Ignoramus26134 wrote:

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those welthy people?


I believe the idea that wealthy people are the major source of Republican funding is an
often repeated fallacy.

In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

That is true. I want to know just how much I am paying for that everything.

There is an art of hiding the knife in politics when it comes to taxes. They want the
money, they just don't want you to see where it came from for fear you will revolt.

Wes


--

The most dangerous tyrant in America is a 'Policy Wonk'.

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 07:05:40 -0600, Ignoramus12571
wrote:


In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

i
The big question I ask you Comrade,,,,is the Government supposed to
provide that magic "everything" you keep talking about?

No, but we will pay eventually for all government expenses, even if
funded by government debt. It is better to start paying earlier, than
later.


So rather than put a halt to what the government pays for, growing in
size like the old Soviet..taking control of all busines...we should just
cough up the money and feed it to them so they can turn into the Soviet?

I have always been supportive of taxes that reflect the level of
government spending. Unlike you, for example, I pay considerable
amount of taxes, so this support is not because I want others to pay
for something.

i

Of course Comrade. You came to America and want to change it to the very
nation you escaped from.

One strongly recommends you read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights
again and again until you see the flaws in your world view.

Gunner



"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:a5cc7a67-5ce7-
:

Ever hear of going without?

And other AMERICAN companies who DO hire Americans do make comparable
products.


Ever hear of REALITY?

The Average American Consumer couldn't care less where a product is made
so long as it doesn't cost him very much.

This is proven by the failure of the many "Buy American" campaigns that,
with few exceptions, have failed miserably.

The FACT is that large US manufacturers are laying off American workers
in favor of paying a tenth of the over-bloated Union wages to workers who
happen to live where the taxes are cheap.

You can thank the Unions for the destruction of America.

"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message
...
On 2009-12-05, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Fri, 04 Dec 2009 20:56:21 -0600, Ignoramus26134
wrote:

On 2009-12-05, Wes wrote:
Ignoramus26134 wrote:

Emerson products usually are not immediately visible to a buyer of any
product. I would not expect anyone to stop buying goods with Emerson
products just because its CEO threw a hissy fit at some conference.

IIRC, Emerson made the Rigid brand of power tools for Homedespot and
other box stores.
They also make a lot of motors.

I believe that Ridgid is Ridge tool in Pennsylvania.

When your competition is moving to China and our current government
thinks business is still the cash cow to milk, I'd have similar
views.

I really hate corporate taxes, those get paid by the consumers but
we the consumers don't see how those taxes empty our pockets.

This is a distinction between the Dems and the Republicans. Dems
like taxing corporations so consumers don't see how it affects them.
Republicans don't like taxing corporations since that is where jobs
exist.

Eventually we have to pay for everything but I truly believe, the
Republicans want the guy or gal working for a living to see what
government is costing him. The Dems, the party of government,
doesn't want you to see how the parasitic constituency empties your
pocket.
1
I think that we should separate the "what" from "why".

Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

I think that you are right by saying so.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those welthy people?

In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

i
The big question I ask you Comrade,,,,is the Government supposed to
provide that magic "everything" you keep talking about?

No, but we will pay eventually for all government expenses, even if
funded by government debt. It is better to start paying earlier, than
later.

I have always been supportive of taxes that reflect the level of
government spending. Unlike you, for example, I pay considerable
amount of taxes, so this support is not because I want others to pay
for something.

i

I don't mind paying taxes, I mind paying for "Murtha Airport", "Bridges to
Nowhere" and other absolute CRAP that the government spends my money on and
the people that they let steal it.

"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

"Buerste" wrote in message
...

"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are
Republicans when the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Wall Street goes with the winner, and they're smart enough to realize it
would be a Democrat that would win in 2008.

You can look up the final figures if you're interested, but as of Mar. 2008,
it looked like this, counting the securities and investment industry; their
employees; and their PACs:

Clinton: $6.29 million
Obama: 6.03 million
McCain: 2.59 million

But they don't care which party the winner is coming from; they just want to
be on board with the winner. Here's how it's looked in other recent
presidential elections:

2004:

Bush: $8.8 million
Kerry: 4.3 million

2000:

Bush: $4.0 million
Go 1.4 million

They're neither Democrats nor Republicans. What they are is Winners -- or
whores, as you prefer.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

And don't be blinded by yours, Tom.

