Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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Default Poor Man's Forklift

As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of folks have cherry
pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want
to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the
arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.

Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com






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Default Poor Man's Forklift

On 2008-07-30, Bob La Londe wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of folks have cherry
pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want
to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the
arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.


I thought about how ot make one safely and could not come up with
anything (not a very high standard). But if you scrounge around you
can find a "die lift" or a "big joe" cheap.

I was given this for free once:

http://yabe.algebra.com/~ichudov/misc/ebay/Forklift/

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Default Poor Man's Forklift

Bob La Londe wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of folks have cherry
pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want
to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the
arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.

Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com


Easy. Use a leveling link like used on backhoes an loaders.

Attach your forks with a hinge, then run a link from the hinge to the
lifts upright.

A smaller version is used on some windshield wiper arms.

--
Steve W.
Near Cooperstown, New York

Life is not like a box of chocolates
it's more like a jar of jalapenos-
what you do today could burn your ass tomorrow!
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Default Poor Man's Forklift


"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to
reach up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks
now, but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use
and affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks
level or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load
that could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the
street, begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the
coolest thing if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that
you could just push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of
folks have cherry pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 -
$700 range. Want to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to
raise and lower the arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.

Bob La Londe
www.YumaBassMan.com


It wouldn't work, for a lot of reasons, one of them being that the center of
gravity of the load will now be further out from the end of the boom, not
closer, and the other being that a cherry picker is designed to handle
vertical suspended loads only. You would have to use basic rigging
techniques to lift the fork assembly with the proper chains, hooks, etc.,
which might be more work than it's worth for most loads.


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Default Poor Man's Forklift

Bob La Londe wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of folks have cherry
pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want
to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the
arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.


Someone already did, except it isn't a cherry picker attachment. Check out
the Genie Superlift. In my area you can rent one for $35/day.

Grant


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In article ,
"Bob La Londe" wrote:

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising.


Not quite a forklift, but the carry-all on my tractor acts as a
reasonable substitute

Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/
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Default Poor Man's Forklift

On Jul 29, 8:14 pm, "Bob La Londe" wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

...I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. ...
I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. ...
Bob La Londewww.YumaBassMan.com


The linkage to keep the forks level is a parallelogram. Use the boom
for the lower compression element, extend the mast upwards and add a
tension link parallel to the boom.

I wouldn't do it, though. Even within its capacity the crane can tip
if the load is outside the wheelbase. I've modified the base of my
crane a lot to use it on dirt and tow it behind the tractor but left
the mast and boom geometry as it was designed. It has tipped over a
few times when I was helping someone and they became impatient.

I do my lifting with a platform stacker ($10 at an auction) and
chains, web slings and an engine leveler for the shop and truck bed
cranes. The chains have a grab hook on one end and an Quicklink eye on
the other, plus another grab hook on a shackle that can be placed
anywhere on the chain to take up slack. The engine leveler makes a
good spreader to keep the crane hook close to the load without having
to angle the chains and maybe dent the sides of the welder.

You might be able to add a tie point in your truck bed to winch a load
up and down ramps. The first ramps I made were 7' long to lie flat in
the bed but now I go with 8' which double as scaffold planks.

The platform stacker makes a nice welding table and work platform for
the lawnmower, air compressor, etc. It lifts higher than the hydraulic
scissors table that HF sells, which is too low for most truck beds.

I bought one of those HF tables when I was fixing power wheelchairs,
and later a crank-up Vestil platform stacker from Northern to work on
Segways. Both were reasonable for the price but not nearly as well
made as the old industrial equipment I have at home. The biggest
difficulty with that stuff was having the leaky hydraulics rebuilt.
Luckily there was a man in town who had a hydraulic repair business in
his barn and didn't charge me the outrageous prices of the industrial
shops. He had the special tool to recut worn needle and check valve
seats. I suppose you could do it with a countersink in a milling
machine except that the cast bases are very difficult to clamp solidly
and squarely.

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Default Poor Man's Forklift

"Bob La Londe" fired this volley in
:


The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks
now, but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to
use and affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the
forks level or even close to level when raising and lowering your
load.


Bob, just imagine a big question-mark hung upside down. Now, make the
bottom of the 'loop' flat, and you have a crane fork. The lift loop is
where the 'dot' on the question mark would be. Therefore, the center of
lift is directly over the center of the load.

