We got the Logan lathe loaded and trailered back to the shop today
without incident.

I'm not going to convert it, just restore it. It's in almost cherry
condition except for the paint and the threading dial pinion. The
threading dial was apparently left engaged for the entire life of the
machine, and is still functional, but heavily worn, mostly as an artifact
of the "logan method" of using the longitudinal screw as a drive shaft
for the standard feeds by cutting a keyway in the screw! (darn!)

The Vari-Speed pulleys were both stuck, but they popped loose with a
little encouragement. The motor? Who knows.

However, the ways are in almost perfect condition. ALL the rust that
shows anywhere is just a light surface dusting from sitting in an
unconditioned warehouse, but with no signs anywhere of pitting, scale, or
water damage. It'll clean up with only steel wool and oil or a little
Evap-O-Rust.

The ways are worn almost not at all. They must've used this for long
spindle work during it's commercial life, because there is no wear
concentrated near the headstock, and no hacksaw or file marks on the
ways, like you see on so many old shop lathes. They really cared for it,
and that likely means that good machinists used it.

This one needs to be snapped back to virgin. It's too nice to chop up
for a small, not very rigid CNC.

It even came with two chucks and three faceplates. The chucks will take
a bit of work. They're frozen up.

It has a lantern-style toolpost, but that can be solved.

Lloyd

On Sun, 25 May 2014 19:46:08 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

We got the Logan lathe loaded and trailered back to the shop today
without incident.

Bueno.


I'm not going to convert it, just restore it. It's in almost cherry
condition except for the paint and the threading dial pinion. The
threading dial was apparently left engaged for the entire life of the
machine, and is still functional, but heavily worn, mostly as an artifact
of the "logan method" of using the longitudinal screw as a drive shaft
for the standard feeds by cutting a keyway in the screw! (darn!)

Replacement time?


The Vari-Speed pulleys were both stuck, but they popped loose with a
little encouragement. The motor? Who knows.

However, the ways are in almost perfect condition. ALL the rust that
shows anywhere is just a light surface dusting from sitting in an
unconditioned warehouse, but with no signs anywhere of pitting, scale, or
water damage. It'll clean up with only steel wool and oil or a little
Evap-O-Rust.

Wow, you lucked out.


The ways are worn almost not at all. They must've used this for long
spindle work during it's commercial life, because there is no wear
concentrated near the headstock, and no hacksaw or file marks on the
ways, like you see on so many old shop lathes. They really cared for it,
and that likely means that good machinists used it.

Most excellent.


This one needs to be snapped back to virgin. It's too nice to chop up
for a small, not very rigid CNC.

Chop up?


It even came with two chucks and three faceplates. The chucks will take
a bit of work. They're frozen up.

Ed's Red to the rescue!


It has a lantern-style toolpost, but that can be solved.

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

Replacement time?

Naw, the longi-screw drives the cross feed. It's got have that keyway.
Just a bad design (from my perspective). OTOH, they served a lot of
years, both as Logan light commercial lathes and as Monkey Wards hobby
lathes.

Chop up?
I mean 'modify'. I'll look for a defunct-electronics CNC lathe to refit
with new electronics.

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.



Lloyd

Nice to see somebody giving an old girl the TLC she deserves...

If you're got photobucket or even RCM dropbox, it would be nice to see
pictures.

Karl

On Sun, 25 May 2014 20:44:13 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

Replacement time?

Naw, the longi-screw drives the cross feed. It's got have that keyway.
Just a bad design (from my perspective). OTOH, they served a lot of
years, both as Logan light commercial lathes and as Monkey Wards hobby
lathes.

Speaking of Monkey Wards, I picked up a hobby wood lathe of that brand
for $10, with another $10 going for a couple old/working 1/3hp motors.


Chop up?
I mean 'modify'. I'll look for a defunct-electronics CNC lathe to refit
with new electronics.

What will you be producing in mass quantity to warrant a CNC lathe?


Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

What will you be producing in mass quantity to warrant a CNC lathe?

None. More for 'organic' shapes, and for quick contouring to tolerance
without the time it takes to do by hand.

I draw everything first, anyway.


Lloyd

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Karl

On Mon, 26 May 2014 12:33:11 -0500, Karl Townsend
wrote:


Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Karl

Indeed it is.

Gunner, KDK tool user


--

"
I was once told by a “gun safety” advocate back in the Nineties
that he favored total civilian firearms confiscation.
Only the military and police should have weapons he averred and what did I think about that?

I began to give him a reasoned answer and he
cut me off with an abrupt, “Give me the short answer.”

I thought for a moment and said, “If you try to take our firearms we will kill you.”"

On Mon, 26 May 2014 07:39:26 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
:

What will you be producing in mass quantity to warrant a CNC lathe?

None. More for 'organic' shapes, and for quick contouring to tolerance
without the time it takes to do by hand.

I draw everything first, anyway.

