I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

"Brent" wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Got any pictures?

Jon

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue



1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

2nd- emergency air vent?

Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.


Dave

wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...


I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.


I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.


i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.


The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.


I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.


Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.


Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.


Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.


I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.


3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.


my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.


I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.


Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures


1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.


2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.


Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above


Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.

Pete C. wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:
Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load
When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.

Pete:

I have never seen a container pickup, so I did not know what
is involved.

Thanks,

-Wayne

On Sep 10, 4:38 pm, "Jon Danniken"
wrote:
"Brent" wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Got any pictures?

Jon

Yes and no, I'm finishing setting up my website rather than cluttering
the dropbox

Brent wrote:

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons.

To save interior space, could the insulation not be placed on the
outside? Built into removable panels, that can be unbolted for transport.

Suggest pay attention to roof, "out of sight, out of mind". Annoying
when they leak. A good coat of paint on top.

For easy door fitment: Mark position, cut area near hinges with 9 inch
angle grinder, fit hinges, then cut rest of door out - perfect alignment
and free door!
Removing the inner closing device on the right hand door makes for
easier access. Can be refitted as required.

Transporting will likely cause some damage to thing inside, unless all
well bolted in place. I once packed a shipping container full of
furniture, so tight it was like a sardine can - could just close the
doors. When opened again after transport, there was a foot space away
from the doors! The tilt-tray trucks drop containers with a thud. Could
always use trucks with built in cranes for gentler handling, if there's
access space to pull up alongside - more expensive though.

You might end up needing a second container for storage
Put it parallel to the first one, 10 feet apart. Roof over the lot -
cheap carport!

Brent writes:

I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Now, that's a *great* idea.

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...



I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.



I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.



i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.



The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.



I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.



Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.



Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.



Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.



I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.



3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.



my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.



I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.



Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures



1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.



2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.



Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above



Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

TMT

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:47:15 -0700, Brent
wrote:

it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?


As long as it didn't say NCC-1701


Gunner

Brent wrote:

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

You will discover that the water is condensing on the metal and thus
*inside* of your container. You'll have rust and humidity *inside*. Isolate
it on the outside and care for good ventilation between the isolation and
the metal.

Maybe you can have a look at containers that are rent for temporary offices
(at construction sites) and see how they did it.


Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

In article . com,
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

The walkin door is only ONE exit since the big end hatch will be dogged
down, you need the vent/escape hatch (w/ladder) at the other end from
the door

Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...



I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.



I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.



i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.



The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.



I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.



Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.



Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.



Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.



I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.



3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.



my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.



I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.



Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures



1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.



2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.



Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above



Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

Absolutely. You'd use one of the Mr. Heater vented garage heaters, or
perhaps an RV heater. Absolutely never use one of the unvented heaters.


2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

If you're gluing extruded polystyrene foam to the inside of the
container and then FRP panels on top of that with staggered joints, I
think you have all the vapor barrier you'd need.


3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

Yes, and if you find a suitable salvage place, used commercial metal
frame doors should be very cheap. Commercial space gets demod and
rebuilt constantly and these days they're pretty good about reclaiming a
lot of the materials.

Pete C.

nick hull wrote:

In article . com,
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

The walkin door is only ONE exit since the big end hatch will be dogged
down, you need the vent/escape hatch (w/ladder) at the other end from
the door

Free men own guns - www(dot)geocities(dot)com/CapitolHill/5357/

Or just a second door. I can't imagine a used salvage commercial steel
frame door to weld in will cost very much.

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

False floor??? The container floor is already 25mm hardwood plywood over
steel C channel on about 12" centers. Bolt directly through that floor,
can use big washers or load plates underneath as well.

On Sep 11, 8:59 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures

1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.

2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.

Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above

Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

Absolutely. You'd use one of the Mr. Heater vented garage heaters, or
perhaps an RV heater. Absolutely never use one of the unvented heaters.



2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

If you're gluing extruded polystyrene foam to the inside of the
container and then FRP panels on top of that with staggered joints, I
think you have all the vapor barrier you'd need.


