On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 15:12:30 -0500, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 14:08:39 -0500, Ignoramus1469
wrote:

I am looking at this piece of pipe:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/09...tions-underway

and the clean end suggests to me that the entire weld failed. What do
our resident pipe weldors say? Steve? Private?
============
While in one sense the disaster may indeed be the result of
a bad weld [no inspection? no x-ray?], in the larger sense,
the disaster was the easily foreseen outcome of the complete
failure to criminally prosecute the accountable directors,
officers, cadre management, and mid level supervisors for
reckless endangerment and/or negligent homicide for prior
disasters.

Fines and jury awards against the legal fiction of "the
corporation" have little or no impact on the
behaviors/actions of the people that run the corporations,
but significant individual/personal fines and especially
prison time, even short 30-90 day jail sentences, make a
deep and lasting impression and reinforce the concept that
actions [and omissions] have consequences. Huge salaries and
bonuses should come complete with large amounts of [strict]
accountability.


-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).


It is scary in the big city, they don't care.

Back when I was a trouble shooter for pools I walked in the backyard
of a customer and gas smell was so bad I was afraid the heater for the
pool might have one of those old pilot lights and quickly hunted down
the leak to the main line to the house and left. As soon as I got to
the street a gas truck was rolling by, I flagged the dude down and
told him and he said he couldn't do a thing about it until the
customer called them. The customer was out of town, oh well.

Just before I left Vegas they had a run away railroad car full of
chlorine that went through the whole town and maybe 200 yards from my
kid's school. They didn't inform anyone, probably wouldn't have said a
word if someone didn't drop the ball to the press. And they told
everyone oh, it's no big deal chlorine dissipates fast. Yeah, right!
Should bust a gallon bottle in their office and see the whole building
get evacuated ASAP with people's lungs filling up with liquid. 30,000
gallons in your neighborhood, no problem.

It was no big deal about pepcon either and it burned for days and you
couldn't get away from the smell.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJVOUgCm5Jk

Or the nuke site down wind mormons or leaking ground water off the
site , no problem. Or the ammonium nitrate from pepcon in Calf. crops,
NP.

When ya here " Nothing to worry about", worry.

SW

"Sunworshipper" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 15:12:30 -0500, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 14:08:39 -0500, Ignoramus1469
wrote:

I am looking at this piece of pipe:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/09...tions-underway

and the clean end suggests to me that the entire weld failed. What do
our resident pipe weldors say? Steve? Private?
============
While in one sense the disaster may indeed be the result of
a bad weld [no inspection? no x-ray?], in the larger sense,
the disaster was the easily foreseen outcome of the complete
failure to criminally prosecute the accountable directors,
officers, cadre management, and mid level supervisors for
reckless endangerment and/or negligent homicide for prior
disasters.

Fines and jury awards against the legal fiction of "the
corporation" have little or no impact on the
behaviors/actions of the people that run the corporations,
but significant individual/personal fines and especially
prison time, even short 30-90 day jail sentences, make a
deep and lasting impression and reinforce the concept that
actions [and omissions] have consequences. Huge salaries and
bonuses should come complete with large amounts of [strict]
accountability.


-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).


It is scary in the big city, they don't care.

Back when I was a trouble shooter for pools I walked in the backyard
of a customer and gas smell was so bad I was afraid the heater for the
pool might have one of those old pilot lights and quickly hunted down
the leak to the main line to the house and left. As soon as I got to
the street a gas truck was rolling by, I flagged the dude down and
told him and he said he couldn't do a thing about it until the
customer called them. The customer was out of town, oh well.

Just before I left Vegas they had a run away railroad car full of
chlorine that went through the whole town and maybe 200 yards from my
kid's school. They didn't inform anyone, probably wouldn't have said a
word if someone didn't drop the ball to the press. And they told
everyone oh, it's no big deal chlorine dissipates fast. Yeah, right!
Should bust a gallon bottle in their office and see the whole building
get evacuated ASAP with people's lungs filling up with liquid. 30,000
gallons in your neighborhood, no problem.

It was no big deal about pepcon either and it burned for days and you
couldn't get away from the smell.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJVOUgCm5Jk

Or the nuke site down wind mormons or leaking ground water off the
site , no problem. Or the ammonium nitrate from pepcon in Calf. crops,
NP.

When ya here " Nothing to worry about", worry.

SW

I was there for the Pepcon blast and the 90 ton chlorine spill. The
chlorine spill scared me the most. But just as the US marching military
personnel so close to nuclear detonations that they could see impressions of
their retinas in their brain during the flash, the good old government said,
"We would never EVER put our troops in harm's way. This is PERFECTLY safe!"

And then thousands died from twenty or thirty forms of extremely rare
cancers APIECE.

My dad used to take me down to the edge of the desert in our tiny little
town to see the big ball of fire and mushroom from the then above ground
detonations. Glad we didn't suffer from The Downwinder's Syndrome. Glad
also that I never ever spent any meaningful time up at the Test Site, where
radiation badges were mandatory, but never read.

Steve

On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 19:03:05 -0700, "Steve B"
wrote:


"Sunworshipper" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 15:12:30 -0500, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Sat, 11 Sep 2010 14:08:39 -0500, Ignoramus1469
wrote:

I am looking at this piece of pipe:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/2010/09...tions-underway

and the clean end suggests to me that the entire weld failed. What do
our resident pipe weldors say? Steve? Private?
============
While in one sense the disaster may indeed be the result of
a bad weld [no inspection? no x-ray?], in the larger sense,
the disaster was the easily foreseen outcome of the complete
failure to criminally prosecute the accountable directors,
officers, cadre management, and mid level supervisors for
reckless endangerment and/or negligent homicide for prior
disasters.

