On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus29388 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Gunner Asch wrote:
??
?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:07:57 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
??
?? ?On 2010-10-31, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 09:05:49 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ???On 2010-10-31, Wes ? wrote:
?? ???? Ignoramus9310 ? wrote:
?? ????
?? ?????My son's 9 year old friend, schoolmate and neighbor was banned from
?? ?????Wikipedia for life today, also.
?? ????
?? ???? Why?
?? ???
?? ???For vandalism, he was modifying an article about Lego. He did it a few
?? ???times and was banned. I laughed so hard yesterday.
?? ???
?? ???i
?? ??
?? ?? Was he posting incorrect information? Is so..and he was committing
?? ?? actual vandalism..he should be banned.
?? ??
?? ?? If he was posting actual provable data...you should start a campaign.
?? ?
?? ?No, he really was vandalizing. I just find it funny that a 9 year old
?? ?was banned for life from Wikipedia. He can, of course, open another account.
?? ?
?? ?i
??
?? He should be beaten to within a fraction of an inch of death, and
?? allowed to heal slowly without medical attention.
??
?? Somethings are simply "wrong"...and he found one of those.
??
?? Id not be laughing at the little gutter slime..but ****ing on him from a
?? great height for his actions.
??
?? He did a Very Bad Thing (cr) and should be taught that such behavior is
?? NOT permissible ever again.
??
?? If you laugh at/with him...before long he will be spray painting your
?? car/truck/house as "a joke".
?
?
? It's no surprise that Iggy thinks vandalism is funny.
?
?

Why is that of no surprise to you?


From the things you've posted in the past.


Then you may be surprised to find out that I made many controbutions
to Wikipedia, and started two successful articles (Enhanced Machine
Controller and Rotary Phase Converter).

That has nothing to do with laughing about a kid being a vandal, and
you know it.

I am laughing about a kid being banned for life.

i

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus29388 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Gunner Asch wrote:
??
?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:07:57 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
??
?? ?On 2010-10-31, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 09:05:49 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ???On 2010-10-31, Wes ? wrote:
?? ???? Ignoramus9310 ? wrote:
?? ????
?? ?????My son's 9 year old friend, schoolmate and neighbor was banned from
?? ?????Wikipedia for life today, also.
?? ????
?? ???? Why?
?? ???
?? ???For vandalism, he was modifying an article about Lego. He did it a few
?? ???times and was banned. I laughed so hard yesterday.
?? ???
?? ???i
?? ??
?? ?? Was he posting incorrect information? Is so..and he was committing
?? ?? actual vandalism..he should be banned.
?? ??
?? ?? If he was posting actual provable data...you should start a campaign.
?? ?
?? ?No, he really was vandalizing. I just find it funny that a 9 year old
?? ?was banned for life from Wikipedia. He can, of course, open another account.
?? ?
?? ?i
??
?? He should be beaten to within a fraction of an inch of death, and
?? allowed to heal slowly without medical attention.
??
?? Somethings are simply "wrong"...and he found one of those.
??
?? Id not be laughing at the little gutter slime..but ****ing on him from a
?? great height for his actions.
??
?? He did a Very Bad Thing (cr) and should be taught that such behavior is
?? NOT permissible ever again.
??
?? If you laugh at/with him...before long he will be spray painting your
?? car/truck/house as "a joke".
?
?
? It's no surprise that Iggy thinks vandalism is funny.
?
?

Why is that of no surprise to you?


From the things you've posted in the past.


Then you may be surprised to find out that I made many controbutions
to Wikipedia, and started two successful articles (Enhanced Machine
Controller and Rotary Phase Converter).

That has nothing to do with laughing about a kid being a vandal, and
you know it.

I am laughing about a kid being banned for life.


More proof. There is nothing funny about vandalism, at any age.
Maybe his next act will be to use a Molitov Cocktail on your home. Or
to beat your son with a baseball bat.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus29388 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Gunner Asch wrote:
??
?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:07:57 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
??
?? ?On 2010-10-31, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 09:05:49 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ???On 2010-10-31, Wes ? wrote:
?? ???? Ignoramus9310 ? wrote:
?? ????
?? ?????My son's 9 year old friend, schoolmate and neighbor was banned from
?? ?????Wikipedia for life today, also.
?? ????
?? ???? Why?
?? ???
?? ???For vandalism, he was modifying an article about Lego. He did it a few
?? ???times and was banned. I laughed so hard yesterday.
?? ???
?? ???i
?? ??
?? ?? Was he posting incorrect information? Is so..and he was committing
?? ?? actual vandalism..he should be banned.
?? ??
?? ?? If he was posting actual provable data...you should start a campaign.
?? ?
?? ?No, he really was vandalizing. I just find it funny that a 9 year old
?? ?was banned for life from Wikipedia. He can, of course, open another account.
?? ?
?? ?i
??
?? He should be beaten to within a fraction of an inch of death, and
?? allowed to heal slowly without medical attention.
??
?? Somethings are simply "wrong"...and he found one of those.
??
?? Id not be laughing at the little gutter slime..but ****ing on him from a
?? great height for his actions.
??
?? He did a Very Bad Thing (cr) and should be taught that such behavior is
?? NOT permissible ever again.
??
?? If you laugh at/with him...before long he will be spray painting your
?? car/truck/house as "a joke".
?
?
? It's no surprise that Iggy thinks vandalism is funny.
?
?

