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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#41
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:48:29 -0700, with neither quill nor qualm,
Gunner quickly quoth: On Wed, 19 Mar 2008 18:27:57 -0600, F. George McDuffee wrote: Therefore, the problem, when analyzed in depth, is that the "illegals" are here, not because the want to be here, but because they were forced from their home country by reasons of "predatory/exploitative economics" and/or "state sponsored [or at least condoned] terrorism," largely due to *EXTERNAL forces over which they have no control, many of which unfortunately appear to originate in the US from US domiciled trans-national corporations. I work with illegals everyday. And to a man (or woman) they came here because of the money. Having lived in LoCal for 35 years, that's pretty much all I ever heard, too, other than better weather than they had in BF Mexico. They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. They pack together in a That's "Estados Unidos", mon. (Español 101) house in large groups, earn serious money and send it back to Mexico or where ever, in the form of Giros (money orders), to their families still living there. When the standard wage in Mexico for example is $5 a day, making $11.50 per hour pushing a green button, deducting living expenses, and then sending the rest back to momma and la ninos makes much sense. Giros are the 2nd or 3rd largest income stream that Mexico has, behind oil production. It's also a major income stream for companies like Western Union, who makes billions on their sheets of paper (MOs) every year. If asked..most will tell you that Mexico is a ******** of corruption Then they find that particular reality here, too, though not as openly flaunted as it is in Los Estados Unidos de Mexico. with no jobs or money. So they come north. But they dont consider themselves immigrants, just temporary workers making enough money for retirement back home. They admit Mexico etc suck and suck badly..but they do NOT consider themselves to be new Americans as our ancestors did. And THAT is the particularly nasty reality. The new immigrants are not blending in, becoming melted into Americans. They keep their own traditions and languages, forming their own mini-countries right here in the States. That, too, is helping to tear our country apart. Deport all illegals of any race/creed/color and put our out-of-work forces back to work. Neither side will like it much at all, but it has to be done, especially in the face of the new and looming recession. -- Death is more universal than life; everyone dies but not everyone lives. -- A. Sachs |
#42
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
Too_Many_Tools wrote in news:76aa0ab5-8228-463f-
: the press is in the Republican pocket. ROFLMAO! |
#43
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
NewsGroups spar@plaus wrote in article .. . "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... A word of caution....it can happen to your neighborhood. Nothing to doo with republicans! All to do with people who spent MUCH more than they had coming in. People ,with no commin sense, that can only blame themselves for the situation they are in. You mean an "interest only" mortgage that stretches my budget to the breaking point now will not be sustainable when the rate adjustment and/or balloon payment comes due???? The liberals education system never taught us that!.....but, I DO know about things like the snail darter, spotted owl, and global warming!!! Unfortunately "New Math" let me down a bit! The liberal education community continues to produce decreasing intelligence - and common sense - among upcoming generations of consumers. |
#44
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
Too_Many_Tools wrote in article ... On Mar 19, 7:23*am, "NewsGroups" spar@plaus wrote: Wrong. Banks are the gatekeepers...they have a responsibility to their creditors to lend money responsibily. When they make bad loans...and they have made MILLLIONS of bad loans...it shows that there was no oversight...and that places the blame squarely upon the Republican Adminstration. TMT ---------- Again, you show your ignorance to the REAL business world. The primary responsibility of ANY business - locally-owned, one-man operations all the way up to the largest bank in the country - is to make a profit for the owner(s). You won't last long if you put your customer above everything else - including profit. |
#45
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 08:02:59 -0700, Larry Jaques
wrote: They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. They pack together in a That's "Estados Unidos", mon. (Español 101) It plays either way ...Ive heard it many times in both directions in the shops. Shrug Mexican is just another corruption of spanish as American is a corruption of English. Which is whe highschool spanish students get lots of blank looks when chatting up a Mexican, San Salvadorian etc. Gunner |
#46
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:48:29 -0700, Gunner