If you need to see a working example, go take a peek at a drywall or
shingle-pallet delivery truck. They all have this sort of fork. The
forks go under the load; the frame loops up and around to the top-center
of the load.

LLoyd


LLoyd


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Default Poor Man's Forklift

On Jul 30, 9:49 am, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
"Bob La Londe" fired this volley :

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks
now, but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to
use and affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the
forks level or even close to level when raising and lowering your
load.


Bob, just imagine a big question-mark hung upside down. Now, make the
bottom of the 'loop' flat, and you have a crane fork. The lift loop is
where the 'dot' on the question mark would be. Therefore, the center of
lift is directly over the center of the load.

If you need to see a working example, go take a peek at a drywall or
shingle-pallet delivery truck. They all have this sort of fork. The
forks go under the load; the frame loops up and around to the top-center
of the load.

LLoyd

LLoyd




These things, as Lloyd described them, are commercially known as
'pallet hooks'. As the name says, they are used to lift pallets with
a crane. Pallet hooks are a catalogue item, at least here in S-W
Ontario.

If you know what you're doing you can fabricate one yourself. Use
your best judgement and simply test it with a load 5X as heavy as the
intended load rating of the hook. Check for cracks, and if all is OK
you're good to go. In my jurisdiction lifting equipment needs to be
checked once a year. This probably only applies to commercially
utilized equipment.

Wolfgang
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Default Poor Man's Forklift

Bob La Londe wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my new
welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form of
regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave it
shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have to reach
up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks now,
but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to use and
affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the forks level
or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year load that
could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down the street,
begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be the coolest thing
if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks that you could just
push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins. Lots of folks have cherry
pickers. Something you could build or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want
to get fancy? Put on an air operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the
arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just slip
away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of you guys
invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when you do.


I'm not sure I get this. Doesn't the platform on a cherry picker stay
level automatically?

Chris



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Default Poor Man's Forklift

Christopher Tidy wrote:
Bob La Londe wrote:
As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my
new welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some form
of regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could leave
it shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would not have
to reach up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple weeks
now, but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an easy to
use and affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to keep the
forks level or even close to level when raising and lowering your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year
load that could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down
the street, begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be
the coolest thing if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb forks
that you could just push your boom upto and slide in a couple pins.
Lots of folks have cherry pickers. Something you could build or buy
in the $400 - $700 range. Want to get fancy? Put on an air operated
hydraulic ram to raise and lower the arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just
slip away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one of
you guys invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one when
you do.


I'm not sure I get this. Doesn't the platform on a cherry picker stay
level automatically?

Chris


and further to that cherry pickers are rated for a one or two man lift .
Here in Australia it is illegal to use cherry pickers and backhoes to
lift loads other than what they were intended for.
If you are caught or someone is injured because of your actions you face
heavy fines and imprisonment.
Machinery inspectors are like under cover cops here ,you never know when
one is likely to show up any where on a job site.

Personally I wouldn't modify or add any attachment to a cherry picker
that was not made for it and rated by the original manufacturer.
Just not worth the risk in my book.

--
Kevin (Bluey)
"I'm not young enough to know everything."


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Kevin(Bluey) wrote:
Christopher Tidy wrote:

Bob La Londe wrote:

As I may have mentioned I used my boom (cherry picker) to unload my
new welder, but I've been thinking. If you could figure out some
form of regular set of forks to go on the end of the boom you could
leave it shortened and have more lifting capacity because you would
not have to reach up over the cargoe you are unloading.

The concept has been nagging in the back of my mind for a couple
weeks now, but I just can't seem to come up with and visualize an
easy to use and affordable to build mechanism that would allow you to
keep the forks level or even close to level when raising and lowering
your load.

Not many of us can afford a forklift for that once or twice a year
load that could use one, so we wind up borrowing a loading dock down
the street, begging a forklift, or improvising. I think it would be
the coolest thing if you could come up with a set of 1000-1500lb
forks that you could just push your boom upto and slide in a couple
pins. Lots of folks have cherry pickers. Something you could build
or buy in the $400 - $700 range. Want to get fancy? Put on an air
operated hydraulic ram to raise and lower the arm faster.