Fines and jury awards against the legal fiction of "the
corporation" have little or no impact on the
behaviors/actions of the people that run the corporations,
but significant individual/personal fines and especially
prison time, even short 30-90 day jail sentences, make a
deep and lasting impression and reinforce the concept that
actions [and omissions] have consequences. Huge salaries and
bonuses should come complete with large amounts of [strict]
accountability.


-- Unka George (George McDuffee)
..............................
The past is a foreign country;
they do things differently there.
L. P. Hartley (1895-1972), British author.
The Go-Between, Prologue (1953).


It is scary in the big city, they don't care.

Back when I was a trouble shooter for pools I walked in the backyard
of a customer and gas smell was so bad I was afraid the heater for the
pool might have one of those old pilot lights and quickly hunted down
the leak to the main line to the house and left. As soon as I got to
the street a gas truck was rolling by, I flagged the dude down and
told him and he said he couldn't do a thing about it until the
customer called them. The customer was out of town, oh well.

Just before I left Vegas they had a run away railroad car full of
chlorine that went through the whole town and maybe 200 yards from my
kid's school. They didn't inform anyone, probably wouldn't have said a
word if someone didn't drop the ball to the press. And they told
everyone oh, it's no big deal chlorine dissipates fast. Yeah, right!
Should bust a gallon bottle in their office and see the whole building
get evacuated ASAP with people's lungs filling up with liquid. 30,000
gallons in your neighborhood, no problem.

It was no big deal about pepcon either and it burned for days and you
couldn't get away from the smell.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJVOUgCm5Jk

Or the nuke site down wind mormons or leaking ground water off the
site , no problem. Or the ammonium nitrate from pepcon in Calf. crops,
NP.

When ya here " Nothing to worry about", worry.

SW

I was there for the Pepcon blast and the 90 ton chlorine spill. The
chlorine spill scared me the most. But just as the US marching military
personnel so close to nuclear detonations that they could see impressions of
their retinas in their brain during the flash, the good old government said,
"We would never EVER put our troops in harm's way. This is PERFECTLY safe!"

And then thousands died from twenty or thirty forms of extremely rare
cancers APIECE.

My dad used to take me down to the edge of the desert in our tiny little
town to see the big ball of fire and mushroom from the then above ground
detonations. Glad we didn't suffer from The Downwinder's Syndrome. Glad
also that I never ever spent any meaningful time up at the Test Site, where
radiation badges were mandatory, but never read.

Steve



Timet...? I was gonna mention that one, but couldn't recall the name
of that nasty place. What was it, titanium, yeap they had some lu lu
spills of chlorine. I'm really surprised they never had one of those
disasters like in India or where ever that was.

One time they were willing to let solar companies do tests at the test
site. Had to have a 1/4 million dollar environmental study to see if a
couple of post holes would hurt the glowing multi-eyed desert tortoise
first though. Go figure.

My favorite was the chlorine levels in the tap water. Being in the
water business I was well aware of the smell of chlorine and filling
buckets with a garden sprayer for more than a decade. The levels where
getting down right toxic as the lake shrank and they kept moving the
water supply to deeper water and farther away from the cesspool, all
the while listening to the reassurances of nothing's wrong with the
water crap.

Never hear a word about how the rich fake lake is nothing but sewage
and chemical plant drainage either. I figured they needed a settling
tank before they dumped it into the water supply and then came up with
this grand idea to make a ton of money on top of it all.

I saw a good one up here. Lots of boats with people fishing in the Fox
river, EEE! That river couldn't possibly be even remotely clean
already. I must admit that Green Bay and De Pere doesn't reek and make
your eyes water anymore. I see even on google the bay looks bluish
green, shocker. I remember banking out over the bay and laughing at
why they didn't change the name to Brown Bay back in the early 70's.

All this incompetence and corruption reminds me of a time when I was
in Hell A and bigger than normal stop signs where blurry from the smog
only 40 feet away. I was outside of a restaurant smoking a cigarette
and every woman that walked out gave me a dirty look like I was the
one making their home unhealthy. fakey chicks too, they ALL wear black
dresses just cause everybody should, couldn't even be original and
wear something with color.

SW

BTW, one would think they would be really on top of underground gas
lines in of all places, San Francisco !

"Sunworshipper" wrote

Timet...? I was gonna mention that one, but couldn't recall the name
of that nasty place. What was it, titanium, yeap they had some lu lu
spills of chlorine. I'm really surprised they never had one of those
disasters like in India or where ever that was.

Timet was notorious locally for polluting the air. Sorry to poke holes in
your balloon, but chlorine was not used much in the process. What happened
a lot were magnesium fires, and blinding but harmless white clouds that
would cover Henderson. Basic Metals Inc. BMI, was first created, and the
plants were built to produce magnesium for metal and for incendiary bombs,
but when they produced it so fast that they had enough on hand for five to
eight years after the war ended, they shut down the plants in 1947. In 1953,
the city was incorporated, as private industry was buying the sites.

Timet, through its history did have fires, flareups, and loss of gases, but
never anything that threatened the town, or was capable of producing
explosions. There were days at Townsite Elementary, in the center of town
when we were kept inside because visibility was 100'. They basically melted
down titanium ore and returned titanium items in an electric crucible.
Nothing fancy and exotic like the Kerr McGee next door that made ammonium
perchlorate solid rocket fuel, or Stauffer chemical that made thousands of
rail cars of liquid chlorine. There was another plant on that row that
escapes me at the moment. State Stove made hot water heaters. My Dad
retired out of Stauffer. Like all the other dads of my friends, they
retired, and were dead within five years of cancers of one type or another.

Lots of smoke, but not a lot of fire.

Steve