wrote: snip I work with illegals everyday. And to a man (or woman) they came here because of the money. They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. snip ===================== Thanks for the perspective, insight and reminder. My main contact with Latino immigrants has been with wait staff and small business owners, and this group may well be self-selected socio-economic/political refugees. As in many things, it appears that we do not have an "immigration" problem, but immigration problem*s* in the US, with many different causes, and many different (possibly overlapping) immigrant groups. This would help explain the total lack of progress and extreme divisiveness the "immigration" issue is having in that one section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem/immigrant group (A), and another section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem / immigrant group (X). A fundamental problem appears to be that actions/activities that reduces the motivation/need for one immigrant group to come to the United States may well exacerbate and amplify the motivation/need for other immigrant groups. For example, increasing the employment opportunities in the home countries of the individuals in United States because of the opportunity to make money, possibly through large scale industrialization for export products to the US, may further destabilize the home countries existing economy/political society for the displaced small farmers and shopkeepers. Political/police measures taken/required to "pacify" a country to attract international investment need for "industrialization" may well increase the number of political refugees. This is another area where unbiased and critical study is urgently required if any meaningful action/gain is to be realized, and precise definition of terms is required for meaningful discussion. Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end? Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625). |
#47
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 17:24:17 -0600, F. George McDuffee
wrote: On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:48:29 -0700, Gunner wrote: snip I work with illegals everyday. And to a man (or woman) they came here because of the money. They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. snip ===================== Thanks for the perspective, insight and reminder. My main contact with Latino immigrants has been with wait staff and small business owners, and this group may well be self-selected socio-economic/political refugees. Very well might be. And do NOT count Cubanos as Latinos. They are a totally seperate culture all together. As in many things, it appears that we do not have an "immigration" problem, but immigration problem*s* in the US, with many different causes, and many different (possibly overlapping) immigrant groups. This would help explain the total lack of progress and extreme divisiveness the "immigration" issue is having in that one section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem/immigrant group (A), and another section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem / immigrant group (X). A fundamental problem appears to be that actions/activities that reduces the motivation/need for one immigrant group to come to the United States may well exacerbate and amplify the motivation/need for other immigrant groups. For example, increasing the employment opportunities in the home countries of the individuals in United States because of the opportunity to make money, possibly through large scale industrialization for export products to the US, may further destabilize the home countries existing economy/political society for the displaced small farmers and shopkeepers. Political/police measures taken/required to "pacify" a country to attract international investment need for "industrialization" may well increase the number of political refugees. This is another area where unbiased and critical study is urgently required if any meaningful action/gain is to be realized, and precise definition of terms is required for meaningful discussion. Frankly..most of their home countries are controlled by small groups of people who own nearly everything, either directly or via proxy Mexico has MORE natural resources than the USA, yet its controlled by the 7 Families, and enjoys one of the worst crime rates and lowest standards of living on the NA continent. A lot of those we see in California, are marginally literate, and are fresh from rural villages. Its odd to see signs in bathrooms in spanish, commanding that when you wipe your ass, you toss the **** covered TP in the toilet and flush it down, rather than toss it into a garbage can. Yet its pretty much a requirement in places that use newer labor. Culture shock sometimes goes the other way..... Gunner Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end? Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625). |
#48
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Mar 20, 12:16*am, "Hawke" wrote:
"Ignoramus25365" wrote in message ... I think that I have seen this once before a long time ago. I hope that such things would not become too prevalent and will remain isolated. Hopefully the capitalist economy would realign itself quickly. i Well, it's not going to work itself out all by itself. Without a lot of government intervention this will become a disaster. If the government does the right things this can be managed and the country can overcome the idiotic mistakes that were made over the last few years. It remains to be seen if they do what is needed. It is looking like Henry Paulson, treasury secretary, doesn't want to go out looking like a fool so he's trying to avoid a complete meltdown. He may do a good job and turn this around pretty quickly. Unlike Bush he's smart and competent. But this whole mess is all the result of following republican idealists who believe that regulation of business is a sin. If the government had been overseeing the mortgage and banking systems like it should have this wouldn't have happened. But if you let business do whatever it wants this is what you get. Be prepared to see a return to heavy regulation of business after Bush has left for the funny farm. Hawke On 2008-03-19, Too_Many_Tools wrote: A word of caution....it can happen to your neighborhood. And more is to come as the Republican recession deepens.... TMT Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight By KRISTIN KLOBERDANZ/MODESTO Tue Mar 18 The peach-colored house in a modest subdivision near downtown Modesto, Calif., used to be someone's dream home. But it stands out in a row of similarly hued homes where many have a "For Sale" sign planted in their front