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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Shamefully simple electricital question
the thing is probably not a transformer, it probably a current limiting
device - I've made such a thing with a low wattage bulb off the high side of 110 - a 1 watt bulb will limit current to 10 ma but will give a pesky shock - the commercial units limit current perhaps in other ways to be super safe. your choice how to proceed - when you "took it apart" - what did you find inside? "Steve B" wrote in message ... Today, I found out my garden dog shocker wasn't working after coming home and finding my new rescue dog full of manure, compost and mud. She got into the fresh flower bed. The wire shocker there apparently got wet and fried. I took it apart, let it dry for hours, put it back together, and touched the terminals with no shock. Outside of case says: 110v. AC in, .27amp, 60 hertz, 10 watts. These Fi-Shocks are about $25 new. Where would I get a transformer like this? When I looked at the transformer, it's marked 311-158 R2 10 2000. How do I read this to buy another cheapie, and where? Steve |
#2
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Shamefully simple electricital question
Today, I found out my garden dog shocker wasn't working after coming home
and finding my new rescue dog full of manure, compost and mud. She got into the fresh flower bed. The wire shocker there apparently got wet and fried. I took it apart, let it dry for hours, put it back together, and touched the terminals with no shock. Outside of case says: 110v. AC in, .27amp, 60 hertz, 10 watts. These Fi-Shocks are about $25 new. Where would I get a transformer like this? When I looked at the transformer, it's marked 311-158 R2 10 2000. How do I read this to buy another cheapie, and where? Steve |
#3
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Shamefully simple electricital question
On Sun, 2 May 2010 21:32:27 -0700, the renowned "Steve B"
wrote: Today, I found out my garden dog shocker wasn't working after coming home and finding my new rescue dog full of manure, compost and mud. She got into the fresh flower bed. The wire shocker there apparently got wet and fried. I took it apart, let it dry for hours, put it back together, and touched the terminals with no shock. Outside of case says: 110v. AC in, .27amp, 60 hertz, 10 watts. These Fi-Shocks are about $25 new. Where would I get a transformer like this? When I looked at the transformer, it's marked 311-158 R2 10 2000. The first part is probably the part number, the 10 2000 the date it was made. How do I read this to buy another cheapie, and where? Steve These guys sell what appears to be it for $30!! http://www.pasturefence.com/fishockparts.html You're probably better off buying a new on for the $25 or whatever. http://www.amazon.com/Flock-Shock-SS.../dp/B001JP7G2A 120:800VAC transformers are not common and safety is an issue. Best regards, Spehro Pefhany -- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com |
#4
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Shamefully simple electricital question
On Mon, 03 May 2010 05:36:09 -0400, Spehro Pefhany
wrote: On Sun, 2 May 2010 21:32:27 -0700, the renowned "Steve B" wrote: Today, I found out my garden dog shocker wasn't working after coming home and finding my new rescue dog full of manure, compost and mud. She got into the fresh flower bed. The wire shocker there apparently got wet and fried. I took it apart, let it dry for hours, put it back together, and touched the terminals with no shock. Outside of case says: 110v. AC in, .27amp, 60 hertz, 10 watts. These Fi-Shocks are about $25 new. Where would I get a transformer like this? When I looked at the transformer, it's marked 311-158 R2 10 2000. The first part is probably the part number, the 10 2000 the date it was made. How do I read this to buy another cheapie, and where? Steve These guys sell what appears to be it for $30!! http://www.pasturefence.com/fishockparts.html You're probably better off buying a new on for the $25 or whatever. http://www.amazon.com/Flock-Shock-SS.../dp/B001JP7G2A 120:800VAC transformers are not common and safety is an issue. p.s. Just to expand on this safety thing a bit.. I have not looked inside the continuous kind of electric fence energizer, but I'd expect to find a special transformer designed to have a lot of leakage inductance as well as proper mains isolation and step-up ratio (and not much else). The consequence of that is that the short-circuit current would be limited to a relatively safe value (relatively safe for animals and relatively safe for the transformer's health). This is not a regular transformer, I suspect. Best regards, Spehro Pefhany -- "it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com |
#5
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Shamefully simple electricital question
Steve B wrote:
Today, I found out my garden dog shocker wasn't working after coming home and finding my new rescue dog full of manure, compost and mud. She got into the fresh flower bed. The wire shocker there apparently got wet and fried. I took it apart, let it dry for hours, put it back together, and touched the terminals with no shock. Outside of case says: 110v. AC in, .27amp, 60 hertz, 10 watts. These Fi-Shocks are about $25 new. Where would I get a transformer like this? When I looked at the transformer, it's marked 311-158 R2 10 2000. How do I read this to buy another cheapie, and where? Not enough info. I'd see if you couldn't find a decent equivalent at a farm store, one that'll last for a while. Like Spehro said, these are specialty items, not bog-common transformers. We just kennel our dogs up when we're not around -- they don't seem to mind, as long as we make sure they know they're not in trouble going in, and that we love them when we get back and take them out (and it's never for more than half a day). -- Tim Wescott Control system and signal processing consulting www.wescottdesign.com |
