$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Apr 8, 12:27 pm, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...and;_ylt=Alg4Q...

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT

For sure the metal thieves will not be able to afford the gasoline to
haul their collection to the scrap yard. Probably the same for the
people who are advertising all the time for scrap metal.

Should be more for us!

Paul

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT

Less competition, so it's worth driving further?
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Apr 8, 3:27*pm, " wrote:
On Apr 8, 12:27 pm, Too_Many_Tools wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...and;_ylt=Alg4Q....

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT

For sure the metal thieves will not be able to afford the gasoline to
haul their collection to the scrap yard. Probably the same for the
people who are advertising all the time for scrap metal.

Should be more for us!

Paul

You make a good point.

Just last week a local scraper was whining that his fuel costs were
forcing him to make choices as to where he trolled for metal.

TMT

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

(somebody) wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

Federal Energy Dept. now predicts gas will peak at $3.60/gallon in early
summer.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Apr 8, 3:40*pm, Spehro Pefhany
wrote:
On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools

wrote:
Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...and;_ylt=Alg4Q....

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT

Less competition, so it's worth driving further? *
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." * * * * * * * * * * * * *"The Journey is the reward"
* * * * * * Info for manufacturers:http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog *Info for designers: *http://www.speff.com

Another good point.

I have always factored in expense of time and mileage when I am
looking for a mahcine.

TMT

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT
Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote in message
...
On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT
Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **


$1.21 per litre here. You do the math!


Steve R.



--
Reply address munged to bugger up spammers

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Tue, 08 Apr 2008 21:45:03 -0400, clare at snyder dot ontario
dot canada wrote:

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT
Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
===========
There is the price that you pay at the pump and what gas actually
costs.

Best current estimate is that *TOTAL* American gas costs to the
end user/consumer are about 10 to 12$ per US gallon when
subsidies, petroleum company tax breaks, tax increment financing,
no cost oil from public lands, etc., (which the tax payers or
their grand kids) have to make up are included.

Note that this does *NOT* include the interest cost on the
borrowed money for the oil company tax breaks and evasion,
military costs including American lives, tax evasion, and the
geo-political costs, which adds substantial but indefinite costs
to every gallon.

== This shows again what a bad idea it is to subvert the free
market by hiding costs. ==

If the US had been up front, with the public paying the full
skippie at the pump since the mid 70s, it would not be crunch
time now. Wind, solar, tidal and even bio fuels [using saw grass
and agricultural waste, *NOT* food stocks] would now be major
players in not only fuel but also feedstocks for plastics. We
would also not have a grossly distorted economy based on
subsidized transportation.


Unka' George [George McDuffee]
-------------------------------------------
He that will not apply new remedies,
must expect new evils:
for Time is the greatest innovator: and
if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Tue, 08 Apr 2008 21:45:03 -0400, clare at snyder dot ontario
dot canada wrote:

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...WE0yyABAqb.HQA

Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT
Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **
===========
There is the price that you pay at the pump and what gas actually
costs.

Best current estimate is that *TOTAL* American gas costs to the
end user/consumer are about 10 to 12$ per US gallon when
subsidies, petroleum company tax breaks, tax increment financing,
no cost oil from public lands, etc., (which the tax payers or
their grand kids) have to make up are included.

Note that this does *NOT* include the interest cost on the
borrowed money for the oil company tax breaks and evasion,
military costs including American lives, tax evasion, and the
geo-political costs, which adds substantial but indefinite costs
to every gallon.

== This shows again what a bad idea it is to subvert the free
market by hiding costs. ==

If the US had been up front, with the public paying the full
skippie at the pump since the mid 70s, it would not be crunch
time now. Wind, solar, tidal and even bio fuels [using saw grass
and agricultural waste, *NOT* food stocks] would now be major
players in not only fuel but also feedstocks for plastics. We
would also not have a grossly distorted economy based on
subsidized transportation.



All true and this isn't only an energy industry thing.
Increased gasoline prices have already had one positive result here in LA.
Traffic has dropped significantly on some routes, especially I-405 between
LAX and 101. I made it from Chatsworth to Torrance (46 miles) yesterday in
an hour at three o'clock in the afternoon. That is unheard of.