Worse comes to worse i'll do the classic plastic and tuck tape vapor
barrier too, for the amount it costs

I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter



3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

Yes, and if you find a suitable salvage place, used commercial metal
frame doors should be very cheap. Commercial space gets demod and
rebuilt constantly and these days they're pretty good about reclaiming a
lot of the materials.

Pete C.

I'll have to investigate that line because so far i was looking at
residential exterior door prices and it hurt to look

On Sep 11, 6:07 am, Nick Mueller wrote:
Brent wrote:
my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

You will discover that the water is condensing on the metal and thus
*inside* of your container. You'll have rust and humidity *inside*. Isolate
it on the outside and care for good ventilation between the isolation and
the metal.

Maybe you can have a look at containers that are rent for temporary offices
(at construction sites) and see how they did it.

Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

Nick, I visited a company that does the conversions and they seem to
have done a 2 inch inner wall of unspecified material and then
chipboard as an exterior cover. Chipboard being glued wood flakes was
not suitable in a shop where welding and sparks would be present. but
for the most part here they do not use many ISO continers as offices
they use little trailers that are constructed in a similar wat to RV's
and motorhomes

On Sep 11, 9:02 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

False floor??? The container floor is already 25mm hardwood plywood over
steel C channel on about 12" centers. Bolt directly through that floor,
can use big washers or load plates underneath as well.

I'll be bolting everything big down and everyting medium sized or on
wheels will be strapped i there is shifting that occurs i'll make sure
i have some squishable space with no critical stuff like a row of milk
crates

Brent wrote:

On Sep 11, 8:59 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures

1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.

2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.

Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above

Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

Absolutely. You'd use one of the Mr. Heater vented garage heaters, or
perhaps an RV heater. Absolutely never use one of the unvented heaters.



2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

If you're gluing extruded polystyrene foam to the inside of the
container and then FRP panels on top of that with staggered joints, I
think you have all the vapor barrier you'd need.


Worse comes to worse i'll do the classic plastic and tuck tape vapor
barrier too, for the amount it costs

Extruded polystyrene isn't permeable, and it has a slight tongue and
groove edge that is easily sealed with adhesive when installing it. The
FRP panels aren't permeable either, and if the joints are staggered and
you run adhesive lines top to bottom, they will be very few potential
leaks. If you really want to go nuts, after gluing the EPS in place, get
a big pack of expanding foam, drill holes top and bottom of the EPS
aligned with the deeper waves in the container and fill those spaces as
well, before applying the FRP.


I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter

Look for a commercial building material salvage place where you should
be able to get good materials cheap that just need a little touch up
paint. I've got several similar places near me and I last got a 6' wide
double door set for my shop for less than half of the cost from Depot or
Lowe's.




3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

Yes, and if you find a suitable salvage place, used commercial metal
frame doors should be very cheap. Commercial space gets demod and
rebuilt constantly and these days they're pretty good about reclaiming a
lot of the materials.

Pete C.

I'll have to investigate that line because so far i was looking at
residential exterior door prices and it hurt to look

Even a regular basic residential steel entry door is like $120 (US) new,
but unfortunately it's wood framed. You want the commercial steel framed
ones so you can just cut a hole and weld it in place in the container.
With the way commercial office space is constantly remodeled and current
recycling efforts, there is a lot of used stuff available.

Brent wrote:

Nick, I visited a company that does the conversions and they seem to
have done a 2 inch inner wall of unspecified material and then
chipboard as an exterior cover.

Yes, and how about condensation? I mean you will have water inside dripping
(and it will *really* drip) off the walls.

Chipboard being glued wood flakes was
not suitable in a shop where welding and sparks would be present.