Goodonya, mate. Contouring is much easier via machine vs hand.

--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

On Mon, 26 May 2014 12:33:11 -0500, Karl Townsend
wrote:


Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far, but I see
what you mean. Have you experienced chattering or deflection problems
with a Phase II?


--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

Karl Townsend fired this volley in
:

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Yeah, well.... Shars Tools sells a really nice Chinese version of AXA or
BXA sizes with the wedge fixing. I have one (BXA), and that is what I
meant by "Phase II", not specifically the brand -- just Chinese in origin.

LLoyd

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:13:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:


I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far,

Say what???

Even on my little Hardinge HLV-H... .10 +is a regular thing

This morning I was cutting a jib sheet cam clamp mounting plate for
the O'day Daysailer and I was cutting .187 to finish size on the
horizontal mill


--

"
I was once told by a “gun safety” advocate back in the Nineties
that he favored total civilian firearms confiscation.
Only the military and police should have weapons he averred and what did I think about that?

I began to give him a reasoned answer and he
cut me off with an abrupt, “Give me the short answer.”

I thought for a moment and said, “If you try to take our firearms we will kill you.”"

Gunner Asch fired this volley in
:

Say what???

Even on my little Hardinge HLV-H... .10 +is a regular thing

And the BXA on my lathe handles 0.2+ with not a sign of flex.

Small cuts are a waste of time, until you get to the finishing pass.

Lloyd

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:13:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 12:33:11 -0500, Karl Townsend
wrote:


Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far, but I see
what you mean. Have you experienced chattering or deflection problems
with a Phase II?

You're just a light weight Larry. You should be fine with a Phase II.

Deflection is a fact of life. making it rigid will reduce not
eliminate it. HSS really shines here, the cutting forces are so much
lower. Any time I have a part more than 4 L/D, I use HSS to finish if
at all possible. Or program in the taper on the CHNC lathe.

As to chatter i have a very old LeBlond where chatter is its middle
name. I'd get rid of it but its hard to find another ten foot lathe
for cheap.

Karl

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:40:57 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:13:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:


I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far,

Say what???

Even on my little Hardinge HLV-H... .10 +is a regular thing

This morning I was cutting a jib sheet cam clamp mounting plate for
the O'day Daysailer and I was cutting .187 to finish size on the
horizontal mill

Delrin or aluminum? g

--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

On Mon, 26 May 2014 18:25:31 -0500, Karl Townsend
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:13:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 12:33:11 -0500, Karl Townsend
wrote:


Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far, but I see
what you mean. Have you experienced chattering or deflection problems
with a Phase II?

You're just a light weight Larry. You should be fine with a Phase II.

Of course I am. g That's why I don't yet own a metal lathe.


--
....in order that a man may be happy, it is
necessary that he should not only be capable
of his work, but a good judge of his work.
-- John Ruskin

On Mon, 26 May 2014 19:33:32 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:40:57 -0700, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Mon, 26 May 2014 13:13:04 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:


I've haven't made any 0.100" cuts in all my days, so far,

Say what???

Even on my little Hardinge HLV-H... .10 +is a regular thing

This morning I was cutting a jib sheet cam clamp mounting plate for
the O'day Daysailer and I was cutting .187 to finish size on the
horizontal mill

Delrin or aluminum? g

4140

Shrug

--

"
I was once told by a “gun safety” advocate back in the Nineties
that he favored total civilian firearms confiscation.
Only the military and police should have weapons he averred and what did I think about that?

I began to give him a reasoned answer and he
cut me off with an abrupt, “Give me the short answer.”

I thought for a moment and said, “If you try to take our firearms we will kill you.”"

On Monday, May 26, 2014 7:35:09 PM UTC-7, Larry Jackass wrote:

Of course I am. g That's why I don't yet own a metal lathe.

Even when Larry Jackass does he will still be a metal midget with no clues.

If Mark Wieber bent over too quickly Larry Jackass would snap his neck.

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message . 3.70...
Karl Townsend fired this volley in
:

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Yeah, well.... Shars Tools sells a really nice Chinese version of AXA or
BXA sizes with the wedge fixing. I have one (BXA), and that is what I
meant by "Phase II", not specifically the brand -- just Chinese in origin.



I use the BXA on all my lathes, mounting them on a riser where needed.

Years ago, I made up ~500 of the straight turning holders and sold a butt load on Ebay....guessing there's still 50 or so left.

Karl Townsend wrote:

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

Phase II is available in both piston and wedge styles, and as of the
past year or so both are priced about the same. I have a piston style on
my older lathe from when the wedge type was $100 more, and my newer
lathe has the wedge type now that there isn't a price premium. Both work
fine and of course the holders interchange between them since they're
both "B" size.


the Aloris brand expands the Z taper with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid. May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Karl

"Pete C." fired this volley in news:5384dd57$0
:


Phase II is available in both piston and wedge styles, and as of the
past year or so both are priced about the same.