Why is that of no surprise to you?


From the things you've posted in the past.


Then you may be surprised to find out that I made many controbutions
to Wikipedia, and started two successful articles (Enhanced Machine
Controller and Rotary Phase Converter).

That has nothing to do with laughing about a kid being a vandal, and
you know it.

I am laughing about a kid being banned for life.


More proof. There is nothing funny about vandalism, at any age.
Maybe his next act will be to use a Molitov Cocktail on your home. Or
to beat your son with a baseball bat.

He is a usual kid and I expect it go grow into a slightly better than
average adult. He gets good grades at school and is far from stupid.

I would, say, not expect him to spend a significant time on welfare
once he grows up.

i

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

He is a usual kid and I expect it go grow into a slightly better than
average adult. He gets good grades at school and is far from stupid.

I would, say, not expect him to spend a significant time on welfare
once he grows up.


How magnanimous of you to share your ability to see the future.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 09:26:16 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus29388 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Gunner Asch wrote:
??
?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:07:57 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
??
?? ?On 2010-10-31, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 09:05:49 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ???On 2010-10-31, Wes ? wrote:
?? ???? Ignoramus9310 ? wrote:
?? ????
?? ?????My son's 9 year old friend, schoolmate and neighbor was banned from
?? ?????Wikipedia for life today, also.
?? ????
?? ???? Why?
?? ???
?? ???For vandalism, he was modifying an article about Lego. He did it a few
?? ???times and was banned. I laughed so hard yesterday.
?? ???
?? ???i
?? ??
?? ?? Was he posting incorrect information? Is so..and he was committing
?? ?? actual vandalism..he should be banned.
?? ??
?? ?? If he was posting actual provable data...you should start a campaign.
?? ?
?? ?No, he really was vandalizing. I just find it funny that a 9 year old
?? ?was banned for life from Wikipedia. He can, of course, open another account.
?? ?
?? ?i
??
?? He should be beaten to within a fraction of an inch of death, and
?? allowed to heal slowly without medical attention.
??
?? Somethings are simply "wrong"...and he found one of those.
??
?? Id not be laughing at the little gutter slime..but ****ing on him from a
?? great height for his actions.
??
?? He did a Very Bad Thing (cr) and should be taught that such behavior is
?? NOT permissible ever again.
??
?? If you laugh at/with him...before long he will be spray painting your
?? car/truck/house as "a joke".
?
?
? It's no surprise that Iggy thinks vandalism is funny.
?
?

Why is that of no surprise to you?


From the things you've posted in the past.


Then you may be surprised to find out that I made many controbutions
to Wikipedia, and started two successful articles (Enhanced Machine
Controller and Rotary Phase Converter).

i

And those have what to do with the topic ?

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 11:51:21 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Ignoramus31297 wrote:

He is a usual kid and I expect it go grow into a slightly better than
average adult. He gets good grades at school and is far from stupid.

I would, say, not expect him to spend a significant time on welfare
once he grows up.


How magnanimous of you to share your ability to see the future.

I understand that many crime family heads are very smart as well.

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 11:51:21 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Ignoramus31297 wrote:

He is a usual kid and I expect it go grow into a slightly better than
average adult. He gets good grades at school and is far from stupid.

I would, say, not expect him to spend a significant time on welfare
once he grows up.


How magnanimous of you to share your ability to see the future.

I understand that many crime family heads are very smart as well.



