I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

On Sep 13, 10:17 am, Louis Ohland wrote:
I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

Hi, louis.
I see no one has replied to your question, yet, so will offer my
opinion.

My Emco lathe has the compound clamped to the cross slide with just
such a ring/collar and two bolts that fit into the "T" slots on the
cross slide. For my lathe, anyway, only real nuts will work, as they
have to be completely removed to remove the compound and locate it to
the second position on the cross slide. It also has to be completely
removed to use the cross slide table with the milling head. The vice
then mounts to the cross slide using 4 bolts/nuts in the "T" slots.
Also completely removed to mount the cutoff tool holder.

Some years ago, I did replace the single nut holding the tool holder
to the compound with a new nut with a 5 inch handle. Makes moving and
removing the tool holder much simpler and quicker.

Do you also have an EMCO, or did some other company copy the design?

Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB
Crooked River Ranch, Oregon

wrote:
On Sep 13, 10:17 am, Louis Ohland wrote:
I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

Hi, louis.
I see no one has replied to your question, yet, so will offer my
opinion.

My Emco lathe has the compound clamped to the cross slide with just
such a ring/collar and two bolts that fit into the "T" slots on the
cross slide. For my lathe, anyway, only real nuts will work, as they
have to be completely removed to remove the compound and locate it to
the second position on the cross slide.

Do you also have an EMCO, or did some other company copy the design?

Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB
Crooked River Ranch, Oregon


http://www.yangzhoumachine.com/lichuang/e-cp-7.htm

Is it a copy of the EMCO? Dunno, but the Chinese seem to be the T2 kind,
where they can copy someone and then kill them, er, produce copies to
gain market share...

My lathe uses the two T slots as well. Unfortunately, the two
clamping nuts are not so big, maybe 1/4" across. They are cunningly
tucked under the compound and the one to the front is a beech to get to
if the compound is anything but fully to the rear of travel.

wrote:

On Sep 13, 10:17 am, Louis Ohland wrote:

I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?


Hi, louis.
I see no one has replied to your question, yet, so will offer my
opinion.

My Emco lathe has the compound clamped to the cross slide with just
such a ring/collar and two bolts that fit into the "T" slots on the
cross slide. For my lathe, anyway, only real nuts will work, as they
have to be completely removed to remove the compound and locate it to
the second position on the cross slide. It also has to be completely
removed to use the cross slide table with the milling head. The vice
then mounts to the cross slide using 4 bolts/nuts in the "T" slots.
Also completely removed to mount the cutoff tool holder.

Some years ago, I did replace the single nut holding the tool holder
to the compound with a new nut with a 5 inch handle. Makes moving and
removing the tool holder much simpler and quicker.

Do you also have an EMCO, or did some other company copy the design?

Sounds like its fitted in the same way as the compound on my Harrison M300.


Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB
Crooked River Ranch, Oregon

On Sep 14, 7:47 am, Louis Ohland wrote:
wrote:
On Sep 13, 10:17 am, Louis Ohland wrote:
I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

Hi, louis.
I see no one has replied to your question, yet, so will offer my
opinion.

My Emco lathe has the compound clamped to the cross slide with just
such a ring/collar and two bolts that fit into the "T" slots on the
cross slide. For my lathe, anyway, only real nuts will work, as they
have to be completely removed to remove the compound and locate it to
the second position on the cross slide.
Do you also have an EMCO, or did some other company copy the design?

Best regards,
Paul, KD7HB
Crooked River Ranch, Oregon

http://www.yangzhoumachine.com/lichuang/e-cp-7.htm

Is it a copy of the EMCO? Dunno, but the Chinese seem to be the T2 kind,
where they can copy someone and then kill them, er, produce copies to
gain market share...

My lathe uses the two T slots as well. Unfortunately, the two
clamping nuts are not so big, maybe 1/4" across. They are cunningly
tucked under the compound and the one to the front is a beech to get to
if the compound is anything but fully to the rear of travel.

