Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same? I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.

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Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve

"Wes" wrote in message ...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same? I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


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On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 00:18:55 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water, then size and lube them within a day or
so..within the next 7-10 days..they will harden up to around Bn 30 and
stay that way for up to 4 yrs..after which they will slowly soften back
down to 13-15

Gunner


"Wes" wrote in message ...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same? I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474
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Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or
about Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:11:29 -0800 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 00:18:55 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water,


I take it, you do this hot, as in right out of the mold?

then size and lube them within a day or
so..within the next 7-10 days..they will harden up to around Bn 30 and
stay that way for up to 4 yrs..after which they will slowly soften back
down to 13-15

-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!
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I have some weird steel things that I think are slag skimmers. I
brought them from a die casting foundry. Anyone needs them, I will
sell them cheaply.

They look kind of like a huge spoon with holes drilled in it.

Most I have are about 5" in diameter, and I have one bigger one.

i


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"Steve Lusardi" wrote in message
...
Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you won't regret
it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They
can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks and not cause barrel leading. If
I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and
Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets
are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead
bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


Read this interesting article.
http://www.lasc.us/FryxellCBAlloyObturation.htm

The more I cast, the more I learn.

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"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are
in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same?
I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


You can get clean WW alloy in ingots on Ebay for about $1/lb delivered.

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"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
...
Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or
about Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:11:29 -0800 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 00:18:55 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9
or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water,


I take it, you do this hot, as in right out of the mold?

then size and lube them within a day or
so..within the next 7-10 days..they will harden up to around Bn 30 and
stay that way for up to 4 yrs..after which they will slowly soften back
down to 13-15

-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!


You can heat treat in an oven.
http://www.lasc.us/HeatTreat.htm

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Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.
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"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9
or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.


I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything; the
last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to make
the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold type" --
computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is done without
any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know where it's
coming from.

--
Ed Huntress




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On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:41:06 -0800, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or
about Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:11:29 -0800 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 00:18:55 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water,


I take it, you do this hot, as in right out of the mold?


Ayup. Knock, flip, Splish!!


then size and lube them within a day or
so..within the next 7-10 days..they will harden up to around Bn 30 and
stay that way for up to 4 yrs..after which they will slowly soften back
down to 13-15

-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!


The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474
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Check. Drop them hot, right out of the mold into ice-cold water.

Flash




"pyotr filipivich" wrote in message
...
Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or
about Wed, 20 Jan 2010 16:11:29 -0800 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 00:18:55 +0100, "Steve Lusardi"
wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9
or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water,


I take it, you do this hot, as in right out of the mold?

then size and lube them within a day or
so..within the next 7-10 days..they will harden up to around Bn 30 and
stay that way for up to 4 yrs..after which they will slowly soften back
down to 13-15

-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!



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Buerste wrote:

"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They
are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same?
I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


You can get clean WW alloy in ingots on Ebay for about $1/lb delivered.


I'd like to see a link to that one.


--

Richard Lamb
http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/

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cavelamb wrote:
Buerste wrote:

"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They
are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the
same? I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


You can get clean WW alloy in ingots on Ebay for about $1/lb delivered.


I'd like to see a link to that one.




Uhm, never mind.
I found several myself...
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Wes, I can give you this, :

http://www.theantimonyman.com/index.htm

He is in ARIDZONA, though.

Flash




"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are
in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same?
I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.





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Mu Google-Fu isn't too strong, but here are a couple more.

Flash

http://www.atlasmetal.com/ Denver, CO



http://www.canadametal.com/



http://www.go4worldbusiness.com/lead...?objid=2967883





http://www.alibaba.com/member/ca1056...oductlist.html



http://www.metalico.com/contact.html Granite City, IL








"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They are
in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same?
I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.



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"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9
or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.


I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything; the
last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to
make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold
type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is
done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know where
it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was easier
/ cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed each year.
They printed tax guides as one part of their product line and lots of pages
rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast in a linotype machine
there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.


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"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9
or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.


I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything; the
last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to
make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold
type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is
done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know where
it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed each
year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line and lots
of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast in a
linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.


Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are they
printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype to make
galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one of us
can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results, with a home
computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of quality. No loss of
anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy hell...I
can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are used today for
things like fancy invitations and wedding announcements. And a few hobbyists
have them, but they set type by hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype
machine is about the size of three refrigerators and looks like the giant
insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


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"cavelamb" wrote in message
m...
cavelamb wrote:
Buerste wrote:

"Wes" wrote in message
...
One supplier that sells casting lead and alloys is Rotometals. They
are in California.

