My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

stryped fired this volley in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?


Nope. 29ga goes on 2' centers, max. In this case, we're not talking
about load-bearing capabilities, but vibration, flex, and NOISE.

29ga "corrugated" is flimsy, and will bounce and bang with ever closing
of a door, even on 2' centers.

I'm not sure, either, that you have nailed the term "corrugated metal".
4-rib standing-rib barn metal is not "corrugated metal", except in the
connotations of the term. Neither is 5-Vee roofing.

True corrugated metal is the wavy stuff formed in a basically sinusoidal
wave shape across its entire surface. Of all the types, this would be
the best for rigidity, but not in 29ga. It can be had (as can all the
ag-metal sidings) in as thick as 22ga. It can also be bought custom-cut
to length with only a tiny cutting fee.

In order of suitability (rigidity), I'd rank the three as Corrugated
Metal (most rigid), 4-rib standing-rib barn/roof metal, then 5-Vee "tin".

Watch yourself, Stryper. My dad taught me how to work with sheet metal
when I was a young teen. He told me, "Lloyd, there's only ONE secret to
working successfully with sheet metal: Don't bleed to death."

LLoyd

On Apr 21, 12:58*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

Nope. *29ga goes on 2' centers, max. *In this case, we're not talking
about load-bearing capabilities, but vibration, flex, and NOISE.

29ga "corrugated" is flimsy, and will bounce and bang with ever closing
of a door, even on 2' centers.

I'm not sure, either, that you have nailed the term "corrugated metal". *
4-rib standing-rib barn metal is not "corrugated metal", except in the
connotations of the term. *Neither is 5-Vee roofing.

True corrugated metal is the wavy stuff formed in a basically sinusoidal
wave shape across its entire surface. *Of all the types, this would be
the best for rigidity, but not in 29ga. *It can be had (as can all the
ag-metal sidings) in as thick as 22ga. *It can also be bought custom-cut
to length with only a tiny cutting fee.

In order of suitability (rigidity), I'd rank the three as Corrugated
Metal (most rigid), 4-rib standing-rib barn/roof metal, then 5-Vee "tin".

Watch yourself, Stryper. *My dad taught me how to work with sheet metal
when I was a young teen. *He told me, "Lloyd, there's only ONE secret to
working successfully with sheet metal: *Don't bleed to death."

LLoyd

What could I use then for an inside ceiling with 4 foot centers?

Would using metal ceilings and walls make it hotter/colder?

stryped fired this volley in news:59ee831d-12b4-
:

What could I use then for an inside ceiling with 4 foot centers?

Would using metal ceilings and walls make it hotter/colder?

In reverse order:

1) What conducts heat in and out of a building faster, a fair insulator
like plaster/paper, or a good conductor like metal?

2) Why the heck don't you just screw 1x4 stringers every 2' to the
bottoms of the trusses, and put up gypsum board? (Um... just to be clear,
that would be PERPENDICULAR to the run of the trusses... otherwise it
might be hard to fasten the ones in-between pairs of them.)

LLoyd

On Apr 21, 2:16*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:59ee831d-12b4-
:

What could I use then for an inside ceiling with 4 foot centers?

Would using metal ceilings and walls make it hotter/colder?

In reverse order: *

1) What conducts heat in and out of a building faster, a fair insulator
like plaster/paper, or a good conductor like metal?

2) Why the heck don't you just screw 1x4 stringers every 2' to the
bottoms of the trusses, and put up gypsum board? (Um... just to be clear,
that would be PERPENDICULAR to the run of the trusses... otherwise it
might be hard to fasten the ones in-between pairs of them.)

LLoyd

Because I was told by the truss manufacturer that drywall weights too
much. Also, I have to do this totally myself and I dont like the idea
of taping/mudding that much overhead.

stryped fired this volley in news:99f055fe-e688-
:

Because I was told by the truss manufacturer that drywall weights too
much. Also, I have to do this totally myself and I dont like the idea
of taping/mudding that much overhead.

I'm tempted to say "poor baby!", but I'll hold on it, because I hate to
tape and joint, too. (although I've done about 300 boards of it in the
last five years; it's not _that_ hard, just irksome).

If that's the case, STILL put up the stringers, and use something like
tileboard, or even paneling. Sheet metal is a lousy ceiling. You want
something relatively quiet. And you're still going to have to run
insulation over the trusses if you want it to be half-way comfortable
during weather extremes.



