I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?

On Nov 25, 10:12*am, "Terry Coombs" wrote:
* I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
* Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?

Be sure your errors and omissions insurance is paid up!

And I do wish you good luck!

Paul

On 25 Nov, 10:12, "Terry Coombs" wrote:
* I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
* Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?

I too wish you luck. Where are you?

Terry Coombs wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel
yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Best of luck, don't underprice too much.

wrote:
On Nov 25, 10:12 am, "Terry Coombs" wrote:
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?

Be sure your errors and omissions insurance is paid up!

And I do wish you good luck!

Paul

Guess I need to research that one ! E&O coverage ... and thanks !
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Nadogail wrote:
On 25 Nov, 10:12, "Terry Coombs" wrote:
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?

I too wish you luck. Where are you?

I'm in Memphis , Tn. - and we already got a crime problem , I just gotta
market my solution .
Thanks !
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second
person to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my
units fails ? I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the
surface it's mounted on ...

Think in terms of "Product Liability" suits - the one where the frustrated
perp clobbers it with his hand and then sues you for making the bars too
hard since his hand was broken when he hit it.

Or the one where a kid runs into a corner and gets scratched...

Although most are the result of some shyster trying to get rich by filing BS
suits, the occasional one slips through: Do you remember the broad who sued
McDonald's over the coffee?

Terry Coombs wrote:

Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...

Three possibly liability openings I can think of:

- Your security bars aren't secure enough and someone inside is
attacked.

- Your security bars are too secure and someone inside can't get out in
a fire.

- Most anything happens and the slime bag lawyers do the shotgun thing
and sue anyone remotely involved, including the pizza delivery guy, and
you have to defend against the suit.

RAM³ wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before
...) building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few
local fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair
margin . Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned
from the steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples
... Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second
person to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my
units fails ? I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps
the surface it's mounted on ...

Think in terms of "Product Liability" suits - the one where the
frustrated perp clobbers it with his hand and then sues you for
making the bars too hard since his hand was broken when he hit it.

Or the one where a kid runs into a corner and gets scratched...

Although most are the result of some shyster trying to get rich by
filing BS suits, the occasional one slips through: Do you remember
the broad who sued McDonald's over the coffee?

Yeah , I remember that one , who doesn't ! What's sad is that you're right
, perps have in fact collected on silly suits like that . Gives me some food
for though , thanks .
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Buerste wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Best of luck, don't underprice too much.

Thanks , and I'm shooting for 20% under the big guys . I have a lot less
overhead ... and no employees to pay SSI , insurance , workmen's comp , etc
for .

--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Terry Coombs wrote:

Buerste wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Best of luck, don't underprice too much.

Thanks , and I'm shooting for 20% under the big guys . I have a lot less
overhead ... and no employees to pay SSI , insurance , workmen's comp , etc
for .

Don't forget your tax overhead, you do have to pay SSI and whatnot on
yourself. Schedule C stuff...

On Nov 25, 3:18*pm, "RAM³" wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message

...



Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

* I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ....)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
* Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to *liability , since you're the second
person to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my
units fails ? I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the
surface it's mounted on ...

Think in terms of "Product Liability" suits - the one where the frustrated
perp clobbers it with his hand and then sues you for making the bars too
hard since his hand was broken when he hit it.

Or the one where a kid runs into a corner and gets scratched...

Although most are the result of some shyster trying to get rich by filing BS
suits, the occasional one slips through: Do you remember the broad who sued
McDonald's over the coffee?

I believe in that case, she won because that McD's had been warned
repeatedly that their coffee was excessively hot. There's hot coffee,
and then there's 'burn on contact' coffee.


Dave

On Nov 25, 2:59*pm, "Terry Coombs" wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

* I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
* Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

*I'm wondering where I'm open to *liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Biggest liability would probably be if someone thought you had
included a 'quick release' to get out in case of a fire, or if you
provided one and it was claimed it didn't work properly.


Dave

wrote:

I believe in that case, she won because that McD's had been warned
repeatedly that their coffee was excessively hot. There's hot coffee,
and then there's 'burn on contact' coffee.