Try to inflame it. It really isn't that bad! The thicker the better. OSB is
cheap like hell, can be painted and you can nail/screw to it wherever you
want.
But **please** reconsider the isolation, or you'll regret it. Ask an
architect (he should know the math and physics behind it) about dew-point
and isolation layers.


but
for the most part here they do not use many ISO continers as offices
they use little trailers that are constructed in a similar wat to RV's
and motorhomes

Containers here are *very* common. 3 to 4 stories high. Workers living in
there, constructors on-site office etc.
A friend had is office made out of two containers (selling trees an plants).
They were "tropical isolated". In summer it was hot like in the dessert, in
winter like in the arctics. Well, but then he had no lathe in there
rusting. :-)

Not that I think the container-idea is bad (it ain't at all), and not
wanting to tear you down.


Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

Nick Mueller wrote:

Brent wrote:

Nick, I visited a company that does the conversions and they seem to
have done a 2 inch inner wall of unspecified material and then
chipboard as an exterior cover.

Yes, and how about condensation? I mean you will have water inside dripping
(and it will *really* drip) off the walls.

Chipboard being glued wood flakes was
not suitable in a shop where welding and sparks would be present.

Try to inflame it. It really isn't that bad! The thicker the better. OSB is
cheap like hell, can be painted and you can nail/screw to it wherever you
want.
But **please** reconsider the isolation, or you'll regret it. Ask an
architect (he should know the math and physics behind it) about dew-point
and isolation layers.

but
for the most part here they do not use many ISO continers as offices
they use little trailers that are constructed in a similar wat to RV's
and motorhomes

Containers here are *very* common. 3 to 4 stories high. Workers living in
there, constructors on-site office etc.
A friend had is office made out of two containers (selling trees an plants).
They were "tropical isolated". In summer it was hot like in the dessert, in
winter like in the arctics. Well, but then he had no lathe in there
rusting. :-)

Not that I think the container-idea is bad (it ain't at all), and not
wanting to tear you down.

Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

Insulated yes, but was your friends container conditioned space? A
normally constructed and insulated house will experience the same
humidity issues if it is left closed and unconditioned (no heat / A/C).
An insulated container that is kept at a controlled interior temperature
will not experience this issue any more than a house maintained at a
controlled interior temperature will. The container also does not have a
shower or kitchen pumping humidity into it like a house does. The only
source of moisture in the container will be one human intermittently
working in it, something normal ventilation will readily handle.

On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 14:09:05 GMT, "Pete C."
wrote:


I'll have to investigate that line because so far i was looking at
residential exterior door prices and it hurt to look

Even a regular basic residential steel entry door is like $120 (US) new,
but unfortunately it's wood framed. You want the commercial steel framed
ones so you can just cut a hole and weld it in place in the container.
With the way commercial office space is constantly remodeled and current
recycling efforts, there is a lot of used stuff available.


If there is one local to you..check out the store at Habitat for
Humanity. Some very good deals to be had on recycled
materials/supplies.

Gunner

Pete C. wrote:

An insulated container that is kept at a controlled interior temperature
will not experience this issue any more than a house maintained at a
controlled interior temperature will.

Sorry, wrong.
You do have a temperature gradient looking at a section through the wall. At
the place where the temperature drops below the dew-point, you'll get
condensation. Preferably, that happens within the insulation-material,
supposing it can retain and transport humidity. If that is not the case you
get condensation. And this will be exactly at the inside of the metal
container. Styrofoam and that stuff glued to the inside of a wall is *the*
*worst* you can do. Except you are out for mushrooms.


The difference to a house is, that the dew-point is *in* the brick-wall (oh,
you know what this is? G) and the brick can transport humidity to the
outside, especially if there is a humidity-stopping layer (or not as good
transporting, or much longer distance) on the inside of the wall. You get a
much better climate and much less humidity this way. No dehumidifier
needed.

The only
source of moisture in the container will be one human intermittently
working in it, something normal ventilation will readily handle.

Sorry, wrong again. Relative humidity is the point. Warm outside, cool
inside and you ventilate - moisture inside. Just have a look at the water
running out of A/Cs.


Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:47:15 -0700, Brent wrote:
....
Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

I'm not sure what you mean by this, but if they're on escutcheons,
I'd just mask around them. If they're only painted on, I'd keep a
record, but whether you paint them in new paint would be a matter
of taste.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

How about an RV plug/receptacle? Or is that what you just said? ;-)

....
my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I saw some stuff on Bob Vila recently where they're building houses out
of old containers, and they sprayed something called "SuperTherm":
http://www.supertherm.us/supertherm_home.htm
Which allagedly gets something like R-20 in a 50 mil coating or some
such.

Good Luck!
Rich

In article ,
Rich Grise wrote:

of old containers, and they sprayed something called "SuperTherm":
http://www.supertherm.us/supertherm_home.htm
Which allagedly gets something like R-20 in a 50 mil coating or some
such.

The key work being "allegedly". Buncha marketing lies, IMNSHO.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

On Sep 11, 2:37 pm, Rich Grise wrote:
On Mon, 10 Sep 2007 12:47:15 -0700, Brent wrote:

...

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

I'm not sure what you mean by this, but if they're on escutcheons,
I'd just mask around them. If they're only painted on, I'd keep a
record, but whether you paint them in new paint would be a matter
of taste.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

How about an RV plug/receptacle? Or is that what you just said? ;-)

...

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

I saw some stuff on Bob Vila recently where they're building houses out
of old containers, and they sprayed something called "SuperTherm":http://www.supertherm.us/supertherm_home.htm
Which allagedly gets something like R-20 in a 50 mil coating or some
such.

Good Luck!
Rich

Hey rich yeah i did see that stuff and i even investigated. its quite
expensive and needs to be applied with an airless sprayer and for the
overall cost involved i felt a lot more comortable going with a proven
product or seeing a demonstration. the Canadian dealer is in BC and
the nearest "certified installer" is 1000 miles away.

Far too many variables in my mind especially compared to an HVLP spray
gun and plain old white "rust paint"

it might not be a hotrod grade paintjob but its a 37 year old shipping
container what more can you expect.

And worse comes to worse i WILL make some gains due to having chosen
white and t lesser light absorption

For the love of Pete!

Prune your friggen posts!

Cheers
Trevor Jones

On Sep 11, 8:02 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

False floor??? The container floor is already 25mm hardwood plywood over
steel C channel on about 12" centers. Bolt directly through that floor,
can use big washers or load plates underneath as well.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I mention a false floor because metalworking machines can be
heavy...very heavy.

If I had a Bridgeport in such container, I would want it securely
attached to the floor when the container was relocated.

Also a false floor allows one to rearrange machinery without
butchering up the main flooring and allows one the ability to run
cables and ducts under it.

TMT

On Sep 11, 8:50 am, Brent wrote:
On Sep 11, 8:59 am, "Pete C." wrote:





Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures

1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.

2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.

Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above

Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

Absolutely. You'd use one of the Mr. Heater vented garage heaters, or
perhaps an RV heater. Absolutely never use one of the unvented heaters.

2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

If you're gluing extruded polystyrene foam to the inside of the
container and then FRP panels on top of that with staggered joints, I
think you have all the vapor barrier you'd need.

Worse comes to worse i'll do the classic plastic and tuck tape vapor
barrier too, for the amount it costs

I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter



3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

Yes, and if you find a suitable salvage place, used commercial metal
frame doors should be very cheap. Commercial space gets demod and
rebuilt constantly and these days they're pretty good about reclaiming a
lot of the materials.

Pete C.

I'll have to investigate that line because so far i was looking at
residential exterior door prices and it hurt to look- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Definitely cheaper...many times free.

In fact I would consider placing a screen door on the inside so one
could have ventilation when desired.

That will go well with the future porch, rocking chair, dog and cooler
of beer that you will be adding. ;)

You're just gonna love your shop when you are done.

TMT

On Sep 11, 10:36 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Nick Mueller wrote:

Brent wrote:

Nick, I visited a company that does the conversions and they seem to
have done a 2 inch inner wall of unspecified material and then
chipboard as an exterior cover.

Yes, and how about condensation? I mean you will have water inside dripping
(and it will *really* drip) off the walls.

Chipboard being glued wood flakes was
not suitable in a shop where welding and sparks would be present.