--
Ed Huntress

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 13:06:38 -0600, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

Another example is "economic development" grants. [Why not
a 5 million dollar unrestricted state grant to Gunner for
"research?"]


Ooooh! I like it! Tell me more! And Id be perfectly happy with just
2.5 million for "research"


Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:


"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.



True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner



"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

On 2009-12-05, Buerste wrote:

"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message
I have always been supportive of taxes that reflect the level of
government spending. Unlike you, for example, I pay considerable
amount of taxes, so this support is not because I want others to pay
for something.

I don't mind paying taxes, I mind paying for "Murtha Airport", "Bridges to
Nowhere" and other absolute CRAP that the government spends my money on and
the people that they let steal it.


I agree with that. In such a case, I would direct my ire at those
projects, as opposed to the taxes that they necessitate.

i

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:


"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.



True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner


All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto. But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto. But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message
...
On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto.
But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

You do mean Bush AND Congress, don't you? They ALL screwed up. But, blame
Bush alone if it makes you happy.

On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 22:31:52 -0600, Ignoramus12571
wrote:

On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto. But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

I think you just became confused.

Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:

"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message
...
On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto.
But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

You do mean Bush AND Congress, don't you? They ALL screwed up. But, blame
Bush alone if it makes you happy.


I place blame squarely on the Republican party and Bush for that one.

i

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:


"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.



True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government
services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

"azotic" wrote in message
...
One of the country's most important industrial companies says the United
States is not a good place to manufacture and it will continue moving its
assets offshore.


Continue, as they have been doing for at least 50 years, making crummy
motors in Mexico:

Emerson Motor Technologies' operations in Monterrey, Mexico, has reached 50
years of service. Founded in 1955, the Motores U.S. de Mexico facility
started with just 18 employees and now employs over 1,000 people.

"We are extremely proud of the administration, staff and employees at our
Motores U.S. de Mexico plant for their tireless commitment to producing high
quality U.S. motor products year after year after year," said Jim Lindemann,
chairman of Emerson Motor Co. "They continue to demonstrate excellence in
customer service by ensuring that our distributors, OEMs and end-user
customers have a consistent, high quality supply of U.S. Motors products
available to ...



http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-143724197.html

The Emerson burner motor on a Beckett oil burner is a good example of the
"high quality supply of U.S. Motors products"

On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 00:47:04 -0500, Ed Huntress wrote:
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:42:34 -0500, "ATP*"
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste"
"Ignoramus26134" wrote in
message ...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on
their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because
they like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or,
perhaps, maybe it is because Republicans get donations from those
wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from
Russia..and as such...his entire mental background has been formed on
the Soviet ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free
government services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

But hey...spew all you want. Im now a Democrat..and as such, deserve
everything the Party gives me. And you are bitching about it? Talk to
your masters in the DNC and complain.

Laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh!!

Jeez, Gunner, the way you're plonking everyone who makes you look foolish,
you'll soon be able to fit your whole little group into a couple of body
bags.

Liberals don't recognize sarcasm either?

Thanks,
Rich

On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:42:34 -0500, "ATP*"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:


"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.



True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government
services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

But hey...spew all you want. Im now a Democrat..and as such, deserve
everything the Party gives me. And you are bitching about it? Talk to
your masters in the DNC and complain.

Laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh!!

plink


Gunner


"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." Grey Ghost

On Dec 5, 7:05*am, Ignoramus12571 ignoramus12...@NOSPAM.
12571.invalid wrote:
On 2009-12-05, Gunner Asch wrote:





On Fri, 04 Dec 2009 20:56:21 -0600, Ignoramus26134
wrote:

On 2009-12-05, Wes wrote:
Ignoramus26134 wrote:

Emerson products usually are not immediately visible to a buyer of any
product. I would not expect anyone to stop buying goods with Emerson
products just because its CEO threw a hissy fit at some conference.