LLoyd

stryped wrote in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-47bd-8fc2-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

Have you considered using a suspended ceiling - the kind used in
office/commercial buildings?

The two biggest advantages: light weight and sound absorption.

Installation is relatively simple, too. G

On Apr 21, 2:56*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
stryped wrote in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-47bd-8fc2-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

Have you considered using a suspended ceiling - the kind used in
office/commercial buildings?

The two biggest advantages: light weight and sound absorption.

Installation is relatively simple, too. G

I thought about that but was worried about humidity and things. When I
priced it out it was over 1000 dollars!

stryped wrote in news:084313b3-c22a-4e9c-8ba8-
:

On Apr 21, 2:56*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
stryped wrote in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-47bd-8fc2-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

Have you considered using a suspended ceiling - the kind used in
office/commercial buildings?

The two biggest advantages: light weight and sound absorption.

Installation is relatively simple, too. G

I thought about that but was worried about humidity and things. When I
priced it out it was over 1000 dollars!


If "Cheap" is your over-riding concern then why put up a ceiling at all?

If you simply MUST put one up then you might want to consider using large
silver tarpaulins stretched either under or over the rafters to interrupt
airflow. This is the cheapest way - and looks it.

On Apr 21, 3:48*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
stryped wrote in news:084313b3-c22a-4e9c-8ba8-
:





On Apr 21, 2:56*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
stryped wrote in news:dc5f3ea9-c01e-47bd-8fc2-
:

My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?

Have you considered using a suspended ceiling - the kind used in
office/commercial buildings?

The two biggest advantages: light weight and sound absorption.

Installation is relatively simple, too. G

I thought about that but was worried about humidity and things. When I
priced it out it was over 1000 dollars!

If "Cheap" is your over-riding concern then why put up a ceiling at all?

If you simply MUST put one up then you might want to consider using large
silver tarpaulins stretched either under or over the rafters to interrupt
airflow. This is the cheapest way - and looks it.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I want it to look good, but I need to do it by myself and it not be
too expensive. I really considered the suspended ceiling but it is
pricy. What do you guys think of a suspended ceilign in a garage?

stryped wrote in news:9b0b63fa-76c1-428b-9ee2-
:

I want it to look good, but I need to do it by myself and it not be
too expensive. I really considered the suspended ceiling but it is
pricy. What do you guys think of a suspended ceilign in a garage?

A few important questions:

1. Will you be using the garage solely for vehicle and yard tool storage?

2. Will the garage be your shop?

3. What material is on the iterior walls of your garage?

If the answer to 1. is "Yes" then your only concern would be the height
of your vehicle(s).

If the answer to 2. is "Yes" then you need to ask yourself if
flammability is an issue _and_ if the ability to replace relatively small
sections of the ceiling would be of benefit. (The advantage of the
ability to add/position overhead lighting is obvious! G)

If the answer to 3. is "nothing" then the insulation factor doesn't
apply. G

On Apr 21, 6:35*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
stryped wrote in news:9b0b63fa-76c1-428b-9ee2-
:

I want it to look good, but I need to do it by myself and it not be
too expensive. I really considered the suspended ceiling but it is
pricy. What do you guys think of a suspended ceilign in a garage?

A few important questions:

1. Will you be using the garage solely for vehicle and yard tool storage?

2. Will the garage be your shop?

3. What material is on the iterior walls of your garage?

If the answer to 1. is "Yes" then your only concern would be the height
of your vehicle(s).

If the answer to 2. is "Yes" then you need to ask yourself if
flammability is an issue _and_ if the ability to replace relatively small
sections of the ceiling would be of benefit. (The advantage of the
ability to add/position *overhead lighting is obvious! G)

If the answer to 3. is "nothing" then the insulation factor doesn't
apply. G

This is a garage and a shop but a "hobby" shop. (Repairing my cars,
lawn mowers, some woodworking when I get the erdge, etc.)

The outside is corregated metal siding. I have insulated the wals with
r-13 and am in the process of doing the ceilign with r-30.

stryped fired this volley in news:55fda0ba-3947-
:

The outside is corregated metal siding. I have insulated the wals with
r-13 and am in the process of doing the ceilign with r-30.

Wait a damned minute, Stryped! (first of all, are you _sure_ it's
"corrugated metal" siding, and not barn metal or 5-Vee? [there's a "u" in
that word, too])


You said the rafters wouldn't support drywall. Now you're hanging R-30
on top of them?

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor barrier? Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

I have an honest question: Why do you propose questions demanding
serious answers when you've already decided not to do _any_ of the things
a prudent builder would do?