Yeah, my understanding of that case is that the case was sound, but
the settlement was larger than even the jury expected. It was based on
the something like the proceeds of the money McDonalds made in one day
by selling their coffee in the US. Turned out to be a much larger number
than the jury anticipated.

Pete


--
Pete Snell
Department of Physics
Royal Military College
Kingston, Ontario,
Canada
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
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Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:

Buerste wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before
...) building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few
local fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair
margin . Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned
from the steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples
... Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Best of luck, don't underprice too much.

Thanks , and I'm shooting for 20% under the big guys . I have a
lot less overhead ... and no employees to pay SSI , insurance ,
workmen's comp , etc for .

Don't forget your tax overhead, you do have to pay SSI and whatnot on
yourself. Schedule C stuff...

My wife has repeatedly reminded me about that ... I'm not going to fall
into that trap again , it's all going into a savings account and payments
will be made quarterly .
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

wrote in message
...
I believe in that case, she won because that McD's had been warned
repeatedly that their coffee was excessively hot. There's hot coffee,
and then there's 'burn on contact' coffee.

To properly brew drip coffee you need water that is between 190 and 200
degrees F. Burger King has a liquid instant product that doesn't have to be
as hot.

The suit was BS. As an example, if she had ordered hot tea, that should
start with water that is at a full boil.

--

Roger Shoaf

About the time I had mastered getting the toothpaste back in the tube, then
they come up with this striped stuff.

"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with
a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment? Boy, you
are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you what the odds of
failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway. You will be needing a
lot of it to even make it through the first year. You'll be needing quite a
bit of money too. I don't want to scare you off but making a new business
pay off is a real challenge. If you can make any money from your efforts
you'll have done a lot better than most.

Hawke

Terry Coombs wrote:
Pete C. wrote:
Terry Coombs wrote:
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
Just be sure you get adequate liability insurance to cover your
posterior.

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...

When something in the vicinity of the thing breaks you'll get included
in the lawsuit, just because.

The E&O insurance will (well, should) help pay the attorneys fees for
going to court and saying "that's absurd, the wall fell because the
3000lb car crashed into it, not because of my 20lb bars".

At least get a price on it, then make an informed decision.

I wouldn't work without it.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Do you need to implement control loops in software?
"Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says.
See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html

On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 14:33:57 -0800, "Hawke"
wrote:


"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with
a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment? Boy, you
are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you what the odds of
failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway. You will be needing a
lot of it to even make it through the first year. You'll be needing quite a
bit of money too. I don't want to scare you off but making a new business
pay off is a real challenge. If you can make any money from your efforts
you'll have done a lot better than most.

Hawke



At least he's TRYING, not just sitting on his ass waiting for the
government to take care of him. I say, go for it Terry. At least you
may have some income, as opposed to no income.

Jim

"Hawke" wrote in message
...

"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with
a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment? Boy,
you
are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you what the odds of
failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway. You will be needing a
lot of it to even make it through the first year. You'll be needing quite
a
bit of money too. I don't want to scare you off but making a new business
pay off is a real challenge. If you can make any money from your efforts
you'll have done a lot better than most.

Hawke

He's got a good business idea for a distressed economy: building security in
a high-crime city.

--
Ed Huntress

Hawke wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment?
Boy, you are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you
what the odds of failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway.
You will be needing a lot of it to even make it through the first
year. You'll be needing quite a bit of money too. I don't want to
scare you off but making a new business pay off is a real challenge.
If you can make any money from your efforts you'll have done a lot
better than most.

Hawke

Well ain't you a ray of hope in an otherwise gray and gloomy day . Ya
think I haven't thought this out and done at least some basic research ? I
know what the odds are , I know what the market for this product is , I know
the price point I need to beat , and have a pretty damn good estimate of my
expected profit margin . As far as capitalization , I already own most of
the tooling I'll need , I have space for the operations I'll be doing .
I have connections to a customer base , and already have a couple of
estimates to run for tomorrow . I was asked to estimate based on a sample I
fabricated this afternoon ...
And to ice this cake , I also have a degree in accounting and business
management - along with several years experience in running my own business
..
I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's willing to
get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike those who sit on their
ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

In article , "Terry Coombs" wrote:
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

I'll pass on some advice that was given to me a number of years ago: if all
your bids are accepted, you're pricing your work too cheaply.

