of anyone doing it. Big boys who make high end fences dont powdercoat-
its not a good longterm finish for outdoor metalwork. One of the
reasons is you cant touch it up, but there are others. Once rust starts
on powdercoating, and it can start if someone scratches the surface
accidentally or intentionally, it will cause the powder finish to peel
up like a bad sunburn.
Then, the only answer is to take the whole fence back down, put it in a
2500 degree burnout oven, then sandblast, then repaint.
I sometimes build very expensive fences. I either use hot dip
galvanizing, or stainless steel. I dont trust powder for exterior uses.

I have sent several powdercoaters kids to college on what I have paid
for finishing furniture, and other things to be used indoors, but I
dont use it outside. I just dont want the callbacks. Plus, some colors
will fade in the sun, and some powders will chalk up outdoors.
The truck liner paint is not a bad idea- that stuff is bulletproof.
Normal painting protocol for a fence would be
Sandblast
Prime twice
Finish coat with a very high quality enamel, or a two part epoxy
system.
Not sure what is still available in California. Many industrial
suppliers like Grainger may still sell industrial enamels, even though
you cant get it from home depot.

Check this stuff out:
http://www.si-coat.com/section_anti-corr/about.html

It's about $80 a gallon, but if it performs as promised, it's worth it's
weight in gold. I'm trying out a sample on some pretty brutal equipment
applications. They have some pretty big pipeline and tank jobs
referenced.

they don't seem to mention where you can actually buy the product on the
website, do you have any more information on where to get it at?

I have some info at work, I'll bring it home and send it to you.

"Alan Frisbie" wrote in message
...
I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it. Unless I get ambitious
and build a giant oven (thanks to the great design pointers
I've seen here!), I'll probably have the sections done by a
local company that is equipped for large items. I've
heard prices between $5 and $10 per foot for fences and
railings, which sounds reasonable.

The problem comes during installation: after welding the
sections together, I would need to touch up the powder coat.

Is this feasible? What heat sources would be suitable?
Can you get a good match (assuming the same powder) between
the original and the touch-up? What do the "big boys" do
on jobs like this?

As an alternative, what brand and type (available in
California) of paint would be best for this kind of
outdoor use? I don't want to have to be repainting it
every few years.

Thanks,
Alan



Powder is nice stuff BUT it can be interesting to work with. The BIG
item is surface prep. Any oil/grease rust MUST be removed and the
surface cleaned real well or the powder will fail. That is the number
one reason for coating failures. As for touching up powder it can be
done but is not easy. What you would need to do is get a small amount of
the SAME powder they use to coat the parts. Then in the areas your
planning on welding grind the powder back an inch or so then weld. Dress
the weld and clean the area real well. Mask off the areas next to the
coated spot to keep any loose powder from sticking during the touch-up.
Then use a high temperature heat gun (NO TORCHES, they will leave
contaminants or moisture on the surface) to heat the area up to 250-300
degrees and apply the powder ( one of the cheap powder guns from HF will
work fine or you can just blow it on from your hand IF your careful)
Then keep the area at 250-300 (watch the powder, it will melt and flow
out at the proper temperature)
Keep it at that temp. for 20 min. or so. That will cure the powder and
it should match the original since it is the same stuff. Make SURE they
use a good UV stabilized Polyester powder since the Epoxy powders and
most of the blends will chalk in a year or so.
Another option is a flame spray coater, they can do powder or metal coat
in an exterior setting without a problem. But it is more expensive than
oven baked powder and I don't think it is as durable.
If you want to go with a conventional paint, a GOOD coat of Catalyzed
Enamel base with a heavy clear would hold up 10 years or more.




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Alan Frisbie wrote:
I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it.

Thanks for all the great replies to my questions! Now that
I understand the issues a bit more, I'm beginning to reconsider
my decision to powder coat. As I now understand it, powder
coating is great as long as there is no way rust can get
under it. This means no chipping or cracking.

For an outdoor fence, that may be impossible over the long
run. Gates get slammed, garden tools fall against them,
lawn mowers or string trimmers fling pebbles, etc. I'm
going to take a fresh look at painting, especially some
of the suggestions you guys made.

That Sci-Coat stuff looks interesting, but I want to see
what it looks like first. Likewise the idea of using truck
bed liner coating.

Outdoors sure is a severe environment! Nothing seems to
stand up very well. I got some of those chrome plated wire
shelf units for my wife to keep her collection of small cacti
on. I figured that since chrome plated car bumpers seemed
to last forever that the shelves would last a long time.
Wrong! Only four years later they are all covered with a
light coating of rust.

Even the "heavy duty" silver tarps can't last more than one
year in the southern California sun. I wrapped a piece of
equipment in one, and one year later the silver coating is
flaking off and the underlying plastic is going fast. Mother
Nature is about as agressive as they come!

Thanks!
Alan

"Alan Frisbie" wrote in message
...
Alan Frisbie wrote:
I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it.

Thanks for all the great replies to my questions! Now that
I understand the issues a bit more, I'm beginning to reconsider
my decision to powder coat. As I now understand it, powder
coating is great as long as there is no way rust can get
under it. This means no chipping or cracking.

For an outdoor fence, that may be impossible over the long
run. Gates get slammed, garden tools fall against them,
lawn mowers or string trimmers fling pebbles, etc. I'm
going to take a fresh look at painting, especially some
of the suggestions you guys made.

