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TIG and 309L ?
Â* I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those
round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage .. This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! Â* -- Â* Snag |
TIG and 309L ?
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 22:28:58 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote: * I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage . This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! * -- * Snag My experience with welding steel with stainless rod is that the stainless tends to absorb carbon from the parent metal and sometimes gets awful hard. I had a welder friend weld up a crack in a cast iron engine head and the weld beads were so hard that it took the end off a high speed end mill. Ultimately I had to reface the head with a surface grinder. -- Cheers, John B. |
TIG and 309L ?
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 22:28:58 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote: * I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage . This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! * -- * Snag Tig? Id run rod for that kind of repair....followed distantly by MIG with a good wire alloy. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus |
TIG and 309L ?
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 22:28:58 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote: * I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage . This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! * -- * Snag I think your gussets will help more than anything else. Pete Keillor |
TIG and 309L ?
On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 22:28:58 -0500
Terry Coombs wrote: Â* I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage . This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! I would use fresh 7018. It has good elongation properties and I think that would be a good thing for what you are trying to repair... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email |
TIG and 309L ?
On 11-Oct-17 10:28 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework ... "No" to welding the spear to the mounting -- if like any we've got had/ever seen it (the spear) should be threaded on the rear in a near friction-fit housing. They're hardened and never even tried to weld the spear itself--can't think you'll have much luck there. If you weld it to the frame then really stuck (so to speak :) ) about just replacing it... Unless, of course, this is a smaller unit for the little round bales instead of the large ones and is from Northern Tool or HF or somesuch instead of a "real" equipment supplier in which case may as well just build a new one on top of the existing mounting brackets, probably... -- |
TIG and 309L ?
On 12-Oct-17 8:08 AM, dpb wrote:
.... "No" to welding the spear to the mounting -- if like any we've got had/ever seen it (the spear) should be threaded on the rear in a near friction-fit housing. They're hardened and never even tried to weld the spear itself--can't think you'll have much luck there. .... Start with rebuilding it with replacement sleeve/spears...they're readily available and not particularly expensive. https://www.sloanex.com/hay-parts/bale-spears.html -- |
TIG and 309L ?
On Thu, 12 Oct 2017 01:29:17 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote: On Wed, 11 Oct 2017 22:28:58 -0500, Terry Coombs wrote: * I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework . Everything is mild steel , and will be welded with either 6013 or 7018 . I noticed that (before the last damage occurred) the spike had been repaired before from metal fatigue breakage . This is why I wondered if a SS weld might hold up better in that location . A set of small triangular reinforcements will also be considered to spread the stress out over a larger area ... but I don't want to get into a situation of chasing stress breakages on this thing - I'm already beefing up the failed mount area by going from 3/8" to 1/2" plate ... The problem is that these hillbillies are always coming up with new ways to break **** . So us repair types gotta keep coming up with new ways to stop them ! * -- * Snag Tig? Id run rod for that kind of repair....followed distantly by MIG with a good wire alloy. --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus Definitely run rod. DCEP weld if possible, 6010 would be OK, but 7018 is stronger (if you are breaking the weld this could be important) 7018 is easier to run than 6010/6011 too and is low hydrogen - so less chance of a brittle weld (if the rod was properly stored, anyway) |
TIG and 309L ?
On 10/12/2017 11:57 AM, dpb wrote:
On 12-Oct-17 8:08 AM, dpb wrote: ... "No" to welding the spear to the mounting -- if like any we've got had/ever seen it (the spear) should be threaded on the rear in a near friction-fit housing. They're hardened and never even tried to weld the spear itself--can't think you'll have much luck there. ... Start with rebuilding it with replacement sleeve/spears...they're readily available and not particularly expensive. https://www.sloanex.com/hay-parts/bale-spears.html -- Â* Well , it's too late ... this thing was homemade to fit the fixture that mounts to the bucket mount points . That spear is not hardened steel but I don't know what it is . It's being stuck together with the 7018 I have on hand . If I run out I'll buy more ... I started with some 6013 , beads looked like crap . The 7018 looks better , but not much . Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . Â* -- Â* Snag |
TIG and 309L ?
