We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

"Tom Gardner" fired this volley in
:

My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!



1935F for 22 seconds.

LLoyd

On 2011-01-03, Tom Gardner wrote:
We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!



I bought one like this for $100 once.

i

On 2011-01-03, Tom Gardner wrote:
We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting.

Not really a rheostat (which is a variable series resistance),
but rather a duty-cycle control.

I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

Possibly Blue-M? I've worked with one about that size.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale.

Certainly. I would suggest replacing the duty cycle controller
with an electronic one -- Omega makes nice ones. Gunner has some of
some other brand used I believe. The duty-cycle type keeps inserting
that off cycle even when you are barely on the way up to temperature.
The electronic one (based on the behavior of my Omega which I fitted to
a smaller oven which I got with *no* controller) is that it will stay on
full time until it reaches about 75% of the set point temperature, then
it will turn off for a while and observe the overshoot, then it will go
back full on until it gets close to the setpoint and start cycling just
right to have perhaps a 1 degree F overshoot at 1850 F. Even with this,
it takes about an hour to get to set point. I'm not sure how long it
would take with the duty cycle controller -- I wasn't after as great an
accuracy back then. :-)

My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Hmm ... fifteen seconds perhaps? 0.0625" thick black outside,
and the rest red and jucy. :-)

Of course, it depends on how hot you get it first. (There is
also the trick of how you will get it back out if you don't have proper
heat treating gloves. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

There's a place in Rochester that makes pizza in a 1000-degree oven in
about 90 seconds -- and it is excellent!

On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Tom Gardner wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

For crusty on the outside, about 500-600F, and for a moist tender inside,
leave it in there about three minutes. ;-)

Whatever you do, please report back with your results!

Bon Appetit!
Rich

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner


I'll send you pix and info on the oven, I'd appreciate it if you would make
a recommendation and sell me the parts.

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 04:27:17 -0500, "LibtardStupid"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner


I'll send you pix and info on the oven, I'd appreciate it if you would make
a recommendation and sell me the parts.

They are very simple to hook up. Power in, relay contacts
in/out..thermocouple in. (110/220 vac)

They will accept up to 39 different types of thermocouples. Very simple.
Reading the manuals (available on line and Ill send you the proper one
on CD) can be a confusing *******.

Programming can be simple..or a stone bitch..depending on how many set
points..ups and downs and delays for the particular treatment you are
trying to do. 800f for 20 minutes..rise to 1487F for 2 hours, drop to
450F for 30 minutes..up to 2200f for 4 minutes....chuckle..it can do
it..but it confuses the **** out of me. Fortunately Im doing single set
point heat treat...Up to 1400F for an hour and then off as an
example...G Whew!!

And Ill be damned if Ill sell you anything!!!

It will be a gift between friends. Crom knows you have sent me enough
brushes over the years.

As you can see in the photos, Ive installed one in one of my two ovens
and it works a treat. The other one is a bit more difficult..as the
front is slanted. Simply finding a way to mount it is the problem. But
its on my List.

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 04:27:17 -0500, "LibtardStupid"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner


I'll send you pix and info on the oven, I'd appreciate it if you would make
a recommendation and sell me the parts.

Im off to LA..via the long way around. The Grapevine is closed due to
snow..so Ive got to go out to Mojave and down and around. 5 hours on
the road at least..and the truck traffic will make it even slower as all
the freight headed to LA will be taking the roundabout as well.

Call me if you need any info.

Gunner, pulling the pin at 1:50 am



--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Don Foreman wrote:

There's a place in Rochester that makes pizza in a 1000-degree oven in
about 90 seconds -- and it is excellent!

I wonder what the window is between success and failure.

Wes

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 01:50:35 -0800, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 04:27:17 -0500, "LibtardStupid"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
. ..
On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner


I'll send you pix and info on the oven, I'd appreciate it if you would make
a recommendation and sell me the parts.