Anyone know a source in Michigan, Indiana or Ohio that sells the same?
I'm tired of
scrounging, I just buy clean alloy and recycle my bullet traps.

Wes
--

The only thing Obama has fixed is Carter's reputation.


You can get clean WW alloy in ingots on Ebay for about $1/lb delivered.


I'd like to see a link to that one.




Uhm, never mind.
I found several myself...


I understand, it's a gut reaction to doubt EVERYTHING I say. I make one of
my engineers write on a dedicated calendar every time we argue and who was
proven right. I'm ahead...by a LOT and yet, he still doubts me.

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Let the Record show that Gunner Asch on or
about Wed, 20 Jan 2010 18:35:37 -0800 did write/type or cause to
appear in rec.crafts.metalworking the following:

And if you cast wheelweight bullets and dump them directly into a 5
gallon bucket filled with water,


I take it, you do this hot, as in right out of the mold?


Ayup. Knock, flip, Splish!!


Oh, that's fun. I messed about with melting lead on the kitchen
stove (gas), and casting molds of license plates. Fun. Then my
younger brother tried it, didn't get the mold quite dry - pop, splat,
and he spilled the rest of the lead on the floor. No injuries (he was
in bare feet and shorts) but we found a neat way to take care of waxy
buildup.

We left some interesting burned places in those quarters when we
PCSed.
-
pyotr filipivich
We will drink no whiskey before its nine.
It's eight fifty eight. Close enough!


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"Buerste" wrote:

Uhm, never mind.
I found several myself...


I understand, it's a gut reaction to doubt EVERYTHING I say. I make one of
my engineers write on a dedicated calendar every time we argue and who was
proven right. I'm ahead...by a LOT and yet, he still doubts me.


Being willing to argue one's point is not a bad thing. The guy that placidly goes with
what you say likely didn't really understand what you were telling him. I get nervous
when I get too quick agreement. Sometimes that is the prelude to blowing me off or
totally misinterpreting my instructions.

The arguer might not really understand you but in the exchange, there is going to be a
real hashing out of the matter at hand. At least you know he was thinking about the
subject at hand.


Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller
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"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than
pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around
9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago
did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to
make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold
type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is
done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer
imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know where
it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed each
year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line and lots
of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast in a
linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.


Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are they
printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype to make
galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one of
us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results, with a
home computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of quality. No
loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy hell...I
can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are used today for
things like fancy invitations and wedding announcements. And a few
hobbyists have them, but they set type by hand, rather than use Linotype.
A Linotype machine is about the size of three refrigerators and looks like
the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or 2 line
change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if they have to
change a whole chapter then they use other than the Linotype. But the
Linotype produces the same pages for years with very good quality. And
these are expensive books. They may have changed now, but in 1990, they
said it was much cheaper and better with the linotype. The use offset
printing.


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"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter
than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around
9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago
did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to
make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold
type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is
done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer
imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know where
it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed each
year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line and lots
of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast in a
linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.


Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are they
printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype to make
galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one of
us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results, with a
home computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of quality. No
loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are used
today for things like fancy invitations and wedding announcements. And a
few hobbyists have them, but they set type by hand, rather than use
Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size of three refrigerators and
looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or 2
line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if they
have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the Linotype. But
the Linotype produces the same pages for years with very good quality.
And these are expensive books. They may have changed now, but in 1990,
they said it was much cheaper and better with the linotype. The use
offset printing.


Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I won't
belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large masses
of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it mechanically
drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when I
worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's more
appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No equipment is
needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype standard
alloy. That's more likely.

--
Ed Huntress


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"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with
newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste,
you won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8%
lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas
checks and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly,
lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is
about 28/29, which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are
much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like
lead bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20
years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place
using Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did
numbering and other specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in
the country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for
anything; the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20
years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned
from hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still
around, to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been
converted to "cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now,
most volume printing is done without any galleys at all. It's
"direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know
where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it
was easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they
printed each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their
product line and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still
have my name cast in a linotype machine there. But as to metal
work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are
they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the
Linotype to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any
one of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same
results, with a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No
loss of quality. No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are
used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding
announcements. And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by
hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size
of three refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or
2 line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if
they have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the
Linotype. But the Linotype produces the same pages for years with
very good quality. And these are expensive books. They may have
changed now, but in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and better
with the linotype. The use offset printing.


Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I
won't belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large
masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it
mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when
I worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's
more appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No
equipment is needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a
line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype
standard alloy. That's more likely.


My cousin runs a one-man print shop on Cape Cod that specializes in odd
jobs that other printers won't (or can't) handle. Things like
sequentially numbered tickets. He still has a Linotype machine, but he
seldom has a job that makes it worth firing up. He's trying to retire,
but hasn't found any takers.

Doug White
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Buerste wrote:

"Steve Lusardi" wrote in message
...
Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you won't
regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure
lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks and not cause
barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the
Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably
harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not
deflect off window glass like lead bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


Read this interesting article.
http://www.lasc.us/FryxellCBAlloyObturation.htm

The more I cast, the more I learn.

very interesting and goes against my preconceptions that hard lead
bullets lead the barrel less.


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"Doug White" wrote in message
...
"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with
newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste,
you won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8%
lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas
checks and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly,
lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is
about 28/29, which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are
much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like
lead bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20
years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place
using Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did
numbering and other specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in
the country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for
anything; the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20
years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned
from hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still
around, to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been
converted to "cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now,
most volume printing is done without any galleys at all. It's
"direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know
where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it
was easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they
printed each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their
product line and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still
have my name cast in a linotype machine there. But as to metal
work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are
they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the
Linotype to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any
one of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same
results, with a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No
loss of quality. No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are
used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding
announcements. And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by
hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size
of three refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or
2 line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if
they have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the
Linotype. But the Linotype produces the same pages for years with
very good quality. And these are expensive books. They may have
changed now, but in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and better
with the linotype. The use offset printing.


Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I
won't belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large
masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it
mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when
I worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's
more appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No
equipment is needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a
line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype
standard alloy. That's more likely.


My cousin runs a one-man print shop on Cape Cod that specializes in odd
jobs that other printers won't (or can't) handle. Things like
sequentially numbered tickets. He still has a Linotype machine, but he
seldom has a job that makes it worth firing up. He's trying to retire,
but hasn't found any takers.

Doug White


Selling a Linotype machine today is about like trying to sell a numerically
controlled lathe that uses pneumatic logic. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress



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"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter
than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is
around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago
did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and
other
specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around, to
make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to "cold
type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume printing is
done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate" computer
imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know
where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed
each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line
and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast
in a linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are
they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype
to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one
of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results, with
a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of quality. No
loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are
used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding announcements.
And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by hand, rather than
use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size of three
refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or 2
line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if they
have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the Linotype.
But the Linotype produces the same pages for years with very good
quality. And these are expensive books. They may have changed now, but
in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and better with the linotype. The
use offset printing.


Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I won't
belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large masses
of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it mechanically
drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when I
worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's more
appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No equipment is
needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype standard
alloy. That's more likely.

--
Ed Huntress


The Linotype machine casts the column of type. Yes they hand set the type
into a large frame. They said it was cheaper than redoing the page and
remaking the whole printing web (I think that is what it is called). I
designed the disk controllers for the Vax computer systems they used. And
as to mechanical, Linotype machines are fantastic. The difference in width
of each character plate allowing the machine to sort the chacter back into
the proper slot.


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"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter
than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is
around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago
did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and
other
specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around,
to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to
"cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume
printing is done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate"
computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know
where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed
each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line
and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name cast
in a linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are
they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype
to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one
of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results, with
a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of quality.
No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are
used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding announcements.
And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by hand, rather than
use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size of three
refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or 2
line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if they
have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the Linotype.
But the Linotype produces the same pages for years with very good
quality. And these are expensive books. They may have changed now, but
in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and better with the linotype.
The use offset printing.


Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I won't
belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large
masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it
mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when I
worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's more
appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No equipment is
needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a line or two of
type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype standard
alloy. That's more likely.

--
Ed Huntress


The Linotype machine casts the column of type. Yes they hand set the type
into a large frame. They said it was cheaper than redoing the page and
remaking the whole printing web (I think that is what it is called). I
designed the disk controllers for the Vax computer systems they used. And
as to mechanical, Linotype machines are fantastic. The difference in
width of each character plate allowing the machine to sort the chacter
back into the proper slot.


