Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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Default New idea for work bench?

I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty. I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this an
original idea? Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


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Default New idea for work bench?

Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty. I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this an
original idea? Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.



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"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this
an
original idea? Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.




I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


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Default New idea for work bench?

On Jul 12, 12:45*pm, "Buerste" wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. *They get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. *I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. *I filled any imperfections with wood putty. *I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. *The bench
is lagged to the wall. *I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to back,
two feet apart. *The bench should be very functional for a lot of things but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. *And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. *I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! *I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. *Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. *I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. *Is this an
original idea? *Also I'll *put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


You may want to run a couple of pieces of threaded rod through the
glued-up top, though it's probably better to do this before the glue
dries.

Sounds like a very nice pseudo butcher block.
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Default New idea for work bench?

Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench.


Can't remember where I saw it (TMBR?) but I've used
this jeweler's idea to great effect.

To Wit:
Regular shop apron with the entire bottom hem clamped
to the top of the leading edge of your workbench.
Wear the top of the apron like normal. You now
have a large 'catchment' for small parts that would
normally zing off to an undisclosed location on the
floor. This saved my bacon on a couple of occasions.

It's nifty to pick up the part from your 'bib' rather
than go crawling on the floor for 10 minutes looking
for the elusive spring or whatchamacallit.

--Winston


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Default New idea for work bench?

On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this
an
original idea?


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater
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Default New idea for work bench?


"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed
them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench.
They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had
to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at
work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood
putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of
things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the
old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide
x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me
from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is
this
an
original idea?


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an
edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.


I recently ran across a heavy brass oil cup with a hinged lid and 1/8" pipe
thread with some lamp tube screwed into it. It has some burned resin and a
stainless steel screen in it. I haven't seen it for 30? years! When I saw
it, the reaction was: "I can clean that up and use it as an oil cup!" My,
things have changed!


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"Winston" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench.


Can't remember where I saw it (TMBR?) but I've used
this jeweler's idea to great effect.

To Wit:
Regular shop apron with the entire bottom hem clamped
to the top of the leading edge of your workbench.
Wear the top of the apron like normal. You now
have a large 'catchment' for small parts that would
normally zing off to an undisclosed location on the
floor. This saved my bacon on a couple of occasions.

It's nifty to pick up the part from your 'bib' rather
than go crawling on the floor for 10 minutes looking
for the elusive spring or whatchamacallit.

--Winston


On my desk at work, where I often do fine mechanical things, I have a strip
of 1/8" x 1"magnetic tape on the face of the top. No good for brass for
some reason though.


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Default New idea for work bench?

In article ,
"Buerste" wrote:


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I thought they were called: O****! Clips and that it was an inflexible
rule that you never have a replacement in the whole effin' shop.
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"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this
an
original idea?


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater



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Strap sez: "Good idea, Tawm. Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. Banks, etc. use it."

Many years ago I got some heavy-duty carpet left over from the lobby of a bank. Took my hot-melt
glue gun and some shears and fashioned it into a protective covering for my Jensen "Engineers" tool
case. Turned rough-side out, the airlines were never able to gouge the simulated leather of the
tool case.

Bob Swinney

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this
an
original idea?


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.




I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater

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Default New idea for work bench?

On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 01:09:59 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Winston" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench.


Can't remember where I saw it (TMBR?) but I've used
this jeweler's idea to great effect.

To Wit:
Regular shop apron with the entire bottom hem clamped
to the top of the leading edge of your workbench.
Wear the top of the apron like normal. You now
have a large 'catchment' for small parts that would
normally zing off to an undisclosed location on the
floor. This saved my bacon on a couple of occasions.

It's nifty to pick up the part from your 'bib' rather
than go crawling on the floor for 10 minutes looking
for the elusive spring or whatchamacallit.

--Winston


On my desk at work, where I often do fine mechanical things, I have a strip
of 1/8" x 1"magnetic tape on the face of the top.


That's a good idea, too.


No good for brass for some reason though.


Yeah, I had to add brass and aloonimum magnets to mine, too. They're
really, really hard to find for a decent price. Anyone got sources?

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater
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Default New idea for work bench?

