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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#41
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On 2010-01-30, axolotl wrote:
Having said that, the business of hiring is screwy. A student of my acquaintance is getting out in June with an MBA, MSME, and a BS in physics. A couple of published papers. Very impressive engineering project resume. Good (summer) engineering work history. No solid offers. In the past someone like this would have to hand out numbers to the HR departments. What gives? That guy should consider going into finance industry. Interesting jobs and good money. I have an MBA and a computer science degree in math physics, that's how I know. I do not sell junk securities to suckers. i |
#42
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Steve B" wrote in message ... But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Why? The most anti-union people where I work were ex-union and glad we didn't have one. However, the company couldn't have done more to make people want a union if they handed out union cards. RogerN |
#43
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On 1/30/2010 5:16 PM, Ignoramus10246 wrote:
That guy should consider going into finance industry. Interesting jobs and good money. I have an MBA and a computer science degree in math physics, that's how I know. I do not sell junk securities to suckers. The student in question is a charming tall redhead without a Y chromosome. All the more reason to be puzzled by the lack of blank checks. Her interests are in engineering, and I presume she wants do develop her engineering skills. I am sure the finance industry pays better, but some kids are born to build things. Kevin Gallimore |
#44
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Too bad, I was in a union and the most important lesson I learned was how bad they were. But you wouldn't hire me in spite of my having learned my lesson. David I remember you. You wanted the break between the application and the interview. Nope, I was the guy being told by my fellow union members that my productivity was making them look bad. They asked, "why do you do more than you have to?" I replied, "self respect, why would I do less than I can?" I was not a good union man. But you are too narrow minded to hire me. Or for me to want to work for you. David David, I was in a union for 37 years. I hear you when your fellow workers tell you to slow down, or you're the first to get laid off because they want to take longer with the slower ones. I was referring to "good union" men. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Steve |
#45
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"jk" wrote in message ... "Steve B" wrote: And the electricians were barred from moving freight. When crafts respect each other's jobs, there's more work. The hell there is! There is the same amount of "work" just more people getting paid for standing around not doing part of it. I didn't want to hook up electrical wires that I knew little about, and I didn't want to turn over my fork lift to someone who didn't know how to operate it. So, you have key personnel, and then the other usual suspects surrounding the people actually getting the work done. You might have observed for a day or two, but you didn't learn much. The convention business in Vegas is dismal. Light years away from what it was decades ago. Out of towners, and under the table deals. Gee and what do you think drives that???????????? Greed. Pure and simple. And union give aways over the years. Changing rules that allow people to work there who have no business working there and taking Teamster jobs. As for the industry itself, the economy has weakened the amount of conventions, pure and simple. Steve, who retired with 37 yrs. Teamster Union, a decent pension, and continuing good benefits. jk |
#46
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
well, never having worked in HR, I'm sure I wouldn't know.
-- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .. "Ignoramus10246" wrote in message ... On 2010-01-30, Stormin Mormon wrote: Occurs to me, that at least two interviews are needed. The HR to discern if the person is a leech, or a worker. And someone from the plant, to see if the candidate has the technical skills. How would HR determine if the person is a leech, or a worker? i |
#47
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On 2010-01-30, Joseph Gwinn wrote:
Ignoramus7752 wrote: Some people are really good at bull****ting and manipulation and only deep digging (asking detailed technical questions) can sort out those BSers. In any job interviews, I always ask "hard questions" that bull****ters will not be able to answer correctly. The worst interview suggestions are "body language" based suggestions, paying attention to body language is truly a great way to get screwed. I'll second that. I am an electrical engineer and have interviewed many an engineer. Two cases stick out, both June grads from name universities looking for their first job: The EE football player. The interview was a struggle from the start and Yep. There are two foolproof interview tips that I know. 1. Use proper body language indicating that you are honest and earnest person. (very easy) 2. If possible, get the interviewer talk about himself or herself. These do not guarantee employment if the interviewer is smart like Joe Gwinn, but they guarantee a very warm fuzzy feeling. i |
#48
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Stormin Mormon wrote: well, never having worked in HR, I'm sure I wouldn't know. Ask if they are a PHD? ;-) -- Greed is the root of all eBay. |
#49
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Ignoramus10246 wrote: On 2010-01-30, Joseph Gwinn wrote: Ignoramus7752 wrote: Some people are really good at bull****ting and manipulation and only deep digging (asking detailed technical questions) can sort out those BSers. In any job interviews, I always ask "hard questions" that bull****ters will not be able to answer correctly. The worst interview suggestions are "body language" based suggestions, paying attention to body language is truly a great way to get screwed. I'll second that. I am an electrical engineer and have interviewed many an engineer. Two cases stick out, both June grads from name universities looking for their first job: The EE football player. The interview was a struggle from the start and Yep. There are two foolproof interview tips that I know. 1. Use proper body language indicating that you are honest and earnest person. (very easy) 2. If possible, get the interviewer talk about himself or herself. These do not guarantee employment if the interviewer is smart like Joe Gwinn, but they guarantee a very warm fuzzy feeling. What good does that do when you need a job? a 'warm fuzzy feeling' won't feed you. BTW, great job the red Cross is doing at taking in all those homeless Haitian kids. It's too bad that local churches have to do the heavy lifting, and pay all the bills though. -- Greed is the root of all eBay. |
#50
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Steve B wrote:
"David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Too bad, I was in a union and the most important lesson I learned was how bad they were. But you wouldn't hire me in spite of my having learned my lesson. David I remember you. You wanted the break between the application and the interview. Nope, I was the guy being told by my fellow union members that my productivity was making them look bad. They asked, "why do you do more than you have to?" I replied, "self respect, why would I do less than I can?" I was not a good union man. But you are too narrow minded to hire me. Or for me to want to work for you. David David, I was in a union for 37 years. So less than 20 years of productive work. I hear you when your fellow workers tell you to slow down, or you're the first to get laid off because they want to take longer with the slower ones. Actually, when the layoffs started, my foreman shipped me out to other depts which kept me from going before some others with more seniority but less, or no, work ethic. I was referring to "good union" men. Yes, I understand, good union men with no self respect or pride in what they do. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Thanks. You probably don't understand that you've complimented me. David |
#51
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:43:01 -0800, the infamous "Steve B"
scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message .. . Most weren't working, all waiting for the union electrician who could legally plug a cord into an outlet, since they were barred from doing so. And on it goes. And the electricians were barred from moving freight. When crafts respect each other's jobs, there's more work. Sure there's more work. Only the "work" is falsely billing employers for time waiting for the electrician, or somebody like him. (Did I just say that?) 87 guys waiting around FOR HOURS for one of two Sparkies. Brilliant planning. And when 'plugging an extension cord into a power strip outlet designed specifically for it' becomes a "craft", I'll eat my shorts. You might have observed for a day or two, but you didn't learn much. The convention business in Vegas is dismal. Light years away from what it was decades ago. Out of towners, and under the table deals. Steve, who retired with 37 yrs. Teamster Union, a decent pension, and continuing good benefits. You may have retired with 37 years, but you didn't learn much. Like I said, I learned my lesson with the Teamsters early on. YMMV -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