They certainly are masterful mechanical devices. That difference in letter
width, and the kerning (letterspacing) adjustments are amazing. To me,
they're like giant Curta Calculators -- a zenith of mechanical art, just
before it became obsolete. g

There used to be thousands of them around. We had six of the Linotype-Hell
Model 6's at a secondary office of McGraw-Hill when I was hired there
(1973). But before I actually started, a month later, they had been moved
into the warehouse, replaced by a new Wang typesetting system that ran on a
minicomputer with around 15 terminals.

In New York, where they published 20 of our 26 magazines, they must have had
dozens of them. I transferred there a few years later and they were all
gone, replaced by a fancy computer typesetting system. Today, I could do the
same work with a dozen decent typists working at PCs.

However, they don't even bother with typists anymore. Writers write on PCs;
editors edit the file; the artists lay out the page and the files go
straight to the printer. But they don't print out the pages, except for
proofreading. They don't even make film. They go straight to printing plates
from the computer files.

And it's all pretty cheap.

--
Ed Huntress



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"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with
newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste,
you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter
than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is
around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better
penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago
did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place
using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and
other
specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for
anything; the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20
years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned from
hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still around,
to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been converted to
"cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And now, most volume
printing is done without any galleys at all. It's "direct to plate"
computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to know
where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it was
easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they printed
each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their product line
and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still have my name
cast in a linotype machine there. But as to metal work, they are the
bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g Are
they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the Linotype
to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any one
of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same results,
with a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No loss of
quality. No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses are
used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding
announcements. And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by
hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the size
of three refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from "Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1 or 2
line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print. But if they
have to change a whole chapter then they use other than the Linotype.
But the Linotype produces the same pages for years with very good
quality. And these are expensive books. They may have changed now, but
in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and better with the linotype.
The use offset printing.

Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I
won't belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not Linotype.
Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for setting large
masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a keyboard and it
mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school, when I
worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called Princeton
Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype, but it's more
appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred words. No equipment is
needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial for just a line or two of
type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype standard
alloy. That's more likely.

--
Ed Huntress


The Linotype machine casts the column of type. Yes they hand set the
type into a large frame. They said it was cheaper than redoing the page
and remaking the whole printing web (I think that is what it is called).
I designed the disk controllers for the Vax computer systems they used.
And as to mechanical, Linotype machines are fantastic. The difference in
width of each character plate allowing the machine to sort the chacter
back into the proper slot.


They certainly are masterful mechanical devices. That difference in letter
width, and the kerning (letterspacing) adjustments are amazing. To me,
they're like giant Curta Calculators -- a zenith of mechanical art, just
before it became obsolete. g

There used to be thousands of them around. We had six of the Linotype-Hell
Model 6's at a secondary office of McGraw-Hill when I was hired there
(1973). But before I actually started, a month later, they had been moved
into the warehouse, replaced by a new Wang typesetting system that ran on
a minicomputer with around 15 terminals.

In New York, where they published 20 of our 26 magazines, they must have
had dozens of them. I transferred there a few years later and they were
all gone, replaced by a fancy computer typesetting system. Today, I could
do the same work with a dozen decent typists working at PCs.

However, they don't even bother with typists anymore. Writers write on
PCs; editors edit the file; the artists lay out the page and the files go
straight to the printer. But they don't print out the pages, except for
proofreading. They don't even make film. They go straight to printing
plates from the computer files.

And it's all pretty cheap.

--
Ed Huntress




This company printed a new tax guide for Accountants and lawyers every year.
90% of the book was the same, so they said it was cheaper with the linotype.
They had used some of the same frames for years with no changes.


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On 1/21/2010 9:04 PM, Ed Huntress wrote:

They certainly are masterful mechanical devices.


You can see them again on your next trip south.

http://www.thebmi.org/index.cfm/cID/...TOKEN=15611222

Kevin Gallimore


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"Buerste" wrote in message
...

"Steve Lusardi" wrote in message
...
Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you won't regret
it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They
can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks and not cause barrel leading.
If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and
Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets
are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead
bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve



I have a friend still trying to get rid of a goodly pile of linotype and
monotype material - contact me if interested (remember, don't reply here,
get my email off my web page, wbnoble.com

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On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:42:24 -0800, "Bill Noble"
wrote:



"Buerste" wrote in message
...