On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:49:23 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.


Everyone seemed to use carpet or carpet samples when I
started working the electronics bench.

I think you will find them gone the way of the Dodo Bird
nowadays. Motorola more-or-less said either you put down
anti-static mats and use such practices or were going to
pull affiliation. If your electronics repair wizard still
has a carpet patch on his bench I think I would be looking
for another place to get things serviced...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
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Leon Fisk wrote:
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 22:49:23 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.


Everyone seemed to use carpet or carpet samples when I
started working the electronics bench.

I think you will find them gone the way of the Dodo Bird
nowadays. Motorola more-or-less said either you put down
anti-static mats and use such practices or were going to
pull affiliation. If your electronics repair wizard still
has a carpet patch on his bench I think I would be looking
for another place to get things serviced...


Things still worth repairing or that have parts available can still be
fixed on carpet.

Pretty much most stuff is throw away though.

Where would you even order parts for a $30 DVD player?
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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:21:40 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
Things still worth repairing or that have parts available can still be
fixed on carpet.

Pretty much most stuff is throw away though.

Where would you even order parts for a $30 DVD player?


Static has always been a problem for solid state devices.
One of the training videos I was required to view had a
major resistor distributor highlighted in it. Just inserting
their resistors into a clear plastic bag applied enough
static voltage to them to change their values out of
tolerance. Nearly drove them batty trying figure out what
was going amuck. Hence why you see the pink bags nowadays or
at least that was how they used to come. I've been out of
circulation for ~8 years now.

If it was my DVD player I would carefully open and look for
anything suspicious. Years of fixing similar stuff helps in
figuring out what looks suspicious, but I've quit holding my
breath lately If I couldn't easily spot/find anything I
would end up replacing it. If we actually had to pay the
true price of these things (USA labor rates) they would be
worth fixing. Maybe someday soon when people figure out that
they can no longer afford to buy even imported items because
they don't have a job things will change...

Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


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Leon Fisk wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:21:40 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
Things still worth repairing or that have parts available can still be
fixed on carpet.

Pretty much most stuff is throw away though.

Where would you even order parts for a $30 DVD player?


Static has always been a problem for solid state devices.
One of the training videos I was required to view had a
major resistor distributor highlighted in it. Just inserting
their resistors into a clear plastic bag applied enough
static voltage to them to change their values out of
tolerance. Nearly drove them batty trying figure out what
was going amuck. Hence why you see the pink bags nowadays or
at least that was how they used to come. I've been out of
circulation for ~8 years now.

If it was my DVD player I would carefully open and look for
anything suspicious. Years of fixing similar stuff helps in
figuring out what looks suspicious, but I've quit holding my
breath lately If I couldn't easily spot/find anything I
would end up replacing it. If we actually had to pay the
true price of these things (USA labor rates) they would be


standard steps doesn't apply to throw away electronics. You can't order
the unmarked IC, and there's no service guide. This doesn't even count
that the board would probaly fall apart if any SM parts were removed.
Maybe some parts in the power supply burned up, but again, good luck
finding out what they were. Trying to read the 1 to 3 digits on SM parts
and figuring out what they really are is almost pointless.

It's too bad too. I prefer to fix vs. throw away when possible. Luckily,
my 1998 dvd player still works fine.

Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.


Not everything is 0.000004 micron process and will be destroyed by +4
volts of static.

I'd not take a computer apart on carpet, other things are fine.
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On Jul 13, 4:39*pm, Leon Fisk wrote:
...Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.

Leon Fisk


I have a grounded static mat on this computer table, and cover it with
cardboard or rug scraps to work on dirty stuff. It's the background
he
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/T...65927027495682

The other side of the surplus mat is a good example of the abuse they
will and won't take. It came from the Segway lab where we disassembled
and modified the machines on it. The damage is mainly razor blade cuts
and melted spots. The sharp edges of machined castings didn't really
affect it and grease smears came right off with static mat cleaner,
which is about as strong as Windex.

jsw
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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:13:18 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Leon Fisk wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:21:40 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
Things still worth repairing or that have parts available can still be
fixed on carpet.

Pretty much most stuff is throw away though.