Im off to LA..via the long way around. The Grapevine is closed due to
snow..so Ive got to go out to Mojave and down and around. 5 hours on
the road at least..and the truck traffic will make it even slower as all
the freight headed to LA will be taking the roundabout as well.

Call me if you need any info.

Gunner, pulling the pin at 1:50 am

****...didnt check the news well enough. They closed the 58 as well.

Im stuck from going to So Cal until they open up one or the other..and
according to the CHP website...its snowing like a bitch on top of the
58..the storm is headed east.

Probably going to have to wait for the 5 to open..damnit~~

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

In article ,
Gunner Asch wrote:

On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

I did such a retrofit on a similar oven. The issue was to ensure that
the plastic controller and solid-state relay didn't overheat when the
oven was at full temperature. The smell of boiled plastic will totally
destroy the flavor of the steak.

Anyway, the thread on my retrofit is titled "Old Vigor Burnout Furnace
adapted to heat treating" and was posted in August 2008 to RCM.

Joe Gwinn

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 01:50:35 -0800, Gunner Asch
wrote:

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 04:27:17 -0500, "LibtardStupid"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
. ..
On Sun, 2 Jan 2011 21:20:31 -0500, "Tom Gardner"
wrote:

We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the
guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot
and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

Id be happy to sent you one

Gunner


I'll send you pix and info on the oven, I'd appreciate it if you would
make
a recommendation and sell me the parts.

Im off to LA..via the long way around. The Grapevine is closed due to
snow..so Ive got to go out to Mojave and down and around. 5 hours on
the road at least..and the truck traffic will make it even slower as all
the freight headed to LA will be taking the roundabout as well.

Call me if you need any info.

Gunner, pulling the pin at 1:50 am

****...didnt check the news well enough. They closed the 58 as well.

Im stuck from going to So Cal until they open up one or the other..and
according to the CHP website...its snowing like a bitch on top of the
58..the storm is headed east.

Probably going to have to wait for the 5 to open..damnit~~

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein


Reply: 166 to Nipomo and then south. Lower levels. Years ago I had to do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"
wrote:



Reply: 166 to Nipomo and then south. Lower levels. Years ago I had to do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"
wrote:



Reply: 166 to Nipomo and then south. Lower levels. Years ago I had to do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein


Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

Gunner Asch wrote:

Until the Hordes come over the ridgeline and decide to decimate the
village and put the survivors in harness to plow the fields.

Response 1:
That's what the Right To Keep and Bear Arms is for.

Response 2:
Do you mean like the Mexicans that are coming over to collect welfare and
drop anchor babies?

Rich...are you that naive?

Probably, but "I do not know" is the first stage of wisdom. ;-)

Cheers!
Rich

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"
wrote:
snip
Im stuck from going to So Cal until they open up one or the other..and
according to the CHP website...its snowing like a bitch on top of the
58..the storm is headed east.

Probably going to have to wait for the 5 to open..damnit~~
snip
========
Damn that global warming...
-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
...............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).

On Jan 3, 5:27*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: *166 to Nipomo and then south. *Lower levels. *Years ago I had to do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
* * * * * * * * * * *Robert A. Heinlein

Holy **** Gunner...I thought you were a survivalist.

Get off your butt and act like one.

TMT

On Jan 2, 8:20*pm, "Tom Gardner" wrote:
We just bought a used HT oven for $60. *It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. *It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. *I forget the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. *My question is: *How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? *Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! *Mmmmmm!

Single phase or three phase?

TMT

On 2011-01-03, Gunner Asch wrote:

[ ... ]

Programming can be simple..or a stone bitch..depending on how many set
points..ups and downs and delays for the particular treatment you are
trying to do. 800f for 20 minutes..rise to 1487F for 2 hours, drop to
450F for 30 minutes..up to 2200f for 4 minutes....chuckle..it can do
it..but it confuses the **** out of me. Fortunately Im doing single set
point heat treat...Up to 1400F for an hour and then off as an
example...G Whew!!