"Steve Lusardi" wrote in message
...
Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper
printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you won't regret
it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They
can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks and not cause barrel leading.
If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and
Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets
are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead
bullets do. Don't ask how I know that.
Steve



I have a friend still trying to get rid of a goodly pile of linotype and
monotype material - contact me if interested (remember, don't reply here,
get my email off my web page, wbnoble.com


Yes!

Emailed!!

Gunner

The current Democratic party has lost its ideological basis for
existence.
- It is NOT fiscally responsible.
- It is NOT ethically honorable.
- It has started wars based on lies.
- It does not support the well-being of americans - only billionaires.
- It has suppresed constitutional guaranteed liberties.
- It has foisted a liar as president upon America.
- It has violated US national sovereignty in trade treaties.
- It has refused to enforce the national borders.

....It no longer has valid reasons to exist.
Lorad474
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"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Doug White" wrote in message
...
"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with
newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their
waste, you won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast
about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS
without gas checks and not cause barrel leading. If I remember
correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and
Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably harder.
Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not
deflect off window glass like lead bullets do. Don't ask how I
know that. Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of
20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place
using Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did
numbering and other specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in
the country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for
anything; the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20
years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned
from hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still
around, to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been
converted to "cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And
now, most volume printing is done without any galleys at all.
It's "direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to
know where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it
was easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they
printed each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their
product line and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still
have my name cast in a linotype machine there. But as to metal
work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g
Are they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the
Linotype to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any
one of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same
results, with a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No
loss of quality. No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses
are used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding
announcements. And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by
hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the
size of three refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from
"Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1
or 2 line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print.
But if they have to change a whole chapter then they use other than
the Linotype. But the Linotype produces the same pages for years
with very good quality. And these are expensive books. They may
have changed now, but in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and
better with the linotype. The use offset printing.

Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I
won't belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not
Linotype. Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for
setting large masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a
keyboard and it mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of
a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school,
when I worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called
Princeton Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype,
but it's more appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred
words. No equipment is needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial
for just a line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype
standard alloy. That's more likely.


My cousin runs a one-man print shop on Cape Cod that specializes in
odd jobs that other printers won't (or can't) handle. Things like
sequentially numbered tickets. He still has a Linotype machine, but
he seldom has a job that makes it worth firing up. He's trying to
retire, but hasn't found any takers.

Doug White


Selling a Linotype machine today is about like trying to sell a
numerically controlled lathe that uses pneumatic logic. d8-)


He's trying to sell the whole business, and the Linotype machine is just
a part of the deal. Unless he can find a museum that wants it, it's
probably going to get scrapped. There's LOT of metal in one of those
things. Most of his gear is museum stuff anyway.

Doug White
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"Doug White" wrote in message
...
"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Doug White" wrote in message
...
"Ed Huntress" wrote in
:


"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Bill McKee" wrote in message
m...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

"Pete C." wrote in message
ster.com...

Steve Lusardi wrote:

Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with
newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their
waste, you won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast
about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS
without gas checks and not cause barrel leading. If I remember
correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and
Linotype is about 28/29, which is considerably harder.
Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not
deflect off window glass like lead bullets do. Don't ask how I
know that. Steve


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does
anyone use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of
20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place
using Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did
numbering and other specialty stuff.

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in
the country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for
anything; the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20
years ago.

The offset and rotogravure presses had plates that were burned
from hard-type originals for a long while, so Linotype was still
around, to make the "hot type" masters. But that's all been
converted to "cold type" -- computer-generated galleys. And
now, most volume printing is done without any galleys at all.
It's "direct to plate" computer imaging.

If someone still has a source of Linotype metal, I'd like to
know where it's coming from.

--
Ed Huntress


A couple of companies I worked with still used Linotype. Said it
was easier / cheaper and better for small changes in books they
printed each year. They printed tax guides as one part of their
product line and lots of pages rarely changed. Somewhere I still
have my name cast in a linotype machine there. But as to metal
work, they are the bomb.

Man, there's somebody who doesn't believe in new technology. g
Are they printing the books on letterpress? Or are they using the
Linotype to make galleys for offset printing?

If it's the latter, here's a secret you might pass on to them: Any
one of us can do exactly the same thing, and produce the same
results, with a home computer and a decent laser printer today. No
loss of quality. No loss of anything.