Where would you even order parts for a $30 DVD player?


Static has always been a problem for solid state devices.
One of the training videos I was required to view had a
major resistor distributor highlighted in it. Just inserting
their resistors into a clear plastic bag applied enough
static voltage to them to change their values out of
tolerance. Nearly drove them batty trying figure out what
was going amuck. Hence why you see the pink bags nowadays or
at least that was how they used to come. I've been out of
circulation for ~8 years now.

If it was my DVD player I would carefully open and look for
anything suspicious. Years of fixing similar stuff helps in
figuring out what looks suspicious, but I've quit holding my
breath lately If I couldn't easily spot/find anything I
would end up replacing it. If we actually had to pay the
true price of these things (USA labor rates) they would be


standard steps doesn't apply to throw away electronics. You can't order
the unmarked IC, and there's no service guide. This doesn't even count
that the board would probaly fall apart if any SM parts were removed.
Maybe some parts in the power supply burned up, but again, good luck
finding out what they were. Trying to read the 1 to 3 digits on SM parts
and figuring out what they really are is almost pointless.

It's too bad too. I prefer to fix vs. throw away when possible. Luckily,
my 1998 dvd player still works fine.

Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.


Not everything is 0.000004 micron process and will be destroyed by +4
volts of static.

I'd not take a computer apart on carpet, other things are fine.


I was surprised to discover that static could also mess with the
accuracy of a powder balance. Not an electronic scale, a balance made
by OHaus for Dillon. Setting the balance on a grounded sheet of
aluminum steadied it out nicely. This was midwinter, very dry air.

Your Dillon 650 dispenses powder volumetrically but the initial
setting and adjustments when changing calibers still need to be done
with a balance or scale.

Poke a "drain hole" somewhere in the circumscribed gutter. That's
where you can shove spilled powder rather than suck it into old
sparky the vacuum. Spilled powder can be spread on the lawn or
garden, it's good nitrate fertilizer.
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"Don Foreman" wrote in message
news
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:13:18 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

Leon Fisk wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 20:21:40 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

snip
Things still worth repairing or that have parts available can still be
fixed on carpet.

Pretty much most stuff is throw away though.

Where would you even order parts for a $30 DVD player?

Static has always been a problem for solid state devices.
One of the training videos I was required to view had a
major resistor distributor highlighted in it. Just inserting
their resistors into a clear plastic bag applied enough
static voltage to them to change their values out of
tolerance. Nearly drove them batty trying figure out what
was going amuck. Hence why you see the pink bags nowadays or
at least that was how they used to come. I've been out of
circulation for ~8 years now.

If it was my DVD player I would carefully open and look for
anything suspicious. Years of fixing similar stuff helps in
figuring out what looks suspicious, but I've quit holding my
breath lately If I couldn't easily spot/find anything I
would end up replacing it. If we actually had to pay the
true price of these things (USA labor rates) they would be


standard steps doesn't apply to throw away electronics. You can't order
the unmarked IC, and there's no service guide. This doesn't even count
that the board would probaly fall apart if any SM parts were removed.
Maybe some parts in the power supply burned up, but again, good luck
finding out what they were. Trying to read the 1 to 3 digits on SM parts
and figuring out what they really are is almost pointless.

It's too bad too. I prefer to fix vs. throw away when possible. Luckily,
my 1998 dvd player still works fine.

Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.


Not everything is 0.000004 micron process and will be destroyed by +4
volts of static.

I'd not take a computer apart on carpet, other things are fine.


I was surprised to discover that static could also mess with the
accuracy of a powder balance. Not an electronic scale, a balance made
by OHaus for Dillon. Setting the balance on a grounded sheet of
aluminum steadied it out nicely. This was midwinter, very dry air.

Your Dillon 650 dispenses powder volumetrically but the initial
setting and adjustments when changing calibers still need to be done
with a balance or scale.

Poke a "drain hole" somewhere in the circumscribed gutter. That's
where you can shove spilled powder rather than suck it into old
sparky the vacuum. Spilled powder can be spread on the lawn or
garden, it's good nitrate fertilizer.


I hear the Hornady powder measure is better, Can it be used instead of
Dillon's?