I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's willing to
get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike those who sit on
their ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?

Great attitude. FWIW, the whole world told me I was f$%^ing nuts when I quit
my job in 1991 to grow apples. Its been 17 years and I've never looked back.
Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about insurance until you start to
make a profit. You're taking a risk, but the scammers only go after deep
pockets. My feeling is you can easily overinsure yourself and doom any
chance of profit.

Karl

I'll pass on some advice that was given to me a number of years ago: if
all
your bids are accepted, you're pricing your work too cheaply.

And if nobody complains that your prices are too high, your prices are too
low.

Karl

"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin . Nothing
fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the steel yard with a
load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !


I'm going to wish you luck in two areas. Living where you need bars, you need a lot of
luck. Same for running a business.

I'd have left already.

Wes

"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I too wish you luck. Where are you?

I'm in Memphis , Tn. - and we already got a crime problem , I just gotta
market my solution .
Thanks !

Wow, I spent a big part of a year at NAS Memphis (Millington). Things have gone down hill
since the mid 70's.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...

One thing to consider, are you a rock that a contingency fee lawyer is going to be able to
squeeze water or blood out of?

Insurance is for people with something to lose. Of all things, I'd think what you are
making is one of the safer things in manufacturing. Big assed bars over the window, my
sawsall going through the wall, my bet is on the sawsall.

Bars over windows are feel good stuff. In the typical frame home, a battery powered
sawsall can penetrate the wall, cut a hole, and you can reach in and unlock the door.

I don't think I'd be worried about the insurance too much.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

Doug Miller wrote:
In article , "Terry Coombs"
wrote:
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !

I'll pass on some advice that was given to me a number of years ago:
if all
your bids are accepted, you're pricing your work too cheaply.

Heh , Im looking for about a 15%-25% rejection rate . I learned that
lesson while I was doing home repairs and remodels . Too many mean you're
too high ... if I start getting over 30 % , I'll have to revisit my pricing
structure .
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Karl Townsend wrote:
I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's
willing to get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike
those who sit on their ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?

Great attitude. FWIW, the whole world told me I was f$%^ing nuts when
I quit my job in 1991 to grow apples. Its been 17 years and I've
never looked back. Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about
insurance until you start to make a profit. You're taking a risk, but
the scammers only go after deep pockets. My feeling is you can easily
overinsure yourself and doom any chance of profit.

Karl

About the time (ass/u/ming) this starts making good money , I'll be
incorporating the business . Insulation of personal assets is just a good
idea ...
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:16:13 -0600, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

Hawke wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment?
Boy, you are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you
what the odds of failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway.
You will be needing a lot of it to even make it through the first
year. You'll be needing quite a bit of money too. I don't want to
scare you off but making a new business pay off is a real challenge.
If you can make any money from your efforts you'll have done a lot
better than most.

Hawke

Well ain't you a ray of hope in an otherwise gray and gloomy day . Ya
think I haven't thought this out and done at least some basic research ? I
know what the odds are , I know what the market for this product is , I know
the price point I need to beat , and have a pretty damn good estimate of my
expected profit margin . As far as capitalization , I already own most of
the tooling I'll need , I have space for the operations I'll be doing .
I have connections to a customer base , and already have a couple of
estimates to run for tomorrow . I was asked to estimate based on a sample I
fabricated this afternoon ...
And to ice this cake , I also have a degree in accounting and business
management - along with several years experience in running my own business
.
I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's willing to
get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike those who sit on their
ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?


Hawkey lives in his moms basement. Unemployed, useless, fat and pizza
faced, living in the squalor of empty chip wrappers, Mt Dew empties and
cockroaches. He only comes up to restock on HoHos, the lastest video
game and Hustler magazine.

