With out the 24K high speed spindles so readily available from China I
wouldn't be able to do what I do. Not and make any money. I've found a
few Chinese sellers on Ebay seem to sell better motors than others.
Look at their feedback, look at the age of their account, and don't buy
from the guys who sell cheap spindles or cheap packages. If you do that
you get spindles that easily give you several thousands of hours and
then only need a bearing swap.

I've never had a true quick change spindle and never used the tool table
in a machine until I picked up a Tormach Mill with an automatic tool
changer. It was awesome for a couple months, but the ATC started acting
up and I had work that needed to be done. I jerked the ATC off the
machine and threw it on the floor. Its still on the floor in about the
same place it landed when I pulled it off.

I did retain the power draw bar (with some adjustment for better holding
power) and continued to use the tool table in the control software. Its
certainly not as fast of a machine as the little Chinese mills with the
24K spindles, but I tool changes are a lot faster. I push a button,
swap the tool, and press start. Its about as quick as it was for you to
read that. Never mind the arguments about the holding power of TTS
tooling. Tool changes are fast and easy, and a job that takes a dozen
tools only need to be touched off once. If the first tool surfaces the
part and establishes zero then every tool after is dead on (or as good
as your height gage anyway.)

On my 24K spindle machines they have ER collet spindle noses. Tool
changes are slow. Very slow. That's the rule for a tool change. Tool
table? Why bother. When you are using mills in a collet its NTHST.
Never The Same Height Twice. Unscrew the closer, take it off if you
need a mill with a different size shank. Install the new mill.
Tighten... and then touch off all over again. I use dial type Z height
setters and I get within .0002 .0005 every time for Z height, but it
still takes a little time. One might suggest mills with collars, but
they can vary depending on how hard you tighten the collet closer. For
many things they might be fine, but for features only a couple
thousandths deep they aren't always good enough.

Everything up to this point is background.

I've decided that the next big job I do I'm going to get atleast one
(maybe 3) of the 24K ATC spindles with the ISO 20 spindle nose. They
range in price from about $2800 to a bunch. A lot more than the
$500-600 I typically pay for a half decent 1.5KW 24K spindle. I could
afford to throw away the money I spent on cheaper spindles when the
decent ones were only 500-600. With the jump in functionality comes the
indicated jump in price. Is a $2800 ATC spindle going to be the same
turd as a $200 ER collet spindle? Throwing away $200 on a lesson is
affordable, but not so much $3000. Yes, I've had more expensive lessons
than that, but still...

On 2/26/2019 3:38 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
With out the 24K high speed spindles so readily available from China I
wouldn't be able to do what I do.Â* Not and make any money.Â* I've found a
few Chinese sellers on Ebay seem to sell better motors than others. Look
at their feedback, look at the age of their account, and don't buy from
the guys who sell cheap spindles or cheap packages.Â* If you do that you
get spindles that easily give you several thousands of hours and then
only need a bearing swap.

I've never had a true quick change spindle and never used the tool table
in a machine until I picked up a Tormach Mill with an automatic tool
changer.Â* It was awesome for a couple months, but the ATC started acting
up and I had work that needed to be done.Â* I jerked the ATC off the
machine and threw it on the floor.Â* Its still on the floor in about the
same place it landed when I pulled it off.

I did retain the power draw bar (with some adjustment for better holding
power) and continued to use the tool table in the control software.Â* Its
certainly not as fast of a machine as the little Chinese mills with the
24K spindles, but I tool changes are a lot faster.Â* I push a button,
swap the tool, and press start.Â* Its about as quick as it was for you to
read that.Â* Never mind the arguments about the holding power of TTS
tooling.Â* Tool changes are fast and easy, and a job that takes a dozen
tools only need to be touched off once.Â* If the first tool surfaces the
part and establishes zero then every tool after is dead on (or as good
as your height gage anyway.)

On my 24K spindle machines they have ER collet spindle noses.Â* Tool
changes are slow.Â* Very slow.Â* That's the rule for a tool change.Â* Tool
table?Â* Why bother.Â* When you are using mills in a collet its NTHST.
Never The Same Height Twice.Â* Unscrew the closer, take it off if you
need a mill with a different size shank.Â* Install the new mill.
Tighten... and then touch off all over again.Â* I use dial type Z height
setters and I get within .0002 .0005 every time for Z height, but it
still takes a little time.Â* One might suggest mills with collars, but
they can vary depending on how hard you tighten the collet closer.Â* For
many things they might be fine, but for features only a couple
thousandths deep they aren't always good enough.

Everything up to this point is background.

I've decided that the next big job I do I'm going to get atleast one
(maybe 3) of the 24K ATC spindles with the ISO 20 spindle nose.Â* They
range in price from about $2800 to a bunch.Â* A lot more than the
$500-600 I typically pay for a half decent 1.5KW 24K spindle.Â* I could
afford to throw away the money I spent on cheaper spindles when the
decent ones were only 500-600.Â* With the jump in functionality comes the
indicated jump in price.Â* Is a $2800 ATC spindle going to be the same
turd as a $200 ER collet spindle?Â* Throwing away $200 on a lesson is
affordable, but not so much $3000.Â* Yes, I've had more expensive lessons
than that, but still...



I should note that this type of spindle starts at about $1800. Not $2800.