The problem with *my* oven at least with that kind of cycle
would be just how fast does the temperature need to fall vs how fast
will it *really* fall with the existing oven. Faster with the oven door
open and a fan blowing into it, but no way to be sure just what the
cooling rate of the workpiece vs the theromcouple.

Of course, my (older) Omega controller has the disadvantage of
having a single set point. But it has the advantage of a low voltage DC
output to feed to a solid state relay to control the power to the
heating element, so it is reliable and quiet as it cycles. :-)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 2011-01-03, Gunner Asch wrote:

[ ... ]

****...didnt check the news well enough. They closed the 58 as well.

Im stuck from going to So Cal until they open up one or the other..and
according to the CHP website...its snowing like a bitch on top of the
58..the storm is headed east.

Probably going to have to wait for the 5 to open..damnit~~

Where do you stay in the meanwhile?

Good Luck,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 2011-01-03, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In article ,
Gunner Asch wrote:

[ ... ]

Need a proper controller?

http://picasaweb.google.com/gunnerasch/HeatTreat#

I did such a retrofit on a similar oven. The issue was to ensure that
the plastic controller and solid-state relay didn't overheat when the
oven was at full temperature. The smell of boiled plastic will totally
destroy the flavor of the steak.

My oven came on stilts, and I mounted the aluminum "Bud Box" to
the stilts, below the surfaces of the well insulated heat-treat oven.

The limitaion of mine is that the total cavity is about the size
of a building brick. :-) (But -- it cost me $35.00 -- and I already had
the controller.)

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 11:28:12 -0800, Rich Grise
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Heinlein was a pompous ass. Of course you can have peace and Freedom
simultaneously - just choose not to make war.

Heinlein was one of the best writers of all time, and a damned good
philosopher, too.


Fighting for peace is like ****ing for virginity.

Not if there are only two courses of action, one being succumbing to
evil forever. I'd chose war over that any day.

--
You do not need a parachute to skydive.
You only need a parachute to skydive twice.

"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message
...
On Jan 2, 8:20 pm, "Tom Gardner" wrote:
We just bought a used HT oven for $60. It has about a 1.5 cubic foot
interior and goes up to 2kF. It has an analog temp meter and a rheostat
that controls the on/off ratio instead of a temp dial setting. I forget
the
name but one of the guys says it's a better but older make and model.

I doubt it'll save us money on heat treating but it'll be fun and the guys
have a new toy...very important for morale. My question is: How hot and
how long to do a steak in there? Crusty on the outside and red in the
middle! Mmmmmm!

Single phase or three phase?

TMT

240 split-phase, I don't know the amps but we had a 2-O gauge outlet where
we put the oven and no breakers popped.

On Jan 3, 6:16*pm, "Califbill" wrote:
"Gunner Asch" *wrote in message

...

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: *166 to Nipomo and then south. *Lower levels. *Years ago I had to do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
* * * * * * * * * * *Robert A. Heinlein

Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT

"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message
...

On Jan 3, 6:16 pm, "Califbill" wrote:
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message

...

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: 166 to Nipomo and then south. Lower levels. Years ago I had to
do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT


Reply:
he is not hiding from snowflakes. The CHP closes the passes these days when
it snows excessively. Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. Now the young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. And hurt some poor ******* that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. So they now close the roads and then run
escorted caravans.

On Jan 5, 12:09*am, "Califbill" wrote:
"Too_Many_Tools" *wrote in message

...

On Jan 3, 6:16 pm, "Califbill" wrote:





"Gunner Asch" *wrote in message

.. .