#52
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:07:12 -0600, the infamous "David R.Birch"
scrawled the following: Stormin Mormon wrote: Occurs to me, that at least two interviews are needed. The HR to discern if the person is a leech, or a worker. And someone from the plant, to see if the candidate has the technical skills. Most of the shops I've interviewed in send you to the guy you're going to be working for first, then HR. The one place where I went to HR first, the interviewer's description of the company management made me not bother with the rest. What a treat: You found an honest HR department employee! -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
#53
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:27:57 -0800, the infamous "Steve B"
scrawled the following: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Too bad, I was in a union and the most important lesson I learned was how bad they were. But you wouldn't hire me in spite of my having learned my lesson. David I remember you. You wanted the break between the application and the interview. Nope, I was the guy being told by my fellow union members that my productivity was making them look bad. They asked, "why do you do more than you have to?" I replied, "self respect, why would I do less than I can?" I was not a good union man. But you are too narrow minded to hire me. Or for me to want to work for you. David David, I was in a union for 37 years. I hear you when your fellow workers tell you to slow down, or you're the first to get laid off because they want to take longer with the slower ones. I was referring to "good union" men. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Damn, Steve. With statements like that, you're _living_proof_ for the disdain we have for unions and their members. That's truly sad. -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
#54
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... There you go. The two level interview. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Buerste" wrote in message ... Yep, I've been snookered a few times but no big deal. I have a 90 day probationary period and the head of the union will tell me if the guy's a worker or not and he wants his people to be a good team. This guy gets it! He knows that the prosperity of the company is directly related to his income. We use a production bonus system and the people can double their pay checks if they work hard and suffer few breakdowns. Each job is dependent on other people doing their job right. If there's a slacker in the chain, other people's bonus suffers...they don't like that! Therefore, peer pressure helps keep people on-time, sober, focused and productive. |
#55
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Steve B" wrote in message ... But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN I have found out that the guy you actually hire shows up about two weeks after starting. They can all do good for about two weeks, then you find out if you made a good choice or not. Steve We call that the "Honeymoon". |
#56
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"RogerN" wrote in message m... "Steve B" wrote in message ... But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Why? The most anti-union people where I work were ex-union and glad we didn't have one. However, the company couldn't have done more to make people want a union if they handed out union cards. RogerN There was only one union that the workers had the skill set I needed. And it was notorious for its tactics and practices at the local mill. Plus, they all wanted $20 an hour to start. Steve |
#57
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Too bad, I was in a union and the most important lesson I learned was how bad they were. But you wouldn't hire me in spite of my having learned my lesson. David I remember you. You wanted the break between the application and the interview. Nope, I was the guy being told by my fellow union members that my productivity was making them look bad. They asked, "why do you do more than you have to?" I replied, "self respect, why would I do less than I can?" I was not a good union man. But you are too narrow minded to hire me. Or for me to want to work for you. David David, I was in a union for 37 years. So less than 20 years of productive work. I hear you when your fellow workers tell you to slow down, or you're the first to get laid off because they want to take longer with the slower ones. Actually, when the layoffs started, my foreman shipped me out to other depts which kept me from going before some others with more seniority but less, or no, work ethic. I was referring to "good union" men. Yes, I understand, good union men with no self respect or pride in what they do. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Thanks. You probably don't understand that you've complimented me. David You did get it, then. Steve |
#58
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message ... On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:27:57 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: "David R.Birch" wrote in message ... Steve B wrote: But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN When I was in business, I would never hire anyone who had been in a union. Steve Too bad, I was in a union and the most important lesson I learned was how bad they were. But you wouldn't hire me in spite of my having learned my lesson. David I remember you. You wanted the break between the application and the interview. Nope, I was the guy being told by my fellow union members that my productivity was making them look bad. They asked, "why do you do more than you have to?" I replied, "self respect, why would I do less than I can?" I was not a good union man. But you are too narrow minded to hire me. Or for me to want to work for you. David David, I was in a union for 37 years. I hear you when your fellow workers tell you to slow down, or you're the first to get laid off because they want to take longer with the slower ones. I was referring to "good union" men. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Damn, Steve. With statements like that, you're _living_proof_ for the disdain we have for unions and their members. That's truly sad. I really believe SEIU had a little to do with it, too. Steve |