--

John R. Carroll
www.machiningsolution.com

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"John R. Carroll" wrote


All true and this isn't only an energy industry thing.
Increased gasoline prices have already had one positive result here in LA.
Traffic has dropped significantly on some routes, especially I-405 between
LAX and 101. I made it from Chatsworth to Torrance (46 miles) yesterday in
an hour at three o'clock in the afternoon. That is unheard of.

I figured it was about break point time for slovenly unnecessary driving.
Lots of people flitting here and there, cell phone glued to their ear,
driving a stick shift, drinking a soda and smoking at the same time. Going
nowhere, doing nothing. Usually under twenty five years old.

Steve

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, Wes wrote:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)
Not free in Ontario. There is an employee health tax.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Apr 9, 3:44*am, "John R. Carroll"
wrote:
F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Tue, 08 Apr 2008 21:45:03 -0400, clare at snyder dot ontario
dot canada wrote:

On Tue, 8 Apr 2008 12:27:52 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

Well it looks like we will definitely see $4 dollar gas this summer.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/...and;_ylt=Alg4Q...







Any thoughts as to how this will affect us HSMers in the shop?

I already find myself limiting the distance I will drive to view,
purchase and pickup machines and supplies for my shop.

TMT
Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.
** Posted fromhttp://www.teranews.com**
===========
There is the price that you pay at the pump and what gas actually
costs.

Best current estimate is that *TOTAL* American gas costs to the
end user/consumer are about 10 to 12$ per US gallon when
subsidies, petroleum company tax breaks, tax increment financing,
no cost oil from public lands, etc., (which the tax payers or
their grand kids) *have to make up are included.

Note that this does *NOT* include the interest cost on the
borrowed money for the oil company tax breaks and evasion,
military costs including American lives, tax evasion, and the
geo-political costs, which adds substantial but indefinite costs
to every gallon.

== This shows again what a bad idea it is to subvert the free
market by hiding costs. ==

If the US had been up front, with the public paying the full
skippie at the pump since the mid 70s, it would not be crunch
time now. *Wind, solar, tidal and even bio fuels [using saw grass
and agricultural waste, *NOT* food stocks] would now be major
players in not only fuel but also feedstocks for plastics. *We
would also not have a grossly distorted economy based on
subsidized transportation.

All true and this isn't only an energy industry thing.
Increased gasoline prices have already had one positive result here in LA.
Traffic has dropped significantly on some routes, especially I-405 between
LAX and 101. I made it from Chatsworth to Torrance (46 miles) yesterday in
an hour at three o'clock in the afternoon. That is unheard of.

--

* * * * * *John R. Carroll
*www.machiningsolution.com- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

yeah..I have seen the traffic down too.

But when considers that road work is funded by gas taxes, it will be
coming back around to bite us.

TMT

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote in message
...
On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, Wes wrote:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)
Not free in Ontario. There is an employee health tax.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

It's not free. It just that there is a health insurance plan for each
province. Most of us pay a fee every month. That and taxation covers the
cost when we do get sick. The system is run as close to cost as possible. In
B.C., it's run by a crown corporation. There is some variation from one
province to another. The Canada Health Act sets minimum standards. No one
can be refused coverage for previously occurring conditions. Many people
also volunteer where it's practical. For example, I am registered as a
volunteer driver, to take cancer patients in for treatment. This way, we do
not have to front cash when services are needed, and overall costs are lower
due to the economies of scale.


Steve. R.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

nick hull wrote:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:


I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm


Richard


Now just why the HELL do I have to press 1 for English?
John Wayne

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...
nick hull wrote:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:


I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm

Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the one that
showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his head, with his hand
on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

--
Ed Huntress

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)

Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(

Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 15:56:28 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


I use much more than that.

Gunner

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 15:56:28 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


I use much more than that.

Gunner

With three drivers and two cars in my family, we use about 45 gallons/month.
That is, since I started telecommuting.