We coached you through the building of this straw house -- even advising
that 4' centers aren't appropriate for anything but a pole barn. I
personally told you that 4' center trusses WOULD handle 1/2" drywall, if
you ran stringers on 2' centers. It's not the load, its the flex between
centers that's the problem. The stringers deal with that -- and they
stiffen the structure against wind loads.

If you've decided to do this "on the cheap", consider that "penny wise
and pound foolish" is an apt phrase for your endeavor. You'll eventually
be sorry for every shortcut and penurious deletion you've made to this
"house of cards" you've built.

So why keep asking for advice, when all you'll say in response is, "I
can't do that"? Why should we even bother responding?

LLoyd

"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley in
. 3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor barrier? Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... Only a pussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. Even for someone who friggin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. Buy some balls.

LLoyd

On Apr 21, 9:22*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley 8.3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor barrier? *Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... *Only a pussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. *Even for someone who friggin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. *Buy some balls.

LLoyd

Amen.

stryped wrote:
My trusses in garage are four foot on center. Is 4 foot on center ok
if I were to use 29 guage metal for an inside ceiling?


Yep!

On Apr 21, 8:22*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley 8.3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor barrier? *Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... *Only a pussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. *Even for someone who friggin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. *Buy some balls.

LLoyd

Last time I checked 30x30 = 900 square feet of drywall.

I have never drywalled before and I am not afraid of hanging it. I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.

On Apr 22, 7:10*am, stryped wrote:
On Apr 21, 8:22*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this volley 8.3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor barrier? *Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... *Only a pussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. *Even for someone who friggin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. *Buy some balls.

LLoyd

Last time I checked 30x30 = 900 square feet of drywall.

I have never drywalled before and I am not afraid of hanging it. I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.

And I am going off what the truss manufacturer said in terms of the
weight for my 2x4 trusses 4 feet apart.

stryped fired this volley in news:489d4834-2805-4eef-
:

I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.


But not afraid of a "corregated" metal ceiling looking horrible?

Right...

LLoyd

stryped fired this volley in
:

On Apr 22, 7:10*am, stryped wrote:
On Apr 21, 8:22*pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this
volley
8.3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor
barrier?
*Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... *Only a
p
ussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. *Even for someone who
frig
gin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. *Buy some balls.

LLoyd

Last time I checked 30x30 = 900 square feet of drywall.

I have never drywalled before and I am not afraid of hanging it. I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.

And I am going off what the truss manufacturer said in terms of the
weight for my 2x4 trusses 4 feet apart.


And all this because initially you wouldn't spring for an extra seven
trusses.

LLoyd

On Apr 22, 7:57*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley :





On Apr 22, 7:10 am, stryped wrote:
On Apr 21, 8:22 pm, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"

lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Lloyd E. Sponenburgh" lloydspinsidemindspring.com fired this
volley
8.3.70:

Have you considered just painting the bottom of the vapor
barrier?
Or
did you buy insulation without a vapor barrier?

Oh, yeah... since we're on the subject of cheap and lazy... Only a
p
ussy
would shy away from a mere 300-400 sq. ft. drywall job.

That's a couple of short afternoon's work. Even for someone who
frig
gin'
HATES drywall finishing like I do. Buy some balls.

LLoyd

Last time I checked 30x30 = 900 square feet of drywall.

I have never drywalled before and I am not afraid of hanging it. I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.

And I am going off what the truss manufacturer said in terms of the
weight for my 2x4 trusses 4 feet apart.

And all this because initially you wouldn't spring for an extra seven
trusses.

LLoyd- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

No dont talk about what you dont understand. I had the building built
and did not even get into a truss discussion on here until after it
was completed. This was the first building I ever had built and no one
mentioned the spacign being a problem.

On Apr 22, 7:55*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:489d4834-2805-4eef-
:

I am
afraid of the taping and mudding looking horrible.

But not afraid of a "corregated" metal ceiling looking horrible?

Right...

LLoyd

I dont see how it could look horrible. This looks pretty good:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/p...e-ceiling.html

stryped fired this volley in news:5364358b-ed74-
:


I dont see how it could look horrible. This looks pretty good:

Oh, I think I can see how snicker. Yeah, HIS looks pretty good. You
are the one doing this job.

Why not try this: Instead of asking questions of which you'll
automatically refute any and all answers, just build it. If you don't
like it, tear it down. If you do like it, keep it.

