Picture of a broken crankshaft
See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881
wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Gunner |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
Ignoramus8881 fired this volley in
: I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. Single-cylinder tug boat engine? Lloyd |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881
wrote: See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i Looks too heavy compared to the throw for an engine. Is it off some kind of compressor or press? Looks like it hasn't been out of service long, not that rusty. Pete Keillor |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 06:36:26 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i Looks too heavy compared to the throw for an engine. Is it off some kind of compressor or press? Looks like it hasn't been out of service long, not that rusty. Pete Keillor That was my reaction, too. Those big engines typically have a long stroke. This looks more like the crank for a mechanical press. -- Ed Huntress |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On 6/23/2015 8:15 AM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 06:36:26 -0500, Pete Keillor wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i Looks too heavy compared to the throw for an engine. Is it off some kind of compressor or press? Looks like it hasn't been out of service long, not that rusty. Pete Keillor That was my reaction, too. Those big engines typically have a long stroke. This looks more like the crank for a mechanical press. +1 |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On 2015-06-23, Pete Keillor wrote:
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i Looks too heavy compared to the throw for an engine. Is it off some kind of compressor or press? Looks like it hasn't been out of service long, not that rusty. Pete Keillor From a punch press |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 06:19:11 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote: Ignoramus8881 fired this volley in : I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. Single-cylinder tug boat engine? Lloyd Punch press of some sort from the looks of it. Gunner |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
Gunner Asch fired this volley in
: Punch press of some sort from the looks of it. Yep, it was. But some of those old 'pancake' engines had short strokes (high ratios, but short strokes). I've seen a couple of 36" piston-diameter tug motors with strokes of less than 10". Flat heads, though, so still good compression ratio. Lloyd |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052
wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? GUnner |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052
wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly Can you explain this crystallized metal issue? |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 23:16:33 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote: Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly Can you explain this crystallized metal issue? Blink blink.."metal fatigue" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(material) http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...557.x/abstract https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&u act=8&ved=0CDUQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww2.lbl.gov% 2Fritchie%2FLibrary%2FPDF%2Fmetglass.pdf&ei=OPWJVd PsC8HYtQXWna-gAw&usg=AFQjCNHxG7PXXXWaZci4WLu_SAI4YLl3Vw&sig2=nB 4fC5dbdNAKz0YLu9pwoQ Etc etc. The broken ends appear to be "crystalized"..actually the result of microscopic stress cracks..but the term has stuck for a century or more and is in common use. Gunner |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 17:14:50 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 23:16:33 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader wrote: Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly Can you explain this crystallized metal issue? Blink blink.."metal fatigue" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(material) http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...557.x/abstract https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&cad=rja&u act=8&ved=0CDUQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww2.lbl.gov% 2Fritchie%2FLibrary%2FPDF%2Fmetglass.pdf&ei=OPWJVd PsC8HYtQXWna-gAw&usg=AFQjCNHxG7PXXXWaZci4WLu_SAI4YLl3Vw&sig2=nB 4fC5dbdNAKz0YLu9pwoQ Etc etc. The broken ends appear to be "crystalized"..actually the result of microscopic stress cracks..but the term has stuck for a century or more and is in common use. Gunner https://books.google.com/books?id=E4...zation&f=false |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
... Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly Can you explain this crystallized metal issue? "Crystallized" is an old and incorrect explanation based on the grainy surface of the break, which follows the existing and usually visible grain boundaries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(material) However some solid metals do recrystallize over time, on a -much- smaller scale. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Precipitation_hardening We studied fatigue failure in college but what I learned may be outdated. Here's a more recent overview: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stress_corrosion_cracking Recently an ME who was investigating a fatigue failure told me that stresses below 1/2 of the ultimate tensile strength can be assumed to not cause fatigue, unless the manufacturing process causes unintended stress concentrations. -jsw |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... I layed such a press with 15k forklifts... rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... Thank you for sharing this fun and educational story. i |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 06:36:26 -0500, Pete Keillor
wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: See this picture of a broken crankshaft: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg I put a standard letter sized document on top to show the scale of this huge crankshaft. i Looks too heavy compared to the throw for an engine. Is it off some kind of compressor or press? Looks like it hasn't been out of service long, not that rusty. Pete Keillor Looks like a stamping press to me. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 20:37:20 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... Thank Crom it was on Hiway 33..not the freeway. Just between Taft and Maricopa. Its been what...15 yrs now..still hasn't been found. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 07:04:33 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck
wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. We can't let this trick go by without comment. First, if you turn the bearing to the side while doing that, the gyroscopic effect will side-load the bearing and likely burn your fingers, unless you instantly let go, in which case the bearing will run off and hit something at a very high speed. If you put your finger through the shaft hole and it side-loads like that, it may seize and rip off your finger. However, your finger will have the ride of its life. Third, if you succeed it getting it to spin up freely, you will, eventually, learn about the fracture mechanics of hardened 8000-Series steel, while the outer race explodes in your face. 'Just a caution. -- Ed Huntress |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
rangerssuck wrote:
On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... -- Snag |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 10:02:03 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote: rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... uh, with all due respect, I think that both of you share some culpability on that one. d8-) -- Ed Huntress |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 11:03:10 -0400
Ed Huntress wrote: On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 10:02:03 -0500, "Terry Coombs" wrote: snip In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... uh, with all due respect, I think that both of you share some culpability on that one. d8-) I had the corner of a $20 bill (just a corner piece, not the whole bill) sticking out from under the anti-static mat on my workbench. I'm sure lots of people looked but ;-) When I was in high school I brazed wood screws to several coins. They were screwed into several obvious places where I worked on the farm. Nobody ever got those up in the few years I was around there... -- Leon Fisk Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b Remove no.spam for email |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 12:54:04 -0400, Leon Fisk
wrote: On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 11:03:10 -0400 Ed Huntress wrote: On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 10:02:03 -0500, "Terry Coombs" wrote: snip In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... uh, with all due respect, I think that both of you share some culpability on that one. d8-) I had the corner of a $20 bill (just a corner piece, not the whole bill) sticking out from under the anti-static mat on my workbench. I'm sure lots of people looked but ;-) When I was in high school I brazed wood screws to several coins. They were screwed into several obvious places where I worked on the farm. Nobody ever got those up in the few years I was around there... So you were one of *those* kids, huh? g -- Ed Huntress |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
Terry Coombs wrote:
rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... Ha! that's pretty good. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 10:32:25 AM UTC-4, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 07:04:33 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. We can't let this trick go by without comment. First, if you turn the bearing to the side while doing that, the gyroscopic effect will side-load the bearing and likely burn your fingers, unless you instantly let go, in which case the bearing will run off and hit something at a very high speed. If you put your finger through the shaft hole and it side-loads like that, it may seize and rip off your finger. However, your finger will have the ride of its life. Third, if you succeed it getting it to spin up freely, you will, eventually, learn about the fracture mechanics of hardened 8000-Series steel, while the outer race explodes in your face. 'Just a caution. -- Ed Huntress This was all 40-odd (very odd) years ago, and I still have both eyes and all fingers are intact. But yeah, it was pretty nuts, but these things did go several hundred feet before hitting the building across the street. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 11:02:06 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up .. He did it on a day I was out ... -- Snag Not often that you'll find me quoting scripture, but... Leviticus 19:14 : "You shall not curse the deaf nor place a stumbling block before the blind." A quick summary of the rabbinic interpretation of this verse is: "It is an admonition not to take advantage of the weak and the helpless or to place temptation in the path of those who may be morally weak." It's actually pretty interesting reading on basic morality, once you get past the "you shall fear your God - I am your Lord" nonsense. http://www.jlaw.com/Articles/placingstumbling.html Placing a Stumbling Block Before the Blind Person: An In-Depth Analysis by Hershey H. Friedman, PhD Professor of Business, Brooklyn College _________________ (c) 2002 H. H. Friedman _________________ The Bible states (Leviticus 19:14): "You shall not curse the deaf nor place a stumbling block before the blind; you shall fear your God - I am your Lord." In Hebrew, the sin of placing a stumbling block before a blind person is referred to as lifnei iver lo sitten michshol (before the blind do not place a stumbling block), or succinctly as lifnei iver. This verse is somewhat perplexing: Why single out blind people for this law? Was placing stumbling blocks before blind people a prevalent practice in ancient times? Furthermore, there are a large number of laws in the Bible that deal with causing injury to others, blind or not. This may explain why the Talmud felt the need to give the verse a more profound meaning. Thus, the word "blind" is interpreted metaphorically to represent any person or group that is unaware, unsuspecting, ignorant, or morally blind, and individuals are prohibited from taking advantage of them or tempting them to do wrong. It is interesting to note that there is a dispute as to whether the verse should be interpreted literally at all. Apparently, some sages felt that there was no need to have a special law against causing blind people to stumble since there are a sufficient number of laws protecting all individuals from malicious harm (see Minchas Chinuch, 232:4). Others believe in the principal that Biblical verses maintain their literal meaning even when the sages use the oral tradition to add additional connotations. The principle of lifnei iver prohibits one from giving bad advice to another person. Thus, one should not advise another party that it is in his interest to sell his field in order to buy a donkey, when his true intention is to buy the field for himself. By concealing the ulterior motive of his advice, he has violated the principle of lifnei iver (Midrash Sifra, Leviticus 19:14). In fact, the Midrash explains the reason the verse ends with the warning about fearing God: Human beings do not know whether advice proffered to them by friends is good or bad. Often, advice is given with an ulterior motive. Only God knows the true motive of the advice giver. In addition, the above verse is considered to be a prohibition against helping or causing another to sin. Thus, placing any kind of prohibited temptation in front of someone would not be allowed. For example, providing an individual with a prohibited food, e.g., wine to a Nazirite (who takes a vow which prohibits him from drinking wine, cutting hair, or ritually contaminating himself by coming into contact with the dead), would be a violation of this commandment (Babylonian Talmud, Pesachim 22b). Rabbi Ashi, who owned forests, was permitted to sell wood to heathens who were fire-worshippers only because the majority of purchased wood is used for kindling, not for idolatry (Babylonian Talmud, Nedarim 62b). However, to sell the wood directly for the purpose of allowing pagans to practice their idolatrous practices would be prohibited. Lending someone money without having any witnesses present is also a violation of lifnei iver since it might ultimately tempt the debtor to deny that he or she borrowed any money (Babylonian Talmud, Baba Metzia 75b). If one person lends another money with interest, the borrower and the lender have also violated lifnei iver since each one enables the other to commit the sin of usury (Babylonian Talmud, Bava Metzia 75b). The Talmud (Babylonian Talmud, Moed Katan 17a) also prohibits one from hitting an older son because of lifnei iver. An older son might angrily retaliate and strike his father, which is a very serious sin. One should not entrust animals to a shepherd, if there is a strong possibility the shepherd will allow them to graze on other people's property (Babylonian Talmud, Bava Metzia 5b). Even purchasing milk, wool, or kids from shepherds was not permitted since they might have stolen these items from the cattle under their care (Babylonian Talmud, Bava Kama 118b). Selling anything that has the potential of causing harm to others is prohibited. Thus, the Talmud (Babylonian Talmud, Avodah Zarah 16a) states: "It is forbidden to sell [idolaters] bears, lions, or anything which may injure the public. One shall not build with them a basilica, a scaffold, a stadium, or a platform" In Talmudic times, wild animals were used in stadiums to kill people for sport; basilicas were used to try people and, if sentenced to death, the defendant was thrown off it. Individuals were also thrown off platforms to kill them. Rebbi owned white mules and was rebuked by Rabbi Pinchas b. Yair for owning such vicious and dangerous animals. He offered to sell them but was told by Rabbi Pinchas that he would then be in violation of lifnei iver (Babylonian Talmud, Chullin 7b). According to Abaye, the reason for marking graves is to ensure that priests or