--
Ed Huntress

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 04:20:22 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Steve
R." quickly quoth:


clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, Wes wrote:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)
Not free in Ontario. There is an employee health tax.

It's not free. It just that there is a health insurance plan for each
province. Most of us pay a fee every month. That and taxation covers the
cost when we do get sick. The system is run as close to cost as possible. In
B.C., it's run by a crown corporation. There is some variation from one
province to another. The Canada Health Act sets minimum standards. No one
can be refused coverage for previously occurring conditions. Many people
also volunteer where it's practical. For example, I am registered as a
volunteer driver, to take cancer patients in for treatment. This way, we do
not have to front cash when services are needed, and overall costs are lower
due to the economies of scale.

That's what our Congress said they were doing for us with the current
prescription drug plan. Instead, it resulted in higher overall costs
for U.S. citizens and a real windfall for the drug companies.

Comprehensive health care should be available in the USA, but we'll
have to totally revamp the entire system to be able to do it. Moving
to a preventive care system would help, too. The gov't shouldn't fund
it (I'm a Libertarian, and I hate to add the latter, too) but could
regulate it.

By putting the Congress on our own public health system, it would
-really- help get them focused on the actual issues here.

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 05:34:41 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, nick
hull quickly quoth:

In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)

Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(

The end result would be the $2/gal raise, since I don't have coverage
now. It's all fantasy and idealism, anyway. We're going down the
tubes and we no longer "gotta wear shades" to see our near future.
big, deep sigh

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 03:40:04 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner quickly quoth:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 15:56:28 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


I use much more than that.

Unfortunately, THAT, sir, is a self-inflicted wound.

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 06:31:08 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, "Ed
Huntress" quickly quoth:


"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...

I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm

Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the one that
showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his head, with his hand
on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

What do you think about taking oil/gas under the public utility
umbrella? I like the idea but haven't quite thought it through yet.

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Ed Huntress wrote:

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...

nick hull wrote:


In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:



I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm


Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the one that
showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his head, with his hand
on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

--
Ed Huntress




Well, it seems appropriate for the times...
Glad you enjoyed it, Ed.

I think I'll print some up and stick them on some gas pumps.
See if I can get arrested for inciting a riot or something?

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Larry Jaques wrote:

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 05:34:41 -0500, with neither quill nor qualm, nick
hull quickly quoth:


In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:


I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)

Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(


The end result would be the $2/gal raise, since I don't have coverage
now. It's all fantasy and idealism, anyway. We're going down the
tubes and we no longer "gotta wear shades" to see our near future.
big, deep sigh

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

Speak for you own depressing future, Larry.
I just got a pair of heavily chromed Georgia Cop shades!
Looking forward to it.


BTW, anyone who advocates Socialized Medicine in the US should
go check out the VA hospitals in this country.

The top dogs are getting paid bonuses for not providing the services
paid for (by you).


yeah yeah, I got cites...
http://my.earthlink.net/article/top?...08040651180337



Richard

whales? What on earth would I want with whales?

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Larry Jaques wrote:

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)

Oh you will accept a gas tax as long as it doesn't really impact you? Tsk,
tsk.

Wes

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 08:24:23 -0500, cavelamb himself
wrote:
snip
In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:



I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)
snip
starting a rerun of a previous thread

One of the major problems is that the US citizens are *ALREADY*
paying for universal single payer health care based on the
fraction of GDP we spend. Indeed we spend about 50% more as a %
of GDP than the other nations that have such care such as the UK,
Canada, France, etc.

The problem is that much of this is "overhead" with no
relationship to providing medical care. Indeed, we appear to be
spending more money denying medical care than what it would cost
to just go ahead and provide it. And then there are the
multimillion dollar bonuses for the executives of the HMOs who's
main function is to deny healthcare...


Unka' George [George McDuffee]
-------------------------------------------
He that will not apply new remedies,
must expect new evils:
for Time is the greatest innovator: and
if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 06:31:08 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, "Ed
Huntress" quickly quoth:


"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...

I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm

Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the one that
showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his head, with his hand
on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

What do you think about taking oil/gas under the public utility
umbrella? I like the idea but haven't quite thought it through yet.