That Sci-Coat stuff looks interesting, but I want to see
what it looks like first. Likewise the idea of using truck
bed liner coating.

Outdoors sure is a severe environment! Nothing seems to
stand up very well. I got some of those chrome plated wire
shelf units for my wife to keep her collection of small cacti
on. I figured that since chrome plated car bumpers seemed
to last forever that the shelves would last a long time.
Wrong! Only four years later they are all covered with a
light coating of rust.

All chrome plating is definitely not created equal.

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:17:08 -0800, Alan Frisbie
wrote:

Alan Frisbie wrote:
I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it.

Thanks for all the great replies to my questions! Now that
I understand the issues a bit more, I'm beginning to reconsider
my decision to powder coat. As I now understand it, powder
coating is great as long as there is no way rust can get
under it. This means no chipping or cracking.

For an outdoor fence, that may be impossible over the long
run. Gates get slammed, garden tools fall against them,
lawn mowers or string trimmers fling pebbles, etc. I'm
going to take a fresh look at painting, especially some
of the suggestions you guys made.

That Sci-Coat stuff looks interesting, but I want to see
what it looks like first. Likewise the idea of using truck
bed liner coating.

Outdoors sure is a severe environment! Nothing seems to
stand up very well. I got some of those chrome plated wire
shelf units for my wife to keep her collection of small cacti
on. I figured that since chrome plated car bumpers seemed
to last forever that the shelves would last a long time.
Wrong! Only four years later they are all covered with a
light coating of rust.

Even the "heavy duty" silver tarps can't last more than one
year in the southern California sun. I wrapped a piece of
equipment in one, and one year later the silver coating is
flaking off and the underlying plastic is going fast. Mother
Nature is about as agressive as they come!

Before I used the truck bed liner, a good friend in FL painted an
extra (throw away) set of motorcycle gas tanks with truck bed liner.
Nominal clean up and prep work. Brushed the stuff on and let them sit
in his yard for almost a year. We're talking Florida sal****er front
property. He poured gas on them, let them bake in the sun, threw
gravel at them, etc. I suggest you give that type of test a try and
see what your results are. Mine were the same.

It's cheap, easy to apply, prep work is a piece of cake, and it really
does last under extreme conditions. Tough stuff! You can brush it,
roll it, or spray it also, but the spay cans are spendy and I've never
used them.

Have you checked out hot dip galvanizing? Gives a zinc coating that protects
both as a covering and as cathodic protection.

Tom

"Alan Frisbie" wrote in message
...
Alan Frisbie wrote:
I am getting ready to weld up a fence for my home and
am considering powder coating it.

Thanks for all the great replies to my questions! Now that
I understand the issues a bit more, I'm beginning to reconsider
my decision to powder coat. As I now understand it, powder
coating is great as long as there is no way rust can get
under it. This means no chipping or cracking.

For an outdoor fence, that may be impossible over the long
run. Gates get slammed, garden tools fall against them,
lawn mowers or string trimmers fling pebbles, etc. I'm
going to take a fresh look at painting, especially some
of the suggestions you guys made.

That Sci-Coat stuff looks interesting, but I want to see
what it looks like first. Likewise the idea of using truck
bed liner coating.

Outdoors sure is a severe environment! Nothing seems to
stand up very well. I got some of those chrome plated wire
shelf units for my wife to keep her collection of small cacti
on. I figured that since chrome plated car bumpers seemed
to last forever that the shelves would last a long time.
Wrong! Only four years later they are all covered with a
light coating of rust.

Even the "heavy duty" silver tarps can't last more than one
year in the southern California sun. I wrapped a piece of
equipment in one, and one year later the silver coating is
flaking off and the underlying plastic is going fast. Mother
Nature is about as agressive as they come!

Thanks!
Alan

Tom Miller wrote:
Have you checked out hot dip galvanizing? Gives a zinc coating
that protects both as a covering and as cathodic protection.

Yes, I did. The problem, as I mentioned in the original
posting, is what to do after welding the various sections
together. I'm not aware of any way to "touch up" hot dip
galvanizing in the field. Is there one? Do the various
zinc-containing paint products work well?

Of course, I am ignoring the aesthetic aspects of galvanizing.
My wife might have something to say about that. :-)

Alan

Yes, I did. The problem, as I mentioned in the original
posting, is what to do after welding the various sections
together. I'm not aware of any way to "touch up" hot dip
galvanizing in the field. Is there one?


Yes , there is. Clean the slag off the weld immediately after welding.
While the weld is still hot, rub it with a "zinc stick". I believe that it
is just that, a stick of pure zinc. It will melt and run over the weld area.
Zinc sticks are avilable here in Australia from BOC Pty Ltd. (Used to be
commonwealth Industrail Gasses) but I would think most good welding supply
organizations would have them available, even if they had to order them in
for you.





Do the various
zinc-containing paint products work well?

There is one here in Oz, called Cold Gal that works reasonably well but it
will be long gone before the hot dip galvanized area starts to corrode


Of course, I am ignoring the aesthetic aspects of galvanizing.
My wife might have something to say about that. :-)

Alan

I'm not aware of any way to "touch up" hot dip
galvanizing in the field. Is there one?

One product:
http://www.zrcworldwide.com/whatszrc.htm
I've never used it.