also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a Ford T I
think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and aftermarket
bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They pulled it to move one
of the transverse spring mounts inboard to clear brake hardware - the mounts
were NOT centering the axle under the car . What they found was a real mess
, stress cracks in the axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The
welds look like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with
stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the brackets
, leave the few that look decent there but feather the ends .
I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the end of
the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame .
Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved
under accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a
lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a Ford T I
think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and aftermarket
bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They pulled it to move one
of the transverse spring mounts inboard to clear brake hardware - the mounts
were NOT centering the axle under the car . What they found was a real mess
, stress cracks in the axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The
welds look like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with
stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the brackets
, leave the few that look decent there but feather the ends .
I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the end of
the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame .
Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved
under accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a
lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been narrowed .
I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I considered stick .
I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand back . Thing about MIG is
that it's so easy to just pick up the stinger and burn a few beads , stick
needs a little more coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges
to the tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .

--
Snag

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been narrowed .
I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I considered stick .
I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand back . Thing about MIG is
that it's so easy to just pick up the stinger and burn a few beads , stick
needs a little more coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges
to the tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .


Perhaps, but I've seen (and done) some real pretty welds with a stick
on heavier guage stuff.

How much has it been narrowed? What's the rear track? Would an 8.5
inch axle from an explorer/Ranger fit? Virtually as strong as a 9 inch
if you get the HD one from an explorer SportTrac - and you get disk
brakes as well.

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 22:38:57 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a Ford T I
think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and aftermarket
bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They pulled it to move one
of the transverse spring mounts inboard to clear brake hardware - the mounts
were NOT centering the axle under the car . What they found was a real mess
, stress cracks in the axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The
welds look like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with
stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the brackets
, leave the few that look decent there but feather the ends .
I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the end of
the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame .
Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved
under accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a
lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

Switch to 4-link to help spread the stress?

I was pleasantly surprised at how much polyurethane bushings stiffened
up my rear leaf suspension in my old '90 F-150. Less side movement
for better handling. I _like_ corners.


Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd

That'd be ideal, but most people want a $ fix, not a ChaCHING $$$ fix.
Snag would know which.


stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

A spray can of B-12 Chemtool is your friend. I'd pull everything
(axles, bearings, nut, lines) and steam clean the beastie with
degreasers, then preclean the weld areas once more with Berryman's.

--
The business of America is not business. Neither is it war. The business
of America is justice and securing the blessings of liberty.
-- George F. Will

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been narrowed .
I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I considered stick .
I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand back . Thing about MIG is
that it's so easy to just pick up the stinger and burn a few beads , stick
needs a little more coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges
to the tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .

MIG with an unpracticed hand is what got him in this situation in the
first place, isn't it?

--
The business of America is not business. Neither is it war. The business
of America is justice and securing the blessings of liberty.
-- George F. Will

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 23:26:58 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been narrowed .
I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I considered stick .
I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand back . Thing about MIG is
that it's so easy to just pick up the stinger and burn a few beads , stick
needs a little more coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges
to the tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .


Perhaps, but I've seen (and done) some real pretty welds with a stick
on heavier guage stuff.

How much has it been narrowed? What's the rear track? Would an 8.5
inch axle from an explorer/Ranger fit? Virtually as strong as a 9 inch
if you get the HD one from an explorer SportTrac - and you get disk
brakes as well.

_There_ is something worth looking into.

--
The business of America is not business. Neither is it war. The business
of America is justice and securing the blessings of liberty.
-- George F. Will

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look
like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes
, with stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds
on the brackets , leave the few that look decent there but
feather the ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG
isn't big enough and because I'm not that good with a stick . I
have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and
6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the
cracks but they might be the best choice for re-welding the
brackets . I'm looking for recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the
end of the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar
attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a
single bolt to the frame - they moved under accel/decel , and this
sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a lot . I plan to
recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise
I'd stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with
all the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been
narrowed . I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I
considered stick . I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand
back . Thing about MIG is that it's so easy to just pick up the
stinger and burn a few beads , stick needs a little more
coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges to the
tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .

MIG with an unpracticed hand is what got him in this situation in the
first place, isn't it?

We don't know the provenance of this axle , it was on the car when the
customer brought it in . The welds look more like stick than MIG . I don't
know for sure , but I suspect the owner brought the car in to correct this
and other problems . I think he bought the car as-is . Axle has been
chromed , but it won't be when we get finished . Well , parts of it won't ,
gotta grind it and the copper underplating off where we weld .
--
Snag

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a Ford T I
think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and aftermarket
bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They pulled it to move one
of the transverse spring mounts inboard to clear brake hardware - the mounts
were NOT centering the axle under the car . What they found was a real mess
, stress cracks in the axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The
welds look like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with
stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the brackets
, leave the few that look decent there but feather the ends .
I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the end of
the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame .
Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved
under accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a
lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

Greetings Terry,
If it was me I would TIG the thing. Are the axles going to be in the
housing when the welding is being done? If so it will be harder to
keep oil from trying to get back into the crack. If you can remove the
axles then you should be able to use brake cleaner to wash the oil out
of the crack and from the surrounding area before welding. I would
wash the crackmout, then grind, then wash again. I would use the 70S2
rod or the 308SS rod. The 308 will be a little more ductile than the
70S2. I wouldn't bother with stick or MIG. Tif will probably be a
little more work to get it clean enough for a good weld but you will
know that it is a good weld when you are done.
Eric

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 22:38:57 -0400, wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a Ford T I
think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and aftermarket
bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They pulled it to move one
of the transverse spring mounts inboard to clear brake hardware - the mounts
were NOT centering the axle under the car . What they found was a real mess
, stress cracks in the axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The
welds look like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with
stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the brackets
, leave the few that look decent there but feather the ends .
I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the end of
the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame .
Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved
under accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a
lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

Thumbs up!

On Wed, 15 Jul 2015 05:10:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise I'd
stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with all
the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been narrowed .
I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I considered stick .
I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand back . Thing about MIG is
that it's so easy to just pick up the stinger and burn a few beads , stick
needs a little more coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges
to the tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .

MIG with an unpracticed hand is what got him in this situation in the
first place, isn't it?

Again..Thumbs up!!

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Greetings Terry,
If it was me I would TIG the thing. Are the axles going to be in the
housing when the welding is being done? If so it will be harder to
keep oil from trying to get back into the crack. If you can remove the
axles then you should be able to use brake cleaner to wash the oil out
of the crack and from the surrounding area before welding. I would
wash the crackmout, then grind, then wash again. I would use the 70S2
rod or the 308SS rod. The 308 will be a little more ductile than the
70S2. I wouldn't bother with stick or MIG. Tif will probably be a
little more work to get it clean enough for a good weld but you will
know that it is a good weld when you are done.
Eric

It's stripped to the bare housing , and has been "degreased" with a
water-based solution . It's actually pretty clean except what's trapped in
the cracks and in the porous welds . If I use a brake cleaner it'll be a
non-chlorinated one , I've read about the potential to produce phosgene gas
under the right conditions . More likely I'll use carb spray as someone
upthread suggested .
--
Snag

On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 3:07:30 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:


It's stripped to the bare housing , and has been "degreased" with a
water-based solution . It's actually pretty clean except what's trapped in
the cracks and in the porous welds . If I use a brake cleaner it'll be a
non-chlorinated one , I've read about the potential to produce phosgene gas
under the right conditions . More likely I'll use carb spray as someone
upthread suggested .
--
Snag

Try using some paint thinner and lots of paper towels. You do not need a spray can to get the solvent to the crack. You do need something like the paper towels to get the solvent out of the crack by capillary action. Maybe some compressed air would help get the solvent out of the crack.