I haven't thought it through, either, but my instinct is that it's a bad
idea. I don't think the problem is expensive gas. The problem is that we're
so hooked on petroleum. There isn't much chance of solving that issue by
political price-setting measures, which is what you'd have if you had an
"oil commission," or something equivalent to a utilities commission. People
would be screaming to lower prices for oil rather than screaming to develop
alternatives and the politicians wouldn't be able to resist.

--
Ed Huntress

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
m...
Ed Huntress wrote:

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...

nick hull wrote:


In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:



I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage ;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the situation.
I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm


Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the one
that showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his head, with
his hand on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

--
Ed Huntress


Well, it seems appropriate for the times...
Glad you enjoyed it, Ed.

I think I'll print some up and stick them on some gas pumps.
See if I can get arrested for inciting a riot or something?

Be sure to call the local press first, if you do. g

--
Ed Huntress

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Ed Huntress wrote:
"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
m...
Ed Huntress wrote:

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...

nick hull wrote:


In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:



I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent
health care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month.
(single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage
;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the
situation. I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm


Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the
one that showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his
head, with his hand on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

--
Ed Huntress


Well, it seems appropriate for the times...
Glad you enjoyed it, Ed.

I think I'll print some up and stick them on some gas pumps.
See if I can get arrested for inciting a riot or something?

Be sure to call the local press first, if you do. g

I think I'll build a small mold and incorporate this into a keychain.
LOL


--

John R. Carroll
www.machiningsolution.com

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

Ed Huntress wrote:


I haven't thought it through, either, but my instinct is that it's a bad
idea. I don't think the problem is expensive gas. The problem is that we're
so hooked on petroleum. There isn't much chance of solving that issue by
political price-setting measures, which is what you'd have if you had an
"oil commission," or something equivalent to a utilities commission. People
would be screaming to lower prices for oil rather than screaming to develop
alternatives and the politicians wouldn't be able to resist.

--
Ed Huntress



That's quite an interesting obseervation, Ed.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

John R. Carroll wrote:

Ed Huntress wrote:

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
news:DNGdnQvm8syeiGPanZ2dnUVZ_oKhnZ2d@earthlink. com...

Ed Huntress wrote:


"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...


nick hull wrote:



In article ,
Larry Jaques wrote:




I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent
health care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month.
(single)


Then you will get a 2-buck a gallon raise and no health coverage
;(




I made up this "international icon" graphic to 'splain the
situation. I thought it would make a great bumper sticker...

http://www.home.earthlink.net/~cavelamb/proof.htm


Ha-ha! That stands the famous old Volkwagen ad on its rear -- the
one that showed a cartoon of a guy holding a pump nozzle to his
head, with his hand on the valve lever, committing suicide. g

--
Ed Huntress


Well, it seems appropriate for the times...
Glad you enjoyed it, Ed.

I think I'll print some up and stick them on some gas pumps.
See if I can get arrested for inciting a riot or something?

Be sure to call the local press first, if you do. g


I think I'll build a small mold and incorporate this into a keychain.
LOL



Well, not like I can ask for royalties on it.
So Go for it.
But if you'd send me a few I'll help spread the word...

I found some "magnetic" paper (ON TOPIC HERE BOSS!) to make
some "bumper stickers".

Might be fun
:)


Richard
--
(remove the X to email)

Now just why the HELL do I have to press 1 for English?
John Wayne

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

cavelamb himself wrote:
John R. Carroll wrote:

Ed Huntress wrote:

"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
m...

Ed Huntress wrote:


"cavelamb himself" wrote in message
...


Be sure to call the local press first, if you do. g


I think I'll build a small mold and incorporate this into a keychain.
LOL



Well, not like I can ask for royalties on it.
So Go for it.
But if you'd send me a few I'll help spread the word...

I wouldn't sell them. They would make a great novelty give away.