IIRC, Emerson made the Rigid brand of power tools for Homedespot and other box stores.
They also make a lot of motors.

I believe that Ridgid is Ridge tool in Pennsylvania.

When your competition is moving to China and our current government
thinks business is still the cash cow to milk, I'd have similar
views.

I really hate corporate taxes, those get paid by the consumers but
we the consumers don't see how those taxes empty our pockets.

This is a distinction between the Dems and the Republicans. *Dems
like taxing corporations so consumers don't see how it affects them.
Republicans don't like taxing corporations since that is where jobs
exist.

Eventually we have to pay for everything but I truly believe, the
Republicans want the guy or gal working for a living to see what
government is costing him. *The Dems, the party of government,
doesn't want you to see how the parasitic constituency empties your
pocket.
1
I think that we should separate the "what" from "why".

Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

I think that you are right by saying so.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those welthy people?

In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

i
The big question I ask you Comrade,,,,is the Government supposed to
provide that magic "everything" you keep talking about?

No, but we will pay eventually for all government expenses, even if
funded by government debt. It is better to start paying earlier, than
later.

I have always been supportive of taxes that reflect the level of
government spending. Unlike you, for example, I pay considerable
amount of taxes, so this support is not because I want others to pay
for something.

i- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Spoken like a responsible American.

Gunner could learn much from Ig.

TMT

On Dec 5, 7:29*am, Wes wrote:
Ignoramus26134 wrote:
The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those welthy people?

I believe the idea that wealthy people are the major source of Republican funding is an
often repeated fallacy. *

In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

That is true. *I want to know just how much I am paying for that everything.

There is an art of hiding the knife in politics when it comes to taxes. *They want the
money, they just don't want you to see where it came from for fear you will revolt.

Wes

--

The most dangerous tyrant in America is a 'Policy Wonk'.

So is that how George Bush ran up a TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICIT?

TMT

On Dec 5, 11:21*am, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sat, 05 Dec 2009 07:05:40 -0600, Ignoramus12571

wrote:

In any case, as you pointed out, eventually we have to pay for
everything.

i
The big question I ask you Comrade,,,,is the Government supposed to
provide that magic "everything" you keep talking about?

No, but we will pay eventually for all government expenses, even if
funded by government debt. It is better to start paying earlier, than
later.

So rather than put a halt to what the government pays for, growing in
size like the old Soviet..taking control of all busines...we should just
cough up the money and feed it to them so they can turn into the Soviet?

I have always been supportive of taxes that reflect the level of
government spending. Unlike you, for example, I pay considerable
amount of taxes, so this support is not because I want others to pay
for something.

i

Of course Comrade. You came to America and want to change it to the very
nation you escaped from.

One strongly recommends you read the Constitution and the Bill of Rights
again and again until you see the flaws in your world view.

Gunner

"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." *Grey Ghost

Hey...I think I agree with Gunner about cutting government spending.

Let's start first with all the welfare that Gunner has been getting.

Next let get all the back taxes that he hasn't paid for decades.

TMT

On Dec 5, 1:35*pm, Eregon wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:a5cc7a67-5ce7-
:

Ever hear of going without?

And other AMERICAN companies who DO hire Americans do make comparable
products.

Ever hear of REALITY?

The Average American Consumer couldn't care less where a product is made
so long as it doesn't cost him very much.

This is proven by the failure of the many "Buy American" campaigns that,
with few exceptions, have failed miserably.

The FACT is that large US manufacturers are laying off American workers
in favor of paying a tenth of the over-bloated Union wages to workers who
happen to live where the taxes are cheap.

You can thank the Unions for the destruction of America.

Better pay attention.

Americans DO CARE where a product is made.

Otherwise why do companies go to incredible lengths to hide where
their products come from?

And why are companies fighting the labeling of food origin?

Give Americans the information they need and they will vote with their
dollars.

TMT

On Dec 5, 1:35*pm, Eregon wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:a5cc7a67-5ce7-
:

Ever hear of going without?

And other AMERICAN companies who DO hire Americans do make comparable
products.

Ever hear of REALITY?