Dan

On Wed, 15 Jul 2015 07:33:15 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:58:23 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look
like they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My
plan is to grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes
, with stop holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds
on the brackets , leave the few that look decent there but
feather the ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG
isn't big enough and because I'm not that good with a stick . I
have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and
6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the
cracks but they might be the best choice for re-welding the
brackets . I'm looking for recommendations on what to use where .
Oh , and the reason for the stress cracks - they're all near the
end of the bracket welds - is because of the ladder bar
attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab that was bolted with a
single bolt to the frame - they moved under accel/decel , and this
sled has a motor that has been "modified" ... a lot . I plan to
recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot better .

--
Snag

Might be a good idea to look for a replacement housing - otherwise
I'd stick weld the whole thing. It's going to be a real bugger with
all the oil in the cracks any way you cut it - but stick is the most
forgiving.

We considered sourcing another housing , but this one has been
narrowed . I'm not set up to do that . And the oil problem is why I
considered stick . I guess I could burn a few sticks and get my hand
back . Thing about MIG is that it's so easy to just pick up the
stinger and burn a few beads , stick needs a little more
coordination . The welds where they attached the flanges to the
tubes are so purty , I'm betting those are subarc welds .

MIG with an unpracticed hand is what got him in this situation in the
first place, isn't it?

We don't know the provenance of this axle , it was on the car when the
customer brought it in . The welds look more like stick than MIG . I don't
know for sure , but I suspect the owner brought the car in to correct this
and other problems . I think he bought the car as-is . Axle has been
chromed , but it won't be when we get finished . Well , parts of it won't ,
gotta grind it and the copper underplating off where we weld .
Chroming a steel diff housing isn't a real good idea anyway due to
"hydrogen embrittlement" from the plating process.

On Wed, 15 Jul 2015 12:51:40 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 3:07:30 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:


It's stripped to the bare housing , and has been "degreased" with a
water-based solution . It's actually pretty clean except what's trapped in
the cracks and in the porous welds . If I use a brake cleaner it'll be a
non-chlorinated one , I've read about the potential to produce phosgene gas
under the right conditions . More likely I'll use carb spray as someone
upthread suggested .
--
Snag

Try using some paint thinner and lots of paper towels. You do not need a spray can to get the solvent to the crack. You do need something like the paper towels to get the solvent out of the crack by capillary action. Maybe some compressed air would help get the solvent out of the crack.

Dan
Bake it with a big rosebud torch untill no more oil boils out of the
cracks, then clean it again, and bake it again. Stick weld while still
hot to limit the extra stress from welding.

wrote:

Try using some paint thinner and lots of paper towels. You do not
need a spray can to get the solvent to the crack. You do need
something like the paper towels to get the solvent out of the crack
by capillary action. Maybe some compressed air would help get the
solvent out of the crack.

Hot air gun?

--

"I'm a doctor, not a mechanic." Dr Leonard McCoy
"I'm a mechanic, not a doctor." Volker Borchert

On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 6:04:56 PM UTC-4, Volker Borchert wrote:


Hot air gun?


It is not what I would use. My thoughts are to dilute the oil with the paint thinner and then to adsorb the paint thinner with paper towels. Heating the part with a hot air gun would evaporate the paint thinner , but would leave any contaminants in the crack.

Dan

Hot air gun?


It is not what I would use. My thoughts are to
dilute the oil with the paint thinner and then to
adsorb the paint thinner with paper towels.
Heating the part with a hot air gun would
evaporate the paint thinner , but would leave any
contaminants in the crack.


Dan

Cracks need to be ground out and re-welded.
Even one ignored crack could be 'bad news' ....

On Tuesday, July 14, 2015 at 10:30:34 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:

I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and because
I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG
fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle housing and brackets are mild
steel . The arc rods are going to be a bit big for filling the cracks but
they might be the best choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where .

--
Snag

Just general comments. You use what you have available. Tig and Mig require getting the metal clean. There is no flux to get rid of any oxides. In the best of all possible worlds, you would use dual shield. That is a wire for a Mig welder that has some flux in the core. But you use it with a shielding gas. So dual shield. Best of all possible worlds where you have almost clean metal.

Now for wild ideas. Worked with a guy that had a 110 volt mig welder and a stick welder. He was not all that great with the stick welder so when he had something to weld that really needed more power than his mig welder would provide, he disconnected the leads on the mig welder and connected his stick welder to the wire gun in his mig welder.