--

John R. Carroll
www.machiningsolution.com

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 05:27:00 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 03:40:04 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner quickly quoth:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 15:56:28 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Wed, 09 Apr 2008 08:51:06 -0400, with neither quill nor qualm, Wes
quickly quoth:

clare at snyder dot ontario dot canada wrote:

Gee, I WISH we had $4/gallon gas.
Best price today here in Kitchener/Waterloo is $4.20 for regular.
Across town it was $4.30. ANd that's for your pipsqueak american
gallon.


But you have free health care ;)

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


I use much more than that.

Unfortunately, THAT, sir, is a self-inflicted wound.

Its the cost of doing business.

Gunner

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 09:50:42 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner quickly quoth:

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 05:27:00 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote:

I'd be willing to accept a buck a gallon raise for a decent health
care package. I don't use 100-300 gallons per month. (single)


I use much more than that.

Unfortunately, THAT, sir, is a self-inflicted wound.

Its the cost of doing business.

It's one possible choice, but, hey, I wouldn't want to live in HelL.A.
either. Not a chance.

--
Save the whales! Trade them for valuable prizes.

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

"Ed Huntress" wrote:

What do you think about taking oil/gas under the public utility
umbrella? I like the idea but haven't quite thought it through yet.

I haven't thought it through, either, but my instinct is that it's a bad
idea. I don't think the problem is expensive gas. The problem is that we're
so hooked on petroleum. There isn't much chance of solving that issue by
political price-setting measures, which is what you'd have if you had an
"oil commission," or something equivalent to a utilities commission. People
would be screaming to lower prices for oil rather than screaming to develop
alternatives and the politicians wouldn't be able to resist.


I have a great idea, get government out of things completely. The only
thing the government seems to be able to do is introduce market distortions
that ultimately cost us.

I have far more faith in Exxon than Congress.


Wes

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 21:53:01 -0400, Wes wrote:

"Ed Huntress" wrote:

What do you think about taking oil/gas under the public utility
umbrella? I like the idea but haven't quite thought it through yet.

I haven't thought it through, either, but my instinct is that it's a bad
idea. I don't think the problem is expensive gas. The problem is that we're
so hooked on petroleum. There isn't much chance of solving that issue by
political price-setting measures, which is what you'd have if you had an
"oil commission," or something equivalent to a utilities commission. People
would be screaming to lower prices for oil rather than screaming to develop
alternatives and the politicians wouldn't be able to resist.


I have a great idea, get government out of things completely. The only
thing the government seems to be able to do is introduce market distortions
that ultimately cost us.

I have far more faith in Exxon than Congress.


Wes
==========
While this is a great sound bite and has considerable emotional
appeal to us conservatives, where it falls down is the assumption
that somehow a giant corporation is not a government.

Why is socio-economic and cultural engineering any better from
the Exxons of the world than from the governments of the world?