Did you not get a wrench to fit all the nuts on the machine? A rather
thin double open ended metric wrench came with mine and somewhere I
got another small open end wrench to fit the nuts under the compound.
Yes, it is a tight fit sometimes, but the wrenches both work in all
compound positions.

Your lathe looks kind of like the Emco. Hard to be sure from a single
photo.

Paul

I wish they made lathes that way with a lever locking compound, but i've
been happy with the Southbend solution which uses two hex set screws, it's
reasonable easy to access with a T handled hex tool.


"Louis Ohland" wrote in message
...
I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing the
compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to tighten
the collar down?

Tony wrote:
I wish they made lathes that way with a lever locking compound, but i've
been happy with the Southbend solution which uses two hex set screws,
it's reasonable easy to access with a T handled hex tool.


"Louis Ohland" wrote in message
...
I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?


After looking at the chin-glese schematics, it looks like the
compound sits on the surface of the saddle with the only thing holding
it down being the two nuts through the hold down collar. If the
schematics are close, those two shafts coming up from the T-slot nuts
are 8mm. Looks tempting to make new T-slot nuts with 1/4x24 threads and
a 90 degree handle. Take up most of the slack in the screw before
sliding the compound back on. Then a quarter turn on either handle to
lock the compound.

On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 12:17:04 -0500, Louis Ohland
wrote:

I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

Hi Louis,

This collar is a weak point on the 9x20 lathes.

I've been toying with making my own replacement, a bit
different than the other solutions I've seen so far.

It would look something like this:

http://www.iserv.net/~lfisk/compoundholder.png

I just made a rough draft for you to see my idea. It needs
to be around 1/2 to 5/8 inch thick. You would have to
measure the distance from you compound to the cross slide
for an exact measurement on thickness. I recall you
mentioning that the new tool holder you installed is a bit
too high. After removing the degree ring (necessary mod)
from the bottom of the round column you may be able to move
the compound down a slight amount too.

The slot could be cut so that the cross bolt is tightened
from the right hand side (or left) rather than the front as
in my crude diagram. I'm not too sure where the optimum
position for it may be yet.

This should make for a lot more support/rigidity on the
front of the compound assembly. You would get your easy to
adjust compound angle too, with just one hex head cap-bolt.

Downside is losing the degree ring. A lot of guys already
use a separate protractor for setting the angle anyway and I
would like to have the extra support/rigidity myself.

I think this should work okay, but I haven't tried it yet
and could easily be missing some obvious problem with it...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Hi Leon, I'd be very interested to hear how your clamp design performs.

You're correct that the 9x20 compound collar/locking/mounting plate is the
weakest point on these models, as far as cutting tool rigidity is concerned.

I like socket head cap screws as much as anyone else, but they're a problem
in the presence of chips (particularly facing upward), and more-so when
cutting lube is used.

I'd seen the Bedair and several other 4-bolt solutions for the compound
mounting plate several years ago, and concluded that I'd try to come up with
a plate that would offer some support to the cylindrical portion of the
compound (the round column at the bottom of the compound base casting).

http://www.kwagmire.com/shop/lathe/9...cessories.html

This base plate can be machined on the 9x20 lathe using the supplied 4-jaw
chuck (although I used a rotary table and mill of a 3in1 machine to make the
crescent-shaped undercuts in the corners).

With the hold-down bolts loosened, there is some resistance felt when
adjusting the angle of the compound, so it's not loose like the original
plate. Keeping the fit very close for the hole diameter and the counterbores
for the degree wheel/disk will make the compound very much more rigid in
use.

While using the new compound plate, I found that it's not neccessary to
loosen all of the nuts to change the position of the compound. The fit is
not so tight that you'd be inclined to make a huge wrench to fit the
compound, just to adjust it.
Additionally, this plate doesn't change the height of the compound.