You can't be as stupid as a box of broken hammers and pull off high
tech crime.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Nov 1, 11:33*am, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:
Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus29388 wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Gunner Asch wrote:
??
?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 13:07:57 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
??
?? ?On 2010-10-31, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? On Sun, 31 Oct 2010 09:05:49 -0500, Ignoramus29388
?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ???On 2010-10-31, Wes ? wrote:
?? ???? Ignoramus9310 ? wrote:
?? ????
?? ?????My son's 9 year old friend, schoolmate and neighbor was banned from
?? ?????Wikipedia for life today, also.
?? ????
?? ???? Why?
?? ???
?? ???For vandalism, he was modifying an article about Lego. He did it a few
?? ???times and was banned. I laughed so hard yesterday.
?? ???
?? ???i
?? ??
?? ?? Was he posting incorrect information? *Is so..and he was committing
?? ?? actual vandalism..he should be banned.
?? ??
?? ?? If he was posting actual provable data...you should start a campaign.
?? ?
?? ?No, he really was vandalizing. I just find it funny that a 9 year old
?? ?was banned for life from Wikipedia. He can, of course, open another account.
?? ?
?? ?i
??
?? He should be beaten to within a fraction of an inch of death, and
?? allowed to heal slowly without medical attention.
??
?? Somethings are simply "wrong"...and he found one of those.
??
?? Id not be laughing at the little gutter slime..but ****ing on him from a
?? great height for his actions.
??
?? He did a Very Bad Thing (cr) and should be taught that such behavior is
?? NOT permissible ever again.
??
?? If you laugh at/with him...before long he will be spray painting your
?? car/truck/house as "a joke".
?
?
? * *It's no surprise that Iggy thinks vandalism is funny.
?
?

Why is that of no surprise to you?

* *From the things you've posted in the past.

Then you may be surprised to find out that I made many controbutions
to Wikipedia, and started two successful articles (Enhanced Machine
Controller and Rotary Phase Converter).

That has nothing to do with laughing about a kid being a vandal, and
you know it.

I am laughing about a kid being banned for life.

* *More proof. *There is nothing funny about vandalism, at any age.
Maybe his next act will be to use a Molitov Cocktail on your home. *Or
to beat your son with a baseball bat.

--

I think, and I could be wrong, but this is the way I read it, that
Iggy was commenting on the *irony* of WP thinking that "banning" a kid
is actually going to stop him from posting.

I most certainly agree that this sort of behavior is to be STRONGLY
discouraged. This can also be viewd as a cautionary tale to all those
who misguidedly rely on Wikipedia for accuracy.

By the way, acording to Wikipedia:
The name "Molotov cocktail" is derived from Vyacheslav Mikhailovich
Molotov, who was the Chairman of the Council of People's Commissars
(i.e. Soviet Prime Minister) and the People's Commissar for Foreign
Affairs of the Soviet Union during World War II.

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

Why is that of no surprise to you?


From the things you've posted in the past.

While Iggy leans left on a few things, call it his heritage, he is far from being a
vandal. Try to be civil.

Wes

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 14:59:39 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 11:51:21 -0400, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:


Ignoramus31297 wrote:

He is a usual kid and I expect it go grow into a slightly better than
average adult. He gets good grades at school and is far from stupid.

I would, say, not expect him to spend a significant time on welfare
once he grows up.


How magnanimous of you to share your ability to see the future.

I understand that many crime family heads are very smart as well.



You can't be as stupid as a box of broken hammers and pull off high
tech crime.


Bingo!

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

On Nov 1, 7:59*pm, Wes wrote:
"Michael A. Terrell" wrote:

Why is that of no surprise to you?

* From the things you've posted in the past.

While Iggy leans left on a few things, call it his heritage, he is far from being a
vandal. *Try to be civil.

Wes

What in the world do left & right have to do with vandalism? You guys
are a real hoot. The show just gets funnier by the minute.

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i


Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-10-31, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:

[ ... ]

If they don't ban you by blocking your IP address.

There is some thing to be said for dynamic IPs that a lot of
ISPs force down your throat. :-)


Wait till they roll out IP V6 and they won't need dynamic addresses.
There will be enough that they could assign everyone on earth one for
life.

They can -- but I'll bet that the ISPs will want to keep handing
out variable IPs via DHCP -- and charge extra for static ones.


BTW, my dynamic IP address has only changed a couple times in over
five years.

You either have very stable power, or a good UPS then. Most
people who I know with dynamic IPs wind up with it changing every time
they reboot -- the router/modem at least. :-)

So -- if someone has been blocked by IP, and has the typical
setup, all they need to do is to power cycle the router/modem/whatever
-- just what the trouble line droids tell you to do first.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-10-31, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:

[ ... ]

If they don't ban you by blocking your IP address.

There is some thing to be said for dynamic IPs that a lot of
ISPs force down your throat. :-)


Wait till they roll out IP V6 and they won't need dynamic addresses.
There will be enough that they could assign everyone on earth one for
life.

They can -- but I'll bet that the ISPs will want to keep handing
out variable IPs via DHCP -- and charge extra for static ones.


BTW, my dynamic IP address has only changed a couple times in over
five years.