yards. The two-story appears battered: its address has been scratched on a front panel and weeds choke what may once have been a manicured lawn. And then there is the overwhelming stench of human waste and stale beer. There has been no electricity and no running water since the bank repossessed it months ago. Still, at least three young men have been squatting here since January. The dream home has become a nightmare. This horror is not an uncommon sight in the Northern San Joaquin Valley, where foreclosure rates are among the highest in the nation, and vacant properties - so tempting to vagrants - flourish. From a fire-gutted shell across from a pretty park on the north side of town to a mangy wreck near the airport where a collection of cats and dogs were found chained together in the yard, abandoned residences are putting a blight on all types of neighborhoods. "We get about six to ten calls a day on vacant homes," says police officer John McGill, who stresses that this isn't just a problem in the poorer parts of town. Transients often move in, steal the power, tear apart the walls and floorboards in search of valuable copper wires and piping and set fires to cook drugs or keep warm. The police struggle to keep the damage under control; but with no owner around to claim a trespass violation on a repossessed home, it's difficult for them to make arrests. All they can do is tell the squatters to leave, board up the house and ship off a note to the bank that now owns the property. "It's a victimless crime," says Bert Lippert, a bit sarcastically. Lippert, along with police officers McGill and Amy Bublak, make up the city's health unit, which takes care of vacant home problems. Burglaries are up 26% in Modesto since a year ago, and the officers say this has to do with the relentless assaults on foreclosed homes. "We're seeing a shift in crimes," Bublak says, noting that people used to just steal property from the outside. Now, in addition to vandalizing the property, stripping its bones and using the yard as a dumping ground, thieves have zeroed in on the homes' utilities. "Forty percent of foreclosed homes in Modesto get their power stolen," says the Modesto Irrigation District's Louis Maceira,who can often be found locking or removing meters from these homes. Just recently, this quiet, agricultural town of 200,000 was in a boom period. House prices shot up in the early 2000s, and Modesto became a bedroom community for the Bay area. But then the subprime mortgage crisis hit hard: in February alone, Stanislaus County had 1,630 foreclosure filings, third highest in the nation. The physical toll it is taking on this hub nestled amid the almond groves is staggering. Huge, dusty stretches of subdivision developments lay untouched or partially built as developers run out of money. The 300-bed homeless shelter is now at capacity, and the local Humane Society is swollen with pets that were left behind in homes when their owners disappeared. Day laborers and contractors alike are having trouble finding work. "This is a problem that's affecting the whole community," Lippert says. There are some glimmers of hope on the horizon. Charities like Habitat for Humanity are taking advantage of the cheap home prices and labor to fix up abandoned properties for underprivileged families. The strangely upbeat Repo Home Tour bus is about to launch a regular Saturday showing of vacant houses in an effort to get them sold quickly. And the city, lenders and financial counselors are joining forces to help residents prevent foreclosure. In fact, less than a mile away from the peach-colored home, close to 1,000 people recently gathered for the city's first free No Homeowner Left Behind seminar, sponsored in part by the city and the local newspaper, the Modesto Bee. Worried residents gathered to spend their Saturday talking to lenders about how they can avoid losing their own homes. "I'm stressed and in turmoil and have butterflies in my stomach," says P.J. Scruggs, who says she is two months behind in paying her mortgage. She is afraid she will lose the home that has been in her family for 35 years. "It's scary - this is just too rampant in the Valley." If they need a cautionary nightmare, they can walk by the peach- colored house. Just beyond the front door, a toilet has exploded into the foyer and a thick sludge of feces seeps across the tiles and into the living room. Beer bottles, wine boxes, cigarette cartons, condom wrappers, dirty clothes and dog chow pile up on the soggy carpeting. Gang tags and drug-addled poetry splash the walls in red, gold and black spray paint. The decimated kitchen counters sag beneath jugs of curdled milk and rot-encrusted dishes. Scratched in the entrance hall is a fitting salutation: "Welcome to Hell." View this article on Time.com- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - "If the government had been overseeing the mortgage and banking systems like it should have this wouldn't have happened. " I agree... TMT |
#49
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Mar 20, 12:34*am, "Hawke" wrote:
"cavelamb himself" wrote in message ... Too_Many_Tools wrote: On Mar 19, 12:54 pm, cavelamb himself wrote: Wes wrote: "NewsGroups" spar@plaus wrote: Nothing to doo with republicans! *All to do with people who spent MUCH more than they had coming in. * People ,with no commin sense, that can only blame themselves for the situation they are in. Just another version of the run on Nasdaq, Enron, ect. *By the time we commoners find out about the ez money it is sucker time. Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." *Dick Anthony Heller What ever happened to, "You can't cheat an honest man"? You want something for nothing, you get nothing for something.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I have heard that saying used when referencing President Bush. TMT this is looking like Obsessive compulsive disorder... No, I think it's a case of right wingers not wanting to be subjected to the well deserved criticism they're hearing about Bush all the time now. It was a lot different when Bush first started the war and cut taxes. Then they loved Bush. But now after everyone has turned on him and sees what a ****ty president and how incompetent he is they don't like it. That's because it's their fault we're in this mess. They voted for him. They have buyers remorse. They voted for the dumbest and most incompetent president in our lives, twice! They don't like hearing or admitting that. I can't blame them. But instead of joining in on the anti republican side and wanting them gone they're still defending them or at least attacking all non republicans. They never learn when it's time to jump ship so they're destined to go down with it. It's tough being them now we're on the way down. Because they're to blame for it. Hawke- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well said. I haven't seen any "Blame me... I voted for Bush" bumper stickers. TMT |
#50
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Mar 20, 9:22*am, "*" wrote:
NewsGroups spar@plaus wrote in article .. . "Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message ... A word of caution....it can happen to your neighborhood. Nothing to doo with republicans! *All to do with people who spent MUCH more than they had coming in. * People ,with no commin sense, that can only blame themselves for the situation they are in. You mean an "interest only" mortgage that stretches my budget to the breaking point now will not be sustainable when the rate adjustment and/or balloon payment comes due???? The liberals education system never taught us that!.....but, I DO know about things like the snail darter, spotted owl, and global warming!!! Unfortunately "New Math" let me down a bit! The liberal education community continues to produce decreasing intelligence - and common sense - among upcoming generations of consumers. The liberal education did teach you about interest...were you paying attention? TMT |
#51
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Mar 21, 12:30*am, Gunner wrote:
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 17:24:17 -0600, F. George McDuffee wrote: On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:48:29 -0700, Gunner wrote: snip I work with illegals everyday. And to a man (or woman) they came here because of the money. They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. snip ===================== Thanks for the perspective, insight and reminder. My main contact with Latino immigrants has been with wait staff and small business owners, and this group may well be self-selected socio-economic/political refugees. Very well might be. And do NOT count Cubanos as Latinos. They are a totally seperate culture all together. As in many things, it appears that we do not have an "immigration" problem, but immigration problem*s* in the US, with many different causes, and many different (possibly overlapping) immigrant groups. This would help explain the total lack of progress and extreme divisiveness the "immigration" issue is having in that one section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem/immigrant group (A), and another section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem / immigrant group (X). A fundamental problem appears to be that actions/activities that reduces the motivation/need for one immigrant group to come to the United States may well exacerbate and amplify the motivation/need for other immigrant groups. * For example, increasing the employment opportunities in the home countries of the individuals in United States because of the opportunity to make money, possibly through large scale industrialization for export products to the US, may further destabilize the home countries existing economy/political society for the displaced small farmers and shopkeepers. *Political/police measures taken/required to "pacify" a country to attract international investment need for "industrialization" may well increase the number of political refugees. This is another area where unbiased and critical study is urgently required if any meaningful action/gain is to be realized, and precise definition of terms is required for meaningful discussion. Frankly..most of their home countries are controlled by small groups of people who own nearly everything, either directly or via proxy Mexico has MORE natural resources than the USA, yet its controlled by the 7 Families, and enjoys one of the worst crime rates and lowest standards of living on the NA continent. A lot of those we see in California, are marginally literate, and are fresh from rural villages. * Its odd to see signs in bathrooms in spanish, commanding that when you wipe your ass, you toss the **** covered TP in the toilet and flush it down, rather than toss it into a garbage can. *Yet its pretty much a requirement in places that use newer labor. *Culture shock sometimes goes the other way..... Gunner Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end? Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - When in Mexico with their too small plumbing, flusing paper down is a guarantee to plugging the pipes. I suspect they have signs in English telling you to throw the paper in the trash can. When in Rome, do as the Romans do... How many families control the majority of the resources in the United States? TMT |
#52