Try to inflame it. It really isn't that bad! The thicker the better. OSB is
cheap like hell, can be painted and you can nail/screw to it wherever you
want.
But **please** reconsider the isolation, or you'll regret it. Ask an
architect (he should know the math and physics behind it) about dew-point
and isolation layers.

but
for the most part here they do not use many ISO continers as offices
they use little trailers that are constructed in a similar wat to RV's
and motorhomes

Containers here are *very* common. 3 to 4 stories high. Workers living in
there, constructors on-site office etc.
A friend had is office made out of two containers (selling trees an plants).
They were "tropical isolated". In summer it was hot like in the dessert, in
winter like in the arctics. Well, but then he had no lathe in there
rusting. :-)

Not that I think the container-idea is bad (it ain't at all), and not
wanting to tear you down.

Nick
--
The lowcost-DRO:
http://www.yadro.de

Insulated yes, but was your friends container conditioned space? A
normally constructed and insulated house will experience the same
humidity issues if it is left closed and unconditioned (no heat / A/C).
An insulated container that is kept at a controlled interior temperature
will not experience this issue any more than a house maintained at a
controlled interior temperature will. The container also does not have a
shower or kitchen pumping humidity into it like a house does. The only
source of moisture in the container will be one human intermittently
working in it, something normal ventilation will readily handle.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Coolant?

TMT

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 11, 8:02 am, "Pete C." wrote:
Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

False floor??? The container floor is already 25mm hardwood plywood over
steel C channel on about 12" centers. Bolt directly through that floor,
can use big washers or load plates underneath as well.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I mention a false floor because metalworking machines can be
heavy...very heavy.

If I had a Bridgeport in such container, I would want it securely
attached to the floor when the container was relocated.

Also a false floor allows one to rearrange machinery without
butchering up the main flooring and allows one the ability to run
cables and ducts under it.

TMT

You're already cutting into your 8' ceiling height with a couple inches
of insulation, ceiling FRP and presumably some lights, you don't want to
loose more with a false floor. The container floor can support a
forklift with cargo, vastly heavier than a Bridgeport, and more
concentrated on the four wheels as well. Definitely secure the machines
well, but the existing floor is plenty strong. Add temporary bracing to
top heavy items like a Bridgeport pre container move. Since under the
25mm floor is steel C channel framing, you can readily run cables under
there, ideally in sealtite type flex conduit.

Nick Mueller wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

An insulated container that is kept at a controlled interior temperature
will not experience this issue any more than a house maintained at a
controlled interior temperature will.

Sorry, wrong.
You do have a temperature gradient looking at a section through the wall. At
the place where the temperature drops below the dew-point, you'll get
condensation. Preferably, that happens within the insulation-material,
supposing it can retain and transport humidity. If that is not the case you
get condensation. And this will be exactly at the inside of the metal
container. Styrofoam and that stuff glued to the inside of a wall is *the*
*worst* you can do. Except you are out for mushrooms.

Moisture doesn't magically appear to condense, it has to come from
somewhere. Neither the steel container, not extruded polystyrene
insulation are permeable so nothing of significance is going to happen
in the space between them. The interior surface is very unlikely to be
at dew point in a conditioned space so nothing is likely to happen there
either.


The difference to a house is, that the dew-point is *in* the brick-wall (oh,
you know what this is? G) and the brick can transport humidity to the
outside, especially if there is a humidity-stopping layer (or not as good
transporting, or much longer distance) on the inside of the wall. You get a
much better climate and much less humidity this way. No dehumidifier
needed.

Again with the steel container, EPS insulation and FRP paneling you have
a triple layer vapor barrier. Moisture outside stays outside, moisture
inside stays inside (normal vents remove it).


The only
source of moisture in the container will be one human intermittently
working in it, something normal ventilation will readily handle.

Sorry, wrong again. Relative humidity is the point. Warm outside, cool
inside and you ventilate - moisture inside. Just have a look at the water
running out of A/Cs.