You either have very stable power, or a good UPS then. Most
people who I know with dynamic IPs wind up with it changing every time
they reboot -- the router/modem at least. :-)


No UPS. Apparently the address changes when they reallocate spare
addresses in the region. Each time it has changed, I get a little more
bandwidth, too. At first I was getting just under 5 Mb/s and it is now
a little over 10 Mb/s.


So -- if someone has been blocked by IP, and has the typical
setup, all they need to do is to power cycle the router/modem/whatever
-- just what the trouble line droids tell you to do first.


That doesn't work here. I've had the power out for a week, and it
comes back with the same address. RR sets the IP address to the MAC
address of their modem, from what they've told me. Even exchanging the
modem for a new one doesn't change the IP address. The scan the label
into their system to replace the old unit. Take it home and hook it up,
to the same IP address.


I check it, because some web hosting services let you lock your FTP
login to your IP address.

http://www.ipchicken.com or http://www.dnsstuff.com will tell you
your IP address.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

Can you even buy carbon composition resistors any more? :-)


Yes:
http://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/Resistors/_/N-5g9n?Keyword=carbon+comp&FS=True

Mouser has them mixed with their carbon film types on that page.

O.K. Ohmite I see -- not Allen Bradley. And the illustration
for the IRC ones looks strange. I guess it is a cutaway to show the
carbon core under the Bakelite. At least they have the Mil-STD
designation -- like

RC07GF184J

though they list those as 1/4 Watt, I seem to remember the RC20GF ones
were 1/4 Watt, RC42GF were 2 Watt, and (I think) RC32GF were 1 Watt.
And the RC07GF ones were 1/8 Watt. Perhaps they are using a more
heat-resistant potting than Bakelite on these, so they can bake them
smaller. :-)

Hmm ... they are ROHS compliant -- but the spec says that the
weight of lead present must be less than 0.10% -- which might allow for
lead tinned leads anyway. (Or were they lead tinned anyway? I remember
spot welding of resistor leads to nickel ribbon in cordwood construction
(and that such spot welding did not work well with a lead which had been
lead/tin solder coated, so perhaps they were coated with something other
than solder.

I still remember sending a "planner" (glorified stock clerk,
there) hunting for a RC20GF007J -- and when he started to doubt it,
showing him a RC42GF007J (hand painted :-), because he could read the
color codes to match the part number -- but did not know how to
translate that into resistance. :-) He spent a lot of a graveyard shift
on that -- with nobody else around to straighten him out. :-)

Thanks,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

Can you even buy carbon composition resistors any more? :-)


Yes:
http://www.mouser.com/Passive-Components/Resistors/_/N-5g9n?Keyword=carbon+comp&FS=True

Mouser has them mixed with their carbon film types on that page.

O.K. Ohmite I see -- not Allen Bradley. And the illustration
for the IRC ones looks strange. I guess it is a cutaway to show the
carbon core under the Bakelite. At least they have the Mil-STD
designation -- like

RC07GF184J

though they list those as 1/4 Watt, I seem to remember the RC20GF ones
were 1/4 Watt, RC42GF were 2 Watt, and (I think) RC32GF were 1 Watt.
And the RC07GF ones were 1/8 Watt. Perhaps they are using a more
heat-resistant potting than Bakelite on these, so they can bake them
smaller. :-)

Hmm ... they are ROHS compliant -- but the spec says that the
weight of lead present must be less than 0.10% -- which might allow for
lead tinned leads anyway. (Or were they lead tinned anyway? I remember
spot welding of resistor leads to nickel ribbon in cordwood construction
(and that such spot welding did not work well with a lead which had been
lead/tin solder coated, so perhaps they were coated with something other
than solder.

I still remember sending a "planner" (glorified stock clerk,
there) hunting for a RC20GF007J -- and when he started to doubt it,
showing him a RC42GF007J (hand painted :-), because he could read the
color codes to match the part number -- but did not know how to
translate that into resistance. :-) He spent a lot of a graveyard shift
on that -- with nobody else around to straighten him out. :-)


http://www.dannyg.com/examples/res2/resistor.htm


I wrote versions for 3 and 4 digit SMD resistors.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Nov 2, 12:09*am, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:
Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
*or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
*caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a *VW

* *Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. *OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

In a strange turn of events, I find myself (in this case only) firmly
on the side of the wingers. what Iggy said is akin to saying, "all you
have to do to stay alive is to keep breathing." Some people are dealt
a bad hand. Some have the deck stacked against them. For some, keeping
the act together is simply not an option. There are also plenty of
people who have their acts firmly and solidly together and are living
in poverty.