The Average American Consumer couldn't care less where a product is made
so long as it doesn't cost him very much.

This is proven by the failure of the many "Buy American" campaigns that,
with few exceptions, have failed miserably.

The FACT is that large US manufacturers are laying off American workers
in favor of paying a tenth of the over-bloated Union wages to workers who
happen to live where the taxes are cheap.

You can thank the Unions for the destruction of America.

And you can thank George Bush for the destruction of America.

And you helped him do it.

TMT

On Dec 5, 1:53*pm, "Buerste" wrote:
"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message

...

snip

Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? *The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

Wall Street started donating to Democrats because they decided that
the Republicans were destroying the Country.

LOL...yeah...your own friends turned on you.

Just like Cheney shooting his friends in the face.

TMT

On Dec 5, 2:15*pm, "Ed Huntress" wrote:
"Buerste" wrote in message

...







"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something like a 4-to-1 ratio? *The falacy is that the "wealthy" are
Republicans when the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Wall Street goes with the winner, and they're smart enough to realize it
would be a Democrat that would win in 2008.

You can look up the final figures if you're interested, but as of Mar. 2008,
it looked like this, counting the securities and investment industry; their
employees; and their PACs:

Clinton: $6.29 million
Obama: 6.03 million
McCain: 2.59 million

But they don't care which party the winner is coming from; they just want to
be on board with the winner. Here's how it's looked in other recent
presidential elections:

2004:

Bush: $8.8 million
Kerry: 4.3 million

2000:

Bush: $4.0 million
Go 1.4 million

They're neither Democrats nor Republicans. What they are is Winners -- or
whores, as you prefer.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

And don't be blinded by yours, Tom.

--
Ed Huntress- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Well said.

TMT

"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:42:34 -0500, "ATP*"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
. ..
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:


"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on
their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.



True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government
services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

But hey...spew all you want. Im now a Democrat..and as such, deserve
everything the Party gives me. And you are bitching about it? Talk to
your masters in the DNC and complain.

Laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh!!

plink


Gunner

Jeez, Gunner, the way you're plonking everyone who makes you look foolish,
you'll soon be able to fit your whole little group into a couple of body
bags.

But no, you've never paid a fraction of your own healthcare. You've never
even paid the interest on it. What's actually happened is that you've just
become what you once despised, and now you're flopping like a flounder
trying to justify yourself.

Don't think you have anyone fooled. And don't fight it so hard. If you think
about what's happened to you, you may even come to realize why what you
*were* is the thing that really should be despised. Now that you're on the
other side of that coin, you ought to take the opportunity to think about
what it all means.

--
Ed Huntress

On Dec 5, 5:23*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:

"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? *The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." *Grey Ghost- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Sad attempt by Gunner to smear Ig noted.

It didn't work.

Ig is a credit to America.

Gunner is a smear of roadkill.

The end result of a Conservative Cull that is currently occurring.

TMT

On Dec 5, 10:31*pm, Ignoramus12571 ignoramus12...@NOSPAM.
12571.invalid wrote:
On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto. *But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

A sign of an intelligent individual.

TMT

On Dec 6, 3:48*am, "Buerste" wrote:
"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message

...





On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto.
But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

You do mean Bush AND Congress, don't you? *They ALL screwed up. *But, blame
Bush alone if it makes you happy.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

You mean Bush and the Republican Congress.

TMT

On Dec 6, 9:47*am, Ignoramus19850 ignoramus19...@NOSPAM.
19850.invalid wrote:
On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:







"Ignoramus12571" wrote in message
m...
On 2009-12-06, Buerste wrote:
Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia...and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

All the "imports" I have known have embraced conservatism with gusto.
But,
they moved away from really bad situations.

I used to fit this description, until Bush attacked Iraq. This opened
my eyes.

i

You do mean Bush AND Congress, don't you? *They ALL screwed up. *But, blame
Bush alone if it makes you happy.

I place blame squarely on the Republican party and Bush for that one.

i- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

As do millions of fellow Americans.

TMT

On Dec 6, 9:42*pm, "ATP*" wrote:
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message

...



On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:

"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? *The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government
services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

And completely true.