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: *166 to Nipomo and then south. *Lower levels. *Years ago I had to
do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
* * * * * * * * * * *Robert A. Heinlein

Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT

Reply:
he is not hiding from snowflakes. *The CHP closes the passes these days when
it snows excessively. *Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. *Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. *Now the young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. *And hurt some poor ******* that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. *So they now close the roads and then run
escorted caravans.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Snicker...the great climate change denier is hiding from some snow
flakes.

We are seeing how much of a real survivalist he is really is...what a
whimp.

TMT

"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message
...

On Jan 5, 12:09 am, "Califbill" wrote:
"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message

...

On Jan 3, 6:16 pm, "Califbill" wrote:





"Gunner Asch" wrote in message

.. .

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: 166 to Nipomo and then south. Lower levels. Years ago I had
to
do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT

Reply:
he is not hiding from snowflakes. The CHP closes the passes these days
when
it snows excessively. Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain
controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. Now the
young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. And hurt some poor *******
that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. So they now close the roads and then
run
escorted caravans.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Snicker...the great climate change denier is hiding from some snow
flakes.

We are seeing how much of a real survivalist he is really is...what a
whimp.

TMT


A survivalist would hide from the snowflakes. Why would they put themselves
in danger if not needed to survive?

On Jan 5, 11:31*pm, "Califbill" wrote:
"Too_Many_Tools" *wrote in message

...

On Jan 5, 12:09 am, "Califbill" wrote:





"Too_Many_Tools" *wrote in message

...

On Jan 3, 6:16 pm, "Califbill" wrote:

"Gunner Asch" *wrote in message

.. .

On Mon, 3 Jan 2011 14:42:07 -0800, "Califbill"

wrote:

Reply: *166 to Nipomo and then south. *Lower levels. *Years ago I had
to
do
that with a POS motor home with a bad transmission.

Thats over 5 hours at normal traffic...with rain, snow and heavy
traffic..Id still be on the road

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
* * * * * * * * * * *Robert A. Heinlein

Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT

Reply:
he is not hiding from snowflakes. *The CHP closes the passes these days
when
it snows excessively. *Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. *Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain
controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. *Now the
young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. *And hurt some poor *******
that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. *So they now close the roads and then
run
escorted caravans.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Snicker...the great climate change denier is hiding from some snow
flakes.

We are seeing how much of a real survivalist he is really is...what a
whimp.

TMT

A survivalist would hide from the snowflakes. *Why would they put themselves
in danger if not needed to survive?- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Snicker...Gummer...that must really be a heck of drinking binge you
are on.

Try posting after the hangover.

And watch out for those rogue snowflakes.

Laugh..laugh..laugh...

TMT

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 18:47:17 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 11:28:12 -0800, Rich Grise
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Heinlein was a pompous ass. Of course you can have peace and Freedom
simultaneously - just choose not to make war.

Heinlein was one of the best writers of all time, and a damned good
philosopher, too.


Fighting for peace is like ****ing for virginity.

Not if there are only two courses of action, one being succumbing to
evil forever. I'd chose war over that any day.

Hear hear!!

Bravo! Live Free or die!!


--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

On Tue, 4 Jan 2011 22:09:21 -0800, "Califbill"
wrote:


Reply:
Still probably quicker than going via Mojave.

So Gunner..still hiding from a few snow flakes?

What will you do as more climate changes due to global warming...beg
for more aid from the liberals?

TMT


Reply:
he is not hiding from snowflakes. The CHP closes the passes these days when
it snows excessively. Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. Now the young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. And hurt some poor ******* that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. So they now close the roads and then run
escorted caravans.

I put a 50cal can in the truck 3 weeks ago, with a full set of tire
chains in it.

I grew up on Michigans Upper Penninsula..average snow fall... 212
inches. Its not new to me.

I once drove Whitehorse Pass with 10,000lbs of Nitromon boosters in the
back of the flatbed, in 12" of fresh snow on the road with visibility
less than 300 feet. That was a very long drive, from 9pm-6am.....