On Thu, 12 Oct 2017 08:08:48 -0500, dpb wrote:
On 11-Oct-17 10:28 PM, Terry Coombs wrote: I'm rebuilding a damaged tractor attachment used for moving those round hay bales . The highest stresses are on the round "spike" that pierces the bale . That's part of the failed structure , and I'm wondering if it would be a good idea to use the TIG welder and some 309L to weld this to the framework ... "No" to welding the spear to the mounting -- if like any we've got had/ever seen it (the spear) should be threaded on the rear in a near friction-fit housing. They're hardened and never even tried to weld the spear itself--can't think you'll have much luck there. If you weld it to the frame then really stuck (so to speak :) ) about just replacing it... Unless, of course, this is a smaller unit for the little round bales instead of the large ones and is from Northern Tool or HF or somesuch instead of a "real" equipment supplier in which case may as well just build a new one on top of the existing mounting brackets, probably... How about welding a heavy wall DOM tube into the mount as a "socket" for the stinger and just weld the end of the stinger to the end of the socket, with the DOM tube supporting it with no HAZ in the stressed area????. Gusset the DOM tube any way you can - with no weld heat compromising the stinger?? |
TIG and 309L ?
On 12-Oct-17 3:45 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
.... Well , it's too late ... this thing was homemade to fit the fixture that mounts to the bucket mount points . That spear is not hardened steel but I don't know what it is. It's being stuck together with the 7018 I have on hand . If I run out I'll buy more ... I started with some 6013 , beads looked like crap . The 7018 looks better , but not much . Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . .... I hear ya' on the latter; all I've got is Dad's old (it's Marquette which is a klew ;) ) stick and I'm g-awful at best...I see HF has one of their wire w/ MIG attachments on sale for pretty doggone cheap -- I've thought last two days of driving to Garden and looking but didn't do it... How big of bales and bales of what? With big ones here and hauling w/ flatbed semis I'm awful nervous about spear breaking just when I wouldn't want it to do so...a lot bad can happen in a hurry that way...just toting a small one around the lot is pretty much ok, it isn't nothing but a nuisance most likely... -- |
TIG and 309L ?
On 10/12/2017 4:56 PM, dpb wrote:
On 12-Oct-17 3:45 PM, Terry Coombs wrote: ... Â*Â* Well , it's too late ... this thing was homemade to fit the fixture that mounts to the bucket mount points . That spear is not hardened steel but I don't know what it is. It's being stuck together with the 7018 I have on hand . If I run out I'll buy more ... I started with some 6013 , beads looked like crap . The 7018 looks better , but not much . Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . ... I hear ya' on the latter; all I've got is Dad's old (it's Marquette which is a klew ;) ) stick and I'm g-awful at best...I see HF has one of their wire w/ MIG attachments on sale for pretty doggone cheap -- I've thought last two days of driving to Garden and looking but didn't do it... How big of bales and bales of what?Â* With big ones here and hauling w/ flatbed semis I'm awful nervous about spear breaking just when I wouldn't want it to do so...a lot bad can happen in a hurry that way...just toting a small one around the lot is pretty much ok, it isn't nothing but a nuisance most likely... -- Â* These are grass hay , probably about 5 feet or a bit more in diameter and 4 feet "long" . Just a guesstimate from my hay haulin' days of youth I'd say the weight is well under a thousand pounds . That spear is 2" in diameter and will be welded at the butt and again at 3" , and there will be gussets .Â* I'm using a Lincoln Tombstone 225 amp AC welder , but have a baby MIG too - it just ain't got the ass for 1/2" plate . Got a 250 amp TIG welder too , but that ain't happening . By the time I finish this I may even be able to make a bead that doesn't look like a string of pigeon droppings . I've never been all that good with stick , probably because I do it so seldom . Â* -- Â* Snag |
TIG and 309L ?