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My suggestions for a work bench:

It depends upon what you're doing at the bench, but the front of mine
gets burned, cut, scraped, oil & paint stained, etc. Having a covering
of 1/4 tempered Masonite handles that nicely. I get 2 uses from a
piece: it gets turned front-to-back when it gets too cut, burned etc.

I have a lip on the front & sides made by bolting 2 x 2 angle flush with
the top (Masonite covers it). This is great for clamping.

My vise is mounted at the side, just below the top, to keep the entire
top of the bench clear for long stuff. Being lower is also
ergonomically better.

" ... lagged to the wall." is very good. It's surprising how easily
even a heavily loaded bench can move when extra leverage is being used
on something in the vise.

Bob


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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 23:46:40 -0500, the infamous Don Foreman
scrawled the following:

Poke a "drain hole" somewhere in the circumscribed gutter. That's
where you can shove spilled powder rather than suck it into old
sparky the vacuum. Spilled powder can be spread on the lawn or
garden, it's good nitrate fertilizer.


Ooh, ooh! I wanna come to your house and throw a lit sparkler on your
lawn to watch it _explode_! g

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater
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Larry Jaques wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 23:46:40 -0500, the infamous Don Foreman
scrawled the following:

Poke a "drain hole" somewhere in the circumscribed gutter. That's
where you can shove spilled powder rather than suck it into old
sparky the vacuum. Spilled powder can be spread on the lawn or
garden, it's good nitrate fertilizer.


Ooh, ooh! I wanna come to your house and throw a lit sparkler on your
lawn to watch it _explode_! g


If you ignite unconfined modern smokeless gunpowder, it just burns. If
you confine it, it burns faster, but it still doesn't explode, even
inside a cartridge fired in a firearm.

David
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"Bob Engelhardt" wrote in message
...
My suggestions for a work bench:

It depends upon what you're doing at the bench, but the front of mine gets
burned, cut, scraped, oil & paint stained, etc. Having a covering of 1/4
tempered Masonite handles that nicely. I get 2 uses from a piece: it gets
turned front-to-back when it gets too cut, burned etc.

I have a lip on the front & sides made by bolting 2 x 2 angle flush with
the top (Masonite covers it). This is great for clamping.

My vise is mounted at the side, just below the top, to keep the entire top
of the bench clear for long stuff. Being lower is also ergonomically
better.

" ... lagged to the wall." is very good. It's surprising how easily even
a heavily loaded bench can move when extra leverage is being used on
something in the vise.

Bob


Good ideas! As a "home" workbench, I hope it's more for show than actual
work.


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"David R.Birch" fired this volley in
:

If
you confine it, it burns faster, but it still doesn't explode, even
inside a cartridge fired in a firearm.


Ummm... den whut's dat big NOISE I hears ever time I pulls duh
trigger?

"Explode" only means - in connotation - to burn quickly enough to
produce a rapid enough expansion of gas to make a loud noise or do
work. Gasses in a modern reciprocating engine "explode", even when
burning smoothly, but do not "detonate" when working properly.

Are you sure you didn't mean "detonate", which has a specific meaning
as applies to explosives? (flame front progresses through the medium
faster than the speed of sound in the medium [and more stuff, but it's
boring]).

LLoyd
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In article , Buerste
wrote:

I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty. I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this an
original idea? Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Your idea wouldn't do me any good. I am usually standing a foot or more
away from the workbench surface when I drop my last 2-56 torx flathead
into the pile of swarf on the floor.

-Frank

--
Here's some of my work:
http://www.franksknives.com/


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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:13:18 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:

big snip)
Not everything is 0.000004 micron process and will be destroyed by +4
volts of static.

I'd not take a computer apart on carpet, other things are fine.


If you can feel it at all, figure upwards of 3000 volts.
Those nice carpet scuff zaps are more likely 5000-6000
volts, or so the story goes.

The plastic bag scenario, training video was a long time
ago, but as I recall it was several thousand volts involved.
Remember, this was changing the value of a resistor as they
were being placed into a plastic bag. A measly 4 volts won't
do that.