Look at moisture running out of an A/C after it has been running in an
enclosed space for a while, and dehumidifying the space. Unless you're
doing something really stupid to allow a lot of moisture into the space,
it will remain dry and the A/C will operate more efficiently since it
won't have the added load of condensing moisture out of the air as well
as cooling the air.

According to Brent :

[ ... ]

I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter

Might I suggest that each window have an opaque panel which
could be swung in place or inserted to keep people from being able to
see what is in there when things are closed up? No sense in tempting
people -- depending on your neighborhood, of course.

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On Sep 11, 11:15 pm, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
On Sep 11, 8:50 am, Brent wrote:



On Sep 11, 8:59 am, "Pete C." wrote:

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:11 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
wrote:

On Sep 10, 3:47 pm, Brent wrote:
I've posted a few questions off and on about things like putting
Machine tools on a wood floor and on insulating a shop. I figured i
would post an interim update on how my shop upgrade is going.

I decided AGAINST erecting a structure and went the shipping container
route instead. I made that realization wen i figured out i would not
likely be staying at this house forever. If 9 of the 10 heaviest
items i own (Excluding my CAR) are already in the shipping container
it will make future moves EXTREMELY easy. So i'm now the Proud owner
of a 20 foot shipping container.

Cars fit in them fine too...

I started by getting a bed delivered of "granular A" gravel material,
And i wound up getting about 4 tons too much.

Oops.

I got it and spread it and then tamped it down (14 tons of gravel with
a guy using a shovel took longer than i thought)

Exercise.

i bought a used container that was WAY older than i thought it was
(Close inspection revels it was built in 1971) but has no structural
rust to speak of so i'm essentially happy BUT i need to find out where
i can buy container hardware to redo one of the locking tabs

They last a long time. I'm not sure what vintage my 40' is, but it is in
pretty much mint condition, barely a ding.

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

The four corners is all you need, and all that is normally supported on
these things when fully loaded.

I've ground and primed all the surface rust spots and i'm in the
process of respraying the exterior to white

Nice. Mine came with a fresh coat of industrial gray, my favorite color.

Should i replace the numbers and identifiers? it said NICU 87214 as an
ID and i think that might be significant enough to return to the box
possibly?

Not unless you think they look cool or expect to have it shipped
internationally.

Electrical will hopefully get resolved this week

I'm planning on running 100A of 240V 1Ph to it and i'm tryig to figure
out whether thats best done with four Camlock Connectors or with a pin
in sleeve connector and finding 4 conductor 4 gauge cable

The cam locks and individual conductors (type W?) are generally the way
to go with anything over about 60A as complete cables become a bear to
handle.

Since i'm in canada i know i will need to run Heat and AC to it along
with lights

Yep. Might want to consider LP for heat though, unless your electric
rates are real low.

I figure i need 100A since as a single user the worst sustained use i
can hit is WELDER + Compressor + heat + lights. which t me works out
to in the ballpark of 80A at 240V

Yep, no reason to skimp. Install a nice 20-32 space panel in the
container.

3 phase if and when required will be done via VFD for machine tools
liek the mill and i will install an RPC

Good.

my only OTHER concern was insulation and so far i think my best option
is to frame the inside with 2x2's and insulate with the pink styrofoam
stuff then drywall over that with the best fire resistant drywall i
can afford.

My suggestion would be to skip framing and instead glue thick insulboard
(like 2" EPS) to the inside of the container and then glue FRP panels on
top of that (with the nice trim strips between them. FRPs are commercial
grade, fire resistant, washable (food prep area rated), and quite
durable. They're expensive in 1s and 2s at the big box places, but
ordering enough for a container from a real building supply place should
be a lot better.

I've decided to delay adding windows and a human access door to the
side until next year for budget reasons. It means a little more rework
next year but getting the shop ready to go is more important. than
making it pretty and if i have to live with a closed box with all
electric lighting it wont kill me for the winter

Best route on this is to cut a hole in the side of the container and
weld in a regular commercial door frame (and install the door of
course). Use this normal door for access and leave the end doors locked.
You can probably get such a door used at a salvage place cheap. Don't
skip this as it's a safety issue.