If, on the other hand, they're printing by letterpress, then holy
hell...I can't imagine how it's easier or cheaper. Letterpresses
are used today for things like fancy invitations and wedding
announcements. And a few hobbyists have them, but they set type by
hand, rather than use Linotype. A Linotype machine is about the
size of three refrigerators and looks like the giant insect from
"Alien."

The fuzzy serifs do have a kind of nostalgic quality, though. g

--
Ed Huntress


No, they have banks of pages in linotype. So if there is only a 1
or 2 line change in a chapter, easy to change, and great print.
But if they have to change a whole chapter then they use other than
the Linotype. But the Linotype produces the same pages for years
with very good quality. And these are expensive books. They may
have changed now, but in 1990, they said it was much cheaper and
better with the linotype. The use offset printing.

Hmm. We're not communicating. d8-) However, it's a side issue, so I
won't belabor it.

My guess is that you're talking about hand-setting type, not
Linotype. Linotype machines are BIG, expensive suckers used for
setting large masses of type quickly -- pages and pages. It has a
keyboard and it mechanically drops type into slots, making a hell of
a racket.

Hand-setting is done in "sticks," something I did in high school,
when I worked one summer for an old-fashioned printer called
Princeton Photoprocess. It produces the same end result as Linotype,
but it's more appropriate for smaller jobs, up to a few hundred
words. No equipment is needed -- it's all labor, but it's trivial
for just a line or two of type.

In any case, any Linotype metal that's available today must be from
someone's ancient hoard, or freshly alloyed to the old Linotype
standard alloy. That's more likely.

My cousin runs a one-man print shop on Cape Cod that specializes in
odd jobs that other printers won't (or can't) handle. Things like
sequentially numbered tickets. He still has a Linotype machine, but
he seldom has a job that makes it worth firing up. He's trying to
retire, but hasn't found any takers.

Doug White


Selling a Linotype machine today is about like trying to sell a
numerically controlled lathe that uses pneumatic logic. d8-)


He's trying to sell the whole business, and the Linotype machine is just
a part of the deal. Unless he can find a museum that wants it, it's
probably going to get scrapped. There's LOT of metal in one of those
things. Most of his gear is museum stuff anyway.

Doug White


Like old machine tools, Linotypes and other old printing equipment have a
hobby/museum following. A publishing consultant I worked with years ago
travelled all over the world collecting sets of antique type, and he had a
little flat-bed press that he used to make replicas of old printing,
hand-setting the type. Apparently he was part of an international hobby
group that was very serious about it.

However, there were a LOT of Linotype machines around, and lots of them are
sitting in warehouses now, or they've been scrapped. The new technologies
swept through the industry like a tsunami -- something like the way that
wire EDM stood the diemaking business on its head, and at about the same
time: the mid-'70s. Finding a buyer for that old printing equipment must be
tough.

It's not something that artists would pick up, the way they bought up
lithographers' stones or engraving equipment when they became obsolete.

--
Ed Huntress


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On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 20:08:37 -0600, "Pete C."
wrote:
Steve Lusardi wrote:


Look for Linotype, it makes brilliant bullets. Check with newspaper printers and ask them how they dispose of their waste, you
won't regret it. The bullets will typically cast about 8% lighter than pure lead. They can be used to 1800FPS without gas checks
and not cause barrel leading. If I remember correctly, lead is around 9 or 10 on the Brinnel scale and Linotype is about 28/29,
which is considerably harder. Linotype bullets are much better penetrators and do not deflect off window glass like lead bullets
do. Don't ask how I know that.


I've been out of the printing biz for a decade or two, but does anyone
use Linotype anymore? Certainly no newspaper I knew of 20 years ago did,
they all use offset web presses with AL plates. The only place using
Linotype back then was a tiny shop that mostly did numbering and other
specialty stuff.


Actually, yes - Go into any good rubber stamp shop that still does
lots of work, and you'll find a motley assortment of Linotype,
Monotype and Ludlow (Headline sized type - DEWEY BEATS TRUMAN)
machines and every font that the owner can find.

When you make the Bakelite matrice for the stamp the heat distorts
the type metal, so regular movable type goes to heck in a few uses.
Linotype is perfect - you use it once to make a matrice (maybe twice
if you blow the first one) and you can make a hundred stamps from that
one matrice.

Then you throw the used and heat distorted Linotype slug back into
the melt furnace pot for reuse.

