I had always hoped to come across a variable speed motor for my
old Rockwell 15" wood worker's drill press or some other way to
get it geared a bit lower. I gave up on finding a variable speed
motor and bought a Westward brand heavy 20" drill press with 12
speeds from Grainger's. I have just about finished making small
modifications to the table and making it "mine". Wouldn't you
know - I just acquired a variable speed motor. The new drill came
with a 1 HP. The new acquisition came from a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. The output
shafts are even the same and the frame mounting pattern is
adaptable.

Should I proceed or is the variable motor more valuable on
something else?
Should I install the multi-sheave pulley on the variable motor and
continue to run through the multiple pulleys?
Is there a simple way to make this reversible?



--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)

DC motors have peak torque at stall - I would not change out the motor on
your drill press - use this motor on a wood working lathe or sell it to
persons who do wood turning


"DanG" wrote in message
...
I had always hoped to come across a variable speed motor for my old
Rockwell 15" wood worker's drill press or some other way to get it geared a
bit lower. I gave up on finding a variable speed motor and bought a
Westward brand heavy 20" drill press with 12 speeds from Grainger's. I
have just about finished making small modifications to the table and making
it "mine". Wouldn't you know - I just acquired a variable speed motor.
The new drill came with a 1 HP. The new acquisition came from a commercial
tread mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. The output
shafts are even the same and the frame mounting pattern is adaptable.

Should I proceed or is the variable motor more valuable on something else?
Should I install the multi-sheave pulley on the variable motor and
continue to run through the multiple pulleys?
Is there a simple way to make this reversible?



--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)








--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Dan,
I have a 15" Clausing DP (non var sp) that I added a GE treadmill
motor/controller to. Having this capability is really slick. Just
a "twist of the wrist" and I have a more suitable speed for what's
needed.
It has the feedback for constant speed and torque.
I rarely change belt positions.
Really nice.
RichD (the occasional poster)

On Sep 3, 2:38 pm, "DanG" wrote:
I had always hoped to come across a variable speed motor for my
old Rockwell 15" wood worker's drill press or some other way to
get it geared a bit lower. I gave up on finding a variable speed
motor and bought a Westward brand heavy 20" drill press with 12
speeds from Grainger's. I have just about finished making small
modifications to the table and making it "mine". Wouldn't you
know - I just acquired a variable speed motor. The new drill came
with a 1 HP. The new acquisition came from a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. The output
shafts are even the same and the frame mounting pattern is
adaptable.

Should I proceed or is the variable motor more valuable on
something else?
Should I install the multi-sheave pulley on the variable motor and
continue to run through the multiple pulleys?
Is there a simple way to make this reversible?

DanG wrote:
... a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. ...

First: what is the new motor's RPM? Many of the treadmill motors run
6-7000 rpm. If you just electrically lower the speed you loose hp
proportionally. Lowering with pulleys can be troublesome.

Bob

Bob,
I will need to check, though it did seem to run up fairly high
when I had it locked in the vise.

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"Bob Engelhardt" wrote in message
. ..
DanG wrote:
... a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. ...

First: what is the new motor's RPM? Many of the treadmill
motors run 6-7000 rpm. If you just electrically lower the speed
you loose hp proportionally. Lowering with pulleys can be
troublesome.

Bob

I use a variable speed 3 phase motor on my mill, whose speed I control
with a VFD. It works beautifully. I do change speeds with belts, but
relatively rarely compared to what I would have to do.

i

On Sep 3, 12:36?pm, Bob Engelhardt wrote:
DanG wrote:
... a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. ...

First: what is the new motor's RPM? Many of the treadmill motors run
6-7000 rpm. If you just electrically lower the speed you loose hp
proportionally. Lowering with pulleys can be troublesome.

Bob

I have a treadmill motor on my drill press. To me a drill press
without a variable speed motor would be as unhandy as an auto with
hand crank start.
I usually run the belt in one of the lower speeds although the
treadmill motor does have amazing torque. The motor's high speed is a
handy feature when drilling with small drills.
To reverse the motor you will have to use a double pole- double throw
switch to reverse the relationship between the armature and field. I
cut the leads going to the brushes and attached them to the switch.
engineman

wrote:
I have a treadmill motor on my drill press. To me a drill press
without a variable speed motor would be as unhandy as an auto with
hand crank start. ...