Tell the mother of three whose husband died after a protracted illness
with no health insurance (the company dropped him when he got sick)
that working three jobs just to keep her children fed isn't enough.
Tell her she still needs to get her act together. Then go stand in
front of a mirror and look deep into your eyes and see if you can find
your soul.

Iggy is just plain wrong here. Gunner and Michael are (gulp) on the
right, err, I mean, correct side of this one.

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-11-01, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

"DoN. Nichols" wrote:

On 2010-10-31, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:

[ ... ]

If they don't ban you by blocking your IP address.

There is some thing to be said for dynamic IPs that a lot of
ISPs force down your throat. :-)


Wait till they roll out IP V6 and they won't need dynamic addresses.
There will be enough that they could assign everyone on earth one for
life.

They can -- but I'll bet that the ISPs will want to keep handing
out variable IPs via DHCP -- and charge extra for static ones.


BTW, my dynamic IP address has only changed a couple times in over
five years.

You either have very stable power, or a good UPS then. Most
people who I know with dynamic IPs wind up with it changing every time
they reboot -- the router/modem at least. :-)


No UPS. Apparently the address changes when they reallocate spare
addresses in the region. Each time it has changed, I get a little more
bandwidth, too. At first I was getting just under 5 Mb/s and it is now
a little over 10 Mb/s.


So -- if someone has been blocked by IP, and has the typical
setup, all they need to do is to power cycle the router/modem/whatever
-- just what the trouble line droids tell you to do first.


That doesn't work here. I've had the power out for a week, and it
comes back with the same address. RR sets the IP address to the MAC
address of their modem, from what they've told me. Even exchanging the
modem for a new one doesn't change the IP address. The scan the label
into their system to replace the old unit. Take it home and hook it up,
to the same IP address.


I check it, because some web hosting services let you lock your FTP
login to your IP address.

http://www.ipchicken.com or http://www.dnsstuff.com will tell you
your IP address.



ifconfig tells me my IP address.

i

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?

i

On Nov 2, 12:41*am, Ignoramus31297 ignoramus31...@NOSPAM.
31297.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:







Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
*or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
*caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a *VW

* *Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. *OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?

i

I do. Emphatically.

On Nov 1, 9:50*pm, Ignoramus31297 ignoramus31...@NOSPAM.
31297.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
*or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
*caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

In another thread, Don Foreman stated that, when he was a kid, his
family was poor. Are you prepared to tell him that this was due to his
father not keeping his act together? Seriously?

Iggy, for a smart guy, you sometimes come out with some pretty off-the-
wall statements.

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?



What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?

i

On Nov 2, 9:08*am, Ignoramus27744 ignoramus27...@NOSPAM.
27744.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:







Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
*or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
*caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a *VW

* *Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. *OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?

* *What disagreement? *Are you drinking again? *Or don't you understand
what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?

i- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

In a very theoretical world, maybe that's true. In the real world,
sometimes the choices are not so easy to make. You have to play the
hand you're dealt. A kid born to a junkie has the deck stacked against
him. Sometimes you can do well, sometimes not. And there most
certainly is a modicum of uncertainty. You can take a pretty good
guess, but you never really KNOW what's around the corner until you
get there.

"Ignoramus29388" wrote in message
...
On 2010-10-31, Mike Henry wrote:

"Ignoramus9310" wrote in message
...
On 2010-10-30, Wes wrote:

Once upon a time I asked that same question on Practical Machinist.
Damn
that
moderator/board op hates Chinese stuff with a passion. I never got an
answer.


The moderator also forbids mentioning cnczone.

With good reason, IMHO. The two forums serve different groups.



How is the CNC forum on practical machinist serving a different gruop
than CNCZone?

i

As I see it, one is oriented toward professional machinists and the other
toward hobbyists.

Ignoramus27744 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Ignoramus31297 wrote:
??
?? On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?? ?
?? ? Gunner Asch wrote:
?? ??
?? ?? On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
?? ?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ?? ?On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? ?? "Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
?? ?? ?? or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
?? ?? ?? caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
?? ?? ?? isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
?? ?? ?? Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
?? ?? ?? results." - John Tucci,
?? ?? ?
?? ?? ?It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
?? ?? ?States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
?? ?? ?poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.
?? ?? ?
?? ?? ?i
?? ??
?? ?? Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW
?? ?
?? ?
?? ? Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
?? ? come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.
??
?? So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?
?
?
?
? What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
? what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?


Sigh. Poverty has many causes, and obesity can be caused by medical
problems, or according to recent research, it may have a genetic cause
for some people.


If you lost your job and couldn't find any work, how is that a 'life
choice'? You have an accident and can't work isn't a choice. Your
health fails, and it isn't a choice. There are hundreds, or even
thousands of things that can put you into poverty. If you are forced
into poverty you can't afford good food, so you have to live on the
cheapest you can buy, which are full of starches & sugars.