I had considered cutting out a section between the "front" bolt holes
(closest to the operator) to leave the degree wheel exposed, but figured I'd
add it later if it was needed.
The other method I wanted to use for seeing the degrees position would be to
mark the degrees on the tapered "wall" of the mounting plate, and use a
brass disk between the compound base and the top of the wall/shoulder with a
tick mark, with the disk secured to the compound base.

I left the pin that protrudes from the compound base intact. This pin drops
into the 2 blind holes in the top face of the cross slide table, and I
didn't see any need to remove it, since it may actually contribute a little
in the way of rigidity.

I contemplated a lever-locking solution for the compound, but there is such
a height limitation to work within, it seemed that fabricating a lever-lock
would've been a much more complicated way to go.
I've seen a very reliable design of a lever-lock on a Gorton rotary table
that I have. It doesn't lock around the circumference of a feature, but uses
a threaded post to apply a vertical force at the center "spindle" portion of
the table, to pull the table down tightly on the base casting. A very
reliable design, but it may prove difficult to fit into a 5/8" space.

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 13 Sep 2007 12:17:04 -0500, Louis Ohland
wrote:

I see that my lathe has a collar that fits over the base of the
compound. There are two nuts to tighten or loosen the collar, allowing
the compound to turn. Has anyone used a lever like on a mill table to
tighten the collar down?

Hi Louis,

This collar is a weak point on the 9x20 lathes.

I've been toying with making my own replacement, a bit
different than the other solutions I've seen so far.

It would look something like this:

http://www.iserv.net/~lfisk/compoundholder.png

I just made a rough draft for you to see my idea. It needs
to be around 1/2 to 5/8 inch thick. You would have to
measure the distance from you compound to the cross slide
for an exact measurement on thickness. I recall you
mentioning that the new tool holder you installed is a bit
too high. After removing the degree ring (necessary mod)
from the bottom of the round column you may be able to move
the compound down a slight amount too.

The slot could be cut so that the cross bolt is tightened
from the right hand side (or left) rather than the front as
in my crude diagram. I'm not too sure where the optimum
position for it may be yet.

This should make for a lot more support/rigidity on the
front of the compound assembly. You would get your easy to
adjust compound angle too, with just one hex head cap-bolt.

Downside is losing the degree ring. A lot of guys already
use a separate protractor for setting the angle anyway and I
would like to have the extra support/rigidity myself.

I think this should work okay, but I haven't tried it yet
and could easily be missing some obvious problem with it...

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 08:18:33 -0400, "Wild_Bill"
wrote:

snip
I'd seen the Bedair and several other 4-bolt solutions for the compound
mounting plate several years ago, and concluded that I'd try to come up with
a plate that would offer some support to the cylindrical portion of the
compound (the round column at the bottom of the compound base casting).

http://www.kwagmire.com/shop/lathe/9...cessories.html

This base plate can be machined on the 9x20 lathe using the supplied 4-jaw
chuck (although I used a rotary table and mill of a 3in1 machine to make the
crescent-shaped undercuts in the corners).
snip

Those are a couple of the ones I've looked over and
considered making too.

My compound is off right now and I took a quick look at it
again last night. My only fear with my suggested design is
whether there would be enough clamping pressure to keep the
compound from creeping in use. It would take a bit more work
but you could leave the degree plate in place and counter
sink the bottom for it. That would keep it captive and if
you kept the tolerances tight would help keep it from
working loose. I kind of like the idea being able to drop it
into the holder though. You could make other accessories to
drop in then too.

My other thought is to turn an adaptor to replace the degree
plate that is made of steel and the same diameter as the top
of the column. This would provide more clamping service to
get a hold of.