On Thu, 12 Oct 2017 20:58:39 -0500, Terry Coombs
wrote: On 10/12/2017 4:56 PM, dpb wrote: On 12-Oct-17 3:45 PM, Terry Coombs wrote: ... ** Well , it's too late ... this thing was homemade to fit the fixture that mounts to the bucket mount points . That spear is not hardened steel but I don't know what it is. It's being stuck together with the 7018 I have on hand . If I run out I'll buy more ... I started with some 6013 , beads looked like crap . The 7018 looks better , but not much . Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . ... I hear ya' on the latter; all I've got is Dad's old (it's Marquette which is a klew ;) ) stick and I'm g-awful at best...I see HF has one of their wire w/ MIG attachments on sale for pretty doggone cheap -- I've thought last two days of driving to Garden and looking but didn't do it... How big of bales and bales of what?* With big ones here and hauling w/ flatbed semis I'm awful nervous about spear breaking just when I wouldn't want it to do so...a lot bad can happen in a hurry that way...just toting a small one around the lot is pretty much ok, it isn't nothing but a nuisance most likely... -- * These are grass hay , probably about 5 feet or a bit more in diameter and 4 feet "long" . Just a guesstimate from my hay haulin' days of youth I'd say the weight is well under a thousand pounds . That spear is 2" in diameter and will be welded at the butt and again at 3" , and there will be gussets .* I'm using a Lincoln Tombstone 225 amp AC welder , but have a baby MIG too - it just ain't got the ass for 1/2" plate . Got a 250 amp TIG welder too , but that ain't happening . By the time I finish this I may even be able to make a bead that doesn't look like a string of pigeon droppings . I've never been all that good with stick , probably because I do it so seldom . * -- * Snag Too bad your little lincoln isn't the DC model - then at least it would look a bit more like goose poop.. . . . |
TIG and 309L ?
On 12-Oct-17 8:58 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
On 10/12/2017 4:56 PM, dpb wrote: .... How big of bales and bales of what? With big ones here and hauling w/ flatbed semis I'm awful nervous about spear breaking ... .... These are grass hay , probably about 5 feet or a bit more in diameter and 4 feet "long" . Just a guesstimate from my hay haulin' days of youth I'd say the weight is well under a thousand pounds . That spear is 2" in diameter and will be welded at the butt and again at 3" , and there will be gussets. ... That should be "stout enough" for those, then... ours are 6' D and a 5'W; grass weight about 12-1300 while silage can be 2000 or a little more. It's losing one of them in the air I worry over; even tho the only time I ever actually broke a spear was while "gathering up" and found a gopher hole and one snapped clean right at the base of the socket. I've seen guys get in a hurry and catch a point in the ground or try to move something other than hay that's too heavy and bend one a little...then they never last long after straighten having once been strained that way... -- |
TIG and 309L ?
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message ...
Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . ************* Similar here, but what I'd really like is my old 97FLHT back or a 350P pulse mig. |
TIG and 309L ?
On 10/13/2017 1:48 PM, Bob La Londe wrote:
"Terry Coombs"Â* wrote in message ... Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . ************* Similar here, but what I'd really like is my old 97FLHT back or a 350P pulse mig. Â* I wish I still had the cherry 76 FLH that got totaled . The only thing I hadn't rebuilt or replaced was the bottom end - and I was getting ready to stroke it . Current is a 90 FLHTCU , soon to be back on the road after some major rehab (trans and top end) work . Â* -- Â* Snag |
TIG and 309L ?
On Thu, 12 Oct 2017 16:56:58 -0500, dpb wrote:
On 12-Oct-17 3:45 PM, Terry Coombs wrote: ... Well , it's too late ... this thing was homemade to fit the fixture that mounts to the bucket mount points . That spear is not hardened steel but I don't know what it is. It's being stuck together with the 7018 I have on hand . If I run out I'll buy more ... I started with some 6013 , beads looked like crap . The 7018 looks better , but not much . Some days I wish I had a 300 amp MIG machine ... others I wish I had a new Harley . Chances of either happenin' is about even . Somewhere between zip and zero . ... I hear ya' on the latter; all I've got is Dad's old (it's Marquette which is a klew ;) ) stick and I'm g-awful at best...I see HF has one of their wire w/ MIG attachments on sale for pretty doggone cheap -- I've thought last two days of driving to Garden and looking but didn't do it... How big of bales and bales of what? With big ones here and hauling w/ flatbed semis I'm awful nervous about spear breaking just when I wouldn't want it to do so...a lot bad can happen in a hurry that way...just toting a small one around the lot is pretty much ok, it isn't nothing but a nuisance most likely... If you look around...you can get some pretty decent welders rather cheaply. Do you have 3ph power available anywhere you can weld? http://www.ebay.com/itm/cobramatic-m...-/122743123723 One of the BEST mig welders Miller ever made: http://www.ebay.com/itm/MILLER-MILLE...AOSw4CFYtey U --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus |
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