Engineers with six figure incomes have ended up homeless when their
job market changes. How is that a 'life choice'?

Once again, I say you have no clue.


--
Politicians should only get paid if the budget is balanced, and there is
enough left over to pay them.

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 08:08:07 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?



What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?

i

In the vast majority of instances....its quite true.

The not insignificant minority take years to get back on the upward
climb.

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus27744 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?
? Ignoramus31297 wrote:
??
?? On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell ? wrote:
?? ?
?? ? Gunner Asch wrote:
?? ??
?? ?? On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
?? ?? ? wrote:
?? ??
?? ?? ?On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch ? wrote:
?? ?? ?? "Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
?? ?? ?? or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
?? ?? ?? caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
?? ?? ?? isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
?? ?? ?? Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
?? ?? ?? results." - John Tucci,
?? ?? ?
?? ?? ?It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
?? ?? ?States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
?? ?? ?poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.
?? ?? ?
?? ?? ?i
?? ??
?? ?? Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW
?? ?
?? ?
?? ? Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
?? ? come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.
??
?? So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?
?
?
?
? What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
? what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?


Sigh. Poverty has many causes, and obesity can be caused by medical
problems, or according to recent research, it may have a genetic cause
for some people.


If you lost your job and couldn't find any work, how is that a 'life
choice'? You have an accident and can't work isn't a choice. Your
health fails, and it isn't a choice. There are hundreds, or even
thousands of things that can put you into poverty. If you are forced
into poverty you can't afford good food, so you have to live on the
cheapest you can buy, which are full of starches & sugars.

Engineers with six figure incomes have ended up homeless when their
job market changes. How is that a 'life choice'?

Once again, I say you have no clue.



So, you said a lot of blah blah blah, but you did not say whether you
agree or disagree with that sentence from Gunner's signature.

i

On 2010-11-02, rangerssuck wrote:
On Nov 1, 9:50?pm, Ignoramus31297 ignoramus31...@NOSPAM.
31297.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
?or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
?caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

In another thread, Don Foreman stated that, when he was a kid, his
family was poor. Are you prepared to tell him that this was due to his
father not keeping his act together? Seriously?

Very possibly it was the case, how would I know?

Iggy, for a smart guy, you sometimes come out with some pretty off-the-
wall statements.

Let's go back to what started it, which was a quote in Gunner's
signature which said that "poverty is caused by life choices".

Much brouhaha ensued, with both Gunner essentially disagreeing with
his own signature, and Mike Terrell saying essentially the same thing,
except not quite openly.

My own opinion, which did not really change from this discussion, is
that the sentence is a typical mindless Republican simplification of
reality, but it is not completely senseless. Absent mental or physical
illness, one can stay out of poverty very easily by keeping their act
together, such as earning $8-10 per hour and working 10 hours a day,
showing up at work on time every day and actually studying at
school. But people can get sick and so, poverty is not always the
fault of the person. Usually it is, however.

Ergo, Gunner makes life choices, such as not wanting a 9-5 job, and so
he is in poverty. He is not forced into poverty, this is just the way
he wants to live, which is of course a free choice that I respect.

i

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 08:08:07 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?



What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?

i

In the vast majority of instances....its quite true.

The not insignificant minority take years to get back on the upward
climb.

I would not call it vast majority, and without the word vast I would
disagree.

i

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 12:42:59 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 08:08:07 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Ignoramus31297 wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Gunner Asch wrote:

On Mon, 01 Nov 2010 20:50:28 -0500, Ignoramus31297
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

Tell that to someone hit by a stoner in a VW


Iggy just doesn't get it. Not everyone can fall into a cesspool and
come out with a gold brick. OTOH, 'Luck' is a fickle bitch.

So, then, you disagree with Gunner's signature above?



What disagreement? Are you drinking again? Or don't you understand
what 'A change of luck' is?

Read the sentence from Gunner that I quoted:

``Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results.''

Do you agree, or disagree, with that sentence?

i

In the vast majority of instances....its quite true.

The not insignificant minority take years to get back on the upward
climb.

I would not call it vast majority, and without the word vast I would
disagree.

i
Again your opinion is noted.

Shrug

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 12:40:00 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

But people can get sick and so, poverty is not always the
fault of the person. Usually it is, however.

Ergo, Gunner makes life choices, such as not wanting a 9-5 job, and so
he is in poverty. He is not forced into poverty, this is just the way
he wants to live, which is of course a free choice that I respect.

i

So you now suddenly agree with the sig. Fascinating.