Arrange the countries by GDP, from smallest to largest and
calculate the cumulative totals. Now compare this to Exxon's
gross sales.
http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXTE...239419,00.html
GDP
Country BC$US 2007 Cumm $US rank (low to high)
Kiribati $0.073 $0.073 1
São Tomé and Príncipe $0.142 $0.215 2
Tonga $0.219 $0.434 3
Dominica $0.268 $0.702 4
Guinea-Bissau $0.343 $1.045 5
Solomon Islands $0.358 $1.403 6
Gambia, The $0.379 $1.782 7
Samoa $0.387 $2.169 8
Vanuatu $0.421 $2.590 9
Comoros $0.436 $3.026 10
Timor-Leste, Dem. Rep. of $0.472 $3.498 11
St. Kitts and Nevis $0.520 $4.018 12
St. Vincent and the Grenadines $0.528 $4.546 13
Grenada $0.553 $5.099 14
Liberia $0.732 $5.831 15
Seychelles $0.733 $6.564 16
Djibouti $0.834 $7.398 17
St. Lucia $0.958 $8.356 18
Guyana $0.978 $9.334 19
Burundi $0.989 $10.323 20
Maldives $1.024 $11.347 21
Antigua and Barbuda $1.079 $12.426 22
Bhutan $1.164 $13.590 23
Belize $1.304 $14.894 24
Cape Verde $1.367 $16.261 25
Eritrea $1.425 $17.686 26
Sierra Leone $1.549 $19.235 27
Lesotho $1.588 $20.823 28
Central African Republic $1.647 $22.470 29
Suriname $2.234 $24.704 30
Togo $2.393 $27.097 31
Swaziland $2.674 $29.771 32
Mauritania $2.747 $32.518 33
Rwanda $2.836 $35.354 34
Fiji $3.289 $38.643 35
Tajikistan $3.353 $41.996 36
Malawi $3.441 $45.437 37
Kyrgyz Republic $3.488 $48.925 38
Barbados $3.739 $52.664 39
Mongolia $3.854 $56.518 40
Lao People's Democratic Republic $4.008 $60.526 41
Moldova $4.021 $64.547 42
Niger $4.219 $68.766 43
Guinea $4.568 $73.334 44
Haiti $5.295 $78.629 45
Benin $5.425 $84.054 46
Nicaragua $5.675 $89.729 47
Papua New Guinea $5.914 $95.643 48
Chad $6.426 $102.069 49
Malta $6.450 $108.519 50
Bahamas, The $6.586 $115.105 51
Namibia $6.707 $121.812 52
Congo, Republic of $6.848 $128.660 53
Burkina Faso $6.858 $135.518 54
Mali $6.936 $142.454 55
Mauritius $7.030 $149.484 56
Madagascar $7.306 $156.790 57
Macedonia, Former Yugoslav Republic of $7.322 $164.112
58
Armenia $7.802 $171.914 59
Mozambique $8.132 $180.046 60
Cambodia $8.488 $188.534 61
Equatorial Guinea $9.512 $198.046 62
Georgia $9.553 $207.599 63
Nepal $9.627 $217.226 64
Congo, Democratic Republic of $9.850 $227.076 65
Afghanistan, Rep. of. $9.933 $237.009 66
Honduras $10.059 $247.068 67
Albania $10.310 $257.378 68
Gabon $10.342 $267.720 69
Paraguay $10.347 $278.067 70
Senegal $10.701 $288.768 71
Jamaica $10.737 $299.505 72
Zambia $10.887 $310.392 73
Uganda $11.141 $321.533 74
Botswana $11.347 $332.880 75
Brunei Darussalam $12.515 $345.395 76

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...ist/index.html
[Exxon is #2 on the Fortune 500 @ 347,254.0 (sales), 39,500.0
(profits) [billions of US$] so their gross sales are equal to the
GDP of the first 76 countries ranked by increasing GDP. Anyone
care to take a guess at what percent of the world's population
live in these 76 countries?

Exxon should have a seat in the United Nations, perhaps as a
permanent member of the security council.

FWIW -- Walmart was #1 with 351,139.0 billion$ in sales &
11,284.0 billion in profits. The total 2007 gross sale of both
these two corporations are 898,383.0 billion$ US or equal to the
GDP of the first 103 countries...


Unka' George [George McDuffee]
-------------------------------------------
He that will not apply new remedies,
must expect new evils:
for Time is the greatest innovator: and
if Time, of course, alter things to the worse,
and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better,
what shall be the end?

Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman.
Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).

$4 dollar gas and its effects on metalworking
 

On Thu, 10 Apr 2008 23:07:25 -0500, F. George McDuffee wrote:
....[snip various country stats from http://web.worldbank.org]

http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortu...ist/index.html
[Exxon is #2 on the Fortune 500 @ 347,254.0 (sales), 39,500.0 (profits)
[billions of US$] so their gross sales are equal to the GDP of the first
76 countries ranked by increasing GDP. Anyone care to take a guess at
what percent of the world's population live in these 76 countries?

Exxon should have a seat in the United Nations, perhaps as a permanent
member of the security council.

FWIW -- Walmart was #1 with 351,139.0 billion$ in sales & 11,284.0
billion in profits. The total 2007 gross sale of both these two
corporations are 898,383.0 billion$ US or equal to the GDP of the first
103 countries...

351 trillion dollars is a pretty good sales total. More than
seven times as much as the world-wide 48 trillion dollar GDP!