If you only make one or a few of a certain stamp, ask the shop if
you can have the matrice too just in case. When the stamp wears out,
you can send the matrice back to get an exact duplicate.

And the photo-resist style plastic stamps flat out don't hold up to
severe service like the old stuff.


-- Bruce --


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"Ed Huntress" wrote:

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything; the
last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.


Back around 1972 or so, I could have learned how to be a linotype operator. My school
system had one and had a course on it. I took typing instead. I figured computers were
in my future and typing would be a head start. Plan worked for me for many years.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller
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"Wes" wrote in message
...
"Ed Huntress" wrote:

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything; the
last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.


Back around 1972 or so, I could have learned how to be a linotype
operator. My school
system had one and had a course on it. I took typing instead. I figured
computers were
in my future and typing would be a head start. Plan worked for me for
many years.

Wes


That was a good move. You would have learned the skill just in time to give
demonstrations at your local museum. g

I knew quite a few typesetters, even the digital kind, who found themselves
out of work with absolutely no prospects. There were waves of them: around
1975, and again around 1985. The last one I knew of worked around 1993.

Of course, that happened to many printing- and publishing-industry jobs over
the same period.

--
Ed Huntress


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On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 21:15:59 -0500, Ed Huntress wrote:

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

There's one in the Baltimore Museum of Industry (geez, R.C.M content).
A retired guy who demonstrates it worked on it in a newspaper, and told
me that they replaced them in the 70s.
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"Przemek Klosowski" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 21:15:59 -0500, Ed Huntress wrote:

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

There's one in the Baltimore Museum of Industry (geez, R.C.M content).
A retired guy who demonstrates it worked on it in a newspaper, and told
me that they replaced them in the 70s.


Yep, someone else posted a note about that one in the Baltimore museum. I'm
tempted to stop in there.

And, yes, most of them disappeared in the '70s. I mentioned here before that
I went to work for McGraw-Hill Publications Co. in '74. I had been hired a
couple of months earlier and they had six Linotype machines operating in a
secondary office. When I started work they had all been moved to the
warehouse, replaced by a Wang computerized phototype ("cold type") system.
That was for promotions and mail solicitations for 26 magazines and
newsletters. The publications themselves were typeset on a much fancier
computerized typesetting system, which replaced another, larger bunch of
Linotypes at about the same time, or slightly earlier. They also handled the
typesetting for McGraw-Hill books.

Those Linotypes and the multi-million-dollar phototype systems can now be
replaced with a desktop PC and a high-quality laser printer. In fact,
though, the whole system has gone away in most publishing houses. The
writers write on computers; the editors edit on computers; the art directors
compose pages on computers; and the output is reproduced directly onto the
printing plates. Along the way they'll print out some proofs for
proofreading, color-checking, etc.

--
Ed Huntress


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On Wed, 27 Jan 2010 23:58:29 -0500, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Przemek Klosowski" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 20 Jan 2010 21:15:59 -0500, Ed Huntress wrote:

I doubt if there is a working Linotype machine in most states in the
country. I don't know of a single magazine that uses it for anything;
the last newspaper I knew of that used it was over 20 years ago.

There's one in the Baltimore Museum of Industry (geez, R.C.M content).
A retired guy who demonstrates it worked on it in a newspaper, and told
me that they replaced them in the 70s.


Yep, someone else posted a note about that one in the Baltimore museum. I'm
tempted to stop in there.

And, yes, most of them disappeared in the '70s. I mentioned here before that
I went to work for McGraw-Hill Publications Co. in '74. I had been hired a
couple of months earlier and they had six Linotype machines operating in a
secondary office. When I started work they had all been moved to the
warehouse, replaced by a Wang computerized phototype ("cold type") system.
That was for promotions and mail solicitations for 26 magazines and
newsletters. The publications themselves were typeset on a much fancier
computerized typesetting system, which replaced another, larger bunch of
Linotypes at about the same time, or slightly earlier. They also handled the
typesetting for McGraw-Hill books.

Those Linotypes and the multi-million-dollar phototype systems can now be
replaced with a desktop PC and a high-quality laser printer. In fact,
though, the whole system has gone away in most publishing houses. The
writers write on computers; the editors edit on computers; the art directors
compose pages on computers; and the output is reproduced directly onto the
printing plates. Along the way they'll print out some proofs for
proofreading, color-checking, etc.

From reading newspapers, I suspect that the last proof reader retired
about ten years ago.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada
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