As for my poverty...it should be noted that I was doing well enough
Before the Great Depression Part 2 occurred.

After it started..Ive lost...at minimum 16 clients..who are now empty
buildings. Their work is no more. Period. Finito. EnditEnditEndit.

2 more simply took their work to China/Far East/India

Another 12 or so, are no longer working 3 shifts a day, or even two..or
even a full 40 hours a week.

Hence my client base has declined significantly...really significantly.

Also..I am not the only such service guy suddenly short on work. There
are literally hundreds of other service guys in my industry who have
also lost clients..so they are competing with each other for the
remaining clients.

If things remain the same until the 1st of the year..I will have grossed
about $17k.

Out of this, I will have paid for the fuel for driving 45,000 miles and
the maintainence.

Plus the none changing things like elecricity, gas, water and so forth.

I made at least 2x-3x..gross before the Democrats sent the nation into
the toilet, based on my records over the past 14 yrs doing this.

Yes..I should have gotten a college degree a gazillion years ago. But I
was....a bit...driven in some respects. Shrug

But I will keep struggling along.

Btw...I get no state aid but the ex does get food stamps. I cover all of
her bills plus my own and of course..I was sued for about $187,000 worth
of medical bills that I unexpectedly ran up some 20 months ago..down
from the original $227,894.35
And payments for that come out of the $17k gross as well.

Whats poverty level for 2 people these days?

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

On Nov 2, 2:22*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:

Gunner was hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt before Obama took
office.

Gunner, by his own admission, has not paid income or employment taxes
in many years.

Gunner likes to blame Democrats for his problems.

Gunner is full of ****.

On Nov 2, 1:40*pm, Ignoramus27744 ignoramus27...@NOSPAM.
27744.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, rangerssuck wrote:





On Nov 1, 9:50?pm, Ignoramus31297 ignoramus31...@NOSPAM.
31297.invalid wrote:
On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
?or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
?caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,

It is also often caused by medical or mental problems. In the United
States, absent the above two problems, it is very easy not to be in
poverty. All one needs is to keep his act together.

i

In another thread, Don Foreman stated that, when he was a kid, his
family was poor. Are you prepared to tell him that this was due to his
father not keeping his act together? Seriously?

Very possibly it was the case, how would I know?

You would have to ask him.


Iggy, for a smart guy, you sometimes come out with some pretty off-the-
wall statements.

Let's go back to what started it, which was a quote in Gunner's
signature which said that "poverty is caused by life choices".

Gunner, as you well know, signs his mail with the most inflamatory
crap he can dig up. In this one respoect alone, Gunner is a success.
He manages to **** off a great number of people.


Much brouhaha ensued, with both Gunner essentially disagreeing with
his own signature, and Mike Terrell saying essentially the same thing,
except not quite openly.

That Gunner disagrees with himself is no surprise at all. That Mike
Terrell agrees with Gunner (while Gunner is agreeing with himself) is
also no surprise. The big (HUGE) surprise to me, anyway, is that I
agree with both of them in their disagreement with Gunner's signature.
I swear the end of days must be near G


My own opinion, which did not really change from this discussion, is
that the sentence is a typical mindless Republican simplification of
reality, but it is not completely senseless. Absent mental or physical
illness, one can stay out of poverty very easily by keeping their act
together, such as earning $8-10 per hour and working 10 hours a day,
showing up at work on time every day and actually studying at
school. But people can get sick and so, poverty is not always the
fault of the person. Usually it is, however.

A studio apartment in my area rents for about $900 per month,
including heat and water, but not electricity. A cashier at the
supermarket makes $7.50 per hour, before taxes. The supermarket will
NOT let anyone work over 40 hours per week because then they are
required by law to pay overtime at a rate of 1.5x. I'm not entirely
sure that the supermarket will even let anyone work more than 30 hours
per week, because that would entitle them to full-time employee
benefits. Unemplyment around here is high. I don't know how high -
probably not on a scale with, say, Nevada or California, but high
enough that there simply are not enough jobs to go around for everyone
to have even one, let alone multiple jobs.

The nearest community college is about an hour's bus ride away. About
20 minutes by car, but a low-wage worker is NOT going to afford a car
around here. Not with $1200 per year insurance premiums. There is a
waiting list to get into the college. Our new, Republican governor has
just slashed the budget for community and state colleges, along with
the budgets for public schools, so there is little hope that this part
of the equation will change anytime soon.

Throw a couple of kids into the equation, and, well, you have a recipe
for a very, very difficult life, with little-to-no chance of success.

Iggy, I donate regularly to the local food bank because there are
people who need it a whole lot more than I do. I also figure that I
ought to give while I can, before a nasty twist of fate puts me on the
other end of the deal.