Pay no attention to him, he would **** on the parade of anyone with more
gumption than he has, which is 99.99999999 % of the human race.

Gunner

"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist..."
Maj. Gen. John Sedgewick, killed by a sniper in 1864 at the battle of Spotsylvania

"Terry Coombs" wrote:

And it's pretty much the same all over . Shootings , muggings , carjacks ,
half of it doesn't even make the news . Unless there's blood " If it bleeds
it leads" .
And now I strap on a pistol to mow the yard ... we've only had two
drive-by's this month , both at the end of the block .

Back in 1976, I stopped into a gun shop on the main drag in Millington during the winter.

The guy had just been robbed. One customer distracted him while another lifted a .25 ACP
pistol. He wasn't terribly worried about the loss other than it was a robbery. His
parting comment was if whoever stole it shoots someone with it in winter, their coat is
going to stop the round and the victim is going to kill them. True story.

Wes
--
"Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect
government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home
in their eyes." Dick Anthony Heller

Terry Coombs wrote:

About the time (ass/u/ming) this starts making good money , I'll be
incorporating the business . Insulation of personal assets is just a good
idea ...

The best of luck on this venture. You're right about crime going up. A gun dealer
recently told me that his safe sales was keeping him going at that time - a few months back.

You want to keep your overhead and risks low, but you might also consider combining this
with related businesses like security systems and safe sales. The three should go well
together. Not everyone sees the same danger from the same angle and some would buy a safe
or get a security system that may not see the need for the other(s).

Wes wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I too wish you luck. Where are you?

I'm in Memphis , Tn. - and we already got a crime problem , I just
gotta market my solution .
Thanks !

Wow, I spent a big part of a year at NAS Memphis (Millington).
Things have gone down hill since the mid 70's.

Wes


It's gotten pretty bad . Our street (Macon / Highland area , about a mile
due south of National Cemetery) was a nice middle-income-racially-mixed
street 20 years ago when we bought . Mowed lawns , kids playing out in the
yards .
Now we have as many empty houses as occupied , most have been broken into
.. Some are used as flops by ho's . And crackheads , but we don't have as
many of those now that the crack dealer moved . Police arrive now two cars
at a time - when they come at all .
And it's pretty much the same all over . Shootings , muggings , carjacks ,
half of it doesn't even make the news . Unless there's blood " If it bleeds
it leads" .
And now I strap on a pistol to mow the yard ... we've only had two
drive-by's this month , both at the end of the block .
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:41:57 -0600, "Karl Townsend"
wrote:

I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's willing to
get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike those who sit on
their ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?

Great attitude. FWIW, the whole world told me I was f$%^ing nuts when I quit
my job in 1991 to grow apples. Its been 17 years and I've never looked back.
Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about insurance until you start to
make a profit. You're taking a risk, but the scammers only go after deep
pockets. My feeling is you can easily overinsure yourself and doom any
chance of profit.

Karl



Someone on the ultralight forum the other day suggested that someone
in a situation such as yours incorporate so as to keep your personal
assets clear of the business. Your liability exposure should be
minimal. They suggest that after forming your corporation that you
carry NO liability insurance whatever. As was said above, the lawyers
only go after deep pockets and if you don't even HAVE any poskets,
they're not going to be bothered.

Jim

Wes wrote:

"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I'm wondering where I'm open to liability , since you're the second person
to mention insurance coverage . Perhaps in the event one of my units fails ?
I can't see the bar unit itself failing , but perhaps the surface it's
mounted on ...

One thing to consider, are you a rock that a contingency fee lawyer is going to be able to
squeeze water or blood out of?

Insurance is for people with something to lose. Of all things, I'd think what you are
making is one of the safer things in manufacturing. Big assed bars over the window, my
sawsall going through the wall, my bet is on the sawsall.

Bars over windows are feel good stuff. In the typical frame home, a battery powered
sawsall can penetrate the wall, cut a hole, and you can reach in and unlock the door.

I don't think I'd be worried about the insurance too much.

As I noted, one of the risks is his super duper security bars preventing
an occupant from escaping a fire.