Just figured i'd post on how it was doing and look for some feedback
on the insulation and electrical issue

Pictures, we want lots of pictures

1st on the list- if you go in and close the door (to keep the heat in,
etc.) make sure there's a way to keep someone on the outside from
locking you in.

That and the fact that you can't fully close the doors from the inside
without leaving the lock bars where a slight bump could lock them
without any malicious assistance.

2nd- emergency air vent?

RV type vents will install easily and inexpensively. Can't stack other
containers on top after that, but I don't expect that will be an issue.

Insulation that won't burn, even if exposed, might be worth a little
extra effort.

As noted above

Maybe a small (but you can fit through it) emergency hatch at the rear
is in order.

RV vent / escape hatch again.

Have fun

Pete C.

Three comments....

1) If you use LP/gas for heat be sure to vent...they produce
considerable water vapor that you won't like in the enclosed space
with nice tools.

Absolutely. You'd use one of the Mr. Heater vented garage heaters, or
perhaps an RV heater. Absolutely never use one of the unvented heaters.

2) Do you need a vapor barrier for the insulation? I think you will
have condensation on the inside of the container and you don't want
your insulation to become saturated.

If you're gluing extruded polystyrene foam to the inside of the
container and then FRP panels on top of that with staggered joints, I
think you have all the vapor barrier you'd need.

Worse comes to worse i'll do the classic plastic and tuck tape vapor
barrier too, for the amount it costs

I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter

3) Big agreement about the walkin door....two exits always for fire
safety.

Yes, and if you find a suitable salvage place, used commercial metal
frame doors should be very cheap. Commercial space gets demod and
rebuilt constantly and these days they're pretty good about reclaiming a
lot of the materials.

Pete C.

I'll have to investigate that line because so far i was looking at
residential exterior door prices and it hurt to look- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Definitely cheaper...many times free.

In fact I would consider placing a screen door on the inside so one
could have ventilation when desired.

That will go well with the future porch, rocking chair, dog and cooler
of beer that you will be adding. ;)

You're just gonna love your shop when you are done.

TMT

I'm definetly considering the porch in part to also double as a
loading bay

my biggest bit of "material handling" equipment is a shop crane and
chain blocks

a porch with recessed steps that can be removed to leave a hoisting
point for the shop crane seems very wise for next year

On Sep 11, 11:30 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
Nick Mueller wrote:

Pete C. wrote:

An insulated container that is kept at a controlled interior temperature
will not experience this issue any more than a house maintained at a
controlled interior temperature will.

Sorry, wrong.
You do have a temperature gradient looking at a section through the wall. At
the place where the temperature drops below the dew-point, you'll get
condensation. Preferably, that happens within the insulation-material,
supposing it can retain and transport humidity. If that is not the case you
get condensation. And this will be exactly at the inside of the metal
container. Styrofoam and that stuff glued to the inside of a wall is *the*
*worst* you can do. Except you are out for mushrooms.

Moisture doesn't magically appear to condense, it has to come from
somewhere. Neither the steel container, not extruded polystyrene
insulation are permeable so nothing of significance is going to happen
in the space between them. The interior surface is very unlikely to be
at dew point in a conditioned space so nothing is likely to happen there
either.



The difference to a house is, that the dew-point is *in* the brick-wall (oh,
you know what this is? G) and the brick can transport humidity to the
outside, especially if there is a humidity-stopping layer (or not as good
transporting, or much longer distance) on the inside of the wall. You get a
much better climate and much less humidity this way. No dehumidifier
needed.

Again with the steel container, EPS insulation and FRP paneling you have
a triple layer vapor barrier. Moisture outside stays outside, moisture
inside stays inside (normal vents remove it).



The only
source of moisture in the container will be one human intermittently
working in it, something normal ventilation will readily handle.

Sorry, wrong again. Relative humidity is the point. Warm outside, cool
inside and you ventilate - moisture inside. Just have a look at the water
running out of A/Cs.

