Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #41   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,888
Default Rising machine tool prices

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 07:47:21 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

1/8" steel appears to be the limit for the Enco 8" bench shear, and
it
distorts one side. If you are shearing a strip from a large sheet
the
strip may have to be on the distorted side.


Do you have the fence/foot for it? If not, consider making one.
I've
used them with and without, and WITH is the way to go. No more bent
stock (or shears!)


Yes, it has the foot. If I keep the blade sharp and the pivot tight it
isn't really necessary for thinner metal.

Hammers and dollies are your friends, too, where applicable.


Oh yes, I've made costume armor and fitted a large watertight rust
patch at the complex junction of a rear fender well and strut tower.
However I'm just an amateur. I'll let those who knock tin for a living
give the advice on it.
-jsw


  #42   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,025
Default Rising machine tool prices

On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 08:48:41 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 11:47:01 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:
................
http://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-air-shears.html


Is 18ga a casually suggested or actual maximum for sheet thickness?
Salesmen usually oversell specs.


The 22 gauge pool column steel was difficult to cut with a hand model,
more from slipping out than the cutting force. I don't remember how I
cut the approximately 18 gauge stainless for the bucket of my loader,


Jig or recip saw?


maybe the 8" Enco shear? I don't have any mild steel in that
thickness. A 24TPI blade in the 4" x 6" bandsaw cuts thicker sheet
metal well enough.


Yeah, if the piece is small enough that you can get it into the
machine.


The companies I built equipment for chose 0.062" and 0.093" 6061
aluminum for electronic enclosures. I bought 0.050" 5052 for my hobby
work because 0.062" strains the 3-in-1, and most recently used
unlabelled 0.031 to fold a box. It cuts and bends like 6061 rather
than the flimsy aluminum in a Bud chassis, which had mistakenly
convinced me that 0.031 was too thin. The only minor problem is that
my stock of PEM nuts was salvaged from 0.062" scrap and they protrude
slightly through the 0.031". The flange can be bent back a little to
make the visible edges close flush.


Huh? How in the heck do you salvage PEM nuts? Do you reuse pop
rivets, too? bseg I'm thinking Type F, which was used in the
aluminum cases at Southcom, Intl's manpack radio accessories.
http://catalog.pemnet.com/category/nuts-for-sheet-metal Are we on the
same page here? I can't figure out how you'd unclinch one.


The body men where I used to work used air chisels and either
electric
or air shears like the above. The chisel bits worked well on thin
sheet like fenders and 1/4 panels. Hover over the 3rd one down:
http://tinyurl.com/h3xmoun


I've used one to cut patch material from a scrap fender, so I wouldn't
have to shape the wheelwell flare from a flat sheet. I think it's
overly aggressive to cut out a small rust area near an edge.


Yeah, the body guys primarily used them for removal of material. The
new quarterpanel was often cut to fit with the air/elec shears. I
liked watching them flange, spotweld, and lead-in the welded area.

Isn't rust/hole removal easily enough handled with a 4-1/2" grinder?
Oh, and a blue sharpie to do the layout.


Have you seen or used the Beverly style throatless air shears from
HF?
I just saw them online. http://tinyurl.com/hpejdn8


I've used a bench mounted Beverly shear at work. IIRC it distorted the
metal a little too much for flat control panels someone else paid me
to make but would have been fine for auto body repair. A warped
control panel can break meter bezels and pull out molded-in mounting
screws.


Press flat or hammer and dolly. As long as the distortion isn't
excessive that the hammer/press-die marks would show. Masking tape
takes a lot of the danger out of that, though.


I always tried to make my sheet metal work look as professional as my
soldering. The Enco 8" bench shear leaves one side straight.


Often good enough, especially if the scrap side is small.


The steel of the uprights and top rail from the pool is a good
balance
between stiffness and workability and the coating stands up pretty
well to a planishing hammer. The wall is thinner and easier to bend
with hand tools.


Was that the skirting and frame for a pool, or the actual pool?


It was an above ground pool that bulged from freezing after the winter
air bags deflated. I sheared the wall into manageable sections that
now protect my woodsheds from brush/leaf fires. The thicker columns
and top rail sections are slowly disappearing into projects like
splash guards around the bottoms of the sheds and a closable box I can
neatly scoop the woodstove fire into to carry it outside and separate
the ash buildup from the hot charcoal without having to let the fire
die down as far. Shoveling the hot coals into a pail releases too much
ash and smoke. The custom box fits the door opening closely enough
that the draft draws the ash back in.


Cool! Well done. Ash dust is nastyass stuff, both to clean up and to
breathe.


I bent the 2" wide decorative strips of wall metal that faced the
columns into U channels to rim 2' x 4' fireproof ceiling tiles to make
a generator sound dampening enclosure. Their unprotected edges shred
easily, otherwise they make good high temperature insulation with some
structural strength. A propane torch flame merely darkens the surface.
The wall metal is thin enough to bend by clamping between wood planks
and hammering down on a block that spreads the force and tightens the
fold.


I have yet to take the old carpet and make a sound dampening enclosure
for my compressor. That's a woodworking, not a metalworking project,
though. Ply and carpet make a damned good sound deadener for most
frequencies. Wood stops the low/mids and carpet absorbs the
mid/highs.

I need to deepen the shelf density in my shop so I can get enough
floor space to fit a small mill. I'm tired of deer paths and stepping
-over- stuff. sigh

--
There is s no such thing as a hyphenated American who is
a good American.* The only man who is a good American is
the man who is an American and nothing else.* We are a
nation, not a hodge-podge of foreign nationalities.* We
are a people, and not a polyglot boarding house.
--Theodore Roosevelt
  #43   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,888
Default Rising machine tool prices

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Jan 2017 08:48:41 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 18 Jan 2017 11:47:01 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote:
................
http://www.eastwood.com/eastwood-air-shears.html

Is 18ga a casually suggested or actual maximum for sheet
thickness?
Salesmen usually oversell specs.


