Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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Old April 15th 19, 06:19 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default 1939/40 Harley trans questions

On Sun, 14 Apr 2019 21:45:10 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote:

On 4/14/2019 9:30 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Sun, 14 Apr 2019 19:47:57 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote:

On 4/14/2019 7:26 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Sun, 14 Apr 2019 17:05:33 -0700, wrote:

SNIP
I guess I don't understand what you are trying to do. I thought you
had a bore that was out of round and so a bearing race would walk out
of it. Are you just going to lap to roundness instead of bore to
roundness? Once you do have the bore the way you want it will you
still need to Loctite the bearing race in? Or bush and then press the
race in? I don't know anything about Harley transmission cases and
where the bearings are located.
Eric
* I'm sorry Eric , I might not have been clear . I have a race that's
pressed into the left side of the transmission case , it carries the
clutch gear (main input shaft to trans , carries the clutch on the
outside) and thrust for the clutch . When this race was pressed into
another case I have the bearings rolled perfectly - these are loose
rollers with retaining washers on both ends . In the case it is
currently pressed into , it ain't workin' so well . The race now
measures .0015" larger horizontally than it is tall - it's oval now .
What we're talking about lapping is the inside diameter of the race , to
make it round IN THIS ORIENTATION in the case . If it's R&R'ed it will
have to be indexed to the exact same orientation . Or I can make the
hole it's pressed into round . Six of one , half a dozen of the other .
I can go either way with what I have on hand except for loctite sleeve
retaining stuff .
OK, now I think I see what you are trying to do. If the race is
pressed into an out of round hole and then takes on this out of
roundness condition the ID of the race will be out of round. Then if
you lap the ID of the race roundness is then restored.
If the race is lapped into roundness it will now be a larger
diameter. Is this OK? The rollers will now be able skid. Maybe they
could in the original configuration. I don't know how the bearing was
designed.
If the race is lapped round after pressing it in is there a
possibility of the race moving in the bore? That would be bad. How
much of a press fit is the race in the bore?
It seems to me that the shaft that rotates in this bearing will
rattle around if the race is lapped oversize. That would bother me.
Maybe I should look online at Harley transmission cases. Maybe there's
a good drawing or two showing how everything works.
As an aside, today I had to remove the distributor from my 1939
Ford 9N tractor. To adjust the points. Sheesh! At least the
distributor drive slot is off center so that it only goes on one way.
Still, needing to remove the distributor to adjust the points???
Eric
Didn't HAVE to remove the distributor on a slant six, but it was
less agravation and took less time that way
* The external adjust points were one of my favorite features of GM
distributors .

On v8 distributors only though.

* With one exception that I'm aware of , the slant 4 they put in some
early Tempests . Basically the right bank of their 389 V8 , it displaced
189 CI and a lot of internals would swap . Like camshafts ... Ever try
to buy half a set of headers ?

You are correct - and I BELIEVE, but am not cetain,that in a pinch
you could run one with an 8 cyl cap.

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Old April 15th 19, 09:39 PM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Default 1939/40 Harley trans questions

On Sat, 13 Apr 2019 19:50:08 -0500
Terry Coombs wrote:

snip
I know nothing of the sort ... a little history is in order . My
father got this bike in 1952 and it had a broken countershaft in the
trans . As far as I know he never even fired it up much less rode it .
It sat around in Grandad's chicken coop (half was storage) until 1965 ,
when Dad pulled the trans and had a countershaft made - somebody in the
machine shops at Hill AFB musta owed him a favor or six . But alas , he
never put the bike back together . And so when he passed in 1998 I put
all the pieces in a trailer and hauled it home to Memphis from Utah .
I've been collecting parts since I got it , very little left to buy now
, just gotta put it all together . And it looks like in the fairly near
future I'll have room to work on it . If I had a bucket list , getting
this machine back on the road would be at the top .


Oh man, great back story and good luck getting this machine up and
running again.

You'll have to make a small video of it tooling down the
road, preferably in the near future ;-)

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI

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Old April 16th 19, 01:04 AM posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Posts: 8,974
Default 1939/40 Harley trans questions

On Sun, 14 Apr 2019 19:47:57 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote:

On 4/14/2019 7:26 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Sun, 14 Apr 2019 17:05:33 -0700, wrote:

SNIP
I guess I don't understand what you are trying to do. I thought you
had a bore that was out of round and so a bearing race would walk out
of it. Are you just going to lap to roundness instead of bore to
roundness? Once you do have the bore the way you want it will you
still need to Loctite the bearing race in? Or bush and then press the
race in? I don't know anything about Harley transmission cases and
where the bearings are located.
Eric
* I'm sorry Eric , I might not have been clear . I have a race that's
pressed into the left side of the transmission case , it carries the
clutch gear (main input shaft to trans , carries the clutch on the
outside) and thrust for the clutch . When this race was pressed into
another case I have the bearings rolled perfectly - these are loose
rollers with retaining washers on both ends . In the case it is
currently pressed into , it ain't workin' so well . The race now
measures .0015" larger horizontally than it is tall - it's oval now .
What we're talking about lapping is the inside diameter of the race , to
make it round IN THIS ORIENTATION in the case . If it's R&R'ed it will
have to be indexed to the exact same orientation . Or I can make the
hole it's pressed into round . Six of one , half a dozen of the other .
I can go either way with what I have on hand except for loctite sleeve
retaining stuff .
OK, now I think I see what you are trying to do. If the race is
pressed into an out of round hole and then takes on this out of
roundness condition the ID of the race will be out of round. Then if
you lap the ID of the race roundness is then restored.
If the race is lapped into roundness it will now be a larger
diameter. Is this OK? The rollers will now be able skid. Maybe they
could in the original configuration. I don't know how the bearing was
designed.
If the race is lapped round after pressing it in is there a
possibility of the race moving in the bore? That would be bad. How
much of a press fit is the race in the bore?
It seems to me that the shaft that rotates in this bearing will
rattle around if the race is lapped oversize. That would bother me.
Maybe I should look online at Harley transmission cases. Maybe there's
a good drawing or two showing how everything works.
As an aside, today I had to remove the distributor from my 1939
Ford 9N tractor. To adjust the points. Sheesh! At least the
distributor drive slot is off center so that it only goes on one way.
Still, needing to remove the distributor to adjust the points???
Eric

Didn't HAVE to remove the distributor on a slant six, but it was
less agravation and took less time that way

* The external adjust points were one of my favorite features of GM
distributors .


That little metal door where you could put the allen key? Yeah, that
was one of GM's few engineering good strokes.

--
"I have noticed even people who claim everything is predestined
and that we can do nothing to change it look before they cross
the road." --Steven Hawking


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