They were also finding that damage was being done to
semiconductors, but not enough to cause an immediate
failure. By dissecting exposed (to zaps, but still working)
semiconductor devices in the lab they could document areas
where they had been weakened internally. It was interesting
stuff.

Most of the parts can be ID'd okay, but finding some of the
more specialized ones can be a problem. An even bigger
problem is figuring out how to calibrate/align things
without instructions. The stuff I repaired for the most part
had good manuals, with instructions describing how the
circuit was suppose to work, layout, schematic, parts
listing... Sometimes you had to fly
by-the-seat-of-your-pants though. Experience helps a lot,
but that isn't always enough either (shrug).

Some things can't be replaced anymore. They just don't
make'em. My labor is dirt cheap and amusement/learning can
be priceless.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 15:06:50 -0700 (PDT), Jim Wilkins
wrote:

snip
I have a grounded static mat on this computer table, and cover it with
cardboard or rug scraps to work on dirty stuff. It's the background
he
http://picasaweb.google.com/KB1DAL/T...65927027495682


The mats we had at work were soft too. They held up well to
most chemicals and mild abrasions. Almost all the radio gear
went right on the mat, but I didn't always use the wrist
strap depending on what it was and what I was doing to it.
We had a cement floor which I'm sure helped a bunch too.

I put down something sacrificial too if I figured it would
tear up the mat.

There were some harder mats/surfaces coming on the market as
I was getting out. Would like to have looked them over in
person as maybe a more durable surface. Doesn't matter much
anymore. Now you just have to know how to pack & ship, open
and re-unite product with said customer...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
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On Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:34:31 -0500, the infamous "David R.Birch"
scrawled the following:

Larry Jaques wrote:
On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 23:46:40 -0500, the infamous Don Foreman
scrawled the following:

Poke a "drain hole" somewhere in the circumscribed gutter. That's
where you can shove spilled powder rather than suck it into old
sparky the vacuum. Spilled powder can be spread on the lawn or
garden, it's good nitrate fertilizer.


Ooh, ooh! I wanna come to your house and throw a lit sparkler on your
lawn to watch it _explode_! g


If you ignite unconfined modern smokeless gunpowder, it just burns. If
you confine it, it burns faster, but it still doesn't explode, even
inside a cartridge fired in a firearm.


Aw, c'mon, Davey. We're playing here. The seriousity factor was zero.
Everyone but them thar gun-grabbin' Liberals knew I was joshing.

P.S: After a quick wetting during the daily watering, the powder would
no longer be granular and wouldn't be lighting, anyway.

--
Mistrust the man who finds everything good, the man who finds everything
evil, and still more the man who is indifferent to everything.
-- Johann K. Lavater
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Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
"David R.Birch" fired this volley in
:

If
you confine it, it burns faster, but it still doesn't explode, even
inside a cartridge fired in a firearm.


Ummm... den whut's dat big NOISE I hears ever time I pulls duh
trigger?

"Explode" only means - in connotation - to burn quickly enough to
produce a rapid enough expansion of gas to make a loud noise or do
work. Gasses in a modern reciprocating engine "explode", even when
burning smoothly, but do not "detonate" when working properly.

Are you sure you didn't mean "detonate", which has a specific meaning
as applies to explosives? (flame front progresses through the medium
faster than the speed of sound in the medium [and more stuff, but it's
boring]).

LLoyd


You're right, but I was responding to someone who thought he could
make unconfined gun powder explode by just igniting it. It would
neither explode nor detonate, just burn.

David
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On Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:47:26 -0400, "Buerste" wrote:

I hear the Hornady powder measure is better, Can it be used instead of
Dillon's?

I don't know. I use a Dillon Square Deal. Got a heckuva deal on it
and it's met my needs very nicely. The powder measure on it works
well enough as doesn't matter for handgun ammo. It keeps a tolerance
of 0.1 grain or so and I don't load handgun ammo anywhere near max
pressure so 0.1 grain is plenty close enough for me.

I use a Rockchucker for rifle ammo and I weigh every charge.


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"Don Foreman" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:47:26 -0400, "Buerste" wrote:

I hear the Hornady powder measure is better, Can it be used instead of
Dillon's?