pilgrims would not inadvertently become ritually unclean (Babylonian Talmud, Moed Katan 5a). When the Temple in Jerusalem was standing, priests and pilgrims bringing sacrifices had to maintain ritual purity. Leaving an unmarked grave that can result in the ritual contamination of priests and pilgrims is a violation of placing the stumbling block -the grave- before the blind, i.e., the priests and pilgrims. There is a Midrash (Midrash Hagadol, Leviticus 19:14) that states that individuals who "strengthen the hand of sinners" or assist others to commit a misdeed have transgressed the prohibition against "placing a stumbling block before the blind." One might argue that remaining quiet in the face of evil, i.e., not blowing the whistle on iniquities, strengthens the hand of wrongdoers. Nehama Leibowitz (1983, p. 178), the renowned Bible teacher, offers the widest extension of the law: "But the Torah teaches us that even by sitting at home doing nothing, by complete passivity and divorcement from society, one cannot shake off responsibility for what is transpiring in the world at large, for the iniquity, violence and evil there. By not protesting, "not marking the graves" and danger spots, you have become responsible for any harm arising therefrom, and have violated the prohibition: "Thou shalt not put a stumbling block before the blind..." The following are some common business situations that might involve the prohibition of lifnei iver. (1) Buildings should be made accessible to the handicapped. Many office buildings have been built without ramps and railings and thereby cause the blind and other handicapped to "stumble." There very well may be an obligation on society to provide large-print books, books in Braille, and special schools for the disabled. This is arguably a modern interpretation of the verse but something to be considered. (2) Accountants and auditors that are not careful with financial statements and thereby mislead others, e.g., investors or creditors, are guilty of lifnei iver. Investors and creditors rely on financial statements and have a right to assume that they are indeed accurate records. Moreover, accountants who purposely "cook the books" are guilty of deception and lifnei iver by helping their clients to sin. (3) Advertising that is intended to elicit envy or create the need for showy luxury products on the part of the consumer may also be problematic. In the classic medieval ethics (mussar) work, Orchos Tzadikim (Chapter 14: Jealousy), the author notes that jealousy comes from observing what friends own.. We become envious of a friend's garment, food, house, and/or wealth, and envy leads to coveting. Thus, individuals who purposely flaunt wealth in order to arouse the envy of their fellows are guilty of lifnei iver. Sadly, the newspapers are filled with stories of teenagers that are killed for a designer shirt, fancy sneakers, or a gold chain. The Orchos Tzadikim recommends a life of moderation and simplicity so as not to arouse the envy of others. (4) Running advertisements that are intended to mislead the public are violations of lifnei iver since this is tantamount to providing people with bad advice. Similarly, salespeople or consultants who are asked for advice about products and recommend the item that provides the highest commissions are also guilty of lifnei iver. The individual who possesses the expertise is obligated to provide accurate information and not cause the "blind" client or customer to "stumble" by providing bad information. This would include stockbrokers who recommend risky financial securities in order to generate a large commission. (5) Bait and switch advertising is a practice in which a retailer promotes an item at an extremely low price (the "bait") in order to attract the customer to the store. When the customer is in the store and attempts to purchase the advertised item, s/he is informed that the item is not available and/or is told that there are better, but "slightly" more expensive, substitutes on hand. This unethical practice is clearly a "stumbling block" to the unknowing customer. (6) Giving a bribe or kickback to a buyer is a violation of lifnei iver. Buyers are supposed to act impartially on behalf of their employers; kickbacks encourage them to act deceitfully. (7) Selling products that are dangerous to the public is a violation of lifnei iver. Certainly, selling weapons to criminals would be illegal. Providing cigarettes to minors would certainly be wrong, even if not prohibited by secular law. There are a number of rabbis who feel that smoking itself is a violation of lifnei iver since it harms the innocent through second-hand smoke. (8) Being a fence and buying stolen goods would be a violation of lifnei iver. (9) Keeping quiet when wrongs are being committed by an organization is also tantamount to "placing a stumbling block ..." CONCLUSION The seemingly simple verse prohibiting the placement of stumbling blocks before the blind is actually a succinct statement encompassing many important rules of ethics and morality. It is an admonition not to take advantage of the weak and the helpless or to place temptation in the path of those who may be morally weak. It is also a call to action demanding that society and people do everything possible help the weak, the vulnerable, and the helpless. It is a fundamental principle of business ethics and is on par with such essential principles as "The stranger who resides with you shall be treated the same as the native-born and you love him as yourself" (Leviticus 19:34) and "loving your fellow human being as yourself" (Leviticus 19: 18). _____________________________________ Reference Leibowitz, Nehama (1983). Studies in Vayikra (Leviticus). Jerusalem: World Zionist Organization. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