And why the hell did you even ASK if you could use the metal on 4'
centers, when it's obvious that 1) your 'model' example did, and 2) you
can hang it on any centers you like, so long as it doesn't buckle from
its own weight. We gave you reasons why you _shouldn't_, not reasons why
you _can't_.

Stop insulting the intelligence of the group.

LLoyd

On Apr 22, 9:13*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:5364358b-ed74-
:



I dont see how it could look horrible. This looks pretty good:

Oh, I think I can see how snicker. *Yeah, HIS looks pretty good. *You
are the one doing this job.

Why not try this: *Instead of asking questions of which you'll
automatically refute any and all answers, just build it. *If you don't
like it, tear it down. *If you do like it, keep it.

And why the hell did you even ASK if you could use the metal on 4'
centers, when it's obvious that 1) your 'model' example did, and 2) you
can hang it on any centers you like, so long as it doesn't buckle from
its own weight. *We gave you reasons why you _shouldn't_, not reasons why
you _can't_.

Stop insulting the intelligence of the group.

LLoyd

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.

stryped fired this volley in news:079c7cab-fc65-4a18-
:

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.

Yeah, just like you didn't ask the group if 4' centers were a good idea
until after you'd built the building. Why ask if you've already made up
your mind?

LLoyd

On Apr 22, 11:03*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:079c7cab-fc65-4a18-
:

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.

Yeah, just like you didn't ask the group if 4' centers were a good idea
until after you'd built the building. *Why ask if you've already made up
your mind?

LLoyd

I was not asked. A guy quoted me a price for the building and I had
him build it. The discussion of truss placement never came up because
at the time I was not sure what I was goign to do to the inside
eventually.

On Thu, 22 Apr 2010 09:22:17 -0700 (PDT), stryped
wrote:

On Apr 22, 11:03*am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:079c7cab-fc65-4a18-
:

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.

Yeah, just like you didn't ask the group if 4' centers were a good idea
until after you'd built the building. *Why ask if you've already made up
your mind?

LLoyd

I was not asked. A guy quoted me a price for the building and I had
him build it. The discussion of truss placement never came up because
at the time I was not sure what I was goign to do to the inside
eventually.


Actually the question of truss placement did come up, although perhaps
not discussed, as it has real meaning when the question of whether
the roof is going to collapse, or not arises.



John B. Slocomb
(johnbslocombatgmaildotcom)

stryped wrote:
On Apr 22, 11:03 am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:079c7cab-fc65-4a18-
:

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.
Yeah, just like you didn't ask the group if 4' centers were a good idea
until after you'd built the building. Why ask if you've already made up
your mind?

LLoyd

I was not asked. A guy quoted me a price for the building and I had
him build it. The discussion of truss placement never came up because
at the time I was not sure what I was goign to do to the inside
eventually.


A suspended metal grid system with 1" 24X48" fiberglass panels weighs
very little-I made my own out of 48X96 X1" rigid fiberglass--don't use
the celotex type of panels--Heavy , and they sag with age--esp. if they
get wet. even with 6" batts The whole thing doesn't weigh much & the
insulation beats corrugated iron into infinity as far as heating goes..
might want to paint them before installing--Aluminum would be my choice.

stryped wrote:
On Apr 22, 11:03 am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
stryped fired this volley in news:079c7cab-fc65-4a18-
:

I did not find that picture until today way after I posted the
question.
Yeah, just like you didn't ask the group if 4' centers were a good idea
until after you'd built the building. Why ask if you've already made up
your mind?

LLoyd

I was not asked. A guy quoted me a price for the building and I had
him build it. The discussion of truss placement never came up because
at the time I was not sure what I was goign to do to the inside
eventually.

Depending on the span--4ft c/c is not bad, IF they're made in a
"factory" which uses good joint fasteners---a truss mfg could give you
a good idea of the safety depending on your snow load

"John B. Slocomb" wrote

Actually the question of truss placement did come up, although perhaps
not discussed, as it has real meaning when the question of whether
the roof is going to collapse, or not arises.



John B. Slocomb
(johnbslocombatgmaildotcom)

Spacing, as well as screw placement and numbers will have an effect also on
what wind it will be rated for. When I planned my 32' x 14' awning, the guy
who doped it out looked at several different sheets of engineering info, and
we settled on the configuration that would withstand 104 mph winds. Did you
get, or did the person building it get any engineer stamped plans? With
these metal buildings, most steel fabrication suppliers of this material may
be a good place to ask these questions for free. If you have an account
anywhere, I'd start there.

Steve

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