Now this meant he was using a constant current supply instead of a constant voltage supply. And that meant he was welding in spray mode. But it worked.

Next wild idea. Have not tried this, but you should be able to use dual shield wire with your Tig welder. I have not tried that, but it ought to work and give you a little flux to help with metal that is not perfectly clean.. It may play hell with your tungstens. The dual shield that I have used worked well with CO2 shielding gas and spray mode. But you would want to use argon with your tig.

I have used mig wire with a tig welder when I wanted a smaller diameter rod than the tig rods I had on hand.

I do have some dual shield wire if you want to try using it with your tig welder. I know some of it is .030 dia. Not sure if the other reel is the same size. It may be bigger. I am sure you will be done with this job by the time any package would get to you. But if you want some. let me know. I got it at Boeing Surplus before they closed up. I have several lifetimes supply.

Dan

On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 8:48:46 PM UTC-4, Phil Kangas wrote:



Cracks need to be ground out and re-welded.
Even one ignored crack could be 'bad news' ....

I was talking about how to clean and certainly not suggesting any cracks be ignored. Depending on the thickness of the metal, I might not grind all the way thru the metal. Say if the metal was 3/16 thick , I might grind out an eighth leaving a 1/16th ( or less ).

Dan

wrote:
On Tuesday, July 14, 2015 at 10:30:34 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:

I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough and
because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand 308/309/312
and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The axle
housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to be a
bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best choice for
re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for recommendations on what to
use where .

--
Snag

Just general comments. You use what you have available. Tig and Mig
require getting the metal clean. There is no flux to get rid of any
oxides. In the best of all possible worlds, you would use dual
shield. That is a wire for a Mig welder that has some flux in the
core. But you use it with a shielding gas. So dual shield. Best of
all possible worlds where you have almost clean metal.

I do have a roll of .030 flux core MIG wire , and could use it with
C25/Ar/CO2 , I have all 3 on hand . That would work on the cracks in the
axle tube itself , it's within the thickness limitations of my little 110
MIG machine - especially with the flux core , it burns hotter than solid
wire .


Now for wild ideas. Worked with a guy that had a 110 volt mig welder
and a stick welder. He was not all that great with the stick welder
so when he had something to weld that really needed more power than
his mig welder would provide, he disconnected the leads on the mig
welder and connected his stick welder to the wire gun in his mig
welder.

Couldn't do that with my arc welder , it's AC only . Might figure out
something that uses the TIG as a power source though .


Now this meant he was using a constant current supply instead of a
constant voltage supply. And that meant he was welding in spray
mode. But it worked.

I think the TIG swings both ways , CC and CV since it's for arc welding
too - and even has spot welding settings .


Next wild idea. Have not tried this, but you should be able to use
dual shield wire with your Tig welder. I have not tried that, but it
ought to work and give you a little flux to help with metal that is
not perfectly clean. It may play hell with your tungstens. The dual
shield that I have used worked well with CO2 shielding gas and spray
mode. But you would want to use argon with your tig.

I have used mig wire with a tig welder when I wanted a smaller
diameter rod than the tig rods I had on hand.

I've used 2-3-4 strands of .025 mig wire when I needed something finer
than the TIG filler II had on hand . Works swell . I never considered using
the flux core wire though . It's pretty brittle , might have fun trying to
twist a couple of them together - maybe some solid and some flux core ...



I do have some dual shield wire if you want to try using it with your
tig welder. I know some of it is .030 dia. Not sure if the other
reel is the same size. It may be bigger. I am sure you will be done
with this job by the time any package would get to you. But if you
want some. let me know. I got it at Boeing Surplus before they
closed up. I have several lifetimes supply.