TMT

On Dec 6, 11:08*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:42:34 -0500, "ATP*"
wrote:







"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
.. .
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste" wrote:

"Ignoramus26134" wrote in message
...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because they
like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or, perhaps, maybe
it is because Republicans get donations from those wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? *The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from Russia..and
as such...his entire mental background has been formed on the Soviet
ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

Gunner

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free government
services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Free government services? Which ones? *And free healthcare? *Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

But hey...spew all you want. Im now a Democrat..and as such, deserve
everything the Party gives me. And you are bitching about it? *Talk to
your masters in the DNC and complain. *

Laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh!!

plink

Gunner

"First Law of Leftist Debate
The more you present a leftist with factual evidence
that is counter to his preconceived world view and the
more difficult it becomes for him to refute it without
losing face the chance of him calling you a racist, bigot,
homophobe approaches infinity.

This is despite the thread you are in having not mentioned
race or sexual preference in any way that is relevant to
the subject." *Grey Ghost- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Gunner the Parasite of America

TMT

"Rich Grise" wrote in message
news
On Mon, 07 Dec 2009 00:47:04 -0500, Ed Huntress wrote:
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
On Sun, 6 Dec 2009 22:42:34 -0500, "ATP*"
"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
On Sat, 5 Dec 2009 14:53:50 -0500, "Buerste"
"Ignoramus26134" wrote in
message ...

snip
Republicans like corporations and "the wealthy" to pay less income
taxes.

Interesting, most of Obama's cabinet were caught with "mistakes" on
their
returns.

The next question is why exactly they do so. Maybe it is because
they like downtrodden people? Or maybe it is accidental? Or,
perhaps, maybe it is because Republicans get donations from those
wealthy people?

Interesting, do you know that Wall Street donated to Democrats by
something
like a 4-to-1 ratio? The falacy is that the "wealthy" are Republicans
when
the fact is the "wealthy" are largely Democrats.

Don't be blinded by your bias.

True indeed.

Just keep in mind..that Iggy is in fact an ex communist from
Russia..and as such...his entire mental background has been formed on
the Soviet ideal.

I cut him slack because of this defect in his thinking. He really cant
help it..its so deeply engrained into his world view that it colors
everything he sees and do.

So the ex-communist is making a go of it in this capitalistic system and
paying taxes and you are leeching off the system, getting free
government services and free healthcare. Kind of ironic.

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

But hey...spew all you want. Im now a Democrat..and as such, deserve
everything the Party gives me. And you are bitching about it? Talk to
your masters in the DNC and complain.

Laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh laugh!!

Jeez, Gunner, the way you're plonking everyone who makes you look
foolish,
you'll soon be able to fit your whole little group into a couple of body
bags.

Liberals don't recognize sarcasm either?

Thanks,
Rich

You'd have to ask a liberal to be sure, Rich, but the body bag analogy was,
as you'll notice, sarcasm in its own right.

Gunner is indeed being sarcastic, but he's not making a joke when he says
he's paid for his $300,000-plus in healthcare ($275,000 in this round, and I
think it was $21,000 or $27,000 back in '04, when he had his first heart
attack and the stents). He wants people to believe it. Just ask him if he's
joking about that, or if he's serious.

--
Ed Huntress

On Mon, 7 Dec 2009 00:47:04 -0500, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
.. .

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

Gunner

Jeez, Gunner, the way you're plonking everyone who makes you look foolish,
you'll soon be able to fit your whole little group into a couple of body
bags.

But no, you've never paid a fraction of your own healthcare. You've never
even paid the interest on it. What's actually happened is that you've just
become what you once despised, and now you're flopping like a flounder
trying to justify yourself.

Perhaps you missed the part of gummer's post where he demonstrated yet
again that he should have paid more attention in grade school. He said
he's been paying taxes for 45 years, which would make him 11 when he
started. So he'd have readers believe that he was so civic-minded that
he paid taxes on his paper route and lemonade stand income. Or maybe
he's talking about the taxes on his smokes? Anyway, it seems that he
paid so much back then that 2 decades ago he decided that it would
only be fair if he skipped out on his property taxes in perpetuity.