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 23:44:31 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote: On Mar 20, 12:34*am, "Hawke" wrote: "cavelamb himself" wrote in message ... Too_Many_Tools wrote: On Mar 19, 12:54 pm, cavelamb himself wrote: Wes wrote: "NewsGroups" spar@plaus wrote: Nothing to doo with republicans! *All to do with people who spent MUCH more than they had coming in. * People ,with no commin sense, that can only blame themselves for the situation they are in. Just another version of the run on Nasdaq, Enron, ect. *By the time we commoners find out about the ez money it is sucker time. Wes -- "Additionally as a security officer, I carry a gun to protect government officials but my life isn't worth protecting at home in their eyes." *Dick Anthony Heller What ever happened to, "You can't cheat an honest man"? You want something for nothing, you get nothing for something.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I have heard that saying used when referencing President Bush. TMT this is looking like Obsessive compulsive disorder... No, I think it's a case of right wingers not wanting to be subjected to the well deserved criticism they're hearing about Bush all the time now. It was a lot different when Bush first started the war and cut taxes. Then they loved Bush. But now after everyone has turned on him and sees what a ****ty president and how incompetent he is they don't like it. That's because it's their fault we're in this mess. They voted for him. They have buyers remorse. They voted for the dumbest and most incompetent president in our lives, twice! They don't like hearing or admitting that. I can't blame them. But instead of joining in on the anti republican side and wanting them gone they're still defending them or at least attacking all non republicans. They never learn when it's time to jump ship so they're destined to go down with it. It's tough being them now we're on the way down. Because they're to blame for it. Hawke- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Well said. I haven't seen any "Blame me... I voted for Bush" bumper stickers. TMT Speaking of obsessive compulsive disorders..it would appear that Hawke and you are entering the terminal stages of BDS Gunner |
#53
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 23:54:36 -0700 (PDT), Too_Many_Tools
wrote: On Mar 21, 12:30*am, Gunner wrote: On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 17:24:17 -0600, F. George McDuffee wrote: On Thu, 20 Mar 2008 07:48:29 -0700, Gunner wrote: snip I work with illegals everyday. And to a man (or woman) they came here because of the money. They come to Unitos Estatas for the big bucks. snip ===================== Thanks for the perspective, insight and reminder. My main contact with Latino immigrants has been with wait staff and small business owners, and this group may well be self-selected socio-economic/political refugees. Very well might be. And do NOT count Cubanos as Latinos. They are a totally seperate culture all together. As in many things, it appears that we do not have an "immigration" problem, but immigration problem*s* in the US, with many different causes, and many different (possibly overlapping) immigrant groups. This would help explain the total lack of progress and extreme divisiveness the "immigration" issue is having in that one section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem/immigrant group (A), and another section of society is observing/analyzing immigration problem / immigrant group (X). A fundamental problem appears to be that actions/activities that reduces the motivation/need for one immigrant group to come to the United States may well exacerbate and amplify the motivation/need for other immigrant groups. * For example, increasing the employment opportunities in the home countries of the individuals in United States because of the opportunity to make money, possibly through large scale industrialization for export products to the US, may further destabilize the home countries existing economy/political society for the displaced small farmers and shopkeepers. *Political/police measures taken/required to "pacify" a country to attract international investment need for "industrialization" may well increase the number of political refugees. This is another area where unbiased and critical study is urgently required if any meaningful action/gain is to be realized, and precise definition of terms is required for meaningful discussion. Frankly..most of their home countries are controlled by small groups of people who own nearly everything, either directly or via proxy Mexico has MORE natural resources than the USA, yet its controlled by the 7 Families, and enjoys one of the worst crime rates and lowest standards of living on the NA continent. A lot of those we see in California, are marginally literate, and are fresh from rural villages. * Its odd to see signs in bathrooms in spanish, commanding that when you wipe your ass, you toss the **** covered TP in the toilet and flush it down, rather than toss it into a garbage can. *Yet its pretty much a requirement in places that use newer labor. *Culture shock sometimes goes the other way..... Gunner Unka' George [George McDuffee] ------------------------------------------- He that will not apply new remedies, must expect new evils: for Time is the greatest innovator: and if Time, of course, alter things to the worse, and wisdom and counsel shall not alter them to the better, what shall be the end? Francis Bacon (1561-1626), English philosopher, essayist, statesman. Essays, "Of Innovations" (1597-1625).- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - When in Mexico with their too small plumbing, flusing paper down is a guarantee to plugging the pipes. I suspect they have signs in English telling you to throw the paper in the trash can. When in Rome, do as the Romans do... How many families control the majority of the resources in the United States? TMT Millions Gunner |
#54
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Foreclosed Homes: A Local Blight
Too_Many_Tools wrote in article ... Well said. I haven't seen any "Blame me... I voted for Bush" bumper stickers. TMT ---------- True! But, you STILL see liberals - proud to be losers - displaying their Kerry/Edwards bumper stickers today.......... |
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