Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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Old July 13th 19, 06:37 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically. A north facing wall can help but in a
shore side (not salt) environment in Arizona that isn't as much help as it
might be elsewhere.

I looked at powder coat, and the best powders start to fade in 20-25 years
from what I have read. That's assuming other factors have not harmed them.

Red metals aren't really "red," and they would need to be coated to prevent
corrosion. Brass (gold finish) red metal is already being incorporated in
the project.

Red anodized aluminum seemed to be an option, but quick checks (not
exhaustive) seemed to indicate that organic pigments used in aluminum
anodizing will fade. My cursory checks didn't show an inorganic red for
aluminum anodizing.

I am prepared (and the person asking is prepared) to leave out the red for
these reasons, but I want to make sure I have exhausted my options. No red
rust isn't an option. LOL.

I'd like it to look good for the maximum remaining life span of those
asking. Maybe as much as 50 years barring further life extension results in
medical research.


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Old July 13th 19, 07:24 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 10:37:51 -0700, "Bob La Londe"
wrote:

As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically. A north facing wall can help but in a
shore side (not salt) environment in Arizona that isn't as much help as it
might be elsewhere.

I looked at powder coat, and the best powders start to fade in 20-25 years
from what I have read. That's assuming other factors have not harmed them.

Red metals aren't really "red," and they would need to be coated to prevent
corrosion. Brass (gold finish) red metal is already being incorporated in
the project.

Red anodized aluminum seemed to be an option, but quick checks (not
exhaustive) seemed to indicate that organic pigments used in aluminum
anodizing will fade. My cursory checks didn't show an inorganic red for
aluminum anodizing.

I am prepared (and the person asking is prepared) to leave out the red for
these reasons, but I want to make sure I have exhausted my options. No red
rust isn't an option. LOL.

I'd like it to look good for the maximum remaining life span of those
asking. Maybe as much as 50 years barring further life extension results in
medical research.

Enamel on metal will work as will ceramic glazes. Takes high heat
though.
Eric
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Old July 13th 19, 08:31 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 11:24:13 -0700, wrote:

On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 10:37:51 -0700, "Bob La Londe"
wrote:

As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically. A north facing wall can help but in a
shore side (not salt) environment in Arizona that isn't as much help as it
might be elsewhere.

I looked at powder coat, and the best powders start to fade in 20-25 years
from what I have read. That's assuming other factors have not harmed them.

Red metals aren't really "red," and they would need to be coated to prevent
corrosion. Brass (gold finish) red metal is already being incorporated in
the project.

Red anodized aluminum seemed to be an option, but quick checks (not
exhaustive) seemed to indicate that organic pigments used in aluminum
anodizing will fade. My cursory checks didn't show an inorganic red for
aluminum anodizing.

I am prepared (and the person asking is prepared) to leave out the red for
these reasons, but I want to make sure I have exhausted my options. No red
rust isn't an option. LOL.

I'd like it to look good for the maximum remaining life span of those
asking. Maybe as much as 50 years barring further life extension results in
medical research.

Enamel on metal will work as will ceramic glazes. Takes high heat
though.
Eric

A red Kynar coating should stand up pretty good. Not easily field
applied though - -
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Old July 13th 19, 10:25 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

On Sat, 13 Jul 2019 10:37:51 -0700, "Bob La Londe"
wrote:

As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically. A north facing wall can help but in a
shore side (not salt) environment in Arizona that isn't as much help as it
might be elsewhere.

I looked at powder coat, and the best powders start to fade in 20-25 years
from what I have read. That's assuming other factors have not harmed them.

Red metals aren't really "red," and they would need to be coated to prevent
corrosion. Brass (gold finish) red metal is already being incorporated in
the project.

Red anodized aluminum seemed to be an option, but quick checks (not
exhaustive) seemed to indicate that organic pigments used in aluminum
anodizing will fade. My cursory checks didn't show an inorganic red for
aluminum anodizing.

I am prepared (and the person asking is prepared) to leave out the red for
these reasons, but I want to make sure I have exhausted my options. No red
rust isn't an option. LOL.

I'd like it to look good for the maximum remaining life span of those
asking. Maybe as much as 50 years barring further life extension results in
medical research.


Barns in New England used to be, maybe still are, painted red. The
original "paint" was a mixture of skimmed milk, lime and iron oxide.
It lasted pretty well.
--
cheers,

John B.

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Old July 14th 19, 12:06 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 10:37:57 AM UTC-7, Bob La Londe wrote:
As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically.


I've bought steel roofing material with red (factory applied) finish that
has a 40-year warranty.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Metal-Sales-12-ft-Classic-Rib-Steel-Roof-Panel-in-Red-2313424/204255145

Other permanent red for walls would be brick, terra-cotta tile, etc.
Stained-glass, too, weathers adequately. I've got a red-glass cup somewhere,
that grandmom got as a souvenir in 1895, in Atlantic City. No fading of color.


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Old July 14th 19, 12:31 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Saturday, July 13, 2019 at 10:37:57 AM UTC-7, Bob La Londe wrote:
As near as I can tell most paints are out. 10-20 years max, and
any UV
exposure reduces that dramatically.


I've bought steel roofing material with red (factory applied) finish
that
has a 40-year warranty.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Metal-Sales-12-ft-Classic-Rib-Steel-Roof-Panel-in-Red-2313424/204255145

Other permanent red for walls would be brick, terra-cotta tile, etc.
Stained-glass, too, weathers adequately. I've got a red-glass cup
somewhere,
that grandmom got as a souvenir in 1895, in Atlantic City. No
fading of color.


A pottery studio owner told me that -all- their red inorganic pigments
had been confiscated as hazardous. She did still have high temperature
fire clay and gave me a little.


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Old July 15th 19, 08:16 AM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default The Color Red - Outdoors

On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 4:30:15 AM UTC-7, Jim Wilkins wrote:
"whit3rd" wrote in message
...


Other permanent red for walls would be brick, terra-cotta tile, etc.


A pottery studio owner told me that -all- their red inorganic pigments
had been confiscated as hazardous. She did still have high temperature
fire clay and gave me a little.


Probably that's about cadmium red; the duller ochre (Fe2O3) that
gives terra cotta its color, probably is still OK.

Tiles in red are certainly available
https://www.fireclaytile.com/brick/colors/detail/catskill

Red lead (minium) and mercuric (vermilion, cinnabar) pigments aren't modern, but
are also certainly a hazard.

Another heavy metal, gold, colors glass red (might make a glaze of bright
red atop a dull tile background).
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Old July 15th 19, 12:00 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Posts: 5,373
Default The Color Red - Outdoors

"whit3rd" wrote in message
...
On Sunday, July 14, 2019 at 4:30:15 AM UTC-7, Jim Wilkins wrote:
"whit3rd" wrote in message
...


Other permanent red for walls would be brick, terra-cotta tile,
etc.


A pottery studio owner told me that -all- their red inorganic
pigments
had been confiscated as hazardous. She did still have high
temperature
fire clay and gave me a little.


Probably that's about cadmium red; the duller ochre (Fe2O3) that
gives terra cotta its color, probably is still OK.

Tiles in red are certainly available
https://www.fireclaytile.com/brick/colors/detail/catskill

Red lead (minium) and mercuric (vermilion, cinnabar) pigments aren't
modern, but
are also certainly a hazard.

Another heavy metal, gold, colors glass red (might make a glaze of
bright
red atop a dull tile background).


When I gently brought up the chemistry of pigments it was evident she
didn't know it so I didn't embarrass her with further questions. I
found high temperature ceramic fiber insulation on Amazon instead.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B077T8HDF3/ref=dp_cerb_1




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