Dan

The good thing is that I have options . Probably not a bad idea to burn a
few sticks of rod with the tombstone , there was a time when I was a fair
hand . Of course at that time it was my only option too .
This isn't a definite thing , but since he has no cheaper options I think
I'll be doing the repairs . Something else I've been thinking about , I
wonder if there was supposed to be a strip to double up the axle tube wall
where the brackets are welded on . Sure looks like a good idea to me , with
little weight penalty .
--
Snag

On Wednesday, July 15, 2015 at 11:24:49 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:





Couldn't do that with my arc welder , it's AC only . Might figure out
something that uses the TIG as a power source though .

Why would that prevent you from using your arc welder?


Now this meant he was using a constant current supply instead of a
constant voltage supply. And that meant he was welding in spray
mode. But it worked.

I think the TIG swings both ways , CC and CV since it's for arc welding
too - and even has spot welding settings .

Arc welding and Tig welding both use CC . Mig uses CV .


Next wild idea. Have not tried this, but you should be able to use
dual shield wire with your Tig welder. I have not tried that, but it
ought to work and give you a little flux to help with metal that is
not perfectly clean. It may play hell with your tungstens. The dual
shield that I have used worked well with CO2 shielding gas and spray
mode. But you would want to use argon with your tig.

I have used mig wire with a tig welder when I wanted a smaller
diameter rod than the tig rods I had on hand.

I've used 2-3-4 strands of .025 mig wire when I needed something finer
than the TIG filler II had on hand . Works swell . I never considered using
the flux core wire though . It's pretty brittle , might have fun trying to
twist a couple of them together - maybe some solid and some flux core ...



I do have some dual shield wire if you want to try using it with your
tig welder. I know some of it is .030 dia. Not sure if the other
reel is the same size. It may be bigger. I am sure you will be done
with this job by the time any package would get to you. But if you
want some. let me know. I got it at Boeing Surplus before they
closed up. I have several lifetimes supply.

Dan

The good thing is that I have options . Probably not a bad idea to burn a
few sticks of rod with the tombstone , there was a time when I was a fair
hand . Of course at that time it was my only option too .
This isn't a definite thing , but since he has no cheaper options I think
I'll be doing the repairs . Something else I've been thinking about , I
wonder if there was supposed to be a strip to double up the axle tube wall
where the brackets are welded on . Sure looks like a good idea to me , with
little weight penalty .
--
Snag

On Wed, 15 Jul 2015 14:06:59 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

wrote:
On Tue, 14 Jul 2015 21:30:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

also posted at sejw

OK , here's what I have :
A good friend runs a car resto business , and he's working on a
Ford T I think it is . Single transverse spring , ladder bars , and
aftermarket bracketry welded to a Ford 9" rear axle housing . They
pulled it to move one of the transverse spring mounts inboard to
clear brake hardware - the mounts were NOT centering the axle under
the car . What they found was a real mess , stress cracks in the
axle tubes , holes burned thru and leaking oil . The welds look like
they were made by a monkey on crack , just gobbed on . My plan is to
grind out the cracks 90% of the thickness of the tubes , with stop
holes drilled at the ends . Grind off the ****ty welds on the
brackets , leave the few that look decent there but feather the
ends . I want to TIG this thing , because the MIG isn't big enough
and because I'm not that good with a stick . I have on hand
308/309/312 and ER70S2 TIG fillers and 6011/6013/7018 in rod . The
axle housing and brackets are mild steel . The arc rods are going to
be a bit big for filling the cracks but they might be the best
choice for re-welding the brackets . I'm looking for
recommendations on what to use where . Oh , and the reason for the
stress cracks - they're all near the end of the bracket welds - is
because of the ladder bar attachments to the frame . Bolted to a tab
that was bolted with a single bolt to the frame - they moved under
accel/decel , and this sled has a motor that has been "modified" ...
a lot . I plan to recommend some mods to tie that axle down a lot
better .