Look at moisture running out of an A/C after it has been running in an
enclosed space for a while, and dehumidifying the space. Unless you're
doing something really stupid to allow a lot of moisture into the space,
it will remain dry and the A/C will operate more efficiently since it
won't have the added load of condensing moisture out of the air as well
as cooling the air.


OK so in my situation i could use a little feedback here

there are 4 passive vents in the corners of my container

i know i'l likely need to leave these vents through but they will
allow humidity to enter too

Because of my Climate i know i will need both Heating and Air
conditioning

Nick's statements about the dewpoint are valid the Container cools
faster than the ambient air once the sun is down so it will draw dew
if it cools past the dewpoint i will need to seal the inside walls
with a vapor barrier that is a given and i will need ot take steps to
de-humidify the shop. the AC itself I primarily use to drop the
humidity to make work bearable rather than needing the temperature
itself to dropit seems that using Styrofoam the possibly after the
electric is run to call in a sprayfoam guy to seal behind it.

Should i fork over a little more for an AC to let it automatically run
to prevent condensation?

Even if i'm not there if it senses that the dewpoint could be exceeded
it will trigger and dehumidify the shop?

I'm investigating elsewhere too but there are no container conversion
experts local to me.

If i have to do something fancy to prevent condensation so be it, my
tools are worth an ounce of prevention and a few dollars of
dehumidifier runtime


Brent
Ottawa Canada

On Sep 11, 11:05 pm, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
On Sep 11, 8:02 am, "Pete C." wrote:



Too_Many_Tools wrote:

On Sep 10, 5:42 pm, "Pete C." wrote:
"Wayne C. Gramlich" wrote:

Brent wrote:
[snip]

The container is delivered and resting on eight pads made up of a pair
of 4 inch solid concrete blocks. For the most part not all are
touching but if there is any settling the open ones will start taking
the load

When it is time to ship the container, how hard is it
for a shipper to pick it up off the concrete pads? Is
this a "standard procedure" or "time to rent a special
crane" or "something else"?

[snip]

Thanks,

-Wayne

Easy to pick up. For non port pickup and delivery of containers
hydraulic tilting flatbed trailers with big winches are the norm. They
could very easily drag the container onto the trailer as is, or for a
little more refinement jack the container off the blocks and onto some
pipe rollers first.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Good point....maybe now is a good time to attach the machines to a
false floor so if and when you move later they are already secured.

TMT

False floor??? The container floor is already 25mm hardwood plywood over
steel C channel on about 12" centers. Bolt directly through that floor,
can use big washers or load plates underneath as well.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I mention a false floor because metalworking machines can be
heavy...very heavy.

If I had a Bridgeport in such container, I would want it securely
attached to the floor when the container was relocated.

Also a false floor allows one to rearrange machinery without
butchering up the main flooring and allows one the ability to run
cables and ducts under it.

TMT

TMT

I have an Index Model 45 its about bridgeport sized maybe a bit bogger
and i DO share your concerns about bolting it

but i will need to both BOLT and level it and right now it has
levelling screws in the base.

but since moving the container is a Secondary concern to making it
into a valid shop for now i'm not THAT worried about how to bolt it to
the floor for another year or so. also if there is to be any settling
i expect it to happen inthe first winter and spring and i will need to
likely re-levle the machine once the ground thaws

On Sep 12, 12:34 am, (DoN. Nichols) wrote:
According to Brent :

[ ... ]

I am a big fan of overbuilding and already i'm not looking forward to
the budget preventing me form putting in windows this winter

Might I suggest that each window have an opaque panel which
could be swung in place or inserted to keep people from being able to
see what is in there when things are closed up? No sense in tempting
people -- depending on your neighborhood, of course.

Enjoy,
DoN.

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Very good idea thanks.

I'm not too worried in this neighbourhood especially since form a shop
and thievery perspective the SNAP ON truck presents a far more
appealing target than my little shop. But thats not to say that its
not a very good preventative measure.