I don't know. I use a Dillon Square Deal. Got a heckuva deal on it
and it's met my needs very nicely. The powder measure on it works
well enough as doesn't matter for handgun ammo. It keeps a tolerance
of 0.1 grain or so and I don't load handgun ammo anywhere near max
pressure so 0.1 grain is plenty close enough for me.

I use a Rockchucker for rifle ammo and I weigh every charge.


The guys at the shop are spitting out ideas about how they want to fully
automate. Can they hit 3,600/hr? I don't know HOW they ever got the
idea...wink,wink! It has nothing to do with shooting anymore, it's
something else.


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On Wed, 15 Jul 2009 09:35:39 -0400, "Buerste" wrote:


"Don Foreman" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 14 Jul 2009 01:47:26 -0400, "Buerste" wrote:

I hear the Hornady powder measure is better, Can it be used instead of
Dillon's?

I don't know. I use a Dillon Square Deal. Got a heckuva deal on it
and it's met my needs very nicely. The powder measure on it works
well enough as doesn't matter for handgun ammo. It keeps a tolerance
of 0.1 grain or so and I don't load handgun ammo anywhere near max
pressure so 0.1 grain is plenty close enough for me.

I use a Rockchucker for rifle ammo and I weigh every charge.


The guys at the shop are spitting out ideas about how they want to fully
automate. Can they hit 3,600/hr? I don't know HOW they ever got the
idea...wink,wink! It has nothing to do with shooting anymore, it's
something else.


One round per second seems quite realistic when everything is going
right.

Some keys to this will be:

* getting brass to feed so it's positioned perfectly every time
* getting bullets to feed so they're positioned perfectly every time
* sensing primer misfeeds. When pulling the handle, those are sensed
by feel. It's important to sense this or you may have a lot of ammo
to disassemble upon inspection.

When doing it by hand with my SD, it seems the faster I try to go the
longer it takes because I have more problems to deal with. If I just
set an easy, steady pace of maybe 200 rounds per hour, it goes very
smoothly without problems. I seldom load more than 200 rounds at a
time and I don't mind spending an hour doing it.
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On Mon, 13 Jul 2009 21:13:18 +0000 (UTC), Cydrome Leader
wrote:


[snip]

Carpet makes a nice surface for fixing all sorts of
mechanical items, but not for anything with a semiconductor
in it.


Not everything is 0.000004 micron process and will be destroyed by +4
volts of static.


The problem with static is not 4 volts. Static charges can easily run
into the thousands of volts. Merely separating two dissimilar
materials builds up quite a charge; look up the triboelectric series
to see where various substances sit relative to each other.

The currents available are generally quite small, but more than
sufficient to destroy tiny semiconductor junctions.

I'd not take a computer apart on carpet, other things are fine.


I do find that the anti-static packaging of *everything* that comes
from electronics suppliers is overkill; perhaps it's easier just to
stock one type of bag.

Joe
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On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:13:15 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. The
bench
is lagged to the wall. I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.

That's when I had a GREAT idea! I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. Is this
an
original idea?


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.

jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". "JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.


The Harbor Freight Magnetic Trays work pretty good for holding Stuff and
they are cheap enough you can buy a half dozen and keep em on the shelf.

And when you drop one..and the magnet falls off the bottom..simply use a
decent epoxy to put it back on.

Gunner

"Lenin called them "useful idiots," those people living in
liberal democracies who by giving moral and material support
to a totalitarian ideology in effect were braiding the rope that
would hang them. Why people who enjoyed freedom and prosperity worked
passionately to destroy both is a fascinating question, one still with us
today. Now the useful idiots can be found in the chorus of appeasement,
reflexive anti-Americanism, and sentimental idealism trying to inhibit
the necessary responses to another freedom-hating ideology, radical Islam"

Bruce C. Thornton, a professor of Classics at American University of Cal State Fresno
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On Jul 18, 8:26*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:13:15 -0700, Larry Jaques



wrote:
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. *They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. *I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. *I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. *The
bench
is lagged to the wall. *I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. *The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. *And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. *I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.


That's when I had a GREAT idea! *I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. *Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. *I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. *Is this
an
original idea? *


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll *put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. *Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. *Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.


jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". *"JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) *the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.


