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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Robot locomotives
On Saturday, June 17, 2017 at 12:47:51 PM UTC-4, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 13 Jun 2017 17:50:18 -0600, rbowman wrote: On 06/13/2017 01:47 PM, Richard Persing wrote: The middle class is shrinking because a huge slice of what formerly was middle class are now rich. You are deluded. http://www.mybudget360.com/us-househ...nce-recession/ Note that there's no source quoted for what they claim is a "new report that came out." That's because it's a crock of ****. Here are the real numbers, which are up, not down since the beginning of the recession: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N -- Ed Huntress |
#3
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Robot locomotives
On Saturday, June 17, 2017 at 2:43:39 PM UTC-4, Richard Persing wrote:
On 6/17/2017 10:55 AM, wrote: On Saturday, June 17, 2017 at 12:47:51 PM UTC-4, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 13 Jun 2017 17:50:18 -0600, rbowman wrote: On 06/13/2017 01:47 PM, Richard Persing wrote: The middle class is shrinking because a huge slice of what formerly was middle class are now rich. You are deluded. http://www.mybudget360.com/us-househ...nce-recession/ Note that there's no source quoted for what they claim is a "new report that came out." That's because it's a crock of ****. Here are the real numbers, which are up, not down since the beginning of the recession: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N Correct. Of course, that still doesn't say anything about the size of the middle class in absolute numbers. Suppose for simplicity that there are 100 million households (it's actually about 125 million), and that it remains constant (remember: simplicity). Suppose there are 60 million that are middle class, with 35 million below middle class and 5 million above it. Now suppose that at the next census, 8 million formerly middle class families have dropped below the bottom income level for being middle class, while another 12 million have moved *above* the middle class and are now classified as upper income. The number of middle class households has now fallen by 20 million, or 1/3, but 50% more of the families that left the middle class are better off. I'm not saying it happened anywhere nearly that dramatically, but that is essentially what's happened. From the Wall Street Journal cited in Forbes: The latest piece of evidence comes from economist Stephen Rose of the Urban Institute, who finds in new research that the upper middle class in the U.S. is larger and richer than its ever been. He finds the upper middle class has expanded from about 12% of the population in 1979 to a new record of nearly 30% as of 2014. 'Any discussion of inequality that is limited to the 1% misses a lot of the picture because it ignores the large inequality between the growing upper middle class and the middle and lower middle classes,' said Mr. Rose. The Urban Institute is a nonpartisan policy research group. Yeah, my son was a research analyst for them before he worked for McKinsey & Co. They're very straight shooters. https://www.forbes.com/sites/timwors.../#12cbf7be21c8 I didn't chase that one down, but I have run the numbers on this before and it's actually pretty simple to do. You get the quintile breakdowns from IRS and then compare the percentages of increase and decrease in adjacent quintiles. It wasn't easy to find actual numbers of people represented by the quintiles, but it was available, and I got it eight or ten years ago. -- Ed Huntress |
#4
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Robot locomotives
On 6/17/2017 11:55 AM, wrote:
On Saturday, June 17, 2017 at 2:43:39 PM UTC-4, Richard Persing wrote: On 6/17/2017 10:55 AM, wrote: On Saturday, June 17, 2017 at 12:47:51 PM UTC-4, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 13 Jun 2017 17:50:18 -0600, rbowman wrote: On 06/13/2017 01:47 PM, Richard Persing wrote: The middle class is shrinking because a huge slice of what formerly was middle class are now rich. You are deluded. http://www.mybudget360.com/us-househ...nce-recession/ Note that there's no source quoted for what they claim is a "new report that came out." That's because it's a crock of ****. Here are the real numbers, which are up, not down since the beginning of the recession: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA672N Correct. Of course, that still doesn't say anything about the size of the middle class in absolute numbers. Suppose for simplicity that there are 100 million households (it's actually about 125 million), and that it remains constant (remember: simplicity). Suppose there are 60 million that are middle class, with 35 million below middle class and 5 million above it. Now suppose that at the next census, 8 million formerly middle class families have dropped below the bottom income level for being middle class, while another 12 million have moved *above* the middle class and are now classified as upper income. The number of middle class households has now fallen by 20 million, or 1/3, but 50% more of the families that left the middle class are better off. I'm not saying it happened anywhere nearly that dramatically, but that is essentially what's happened. From the Wall Street Journal cited in Forbes: The latest piece of evidence comes from economist Stephen Rose of the Urban Institute, who finds in new research that the upper middle class in the U.S. is larger and richer than its ever been. He finds the upper middle class has expanded from about 12% of the population in 1979 to a new record of nearly 30% as of 2014. 'Any discussion of inequality that is limited to the 1% misses a lot of the picture because it ignores the large inequality between the growing upper middle class and the middle and lower middle classes,' said Mr. Rose. The Urban Institute is a nonpartisan policy research group. Yeah, my son was a research analyst for them before he worked for McKinsey & Co. They're very straight shooters. https://www.forbes.com/sites/timwors.../#12cbf7be21c8 I didn't chase that one down, but I have run the numbers on this before and it's actually pretty simple to do. You get the quintile breakdowns from IRS and then compare the percentages of increase and decrease in adjacent quintiles. It wasn't easy to find actual numbers of people represented by the quintiles, but it was available, and I got it eight or ten years ago. As I said, it's not as dramatic as my hypothetical case, but it /has/ happened, and in appreciable numbers. |
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