#59
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message ... On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:43:01 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message . .. Most weren't working, all waiting for the union electrician who could legally plug a cord into an outlet, since they were barred from doing so. And on it goes. And the electricians were barred from moving freight. When crafts respect each other's jobs, there's more work. Sure there's more work. Only the "work" is falsely billing employers for time waiting for the electrician, or somebody like him. (Did I just say that?) 87 guys waiting around FOR HOURS for one of two Sparkies. Brilliant planning. And when 'plugging an extension cord into a power strip outlet designed specifically for it' becomes a "craft", I'll eat my shorts. You might have observed for a day or two, but you didn't learn much. The convention business in Vegas is dismal. Light years away from what it was decades ago. Out of towners, and under the table deals. Steve, who retired with 37 yrs. Teamster Union, a decent pension, and continuing good benefits. You may have retired with 37 years, but you didn't learn much. Like I said, I learned my lesson with the Teamsters early on. YMMV And yet you contradict yourself with the statement that I didn't learn much. I learned enough to get myself into a department that was performance based (the only one there), and to work from bare floor to bare floor while the other crews worked helter skelter and intermittently. You may have learned something from your experience with the Las Vegas Teamsters. But it wasn't "Shut up and do what you're told". When you do that, it goes better. And you get more hours. Notice I said "hours" and not "work". Soldiers who do what they are told fare better than those who don't and have to question every order. They either get sent down the road or killed. Steve |
#60
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Steve B wrote: Soldiers who do what they are told fare better than those who don't and have to question every order. They either get sent down the road or killed. Not always. I got a letter of commendation and a promotion for ignoring an order. -- Greed is the root of all eBay. |
#61
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Let the Record show that "Steve B" on or
about Fri, 29 Jan 2010 15:35:06 -0800 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: There's a hundred ways to cook a poodle. But it all tastes like chicken. LOL - I like that! Steve - pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough! |
#62
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Let the Record show that "Buerste" on or about
Fri, 29 Jan 2010 21:26:44 -0500 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: "pyotr filipivich" wrote in message .. . Let the Record show that " on or about Fri, 29 Jan 2010 06:52:53 -0800 (PST) did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: On Jan 29, 3:39 am, "RogerN" wrote: Couldn't you also be weeding out the best employees in the raw? I've seen a lot of burnt out experienced employees get preferred over a newbie although in a year or two sometimes the newbie goes far beyond the experienced burnout. RogerN Lots of companies want specific experience and should be more open minded. But it sounds like Tom's test of measuring the length of lines falls into general knowledge. I once did not hire a high school graduate that did not know how many inches were in a foot. I do not think he would have turned out to be one of our best employees. As bizarre as it sounds, I did work with a guy who could not read a steel tape. Kind of a handclap when it came to measuring things around the shop. - pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough! Not bizarre at all! Did you ever try to teach somebody to read a tape that has no concept of fractions? Can't say. Do not know, so cannot say. I would wager it get a little bit difficult when they're missing that little detail. - pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough! |
#63
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Let the Record show that "Denis G." on or about