I've been toying with this for awhile now and will probably
try making it unless someone points out the folly in it. It
seems like an obvious solution/method and I wonder why
nobody has tried it. Usually that means it is a bad idea for
some reason or another

I'll let you know how it works out if I ever get around to
it. First I need to get the lathe running. It only took me 3
weeks to get it out of the crate and mounted on a bench.
That was last April... There is still something wrong with
the motor/belt area. I have to walk the belt on/off even
with the tension released. There are two different belt
lengths sold for it and I have the shorter version. I tried
searching some, but couldn't find any info on why two
different length belts are used. Only thing I can figure is
that it depends on which motor is sold with it (shrug).

I am cheap and loath the idea of buying the longer belt just
yet.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

I hadn't thought of your design being useful as a sort of universal mounting
plate, and that's a neat idea.

I procrastinated making my 4-bolt plate too, and one of the other reasons
that made it seem definite was that the T-slots of the cross table aren't
very strong, and using 4 T-nuts was a much better mounting solution.

I hadn't heard about the 2 different sized belts, but I'd most likely get
one locally instead of ordering it from one of the lathe distributors.
I had read of the belts rolling over and causing other problems. Mine didn't
cause those problems, and the original is still on the lathe.
I did notice that the tensioning lever needed some attention, while I was
setting up the machine though. The pivot point was really sloppy where it
passed thru the plate, and I added a shim washer there, and bought a new
retaining snap-ring of better quality.

Somewhere in one of the Dropbox archives, there is the threading chart for
the 9x20 lathes, but I didn't find it right now. Someone on the Yahoo group
had come up with a chart that shows a lot of thread pitches that are
possible on the 9x20 which aren't shown in the user manuals, including the
metric spindle thread on most models (except the Jet brand, which don't use
a metric thread, I guess).

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
...

Those are a couple of the ones I've looked over and
considered making too.

My compound is off right now and I took a quick look at it
again last night. My only fear with my suggested design is
whether there would be enough clamping pressure to keep the
compound from creeping in use. It would take a bit more work
but you could leave the degree plate in place and counter
sink the bottom for it. That would keep it captive and if
you kept the tolerances tight would help keep it from
working loose. I kind of like the idea being able to drop it
into the holder though. You could make other accessories to
drop in then too.

My other thought is to turn an adaptor to replace the degree
plate that is made of steel and the same diameter as the top
of the column. This would provide more clamping service to
get a hold of.

I've been toying with this for awhile now and will probably
try making it unless someone points out the folly in it. It
seems like an obvious solution/method and I wonder why
nobody has tried it. Usually that means it is a bad idea for
some reason or another

I'll let you know how it works out if I ever get around to
it. First I need to get the lathe running. It only took me 3
weeks to get it out of the crate and mounted on a bench.
That was last April... There is still something wrong with
the motor/belt area. I have to walk the belt on/off even
with the tension released. There are two different belt
lengths sold for it and I have the shorter version. I tried
searching some, but couldn't find any info on why two
different length belts are used. Only thing I can figure is
that it depends on which motor is sold with it (shrug).

I am cheap and loath the idea of buying the longer belt just
yet.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Thu, 20 Sep 2007 15:03:40 -0400, "Wild_Bill"
wrote:

I hadn't thought of your design being useful as a sort of universal mounting
plate, and that's a neat idea.

I procrastinated making my 4-bolt plate too, and one of the other reasons
that made it seem definite was that the T-slots of the cross table aren't
very strong, and using 4 T-nuts was a much better mounting solution.

I hadn't heard about the 2 different sized belts, but I'd most likely get
one locally instead of ordering it from one of the lathe distributors.
I had read of the belts rolling over and causing other problems. Mine didn't
cause those problems, and the original is still on the lathe.
I did notice that the tensioning lever needed some attention, while I was
setting up the machine though. The pivot point was really sloppy where it
passed thru the plate, and I added a shim washer there, and bought a new
retaining snap-ring of better quality.

Somewhere in one of the Dropbox archives, there is the threading chart for
the 9x20 lathes, but I didn't find it right now. Someone on the Yahoo group
had come up with a chart that shows a lot of thread pitches that are
possible on the 9x20 which aren't shown in the user manuals, including the
metric spindle thread on most models (except the Jet brand, which don't use
a metric thread, I guess).