The 22 gauge pool column steel was difficult to cut with a hand
model,
more from slipping out than the cutting force. I don't remember how
I
cut the approximately 18 gauge stainless for the bucket of my
loader,


Jig or recip saw?


maybe the 8" Enco shear? I don't have any mild steel in that
thickness. A 24TPI blade in the 4" x 6" bandsaw cuts thicker sheet
metal well enough.


Yeah, if the piece is small enough that you can get it into the
machine.


On the left side there's about 2-1/2" clearance to the frame, plenty
of allowance for a rough cut with a grinder or torch. On the right I
support the sheet with a hydraulic lift table so my hands are only
guiding the cut and I can let go to shut off the power.

The metal I buy new is within the capacity of my equipment, 6" for the
saw and 30" for the shear.

.....The only minor problem is that
my stock of PEM nuts was salvaged from 0.062" scrap and they
protrude
slightly through the 0.031". The flange can be bent back a little to
make the visible edges close flush.


Huh? How in the heck do you salvage PEM nuts? Do you reuse pop
rivets, too? bseg I'm thinking Type F, which was used in the
aluminum cases at Southcom, Intl's manpack radio accessories.
http://catalog.pemnet.com/category/nuts-for-sheet-metal Are we on
the
same page here? I can't figure out how you'd unclinch one.


Insert a screw part way from the back, place the PEM/Southco insert
over a hole in a bench block and tap the screw head with a hammer. The
taller round ones remove easily, the hex flush Type F ones are a
little more difficult but they don't interfere as much with
repurposing the metal for something else.

The body men where I used to work used air chisels and either
electric
or air shears like the above. The chisel bits worked well on thin
sheet like fenders and 1/4 panels. Hover over the 3rd one down:
http://tinyurl.com/h3xmoun


I've used one to cut patch material from a scrap fender, so I
wouldn't
have to shape the wheelwell flare from a flat sheet. I think it's
overly aggressive to cut out a small rust area near an edge.


Yeah, the body guys primarily used them for removal of material. The
new quarterpanel was often cut to fit with the air/elec shears. I
liked watching them flange, spotweld, and lead-in the welded area.

Isn't rust/hole removal easily enough handled with a 4-1/2" grinder?
Oh, and a blue sharpie to do the layout.


I usually fix rust before it gets big enough for a flanged patch,
although I do have the flanging tool and a set of Clecos. I trace
around the patch, trim the hole to the line, then hold the patch in
place with magnets while tack-welding.

Have you seen or used the Beverly style throatless air shears from
HF?
I just saw them online. http://tinyurl.com/hpejdn8


I've used a bench mounted Beverly shear at work. IIRC it distorted
the
metal a little too much for flat control panels someone else paid me
to make but would have been fine for auto body repair. A warped
control panel can break meter bezels and pull out molded-in mounting
screws.



Press flat or hammer and dolly. As long as the distortion isn't
excessive that the hammer/press-die marks would show. Masking tape
takes a lot of the danger out of that, though.


I always tried to make my sheet metal work look as professional as
my
soldering.


My workmanship was good enough to show to a customer, which helped get
me promoted into engineering over techs who beat out their sheet metal
mistakes with a hammer.

The steel of the uprights and top rail from the pool is a good
balance
between stiffness and workability and the coating stands up pretty
well to a planishing hammer. The wall is thinner and easier to
bend
with hand tools.

Was that the skirting and frame for a pool, or the actual pool?


It was an above ground pool that bulged from freezing after the
winter
air bags deflated. I sheared the wall into manageable sections that
now protect my woodsheds from brush/leaf fires. The thicker columns
and top rail sections are slowly disappearing into projects like
splash guards around the bottoms of the sheds and a closable box I
can
neatly scoop the woodstove fire into to carry it outside and
separate
the ash buildup from the hot charcoal without having to let the fire
die down as far. Shoveling the hot coals into a pail releases too
much
ash and smoke. The custom box fits the door opening closely enough
that the draft draws the ash back in.


Cool! Well done. Ash dust is nastyass stuff, both to clean up and
to
breathe.


I bent the 2" wide decorative strips of wall metal that faced the
columns into U channels to rim 2' x 4' fireproof ceiling tiles to
make
a generator sound dampening enclosure. Their unprotected edges shred
easily, otherwise they make good high temperature insulation with
some
structural strength. A propane torch flame merely darkens the
surface.
The wall metal is thin enough to bend by clamping between wood
planks
and hammering down on a block that spreads the force and tightens
the
fold.


I have yet to take the old carpet and make a sound dampening
enclosure
for my compressor. That's a woodworking, not a metalworking
project,
though. Ply and carpet make a damned good sound deadener for most
frequencies. Wood stops the low/mids and carpet absorbs the
mid/highs.


We used carpet scraps to quiet the sound of walking on raised theatre
set platforms. If the "Bus Stop" lunch counter could hold a row of
burly carpenters making like Rockettes, it was safe for the actress
with the Marilyn Monroe part to dance on.


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
will tool and wood prices soar (was Fahrenheit 11-8) [email protected] Woodworking 21 November 8th 16 02:42 AM
K. O. Lee tool and cutter machine psient Metalworking 4 April 2nd 10 02:54 AM
Tool Chest - Compare Prices kanghuaiqiang Metalworking 0 October 27th 07 04:56 AM
Old Machine tool catalog machineman Metalworking 0 December 31st 04 12:17 AM
Great tool prices at Home Depot Dick Snyder Woodworking 4 December 20th 03 08:55 AM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 03:06 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about DIY & home improvement"