Fri, 29 Jan 2010 15:31:17 -0800 (PST) did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: On Jan 29, 2:21*pm, pyotr filipivich wrote: Let the Record show that "Karl Townsend" on or about Fri, 29 Jan 2010 02:24:15 -0500 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking *the following: I recently read a Warren Buffet quote: "Someone once said that in looking for people to hire you look for three qualities: integrity, intelligence, and energy. *And if they don't have the first, the other two will kill you." Man I couldn't agree more. Give me a person with integrity and a good work * * * * Integrity will give you a "good work ethic". * * * * Buffet's point is that a hard worker without integrity, is working for themselves, not you. Being ethical and having integrity are one in the same. Warren Buffets wants people he can trust. I expect that he understands people who seek profit for themselves and he looks for as much value as he can get for what he is paying in wages. Sounds like a fair horse trader to me. I think what Buffet (and the rest of us) want is someone who will give an hour's work for an hour's wage, and figures if the company makes money, we "both" get rich. That does go both ways, if the company makes money, but doesn't share, or don't reward effort, then .... "I was looking for a job when I started here." The "unethical' may do a lot of work at the job, but it isn't for the company. I know of a case where the guy built a database 'for the company', then left and took it with him. Bad move. There was a editorial in the Wall Street Journal 'last week" (Jan 25th,2010), commenting on the (Current flap with the late night TV talk shows. The comparison was made to when Johnny Carson had the tonight show. He had a favorite guest host who filled in while he was gone. Once, he was going to be gone for three weeks. At the end of the first week,the guest host announced that starting the next week, they would have their own show, on a different network (iirc). Not nice. But Johnny Carson simply replaced the guest host for the rest of the gig, and forbade anything to be said about it on the show. Class act, and a class response to a person who had taken advantage of him in manner which might be considered unethical.. - pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough! |
#64
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Let the Record show that "David R.Birch" on or
about Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:07:12 -0600 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: Stormin Mormon wrote: Occurs to me, that at least two interviews are needed. The HR to discern if the person is a leech, or a worker. And someone from the plant, to see if the candidate has the technical skills. Most of the shops I've interviewed in send you to the guy you're going to be working for first, then HR. The one place where I went to HR first, the interviewer's description of the company management made me not bother with the rest. After a group orientation for a company, which ran a rotating shift - twelve hour days (two on three off, three one two off, etc) for two weeks, then reverse for two weeks on nights, a bunch of us left before it got went any further. I didn't want to have to carry a calendar to know if I'll be free on Saturday. and then said "I've only been here a half hour, and already I have a bad attitude about working here." Twelve hour shifts and an hour's drive in good traffic, each way? I might not have much of a life, but I do have one. - pyotr filipivich If the world was flat - some would sue about people falling off the edge. |
#65
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Let the Record show that Wes on or about Sat, 30
Jan 2010 07:59:23 -0500 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: pyotr filipivich wrote: As bizarre as it sounds, I did work with a guy who could not read a steel tape. Kind of a handclap when it came to measuring things around the shop. I'm dangeous if I'm reading it upside down. Tend to cut an inch short Heard of a guy who used folding rulers - the wooden kinds. Till he ,made a set of cabinets 6 inches short. Seems the first six inch section had gotten broken off... and he had not noticed.. tschus pyotr - pyotr filipivich We will drink no whiskey before its nine. It's eight fifty eight. Close enough! |
#66
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"RogerN" wrote:
But, would you prefer an employee that knows nothing but is able and willing to quickly learn everything, or an employee that knows everything and can't be taught anything? RogerN Yes, but SOME of the examples given, show that the person ALREADY didn't learn anything. [i.e. the one who didn't know how many inches in a foot. No perhaps out of the US, that particular one would be different.] jk |
#67
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:07:12 -0600, the infamous "David R.Birch" scrawled the following: Stormin Mormon wrote: Occurs to me, that at least two interviews are needed. The HR to discern if the person is a leech, or a worker. And someone from the plant, to see if the candidate has the technical skills. Most of the shops I've interviewed in send you to the guy you're going to be working for first, then HR. The one place where I went to HR first, the interviewer's description of the company management made me not bother with the rest. What a treat: You found an honest HR department employee! Not really, she told me the company had been bought from a machinist who started it by a much younger couple who had made some money in accounting. I'd already experienced one company run by a bean counter who had no idea how to make parts. David |
#68
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 21:40:15 -0800, the infamous "Steve B"
scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message .. . On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 15:27:57 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: I was referring to "good union" men. Sounds like you do not fit that bill. Damn, Steve. With statements like that, you're _living_proof_ for the disdain we have for unions and their members. That's truly sad. I really believe SEIU had a little to do with it, too. Sure, they did. They corrupted you, Steve. Like I said: sad. http://fwd4.me/Dfg More? -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
#69
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 21:47:36 -0800, the infamous "Steve B"
scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message .. . On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 09:43:01 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message ... Most weren't working, all waiting for the union electrician who could legally plug a cord into an outlet, since they were barred from doing so. And on it goes. And the electricians were barred from moving freight. When crafts respect each other's jobs, there's more work. Sure there's more work. Only the "work" is falsely billing employers for time waiting for the electrician, or somebody like him. (Did I just say that?) 87 guys waiting around FOR HOURS for one of two Sparkies. Brilliant planning. And when 'plugging an extension cord into a power strip outlet designed specifically for it' becomes a "craft", I'll eat my shorts. You might have observed for a day or two, but you didn't learn much. The convention business in Vegas is dismal. Light years away from what it was decades ago. Out of towners, and under the table deals. Steve, who retired with 37 yrs. Teamster Union, a decent pension, and continuing good benefits. You may have retired with 37 years, but you didn't learn much. Like I said, I learned my lesson with the Teamsters early on. YMMV And yet you contradict yourself with the statement that I didn't learn much. I learned enough to get myself into a department that was performance based (the only one there), and to work from bare floor to bare floor while the other crews worked helter skelter and intermittently. Huh? What I learned was ABOUT them, that they were scammers. I didn't learn anything FROM them. You may have learned something from your experience with the Las Vegas Teamsters. But it wasn't "Shut up and do what you're told". When you do that, it goes better. And you get more hours. Notice I said "hours" and not "work". You're unbelieveable, Steve. Weren't you just talking about hiring people with ethics? What you've just recommended is the total opposite of that. Soldiers who do what they are told fare better than those who don't and have to question every order. They either get sent down the road or killed. It's interesting that you used that particular analogy, Steve, given the known syndicate backing of the Unions. -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
pyotr filipivich wrote: Let the Record show that "David R.Birch" on or about Sat, 30 Jan 2010 10:07:12 -0600 did write/type or cause to appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following: Stormin Mormon wrote: Occurs to me, that at least two interviews are needed. The HR to discern if the person is a leech, or a worker. And someone from the plant, to see if the candidate has the technical skills. Most of the shops I've interviewed in send you to the guy you're going to be working for first, then HR. The one place where I went to HR first, the interviewer's description of the company management made me not bother with the rest. After a group orientation for a company, which ran a rotating shift - twelve hour days (two on three off, three one two off, etc) for two weeks, then reverse for two weeks on nights, a bunch of us left before it got went any further. I didn't want to have to carry a calendar to know if I'll be free on Saturday. and then said "I've only been here a half hour, and already I have a bad attitude about working here." Twelve hour shifts and an hour's drive in good traffic, each way? I might not have much of a life, but I do have one. Try 16+ hour days, three on, two off, two on, one week and three off, two on, two off the next. I had a year of that in the US Army, at an AFRTS Radio & TV station The Saturday & Sunday rotation could hit 40 hours in just two days. -- Greed is the root of all eBay. |
#71
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Jan 31, 12:10*pm, Larry Jaques
wrote: On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 21:47:36 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: ... Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *-- George Bernard Shaw- Your quote is ironic considering Shaw's imaginary view of Stalin: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...-killings.html |
#72
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 23:48:34 -0500, "Buerste"
wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... There you go. The two level interview. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Buerste" wrote in message ... Yep, I've been snookered a few times but no big deal. I have a 90 day probationary period and the head of the union will tell me if the guy's a worker or not and he wants his people to be a good team. This guy gets it! He knows that the prosperity of the company is directly related to his income. We use a production bonus system and the people can double their pay checks if they work hard and suffer few breakdowns. Each job is dependent on other people doing their job right. If there's a slacker in the chain, other people's bonus suffers...they don't like that! Therefore, peer pressure helps keep people on-time, sober, focused and productive. I built a railroad yard for a lumber mill and they used that business model. It was only a 4 month contract (that I was there), but they had a lot of employee injuries. Too many if you ask me. If any link in the production chain broke, the entire operation came to a screeching halt. Busting ass to catch back up was when the injuries happened. That and pushing the limits to make the bonus. How do you balance those aspects to keep injuries to a minimum? And to add some metal working content, there is a lot of really cool machinery in a lumber mill! Everything is timed like a watch with product moving from raw trees to finished product in one plant. The millwrights who keep that show running are worth their weight in gold. I found the place facinating. I suspect your company is similar to that. Newb |