rangerssuck fired this volley in
: This was all 40-odd (very odd) years ago, and I still have both eyes and all fingers are intact. But yeah, it was pretty nuts, but these things did go several hundred feet before hitting the building across the street. Even a 'little one' with a 2' flywheel can f-up a coke machine at 100' away! Saw that at a transformer factory when I worked in the design lab there. All we did all day long was 'burn in' prototypes, and characterize temperature rise and hot resistance. Some "lab". Lloyd |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
rangerssuck wrote:
On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 11:02:06 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote: rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... -- Snag Not often that you'll find me quoting scripture, but... Leviticus 19:14 : "You shall not curse the deaf nor place a stumbling block before the blind." A quick summary of the rabbinic interpretation of this verse is: "It is an admonition not to take advantage of the weak and the helpless or to place temptation in the path of those who may be morally weak." snipped several hundred lines of Biblical analysis ... principles as "The stranger who resides with you shall be treated the same as the native-born and you love him as yourself" (Leviticus 19:34) and "loving your fellow human being as yourself" (Leviticus 19: 18). _____________________________________ Reference Leibowitz, Nehama (1983). Studies in Vayikra (Leviticus). Jerusalem: World Zionist Organization. All this over a quarter glued to the floor as a joke ? That coin had been there for at least a month , everybody knew it was there and the joke was dead - unless somebody that didn't work there came thru . This prick used my best chisel on purpose , he for some obscure reason made all kinds of problems for me . -- Snag |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 10:32:11 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote: On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 07:04:33 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 16:39:06 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 08:47:22 -0500, Ignoramus9052 wrote: On 2015-06-23, Gunner Asch wrote: On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 23:02:16 -0500, Ignoramus8881 wrote: http://igor.chudov.com/tmp/crankshaft.jpg They abused the **** out of that crank. See the scoring on the driven side? No lube there in a long time. Great observation! This was from a punch press. This is how most Chicago people use most equipment, in general. i Folks here seem to forget I work on and repair this sort of thing. Machinery in machine shops Shrug. Its how Ive made my living for 20 yrs. The folks that owned that press had zero maintainece. Even if they were paying somebody. Having a crank that badly scored is clear indication that sooner or later..somebody is gonna **** up badly enough to bust that same crank. What happened..die platten bolts break and the platten shift? That wasnt a "crystalization" break of the crank..but a full power ****up. Anyone get hurt when it all broke loose? I have no idea, I simply observed that crankshaft on the ground, I do not know the story. My guess is not much happened to the operator. i The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. It damaged everything so badly on the press..and the shop wall..and the front office wall..and the wall outside of the building, and a motorcycle in the parking lot......that they simply scrapped the press, moved in a new(er) press, called in the carpenters, tow trucks and the insurance company (s)...... http://midwestmachy.com/wp-content/u...6/DSC_0012.jpg Is an example of the type of press that failed.... This is the biggest reason most..most presses today have hydraulic rams instead of a flywheel. While more complicated...when they fail catastrophically...they usually stay together.... That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. We can't let this trick go by without comment. First, if you turn the bearing to the side while doing that, the gyroscopic effect will side-load the bearing and likely burn your fingers, unless you instantly let go, in which case the bearing will run off and hit something at a very high speed. If you put your finger through the shaft hole and it side-loads like that, it may seize and rip off your finger. However, your finger will have the ride of its life. Third, if you succeed it getting it to spin up freely, you will, eventually, learn about the fracture mechanics of hardened 8000-Series steel, while the outer race explodes in your face. 'Just a caution. Way back when I was cleaning some wheel bearings from a VW Bug. I was using air to blow them out after cleaning with solvent. I decided to spin one up. I put it on my finger and spun it up a little, then a little more, and then decided to see how fast I could get it to spin. The pitch of the sound coming from the air accelerated bearing rose higher and higher. Just when it got high enough that I couldn't hear it the thing exploded. I thought my finger was broken. Pieces of bearing stuck into the sheetrock. Learned my lesson that day for sure. Eric |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:07:11 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 20:37:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... Thank Crom it was on Hiway 33..not the freeway. Just between Taft and Maricopa. Its been what...15 yrs now..still hasn't been found. Did they ever catch the perp fer littrin'? -- Find out what people will submit to, and you have found out the exact amount of injustice and wrong which will be imposed on them. --Frederick Douglass |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