The Harbor Freight Magnetic Trays work pretty good for holding Stuff and
they are cheap enough you can buy a half dozen and keep em on the shelf.

And when you drop one..and the magnet falls off the bottom..simply use a
decent epoxy to put it back on.

Gunner

You do know that those magnetic trays are made by communists in
China, don't you? By purchasing them, you are supporting you enemy.



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rangerssuck wrote:

You do know that those magnetic trays are made by communists in
China, don't you? By purchasing them, you are supporting you enemy.



It appears that YOUR enemy is literacy.


--
You can't have a sense of humor, if you have no sense!
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On Sat, 18 Jul 2009 19:37:23 -0700 (PDT), rangerssuck
wrote:

On Jul 18, 8:26*pm, Gunner Asch wrote:
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:13:15 -0700, Larry Jaques



wrote:
On Sun, 12 Jul 2009 20:42:19 -0400, the infamous "Buerste"
scrawled the following:


"Cydrome Leader" wrote in message
...
Buerste wrote:
I took two old vanities that I replaced in the bathrooms and screwed them
together end to end to make the carcass of a new garage workbench. *They
get
raised 12" and I made a top from 2 x 4s glued-up face to face. *I had to
make the top in 2 pieces so they would fit through the 20" planer at work
then glued the two together. *I filled any imperfections with wood putty.
I
don't care what it looks like, I just want a good, solid surface. *The
bench
is lagged to the wall. *I also bored two lines of 3/4" holes front to
back,
two feet apart. *The bench should be very functional for a lot of things
but
mostly it'll be my reloading station. *And, I mounted a bunch of the old
kitchen cabinets above it on the wall. *I have five 8', 2-tube fixtures
to
go up on the ceiling and walls.


That's when I had a GREAT idea! *I routed a half-round groove 3/4" wide x
3/8" deep, all the way around the top, 3/4" in from the edge. *Then I
polyurethaned the **** out of the whole top. *I'll bet that saves me from
some of the trying to find parts that would otherwise roll off. *Is this
an
original idea? *


No. See "carving platter" for earlier patents.


Also I'll *put some indoor/outdoor carpet on 1/3 of the
bench.


Good idea, Tawm. *Get some good commercial carpeting. It's like I/O
but tougher and less cheaply made. *Banks, etc. use it.


I've seen a "homemade" shop bench for electronics repair that had an edge
designed to catch screws or lay screwdrivers. Those are usually carpet
coverer, so parts can't really roll away.


jumping away c-clips is another story.


I always call them "Jesus Clips". *"JESUS---where did THAT go?"


I have a Jesus Clip Holder. It's a spring-loaded roach clip of sorts.
(reference from another life) *the little carburetor linkage clips
were the worst sort for flying off into nowhere.


The Harbor Freight Magnetic Trays work pretty good for holding Stuff and
they are cheap enough you can buy a half dozen and keep em on the shelf.

And when you drop one..and the magnet falls off the bottom..simply use a
decent epoxy to put it back on.

Gunner

You do know that those magnetic trays are made by communists in
China, don't you? By purchasing them, you are supporting you enemy.


Actually..they are made by little yellow capitalists, all held in check
by your fellow Party members as quasi slaves.

By purchasing them, Im making sure they have something to eat, and a
place to sleep and something to wear.

If we keep up the good work..the slaves will be able to live another
month or two longer and sooner or later..probably right after we kill
all of our Leftists..they will be strong enough to rise up and kill all
of theirs.

So its a wonderful twofer..the Chinese Communists and you are dead.

And everyone is happy!

Gunner

"Lenin called them "useful idiots," those people living in
liberal democracies who by giving moral and material support
to a totalitarian ideology in effect were braiding the rope that
would hang them. Why people who enjoyed freedom and prosperity worked
passionately to destroy both is a fascinating question, one still with us
today. Now the useful idiots can be found in the chorus of appeasement,
reflexive anti-Americanism, and sentimental idealism trying to inhibit
the necessary responses to another freedom-hating ideology, radical Islam"

Bruce C. Thornton, a professor of Classics at American University of Cal State Fresno
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