#73
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Steve B" wrote:
And the electricians were barred from moving freight. When crafts respect each other's jobs, there's more work. The hell there is! There is the same amount of "work" just more people getting paid for standing around not doing part of it. You might have observed for a day or two, but you didn't learn much. The convention business in Vegas is dismal. Light years away from what it was decades ago. Out of towners, and under the table deals. Gee and what do you think drives that???????????? Steve, who retired with 37 yrs. Teamster Union, a decent pension, and continuing good benefits. jk |
#74
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Larry Jaques" wrote You're unbelieveable, Steve. Weren't you just talking about hiring people with ethics? What you've just recommended is the total opposite of that. You're a piece of work. No, you are a piece of ****. Your reading comprehension sucks, and your psychic powers are overrated. By YOU! My two experiences are just that. One as a union member, and the other as a business owner. Interspersed with 37 years of membership in the union was three separate careers where I ventured outside the confines of the union shop and into the real world. The first one almost didn't go so well, venturing from union shop into offshore oil business. But I adapted. You have mixed and muddled so many things with absolutely no comprehension of any of it that I find you no longer interesting or worth of talking with. You may go now. Steve |
#75
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message ... On Jan 31, 12:10 pm, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 21:47:36 -0800, the infamous "Steve B" scrawled the following: ... Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw- Your quote is ironic considering Shaw's imaginary view of Stalin: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...-killings.html Sorry, but you have attributed something to me that I did not write. Steve |
#76
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
On Sun, 31 Jan 2010 17:52:37 -0800, the infamous "Steve B"
scrawled the following: "Larry Jaques" wrote You're unbelieveable, Steve. Weren't you just talking about hiring people with ethics? What you've just recommended is the total opposite of that. You're a piece of work. No, you are a piece of ****. Your reading comprehension sucks, and your psychic powers are overrated. By YOU! My two experiences are just that. One as a union member, and the other as a business owner. Interspersed with 37 years of membership in the union was three separate careers where I ventured outside the confines of the union shop and into the real world. The first one almost didn't go so well, venturing from union shop into offshore oil business. But I adapted. You have mixed and muddled so many things with absolutely no comprehension of any of it that I find you no longer interesting or worth of talking with. You may go now. Bwahahahahaha! You, too. -- Imagination is the beginning of creation. You imagine what you desire, you will what you imagine and at last you create what you will. -- George Bernard Shaw |
#77
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New employee test for "metalworking skills"
wrote in message ... On Sat, 30 Jan 2010 23:48:34 -0500, "Buerste" wrote: "Stormin Mormon" wrote in message ... There you go. The two level interview. -- Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org . "Buerste" wrote in message ... Yep, I've been snookered a few times but no big deal. I have a 90 day probationary period and the head of the union will tell me if the guy's a worker or not and he wants his people to be a good team. This guy gets it! He knows that the prosperity of the company is directly related to his income. We use a production bonus system and the people can double their pay checks if they work hard and suffer few breakdowns. Each job is dependent on other people doing their job right. If there's a slacker in the chain, other people's bonus suffers...they don't like that! Therefore, peer pressure helps keep people on-time, sober, focused and productive. I built a railroad yard for a lumber mill and they used that business model. It was only a 4 month contract (that I was there), but they had a lot of employee injuries. Too many if you ask me. If any link in the production chain broke, the entire operation came to a screeching halt. Busting ass to catch back up was when the injuries happened. That and pushing the limits to make the bonus. How do you balance those aspects to keep injuries to a minimum? And to add some metal working content, there is a lot of really cool machinery in a lumber mill! Everything is timed like a watch with product moving from raw trees to finished product in one plant. The millwrights who keep that show running are worth their weight in gold. I found the place facinating. I suspect your company is similar to that. Newb We are pretty low risk injury wise AND we have safety protocols that work! We haven't had a Workers Comp involved injury for 15 years. A few cuts and back pains are the norm and on the whole my people take safety seriously. Your point is very well taken, hurried people make mistakes. And, NO amount of money is worth a serious injury, it would break my heart if somebody had a run-in with a punch press. |
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