Yeah, I thought I had seen that, but mine isn't the PhaseII brand, it's
from Shars. I've exchanged Aloris and PhaseII toolholders with it with
no problem.

The Chinese do little well (whenever they can get away with it), but
Shars has apparently ridden them pretty hard to get a toolpost that meets
all the specs. It's a good tool.

LLoyd

On 5/27/2014 2:04 PM, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
"Pete C." fired this volley in news:5384dd57$0
:


Phase II is available in both piston and wedge styles, and as of the
past year or so both are priced about the same.

Yeah, I thought I had seen that, but mine isn't the PhaseII brand, it's
from Shars. I've exchanged Aloris and PhaseII toolholders with it with
no problem.

The Chinese do little well (whenever they can get away with it), but
Shars has apparently ridden them pretty hard to get a toolpost that meets
all the specs. It's a good tool.

LLoyd


I have a Shars AXA piston tool post on my Atlas 12x36 and it's rigid
enough for that machine.

And I have no problem taking .100" cuts.

OTOH, I used a Voest lathe at a former job and that machine had no
problem with .400". Of course, I had to stand away from the stream of chips.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nQfDsTWqzoA

David

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message
. 3.70...
"Pete C." fired this volley in news:5384dd57$0
:


Phase II is available in both piston and wedge styles, and as of the
past year or so both are priced about the same.

Yeah, I thought I had seen that, but mine isn't the PhaseII brand, it's
from Shars. I've exchanged Aloris and PhaseII toolholders with it with
no problem.

The Chinese do little well (whenever they can get away with it), but
Shars has apparently ridden them pretty hard to get a toolpost that meets
all the specs. It's a good tool.


Suggest use caution with anything that's made of "hardened
steel"...oftentimes, the item will have mechanical properties quite similar
to those of a ceramic ashtray.

--

On Tuesday, May 27, 2014 10:35:33 PM UTC-7, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote in message

. 3.70...

"Pete C." fired this volley in news:5384dd57$0

:





Phase II is available in both piston and wedge styles, and as of the

past year or so both are priced about the same.



Yeah, I thought I had seen that, but mine isn't the PhaseII brand, it's

from Shars. I've exchanged Aloris and PhaseII toolholders with it with

no problem.



The Chinese do little well (whenever they can get away with it), but

Shars has apparently ridden them pretty hard to get a toolpost that meets

all the specs. It's a good tool.





Suggest use caution with anything that's made of "hardened

steel"...oftentimes, the item will have mechanical properties quite similar

to those of a ceramic ashtray.



--

Shars doesn't ride anyone hard.

Shars doesn't have anything made to their specs.

If you get something from Shars that's acceptable you got lucky.

On 2014-05-26, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sun, 25 May 2014 20:44:13 -0500, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Larry Jaques fired this volley in
m:

[ ... ]

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Better to go with the wedge style instead of the piston style,
since Phase-II makes both. I started with the wedge style Phase-II in
the BXA size, and later wound up with a Dorian in the same size. Some
of the toolholders are Aloris, some Phase-II, and maybe something else
in the mix somewhere.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 2014-05-26, Karl Townsend wrote:

Going with Aloris or PhaseII?

Phase-II works for me.

I've only seen one PII, but it looked well designed and worked fine.

Phase II uses a piston to push out on the Aloris style holder. Only
the angled surface and the psiton make contact.

Phase-II makes *both* styles. I know, because I opted for the
wedge style when I got mine

the Aloris brand expands the Z taper

The dovetail, you mean?

And I have seen one old Aloris one in the piston style.

with a wedge making full contact
on the entire Z area. WAY more rigid.

I agree that the wedge style is more rigid (which is why I got
that to start with, even though it cost a little more from Phase-II.

The Dorian toolpost is sort of a cross between the piston and
the wedge style. It has a small piece which projects out of the outside
dovetail -- or the one towards the tailstock for the boring/facing
station) which in effect does the same thing that the wedge style does.
And the lever does *not* swing in a full circle, unlike the norma
piston style. (See Below for significance.)

May not make any difference on
light lathes with small cuts. Pour the coals to it with a heavy cut
and insert tooling; the difference is night and day.

Agreed there.

Another consideration between the piston and the wedge style is
that (with no tool holder on the post) the piston style's locking lever
can freely rotate a full 360 degrees. This can bring it into the path
of the chuck jaws, and result in Shrapnel as the plastic end of the
handle shatters.

I did not know about this "feature" until I had already gotten
my Phase-II. It made me even more glad about my choice.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | (KV4PH) Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

replying to Lloyd E. Sponenburgh, tony mountjoy wrote:
I need a replacement flat belt that is approx. 51.75 long X 1-1/4" wide with
approx.14 straight ribs

--
for full context, visit https://www.polytechforum.com/metalw...me-597443-.htm