I was gonna try and invent this gizmo, but the basic mechanics just
slip away when I almost have it vizualized each time. I'll let one
of you guys invent it and make a million dollars. I'll just buy one
when you do.



I'm not sure I get this. Doesn't the platform on a cherry picker stay
level automatically?

Chris


and further to that cherry pickers are rated for a one or two man lift .
Here in Australia it is illegal to use cherry pickers and backhoes to
lift loads other than what they were intended for.
If you are caught or someone is injured because of your actions you face
heavy fines and imprisonment.
Machinery inspectors are like under cover cops here ,you never know when
one is likely to show up any where on a job site.


A backhoe is probably safer than a cherry picker. You just have to
remember not to drop the load by opening the valve all the way. It is
not uncommon to see a backhoe with a rated load sticker applied by the
manufacturer, so they are not unhappy about them being used for lifting.
Usually it's about 1000 kg on a medium to large backhoe loader. There's
often not a lot of point, though, when you could just put pallet forks
on the front.

Best wishes,

Chris

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On Jul 30, 6:08*pm, wrote:
...
If you know what you're doing you can fabricate one yourself. *Use
your best judgement and simply test it with a load 5X as heavy as the
intended load rating of the hook. *Check for cracks, and if all is OK
you're good to go. ...
Wolfgang


From what I've read, test samples are generally checked at 4X or 5X,
then working parts proofed at 2X. I tested my overbuilt, overweight
scaffold section to 1000 Lbs vertically and 500 on all diagonals,
which the 3/4" EMT braces initially failed.

What is normal practice for testing a single piece without damaging it?
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On Aug 1, 6:46 am, Jim Wilkins wrote:
On Jul 30, 6:08 pm, wrote:
...

If you know what you're doing you can fabricate one yourself. Use
your best judgement and simply test it with a load 5X as heavy as the
intended load rating of the hook. Check for cracks, and if all is OK
you're good to go. ...
Wolfgang


From what I've read, test samples are generally checked at 4X or 5X,
then working parts proofed at 2X. I tested my overbuilt, overweight
scaffold section to 1000 Lbs vertically and 500 on all diagonals,
which the 3/4" EMT braces initially failed.

What is normal practice for testing a single piece without damaging it?



This is from memory, but: Industrial material hoists / cranes are
designed with a factor of safety (FOS) of 5 on the structure.
(Hoisting ropes have a minimum FOS of 6, often more). Companies
designing & supplying underhook appliances (lift beams, spreader
beams, etc.) often also use this factor of safety, although I have
seen FOS as low as 2 or 3 on these appliances.

Engineering designed hoisting equipment is often tested after
installation, with a load of 1.25X the load rating to ensure what??
Absence of gross errors, I suppose, and functioning of load brake and
overload protective devices.

For the Do-It-Yourselfer the easiest approach is to load test his
creation at 5X the rated load. If this is a commercial application
then the witnessing of this load test (at 5X rated load) by a P.Eng.
would be, in most cases, sufficient for him to sign off on the
design. At least I would be prepared to do this provided reasonable
workmanship was apparent.

As an aside, people hoists require a factor of safety of 10.

I am not too familiar with (temporary) scaffolding, but I seem to
recall that a factor of safety of 2 is required. I forget whether
this applies to the tensile strength or the yield strength of the
material, but when I design access platforms, walkways, etc. I always
base the FOS on the published yield strength of the material.

I use the rules as laid out in the Canadian Handbook of Steel
Construction, the Ontario Health and Safety Act, and the Ontario
Building Code as applicable.

In case of a scaffold I suppose you could test individual pieces at,
say, 3X or 4X the working load, but this is not normal practice.
Normal practice is to use the published strength of the material in
the design, with the working stresses, at full load, in compliance
with the laws and regulations.

Just a word of caution on compression members (posts, bracing, etc.).
These are subject to catastrophic buckling failure with very little or
no warning of the onset of this mode of failure. The best way for a
Do-it-Yourselfer to deal with this is to copy a good existing design.
Fortunately the strength of the material affects the buckling failure
only minimally, but do not substitute say aluminum for steel when
copying the design of a compression member.

Experimental design could be used, also: Make 2 and test load one to
destruction. This is sometimes used in the case of pipe fittings or
small complex machine components. Also in airplanes :-)).

Wolfgang



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