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Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wed, 24 Jun 2015 17:39:47 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 22:07:11 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 20:37:20 -0700, Larry Jaques wrote: On Tue, 23 Jun 2015 15:05:27 -0700, Gunner Asch wrote: The older machines often had a BIG assed flywheel on that end of the crank along with the brake. I was called in years ago on a repair job for a crank that had crystallized and that 8' flywheel had suddenly gotten free. No one was badly hurt..but the flywheel was found in the street blocking traffic....embedded in the side of someone's van...about 400 feet from the press. That's vaguely reminiscent of the trailer spare tire which got away while traveling down the freeway in LoCal... Thank Crom it was on Hiway 33..not the freeway. Just between Taft and Maricopa. Its been what...15 yrs now..still hasn't been found. Did they ever catch the perp fer littrin'? Got to find the evidence first! (Grin) |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 7:11:23 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
rangerssuck wrote: On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 11:02:06 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote: rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... -- Snag Not often that you'll find me quoting scripture, but... Leviticus 19:14 : "You shall not curse the deaf nor place a stumbling block before the blind." A quick summary of the rabbinic interpretation of this verse is: "It is an admonition not to take advantage of the weak and the helpless or to place temptation in the path of those who may be morally weak." snipped several hundred lines of Biblical analysis ... principles as "The stranger who resides with you shall be treated the same as the native-born and you love him as yourself" (Leviticus 19:34) and "loving your fellow human being as yourself" (Leviticus 19: 18). _____________________________________ Reference Leibowitz, Nehama (1983). Studies in Vayikra (Leviticus). Jerusalem: World Zionist Organization. All this over a quarter glued to the floor as a joke ? That coin had been there for at least a month , everybody knew it was there and the joke was dead - unless somebody that didn't work there came thru . This prick used my best chisel on purpose , he for some obscure reason made all kinds of problems for me . -- Snag Sorry - This was one of those things that was banged into my head relentlessly when I was a kid. The chisel thing makes a very good case for locked toolboxes, which were the norm for all the privately owned tools at every shop where I ever worked. Even non-maliciously, an idiot could not know the difference between a wood chisel and a cold chisel or a screwdriver. Better to keep your stuff out of the reach of idiots. I'm glad it's my shop now, and only people I trust come in here. |
Picture of a broken crankshaft
Terry Coombs wrote:
rangerssuck wrote: On Wednesday, June 24, 2015 at 11:02:06 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote: rangerssuck wrote: On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 11:37:14 PM UTC-4, Larry Jaques wrote: In a shop where I worked, a somewhat amusing lunchtime activity was taking clapped-out bearings, washing all the lube & dirt out of them, holding the inner race between thumb & index finger, spinning them up to some insane speed with an air gun & putting them down in the parking lot. They'd go some pretty impressive distances. In a (woodworking) shop where I worked , I epoxied a quarter to the concrete floor . Asshole floor sweeper used my best chisel to take it up . He did it on a day I was out ... -- Snag Not often that you'll find me quoting scripture, but... Leviticus 19:14 : "You shall not curse the deaf nor place a stumbling block before the blind." A quick summary of the rabbinic interpretation of this verse is: "It is an admonition not to take advantage of the weak and the helpless or to place temptation in the path of those who may be morally weak." snipped several hundred lines of Biblical analysis ... principles as "The stranger who resides with you shall be treated the same as the native-born and you love him as yourself" (Leviticus 19:34) and "loving your fellow human being as yourself" (Leviticus 19: 18). _____________________________________ Reference Leibowitz, Nehama (1983). Studies in Vayikra (Leviticus). Jerusalem: World Zionist Organization. All this over a quarter glued to the floor as a joke ? That coin had been there for at least a month , everybody knew it was there and the joke was dead - unless somebody that didn't work there came thru . This prick used my best chisel on purpose , he for some obscure reason made all kinds of problems for me . Maybe the sweeper took as much pride in his work as you did with your tools. It's still an amusing story. |
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