Im somewhat..somewhat familiar with driving in snow, sleet, slush etc
etc. Been doing it for most of 41 yrs. Shrug

Too bad Too Many Fools is trapped in his mommas basement, driving that
little pong around the B&W tv screen.

Gunner

--

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Gunner Asch on Sat, 08 Jan 2011 01:07:50 -0800
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Tue, 4 Jan 2011 22:09:21 -0800, "Califbill"
wrote:

he is not hiding from snowflakes. The CHP closes the passes these days when
it snows excessively. Mostly because of people driving Japanese 4x4
minitrucks. Use to be, before all the 4x4's that they put on chain controls
and people installed chains and drove the 25 mph speed limit. Now the young
mostly in the 4x4's and the ignorant figure they can drive 70 mph because
they have a 4x4. Cause really bad crashes. And hurt some poor ******* that
is driving the 25 mph speed limit. So they now close the roads and then run
escorted caravans.

4x4 - that much farther to walk, once you get it stuck. And on
slick roads, the difference is the number of tires uselessly spinning.

I put a 50cal can in the truck 3 weeks ago, with a full set of tire
chains in it.

I grew up on Michigans Upper Penninsula..average snow fall... 212
inches. Its not new to me.

I once drove Whitehorse Pass with 10,000lbs of Nitromon boosters in the
back of the flatbed, in 12" of fresh snow on the road with visibility
less than 300 feet. That was a very long drive, from 9pm-6am.....

Driving to church Saturday evening, taking my lady friend after
the "Christmas Dinner" - it is the big fat flakes zooming at you which
make the trip so exhausting. Good thing I know the road, but still,
.... "lost the road! .... found it!" "Good to hear."

Im somewhat..somewhat familiar with driving in snow, sleet, slush etc
etc. Been doing it for most of 41 yrs. Shrug

It has its own charm. Sunday, back over the Pass.


tschus
pyotr
--
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!

Gunner Asch on Sat, 08 Jan 2011 01:00:37 -0800
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 18:47:17 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 11:28:12 -0800, Rich Grise
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Heinlein was a pompous ass. Of course you can have peace and Freedom
simultaneously - just choose not to make war.

Heinlein was one of the best writers of all time, and a damned good
philosopher, too.


Fighting for peace is like ****ing for virginity.

Not if there are only two courses of action, one being succumbing to
evil forever. I'd chose war over that any day.

Hear hear!!

Bravo! Live Free or die!!

I suppose Larry and all the other passives have heard Bertol
Brecht's poem which began "Suppose the gave a war, and nobody came?"
What they seem to miss is the next line "Why then, the war would come
to you."
--
pyotr filipivich
"What if they gave a war and nobody came?
Why then, the war would come to you."
Bertolt Brecht 1898-1956

On Sun, 09 Jan 2011 12:37:59 -0800, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

Gunner Asch on Sat, 08 Jan 2011 01:00:37 -0800
typed in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 18:47:17 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 03 Jan 2011 11:28:12 -0800, Rich Grise
wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

"You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having
both at once."
Robert A. Heinlein

Heinlein was a pompous ass. Of course you can have peace and Freedom
simultaneously - just choose not to make war.

Heinlein was one of the best writers of all time, and a damned good
philosopher, too.


Fighting for peace is like ****ing for virginity.

Not if there are only two courses of action, one being succumbing to
evil forever. I'd chose war over that any day.

Hear hear!!

Bravo! Live Free or die!!

I suppose Larry and all the other passives have heard Bertol
Brecht's poem which began "Suppose the gave a war, and nobody came?"
What they seem to miss is the next line "Why then, the war would come
to you."

Right you are, Pete. I'm just sitting here on my front porch,
strummin' my banjo, keepin' my powder dry, and waitin' for the
hoardes to descend.

--
You and I have a rendezvous with destiny. We will
preserve for our children this, the last best hope
of man on Earth, or we will sentence them to take
the last step into a thousand years of darkness.?
-- Ronald Reagan