WB

I've found/saved several thread charts already. If you
need/want one I'll gladly squirt them off in your direction.

On Bedair's website he makes mention of cutting down one of
the larger gears shoulder so that the cir-clip can hold it
in place. Otherwise it is too thick. I think that is the
gear you need for turning the thread on the spindle nose.
Pretty sure that is mentioned on the page where he makes a
backing plate for a new 3-jaw chuck. Here it is, see:

http://bedair.org/Chuck/Chuck2.html

He has one of the thread charts too:

http://bedair.org/Shifter/Thread.html

I asked Steve about the different belt sizes and he didn't
know why either (he has a DC motor now). My idea about
different motors being used was as good as any. Take a look
at this page and then you will know about as much as I do
about it:

http://bedair.org/Shifter/Belt.html

Mine is brand new (Harbor Freight 9x20) and has never been
run yet. The belt measures 705mm in length (I checked it
several times . It is as tight as I think it should be
WITHOUT the tension being drawn down on it.

I've read some stuff about other people having trouble with
the tension pulley too. One guy ruined several belts before
he figured out the tension pulley wasn't lining up right
(yipes!). I'll remember to check that area out good when I
get to that point.

I'll keep you in mind and let you know how it goes if I ever
get around to making one.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Thanks again Leon, yes if you wouldn't mind, I'd like to see the threading
charts. I believe my Yahoo mail account (without the xspam) will accept
them.

I've found that taking the time to examine and adjust/refit a machine prior
to setting it up, is well worth the effort and time.. another good example
besides the 9x20 lathe was the 4x6 bandsaw.
I had the saw apart for quite a while before I actually turned it on.. there
were a lot of little things that would've caused me to stop using it if I
hadn't fixed them before I started using it.

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
...

I've found/saved several thread charts already. If you
need/want one I'll gladly squirt them off in your direction.

On Bedair's website he makes mention of cutting down one of
the larger gears shoulder so that the cir-clip can hold it
in place. Otherwise it is too thick. I think that is the
gear you need for turning the thread on the spindle nose.
Pretty sure that is mentioned on the page where he makes a
backing plate for a new 3-jaw chuck. Here it is, see:

http://bedair.org/Chuck/Chuck2.html

He has one of the thread charts too:

http://bedair.org/Shifter/Thread.html

I asked Steve about the different belt sizes and he didn't
know why either (he has a DC motor now). My idea about
different motors being used was as good as any. Take a look
at this page and then you will know about as much as I do
about it:

http://bedair.org/Shifter/Belt.html

Mine is brand new (Harbor Freight 9x20) and has never been
run yet. The belt measures 705mm in length (I checked it
several times . It is as tight as I think it should be
WITHOUT the tension being drawn down on it.

I've read some stuff about other people having trouble with
the tension pulley too. One guy ruined several belts before
he figured out the tension pulley wasn't lining up right
(yipes!). I'll remember to check that area out good when I
get to that point.

I'll keep you in mind and let you know how it goes if I ever
get around to making one.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Tue, 25 Sep 2007 16:21:23 -0400, "Wild_Bill"
wrote:
snip
Thanks again Leon, yes if you wouldn't mind, I'd like to see the threading
charts. I believe my Yahoo mail account (without the xspam) will accept
them.

They should be on there way as an email (9x20 Thread charts)
with zip file attachment.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email

Good 'ol Global Express EMail.. they're here already

Thanks
WB


"Leon Fisk" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Sep 2007 16:21:23 -0400, "Wild_Bill"
wrote:
snip
Thanks again Leon, yes if you wouldn't mind, I'd like to see the threading
charts. I believe my Yahoo mail account (without the xspam) will accept
them.

They should be on there way as an email (9x20 Thread charts)
with zip file attachment.

--
Leon Fisk
Grand Rapids MI/Zone 5b
Remove no.spam for email


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com