Even funnier is this thread.
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.p...06c5ec3716c02c.
Gummy's ranch "acreage" (which turns out to be ~56' X 126' according
to the dimensions on his county's online map) has grown yet again!
Only a week or so ago he claimed to "lease" snorf some lots other
than the one he lives on. But now land baron gummer declares: "I own a
quarter of an entire block". Never mind that it would take 7 of the
average lots on his street to make a single acre. But then, perhaps he
"owns" some larger parcels in Beverly Hills as well. :-)

Wayne

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 7 Dec 2009 00:47:04 -0500, "Ed Huntress"
wrote:


"Gunner Asch" wrote in message
. ..

Free government services? Which ones? And free healthcare? Ive paid
for those many many times in the past 45 yrs in taxes alone.

Gunner

Jeez, Gunner, the way you're plonking everyone who makes you look foolish,
you'll soon be able to fit your whole little group into a couple of body
bags.

But no, you've never paid a fraction of your own healthcare. You've never
even paid the interest on it. What's actually happened is that you've just
become what you once despised, and now you're flopping like a flounder
trying to justify yourself.

Perhaps you missed the part of gummer's post where he demonstrated yet
again that he should have paid more attention in grade school. He said
he's been paying taxes for 45 years, which would make him 11 when he
started.

g No, I didn't miss it. I just don't waste time getting involved with
his...ah, stories anymore. If you wanted a good whopper, you may have
noticed in the past week how he had to drop his insurance in October 2008,
which means, if you followed closely and believed his many other statements
on the subject, he had medical insurance for no more than 11 months of the
past 8 years and now is rueing his ill fortune at having had a heart attack
just three months after his insurance terminated. Have you heard the one
about the gang-bangers at the desert pistol range? That one was far more
imaginative. d8-)

I only become annoyed at the constant bigotries and put-downs -- political,
geographical, etc. If that's what he needs to inflate his own self-image,
there's an entire literature on that subject and far be it from me to tell
him what to do about it in his private life. When it becomes public and it
sours the atmosphere, as it does here, I'll say something. Otherwise, you'll
have to catch his whoppers on your own. There certainly are enough of them
flying by to keep you busy.

--
Ed Huntress

In article ,
says...

Have you heard the one about the gang-bangers at the desert pistol
range? That one was far more
imaginative. d8-)


I think my favorite was his snow camping at minus 60 deg. I was born
up here, been here 62 years, and it's never hit -60.

"Yooper" wrote in message
.. .
In article ,
says...

Have you heard the one about the gang-bangers at the desert pistol
range? That one was far more
imaginative. d8-)


I think my favorite was his snow camping at minus 60 deg. I was born
up here, been here 62 years, and it's never hit -60.

Mmm.. he musta used a different scale. g

--
Ed Huntress

On 2009-12-07, Ed Huntress wrote:
Perhaps you missed the part of gummer's post where he demonstrated yet
again that he should have paid more attention in grade school. He said
he's been paying taxes for 45 years, which would make him 11 when he
started.

There is two possibilities of his statement being true:

1) He may be referring to sales taxes
2) Maybe during childhood, he had some investments in his name and had
to pay taxes on capital gains and income.

2 seems highly unlikely and 1 is questionable as to whether it
qualifies as taxes.

g No, I didn't miss it. I just don't waste time getting involved with
his...ah, stories anymore. If you wanted a good whopper, you may have
noticed in the past week how he had to drop his insurance in October 2008,
which means, if you followed closely and believed his many other statements
on the subject, he had medical insurance for no more than 11 months of the
past 8 years and now is rueing his ill fortune at having had a heart attack
just three months after his insurance terminated. Have you heard the one
about the gang-bangers at the desert pistol range? That one was far more
imaginative. d8-)

I have not heard that one.

I only become annoyed at the constant bigotries and put-downs -- political,
geographical, etc. If that's what he needs to inflate his own self-image,
there's an entire literature on that subject and far be it from me to tell
him what to do about it in his private life. When it becomes public and it
sours the atmosphere, as it does here, I'll say something. Otherwise, you'll
have to catch his whoppers on your own. There certainly are enough of them
flying by to keep you busy.

