"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.
--
EA



Jon

On 6/26/2013 7:10 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 7:10 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

Ask and you'll get the explanation.

--
Ed Huntress

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 22:14:58 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

Existential Angst wrote:

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

He's doing exactly the same thing he does when he talks about his
birtherism. Demonstrating beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's not
smart enough to STFU.

On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 08:14:46 -0700, whoyakidding's ghost
wrote:

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 22:14:58 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

Existential Angst wrote:

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

He's doing exactly the same thing he does when he talks about his
birtherism. Demonstrating beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's not
smart enough to STFU.

He's doing a Roger. No serious conversation goes unpunished with silly
right-wing wisecracks or reactionary tirades.

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 08:14:46 -0700, whoyakidding's ghost
wrote:

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 22:14:58 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

Existential Angst wrote:

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering
grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic
was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

He's doing exactly the same thing he does when he talks about his
birtherism. Demonstrating beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's not
smart enough to STFU.

He's doing a Roger. No serious conversation goes unpunished with silly
right-wing wisecracks or reactionary tirades.

Idnat just like Kidding? Except kidding substitutes narcissistic
self-obsession for right-wingism, constantly interrupting adult discussion.
And I think kidding does believe in perpetual motion..... now he's "dropped
down to 147 mpg"...... must be what his pyooter readout says, since he
can't quite do division, on a calculator.
--
EA



--
Ed Huntress

On 6/26/2013 10:14 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 7:10 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

Ask and you'll get the explanation.



Any car that "plugs in" is basically burning coal at least some of the
time and avoiding road taxes and increasing pollution, unless you have
your own solar array or such. When electric cars become prevalent
enough, the gov will further tax ALL electricity to make up for lost
road tax. I'll explain it to you if you further if you like.

On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 16:11:00 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 10:14 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 7:10 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

Ask and you'll get the explanation.



Any car that "plugs in" is basically burning coal at least some of the
time and avoiding road taxes and increasing pollution, unless you have
your own solar array or such.

Unless you're in the habit of paying more taxes than you have to, all
your wisecracks amount to is some pretty snotty sarcasm, Tom.

When electric cars become prevalent
enough, the gov will further tax ALL electricity to make up for lost
road tax. I'll explain it to you if you further if you like.

Since transportation fuel charges only cover 48% of our paltry highway
maintenance costs now, with the rest coming from general funds (in the
form of repeated emergency appropriations), there isn't much to
explain. We'll either tap more from the general fund or we'll have to
get halftracks on our Toyotas.

--
Ed Huntress

On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 19:05:50 -0400, Ed Huntress
wrote:

On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 16:11:00 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 10:14 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Any car that "plugs in" is basically burning coal at least some of the
time and avoiding road taxes and increasing pollution, unless you have
your own solar array or such.

Unless you're in the habit of paying more taxes than you have to, all
your wisecracks amount to is some pretty snotty sarcasm, Tom.

When electric cars become prevalent
enough, the gov will further tax ALL electricity to make up for lost
road tax. I'll explain it to you if you further if you like.

Since transportation fuel charges only cover 48% of our paltry highway
maintenance costs now, with the rest coming from general funds (in the
form of repeated emergency appropriations), there isn't much to
explain. We'll either tap more from the general fund or we'll have to
get halftracks on our Toyotas.

Tom was complaining about my driving sucking the funding from his
highways. That is IMPOSSIBLE. Same with his coal claim. Local grid has
none and it's a net exporter. Tom should ask if there's anyone here
who could add a toggle switch to his tunnel vision. Then he could turn
it off once in a while and live a brighter life.

In case there might be any serious readers other than Ed, they can see
Volt fuel consumption stats by EV percentage etc.
http://www.voltstats.net/ They use a standardized MPGe to
differentiate MPG. It's a handy and interesting resource although one
needs to apply local fuel and electric rates to calculate individual
economics.

Note to EA: I'm on the list. Get busy. Do not sleep until you find my
stats. I suggest you get Gunner's cyber wieners on the case.

On 6/27/2013 7:05 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Thu, 27 Jun 2013 16:11:00 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 10:14 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:
On Wed, 26 Jun 2013 21:17:28 -0400, Tom Gardner Mars@Tacks wrote:

On 6/26/2013 7:10 PM, Existential Angst wrote:
"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:




So, I figger, since I drive about 20,000 mi/yr, let's compare the Fit and
the Volt in that mile range.
So in the driving I do, I get about 40 mpg on the Fit.... course, I
free-wheel all over the fukn place, have a helium foot, and shut off the
engine at the drop of a hat, etc.
And the Volt, at that mileage, will do 45 mpg. And, very importantly,
what
I do manually the Volt does *automatically*. Long live The Chip, eh?
Well, you can get a Honda Civic Hybrid for a little over $20K, and I
get up to 57 MPG without much work. I do have a light foot. I drove
3 kids plus myself (and the oldest of that crew outweighs me) about
250 miles to a basketball tournament at got 57 MPG on the highway
at 59 MPH without air conditioning. It was just at the upper range of
comfortable temps. This was flat southern Illinois country, the HCH
does great on that terrain. I just used the cruise control.