--
Snag

Greetings Terry,
If it was me I would TIG the thing. Are the axles going to be in the
housing when the welding is being done? If so it will be harder to
keep oil from trying to get back into the crack. If you can remove the
axles then you should be able to use brake cleaner to wash the oil out
of the crack and from the surrounding area before welding. I would
wash the crackmout, then grind, then wash again. I would use the 70S2
rod or the 308SS rod. The 308 will be a little more ductile than the
70S2. I wouldn't bother with stick or MIG. Tif will probably be a
little more work to get it clean enough for a good weld but you will
know that it is a good weld when you are done.
Eric

It's stripped to the bare housing , and has been "degreased" with a
water-based solution . It's actually pretty clean except what's trapped in
the cracks and in the porous welds . If I use a brake cleaner it'll be a
non-chlorinated one , I've read about the potential to produce phosgene gas
under the right conditions . More likely I'll use carb spray as someone
upthread suggested .
I use both types of brake cleaner Terry. The non-chlorinated stuff
mostly but the chlorinated stuff when cleaning for Loctite. The
chlorinated stuff can indeed create phosgene gas when passed through a
flame and I am very careful to avoid that. Always have been. I like
brake cleaner netter than carb cleaner for weld zone cleaning because
it leaves no residue. Grind out the cracks and porosity, clean with
the flammable brake cleaner as a final clean, heat before welding to
drive off any water or cleaners, and weld. One thing I like about TIG
is that if there is any dirt in the weld zone you can tell right away.
Then the metal can be cleaned properly and welding can start again.
Eric

SNIP

Just general comments. You use what you have available. Tig and Mig
require getting the metal clean. There is no flux to get rid of any
oxides. In the best of all possible worlds, you would use dual
shield. That is a wire for a Mig welder that has some flux in the
core. But you use it with a shielding gas. So dual shield. Best of
all possible worlds where you have almost clean metal.

I do have a roll of .030 flux core MIG wire , and could use it with
C25/Ar/CO2 , I have all 3 on hand . That would work on the cracks in the
axle tube itself , it's within the thickness limitations of my little 110
MIG machine - especially with the flux core , it burns hotter than solid
wire .

SNIP
Greetings Terry,
Dual shield wire is not the same as running flux core with shielding
gas. It is a type of flux cored welding wire that mjust be used with
shielding gas in order to weld right. I was told by Ernie that running
regular flux core wire with shielding gas wouldn't work very well.
Nevertheless I tried it just to see how bad it welded. It did not work
well. Ernie was, of course, correct.
Eric

On Thu, 16 Jul 2015 09:07:33 -0700, wrote:

SNIP

Just general comments. You use what you have available. Tig and Mig
require getting the metal clean. There is no flux to get rid of any
oxides. In the best of all possible worlds, you would use dual
shield. That is a wire for a Mig welder that has some flux in the
core. But you use it with a shielding gas. So dual shield. Best of
all possible worlds where you have almost clean metal.

I do have a roll of .030 flux core MIG wire , and could use it with
C25/Ar/CO2 , I have all 3 on hand . That would work on the cracks in the
axle tube itself , it's within the thickness limitations of my little 110
MIG machine - especially with the flux core , it burns hotter than solid
wire .

SNIP
Greetings Terry,
Dual shield wire is not the same as running flux core with shielding
gas. It is a type of flux cored welding wire that mjust be used with
shielding gas in order to weld right. I was told by Ernie that running
regular flux core wire with shielding gas wouldn't work very well.
Nevertheless I tried it just to see how bad it welded. It did not work
well. Ernie was, of course, correct.
Eric

Right. If you want a short, not-too-technical explanation about the
differences between plain flux-core and flux-core made for dual-shield
welding, this brief explanation from Lincoln Electric does it:

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...lectrodes.aspx

--
Ed Huntress

On Wed, 15 Jul 2015 22:24:50 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:


I do have a roll of .030 flux core MIG wire , and could use it with
C25/Ar/CO2 , I have all 3 on hand . That would work on the cracks in the
axle tube itself , it's within the thickness limitations of my little 110
MIG machine - especially with the flux core , it burns hotter than solid
wire .

Remember..Co2 alone is quite hot..and when used with MIG..will take a
110vt 80 amp machine up to almost double in heat. It WILL splatter
and pop and not be as pretty a weld...but running CO2 alone will
almost double the size of your welder..at least 50% more heat,
allowing deeper penetration and larger wire.

Gunner