#6
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Shamefully simple electricital question
"Bill Noble" wrote in message ... the thing is probably not a transformer, it probably a current limiting device - I've made such a thing with a low wattage bulb off the high side of 110 - a 1 watt bulb will limit current to 10 ma but will give a pesky shock - the commercial units limit current perhaps in other ways to be super safe. your choice how to proceed - when you "took it apart" - what did you find inside? Two wires to a device that looked like a 2" x 3" metal rectangle with a hole in the middle. In the hole are two 1.25" diameter coils that look like they are wound of rough brown paper, then a clear sealant. Between the coils are two little boxes the size of your fingernail, but are sealed in with clear goop. Two wires in, two wires out. Steve visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com watch for the book A fool shows his annoyance at once, but a prudent man overlooks an insult. |
#7
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Shamefully simple electricital question
I've looked inside a number of fence chargers and not one of them was just a transformer. They all had some sort of timed interruption, probably to give an inductive kick (I never actually analyzed a circuit). Bob |
#8
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Shamefully simple electricital question
On Mon, 03 May 2010 13:48:22 -0400, Bob Engelhardt
wrote: I've looked inside a number of fence chargers and not one of them was just a transformer. They all had some sort of timed interruption, probably to give an inductive kick (I never actually analyzed a circuit). Bob That describes the ones I've seen-- and the one I built as a kid using an automotive ignition coil. But this type specifically says it's continuous (and sinusoidal output, see below). Assuming it's the SS-600:- This Fi-Shock™ Poultry Charger for electric fences is electric powered and features continuous AC output. Effective for adult chickens and other large birds, it has a 1 mile range under ideal conditions and is covered by a 1 year limited warranty. Voltage: Input Voltage: 110-120 VAC, 60 Hz, .027 A, 10 W Output Voltage: 800 VAC +/- 20% open circuit voltage The manual further says it's 8mA +/-2mA short-circuit current. http://www.fishock.com/resource/uplo...structions.pdf Here is an intermittent version that just cycles the power to the transformer using a 555 timer and a triac. It's publically there in all the gory detail because it allegedly killed a 4-year-old boy. http://www.cpsc.gov/library/foia/foi...e/fidoshc3.pdf The transformer is listed as made by the manufacturer (Fi-Shock). Not surprising, since it would be much of the cost. Note the presence of a magnetic shunt to increase the leakage inductance (page 13). |
#9
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Shamefully simple electricital question
On Mon, 03 May 2010 13:48:22 -0400, Bob Engelhardt
wrote: I've looked inside a number of fence chargers and not one of them was just a transformer. They all had some sort of timed interruption, probably to give an inductive kick (I never actually analyzed a circuit). Bob Most fence chargers are not continuious output..but timed cycles. .5 seconds on, .5 seconds off...etc etc. This helps keep smaller critters from muscular contraction keeping the little critter "stuck" to the fence and suffocating when their lungs freeze up. Larger livestock fences can be full time, part time, programmable etc etc. Lots of them around here to keep stock from going through the fence. Gunner -- "First Law of Leftist Debate The more you present a leftist with factual evidence that is counter to his preconceived world view and the more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot, homophobe approaches infinity. This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to the subject." Grey Ghost |
#10
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Shamefully simple electricital question
Gunner Asch fired this volley in
: Lots of them around here to keep stock from going through the fence. The majority of the "Bull Zappers" around here aren't merely pulsed on/off, but give short (say 10ms) "zaps" of 5KV followed by longer delays -- about two to three a second, or so. Their primary uses here are to keep deer OUT of areas, and to keep cattle from leaning on the fences; not really to keep the cattle IN, per se, but to keep their continous desire to eat through the fence on the "greener grass" down, so they don't damage the lines. A ****ed-off bull can clear a 5' fence easily, anyway, so it won't do much to keep them in the pasture if they want out. Because of the constant maintenance work repairing the live runs, it's about the same cost to just kill a 4' apron around the outside of the fence with a soil sterilant. The former needs to be fixed about twice a month at low cost (but labor and trips out), the latter - with sterilants - has to re-done about once a year at significant cost for the chemicals, but hardly any labor per rod of fence line. I don't have either method employed. I've only got about 80 rod of fence to maintain, so I just mow a 10' stripe outside the line right down to scalped every time I mow the front yard. Ends up working just as well. If there's nothing attractive for them to reach for, they stay off the wire. LLoyd LLoyd |
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