Last week I drove 1000 miles on an out of town trip taking about 600 Lbs
of stuff to a show, hotter than hell both ways, and lots of hills
that make it harder to get good mileage. I got about 47 MPG on that
run, mostly around 68 MPH. AC, hills and speed all conspire to
wreck the mileage.

You can almost buy two of the Civic Hybrids for the price of one
Volt, and get good mileage both in town and on long trips.

In that case, Kidding would indeed never ever EVER realize an ROI, unless it
was under the 10,000 mi/yr range.
And then it would be sumpn like 69 years.... lol

57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
The VW TDI engine supposedly returns mpg's in the mid-fifties, with a light
foot.
When sumpn like a prius c pushes 70 mpg, 100 mpge electrics -- with all the
associated prices/visissytudes thereof -- lose quite a bit of their dazzle.

And not knockin the Volt. The concept is excellent, the engineering grand,
the quality apparently very good.... just, the execution and logic was a
bit off.
But much too much for Kidding to grok, apparently.


I'm sure he sends checks to the State and Fed for the unpaid road taxes.
And a check to the EPA for all the coal burned.

Tom, what the hell are you talking about? Oh, you don't know?

If you drive a Volt 40 miles each way to work, that's about 20,000
miles per year. That's at 94 mpg.

What? You don't know where 94 mpg comes from? Really? Then what are
you doing wising off in this thread?

Ask and you'll get the explanation.



Any car that "plugs in" is basically burning coal at least some of the
time and avoiding road taxes and increasing pollution, unless you have
your own solar array or such.

Unless you're in the habit of paying more taxes than you have to, all
your wisecracks amount to is some pretty snotty sarcasm, Tom.

When electric cars become prevalent
enough, the gov will further tax ALL electricity to make up for lost
road tax. I'll explain it to you if you further if you like.

Since transportation fuel charges only cover 48% of our paltry highway
maintenance costs now, with the rest coming from general funds (in the
form of repeated emergency appropriations), there isn't much to
explain. We'll either tap more from the general fund or we'll have to
get halftracks on our Toyotas.



Electricity WILL be taxed for lost revenue due to electric cars, look it
up! Since I pay a fortune for electricity, the added taxes won't be
fair to me to pay for everybody's coal-burner. I know leftists haven't
the slightest idea about "Unintended Consequences" because they don't
think about what they do, they only think that it feels good at the
time. They don't care what they hurt or destroy.

Where does the General Fund come from Ed?

Existential Angst wrote:


57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
Apparently you can do it on some Honda hybrids, too, by overpressurizing
the tires, tweaking the rear tire alignment and running it on
pure petroleum gas, instead of gasohol. The numbers I gave
were on gasohol, as pure gasoline is pretty rare in these parts.

There was a guy selling one of the original Honda Insights
on eBay that had a photo of his dashboard showing a
lifetime average of 86 MPG over 140,000 miles. I wanted
one of those SO BAD!

Jon

"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:


57 mpg is fantastic; 47 is excellent.
The prius c geekies talk about hitting 68 mpg.
Apparently you can do it on some Honda hybrids, too, by overpressurizing
the tires, tweaking the rear tire alignment and running it on
pure petroleum gas, instead of gasohol. The numbers I gave
were on gasohol, as pure gasoline is pretty rare in these parts.

There was a guy selling one of the original Honda Insights
on eBay that had a photo of his dashboard showing a
lifetime average of 86 MPG over 140,000 miles. I wanted
one of those SO BAD!

I hear dat.
Funny, those hybrid Insights were not a good seller, fwiu.
But I wonder if 86 mpg is a real number, tho...

I over-pressurize my tires, up to 45 psi, usually around 40.
I don't know what I'm gaining mpg-wise over 35 psi, tho.
The higher pressures don't seem to affect the *pattern* of wear, so I don't
appear to be sacrificing anything.
Altho you can feel it in the ride.
--
EA


Jon

Existential Angst wrote:


I hear dat.
Funny, those hybrid Insights were not a good seller, fwiu.
But I wonder if 86 mpg is a real number, tho...
Well, I saw the picture on the eBay listing of his dashboard
trip display. I have no idea how to fake it, but I think it
would be real hard.