I personally disagree with him trying to discount my political views
by bringing up where I came from. It makes it difficult to have a
meaningful discourse.

i

"Ignoramus8601" wrote in message
...
On 2009-12-07, Ed Huntress wrote:
Perhaps you missed the part of gummer's post where he demonstrated yet
again that he should have paid more attention in grade school. He said
he's been paying taxes for 45 years, which would make him 11 when he
started.

There is two possibilities of his statement being true:

First off, that wasn't me you quoted. I don't call him gummer.


1) He may be referring to sales taxes

In 1963, Michigan's sales tax was raised to 6%. So maybe if was spending,
oh, say $90,000/year. That would be $5,400. Then the tax would go to pay for
all of the things in Michigan's budget that are paid for by sales tax.
Hmmm....maybe if he spent $900,000/year.

That's one hell of an allowance, or a really big paper route.

2) Maybe during childhood, he had some investments in his name and had
to pay taxes on capital gains and income.

Iggy, Iggy...please. d8-)


2 seems highly unlikely and 1 is questionable as to whether it
qualifies as taxes.

g No, I didn't miss it. I just don't waste time getting involved with
his...ah, stories anymore. If you wanted a good whopper, you may have
noticed in the past week how he had to drop his insurance in October
2008,
which means, if you followed closely and believed his many other
statements
on the subject, he had medical insurance for no more than 11 months of
the
past 8 years and now is rueing his ill fortune at having had a heart
attack
just three months after his insurance terminated. Have you heard the one
about the gang-bangers at the desert pistol range? That one was far more
imaginative. d8-)

I have not heard that one.

It was a beauty. Maybe it's still on Google Groups.


I only become annoyed at the constant bigotries and put-downs --
political,
geographical, etc. If that's what he needs to inflate his own self-image,
there's an entire literature on that subject and far be it from me to
tell
him what to do about it in his private life. When it becomes public and
it
sours the atmosphere, as it does here, I'll say something. Otherwise,
you'll
have to catch his whoppers on your own. There certainly are enough of
them
flying by to keep you busy.

I personally disagree with him trying to discount my political views
by bringing up where I came from. It makes it difficult to have a
meaningful discourse.

I was waiting for you to react to that. I had one hell of a message
pre-written, in case Gunner and Tom continued to gang up on you. d8-)

--
Ed Huntress

On Dec 7, 7:25*am, " wrote:
On Dec 7, 5:39*am, Too_Many_Tools wrote:





On Dec 5, 1:35*pm, Eregon wrote:

Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:a5cc7a67-5ce7-
:

Ever hear of going without?

And other AMERICAN companies who DO hire Americans do make comparable
products.

Ever hear of REALITY?

The Average American Consumer couldn't care less where a product is made
so long as it doesn't cost him very much.

This is proven by the failure of the many "Buy American" campaigns that,
with few exceptions, have failed miserably.

The FACT is that large US manufacturers are laying off American workers
in favor of paying a tenth of the over-bloated Union wages to workers who
happen to live where the taxes are cheap.

You can thank the Unions for the destruction of America.

Better pay attention.

Americans DO CARE where a product is made.

Otherwise why do companies go to incredible lengths to hide where
their products come from?

And why are companies fighting the labeling of food origin?

Give Americans the information they need and they will vote with their
dollars.

TMT

Most Americans are not as prejudiced against other countries as you
are. *Many believe that buying products from third world countries
helps those countries to develop economies that pay a decent wage.

TMT apparently wants Americans to only buy products made in America.
Does this describe TMT?

"A bigot is a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her
own opinions and prejudices.

The correct use of the term requires the elements of obstinacy,
irrationality, and animosity toward those of differing devotion.

The origin of the word bigot and bigoterie in English dates back to at
least 1598, via Middle French, and started with the sense of
"religious hypocrite". Forms of bigotry may have a related ideology or
world views."

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Dan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I have no problem buying products from different countries.

I want to know where it was made so I can choose.

Don't you?

Or would you rather be a sheeple led around by your master?

TMT