Jim Chandler wrote:
On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:41:57 -0600, "Karl Townsend"
wrote:

I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's
willing to get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike
those who sit on their ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?

Great attitude. FWIW, the whole world told me I was f$%^ing nuts
when I quit my job in 1991 to grow apples. Its been 17 years and
I've never looked back. Personally, I wouldn't worry too much about
insurance until you start to make a profit. You're taking a risk,
but the scammers only go after deep pockets. My feeling is you can
easily overinsure yourself and doom any chance of profit.

Karl



Someone on the ultralight forum the other day suggested that someone
in a situation such as yours incorporate so as to keep your personal
assets clear of the business. Your liability exposure should be
minimal. They suggest that after forming your corporation that you
carry NO liability insurance whatever. As was said above, the lawyers
only go after deep pockets and if you don't even HAVE any poskets,
they're not going to be bothered.

Jim

Kinda counter-intuitive , but it makes sense !
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Gunner Asch wrote:
On Tue, 25 Nov 2008 17:16:13 -0600, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:

Hawke wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote in message
...
I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before
...) building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few
local fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair
margin . Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned
from the steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples
... Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !
--
Snag
When times get tough , break-ins go up ... are YOU protected ?


Going into business for yourself, eh? In this business environment?
Boy, you are going to need a lot of luck. I don't want to tell you
what the odds of failure for a new start up are so good luck anyway.
You will be needing a lot of it to even make it through the first
year. You'll be needing quite a bit of money too. I don't want to
scare you off but making a new business pay off is a real challenge.
If you can make any money from your efforts you'll have done a lot
better than most.

Hawke

Well ain't you a ray of hope in an otherwise gray and gloomy day .
Ya think I haven't thought this out and done at least some basic
research ? I know what the odds are , I know what the market for
this product is , I know the price point I need to beat , and have a
pretty damn good estimate of my expected profit margin . As far as
capitalization , I already own most of the tooling I'll need , I
have space for the operations I'll be doing . I have connections to
a customer base , and already have a couple of estimates to run for
tomorrow . I was asked to estimate based on a sample I fabricated
this afternoon ... And to ice this cake , I also have a degree in
accounting and business management - along with several years
experience in running my own business .
I my opinion - and my experience bears this out - anyone that's
willing to get off their ass and WORK can make a living . Unlike
those who sit on their ass and whine about how bad things are .
Which are you , Hawke ?


Hawkey lives in his moms basement. Unemployed, useless, fat and pizza
faced, living in the squalor of empty chip wrappers, Mt Dew empties
and cockroaches. He only comes up to restock on HoHos, the lastest
video
game and Hustler magazine.

Pay no attention to him, he would **** on the parade of anyone with
more
gumption than he has, which is 99.99999999 % of the human race.

Gunner

"They couldn't hit an elephant at this dist..."
Maj. Gen. John Sedgewick, killed by a sniper in 1864 at the battle of
Spotsylvania

Hmmm , worse than I thought . I figgered him for a 35 year old loser with
terminal acne , no girlfriend , and the requisite pile of empty soda cans
and chip wrappers around his computer desk .
I mean after all , " Hawke" ?? With an "e" ??
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills

Wes wrote:
"Terry Coombs" wrote:

I've decided to go into business for myself (been there before ...)
building window bars and A/C surrounds . I've checked a few local
fabricators , and I can beat their prices by a pretty fair margin .
Nothing fancy , just basic security bars . Just returned from the
steel yard with a load of stock for fabricating samples ...
Getting laid off last week might be a blessing !


I'm going to wish you luck in two areas. Living where you need bars,
you need a lot of luck. Same for running a business.

I'd have left already.

Wes

If I didn't own the property , I'd have been gone years ago . I gave my
word to the mortgage company ... and there hasn't been a realistic real
estate transaction here since the killin's down the street in '02 drug
related ... .
The people on this street know me . They know my dogs too . Not sure which
they're more afraid of . Something about the wild hair , beard , Harleys ,
and open carry of a sidearm makes them leave me alone .
--
Snag
sometimes ya gotta
shovel manure
to pay the bills