2 seat cars (the original Insight) have never been great sellers,
although the Mazda Miata and Toyota MR2 have a bit of a cult
following. The styling of the original Insight was a bit
funky, especially with the fender skirts. But, I know of
no other production car that gets that kind of mileage.
Not even close.

Oh, for comparison, the "king of the hypermilers" Wayne Gerdes
was in a competition of hypermiling. He borrowed a stock
Insight from somebody in town, and ran the measured
course under supervision. He got ** 168 ** miles per gallon!
It was also raining, which tends to hurt mileage, too.

Jon

"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...
Existential Angst wrote:


I hear dat.
Funny, those hybrid Insights were not a good seller, fwiu.
But I wonder if 86 mpg is a real number, tho...
Well, I saw the picture on the eBay listing of his dashboard
trip display. I have no idea how to fake it, but I think it
would be real hard.

2 seat cars (the original Insight) have never been great sellers,
although the Mazda Miata and Toyota MR2 have a bit of a cult
following. The styling of the original Insight was a bit
funky, especially with the fender skirts. But, I know of
no other production car that gets that kind of mileage.
Not even close.

Oh, for comparison, the "king of the hypermilers" Wayne Gerdes
was in a competition of hypermiling. He borrowed a stock
Insight from somebody in town, and ran the measured
course under supervision. He got ** 168 ** miles per gallon!

How was he able to do that????
6th gear at 20 mph??


It was also raining, which tends to hurt mileage, too.

I've noticed that myself, but thought it might have been my imagination.
Water vapor in the air displaces O2, compromises combustion?
--
EA




Jon

On Fri, 28 Jun 2013 13:55:35 -0400, "Existential Angst"
wrote:

"Jon Elson" wrote in message
m...
Existential Angst wrote:


I hear dat.
Funny, those hybrid Insights were not a good seller, fwiu.
But I wonder if 86 mpg is a real number, tho...
Well, I saw the picture on the eBay listing of his dashboard
trip display. I have no idea how to fake it, but I think it
would be real hard.

2 seat cars (the original Insight) have never been great sellers,
although the Mazda Miata and Toyota MR2 have a bit of a cult
following. The styling of the original Insight was a bit
funky, especially with the fender skirts. But, I know of
no other production car that gets that kind of mileage.
Not even close.

Oh, for comparison, the "king of the hypermilers" Wayne Gerdes
was in a competition of hypermiling. He borrowed a stock
Insight from somebody in town, and ran the measured
course under supervision. He got ** 168 ** miles per gallon!

How was he able to do that????
6th gear at 20 mph??

Look up "hypermiling." It's a sport you may want to participate in.



It was also raining, which tends to hurt mileage, too.

I've noticed that myself, but thought it might have been my imagination.
Water vapor in the air displaces O2, compromises combustion?

It's not the vapor. In fact, in the old days when they ran carburetted
Offys on methanol at Indy, the drivers would often wait until the last
possible minute before a rainstorm to make a qualifying run, because
they got more horsepower when the humidity was at max. It delayed
detonation and produced a bit more power as a result.

OTOH, humid air is less dense, so unless you're getting the cooling
effect from drawing methanol though a carburetor, you'll actually
*lose* horsepower.

But those are minor effects on a road car. The major ones *in* the
rain are 1) loss of tire adhesion, and slippage; 2) increased rolling
resistance from dragging up water with the tires and flinging it
around; and 3) increased laminar airflow attachment to the car body
due to raindrops. No kidding. The effect is measurable.

--
Ed Huntress

Existential Angst wrote:

"Jon Elson" wrote in message
...


Oh, for comparison, the "king of the hypermilers" Wayne Gerdes
was in a competition of hypermiling. He borrowed a stock
Insight from somebody in town, and ran the measured
course under supervision. He got ** 168 ** miles per gallon!

How was he able to do that????
6th gear at 20 mph??

I have NO idea! It starts to sound like the "uphill both ways
to school" story. But, part of it is NEVER, EVER using the brakes or
stopping, so it might be like the bike riders that never stop
for stop signs, etc.
http://www.egmcartech.com/2007/09/12/top-10-fuel-saving-tips-from-a-hypermiler-who-gets-180mpg-in-a-honda-insight/

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3404022&page=1
This one seems to say it wasn't Wayne but one of the other
competitors who did the 168 MPG.


It was also raining, which tends to hurt mileage, too.

I've noticed that myself, but thought it might have been my imagination.
Water vapor in the air displaces O2, compromises combustion?
I think it is the squishing of the water out under the tires
that wastes the energy. Kind of like a water dyno added to the
engine.

Jon