Of course a certain amount of poverty is caused by life choices. But a
certain and, unfortunately, growing amount of it is due to
circumstance. I know some of these people personally. Some of them
continue to make bad decisions, some are comfortable living on
welfare, and some are working their tails off to dig out of the hole.
But the hole is deep, and the digging is hard, and it's going to take
a long, long time and a heap of good fortune.

One woman I know worked two full-time jobs as a nurse's aid while she
went to nursing school. While she was in school, there was a rash of
hospital closings in New Jersey. There are simply no nursing jobs
available. Did this woman make a bad life choice or did she fall
victim to the ****ty business practices of the health care industry?
When she started school, there were plenty of job openings. Now there
are none. There is still a waiting list to get into nursing school.
Are all those students making bad choices?

Life is hard. Harder for some than for others. But when you make
blanket statements like the one we're talking about, you may as well
blame a hungry kid for choosing to be born. Some things are not
reasonably under our control.


Ergo, Gunner makes life choices, such as not wanting a 9-5 job, and so
he is in poverty. He is not forced into poverty, this is just the way
he wants to live, which is of course a free choice that I respect.

I don't disagree with you on that, except to the extent that Gunner
has stolen from others by cheating on his taxes, and makes no attempt
to repay his debts. It is also irksome (but again, Gunner is in the
'irk' business) that Gunner so readily bites the hand that feeds him.
But Gunner also gives rise to a new twist on the old saw that there
are no atheists in foxholes: There are no wingers on welfare. I know
what he says, but he obviously has a hard time agreeing with even
himself. I can understand how hard it must be for him to admit to
himself, let alone in public, that his choices have led him to this
predicament, and that it is the liberals who have kept him alive
through the years.

i
RS

And just one more point: We're not just talking about the
stereotypical ghetto trash people. Over the past 15 years, I have seen
my hardware development work dry up as some customers failed and
others (my two biggest customers) have outsourced to Korea. There are
plenty of out-of-work engineers around here. Fortunately, I have made
enough good choices to outweigh my bad ones, and, so far, my business
is still pretty comfortably afloat. But that could change without much
warning.

I just now got off the phone with a sales person from a software
development company in India. They work for $12 per hour, fully
loaded.

Don't think for a second that your job is perfectly safe.

Just sayin'

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 12:40:00 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

But people can get sick and so, poverty is not always the
fault of the person. Usually it is, however.

Ergo, Gunner makes life choices, such as not wanting a 9-5 job, and so
he is in poverty. He is not forced into poverty, this is just the way
he wants to live, which is of course a free choice that I respect.

i

So you now suddenly agree with the sig. Fascinating.

Mostly, with the medical exception.

i

On Nov 2, 1:21*pm, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:

* *Engineers with six figure incomes have ended up homeless when their
job market changes. *How is that a 'life choice'?


Not disagreeing with most of what you say, BUT................

Anyone with a six figure income ought to have enough sense to save a
significant portion of that income. And also ought to have enough
sense to see that the job market is changing and keep learning so one
has skills that are what the market wants. So to me an engineer that
has a six figure income and ends up homeless when their job market
changes has made a poor life choice.

Dan

On 2010-11-02, wrote:
On Nov 2, 1:21?pm, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote:

? ?Engineers with six figure incomes have ended up homeless when their
job market changes. ?How is that a 'life choice'?


Not disagreeing with most of what you say, BUT................

Anyone with a six figure income ought to have enough sense to save a
significant portion of that income. And also ought to have enough
sense to see that the job market is changing and keep learning so one
has skills that are what the market wants. So to me an engineer that
has a six figure income and ends up homeless when their job market
changes has made a poor life choice.

Dan, you have nailed it. Everyone knows that anyone can lose a
job. That's why people should save, instead of buying the biggest
house that the dumbest bank would let them buy.

i

On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 14:39:40 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

On 2010-11-02, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 02 Nov 2010 12:40:00 -0500, Ignoramus27744
wrote:

But people can get sick and so, poverty is not always the
fault of the person. Usually it is, however.

Ergo, Gunner makes life choices, such as not wanting a 9-5 job, and so
he is in poverty. He is not forced into poverty, this is just the way
he wants to live, which is of course a free choice that I respect.

i

So you now suddenly agree with the sig. Fascinating.

Mostly, with the medical exception.

i

Which medical exception?

Gunner

"Confiscating wealth from those who have earned it, inherited it,
or got lucky is never going to help 'the poor.' Poverty isn't
caused by some people having more money than others, just as obesity
isn't caused by McDonald's serving super-sized orders of French fries
Poverty, like obesity, is caused by the life choices that dictate
results." - John Tucci,