I have a 3 ph & VFD on mine, but I agree about its usefulness. I
advocate for their use regularly.

But the speed can be a problem. Some treadmill motors run more slowly,
e.g., 3000 rpm, but if you have one that runs 7000 and your drill press
is pullyed for a 1725 motor, then you have to cut the speed (& hp) by 4
just to get the same speeds. Then if your drill is pullyed for a lowest
speed of 300 rpm, e.g., and you want to run at 60 rpm, as I do when
tapping, you cut the speed & hp by another factor of 5, you're down to
1/20 of the rated hp. E.g., 1/10 hp from a rated 2 hp , 7000 rpm motor.

Actually, now that I think about, that's not too bad. I run mine at 5
Hz to get 60 rpm, so I'm getting 1/12 of rated hp, which is 1. So I'm
getting 1/12 hp at lowest speed & it's not a problem!

So, I guess that I've got to say to the OP: "Go ahead, use it".

I know when I'm mistaken,
Bob

engineman,

I appreciate everyone's input, but I want to clear up the
reversing. The motor has red, black, green that terminate on a
printed circuit board. I'm sure the circuit board's primary
responsibility is to create DC and also to provide the variable
input. If I understand correctly, reversing the red, black motor
leads should reverse the direction. My main concern would be to
not hurt the circuit board. The reversing should occur after the
circuit board, and the circuit board should not be affected?

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




wrote in message
oups.com...
On Sep 3, 12:36?pm, Bob Engelhardt
wrote:
DanG wrote:
... a commercial tread
mill with a 1 1/2 HP, 90 V DC, variable Leeson motor. ...

First: what is the new motor's RPM? Many of the treadmill
motors run
6-7000 rpm. If you just electrically lower the speed you loose
hp
proportionally. Lowering with pulleys can be troublesome.

Bob

I have a treadmill motor on my drill press. To me a drill press
without a variable speed motor would be as unhandy as an auto
with
hand crank start.
I usually run the belt in one of the lower speeds although the
treadmill motor does have amazing torque. The motor's high speed
is a
handy feature when drilling with small drills.
To reverse the motor you will have to use a double pole- double
throw
switch to reverse the relationship between the armature and
field. I
cut the leads going to the brushes and attached them to the
switch.
engineman

you are correct. Be sure to NEVER EVER reverse with the motor moving - that
board is not designed for the huge spike that will result and you'll smoke
the board - always reverse at 0 RPM



"DanG" wrote in message
...
engineman,

I appreciate everyone's input, but I want to clear up the reversing. The
motor has red, black, green that terminate on a printed circuit board.
I'm sure the circuit board's primary responsibility is to create DC and
also to provide the variable input. If I understand correctly, reversing
the red, black motor leads should reverse the direction. My main concern
would be to not hurt the circuit board. The reversing should occur after
the circuit board, and the circuit board should not be affected?

--



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Dan, it seems that your motor is a fairly common PM (permanent magnet
field)-type, and therefore has no field wires/leads to be concerned with.
It should be fairly obvious that the green wire is earth ground, and is very
likely connected to the motor's case/housing.

Yes, reversing the red & black connections will reverse the direction of the
motor when the switch is located between the circuit board and the motor.
The only precaution is to only switch the direction when the motor is
stopped (the drive circuit board output is zero).
The reversing switch that's generally used is a DPDT (six terminals) type.

Since the motor is a Leeson, and from a piece of commercial equipment, it
probably has adequate cooling for being run at low speeds.
This is an important consideration when various other types of motors,
intended to be run at higher operating speeds, are utilized for running shop
machines at lower than (the motor's) optimum speeds.
Another consideration for the generic variety of treadmill motors is that
they sometimes utilize a flywheel with fins to act as a fan to cool the
motor, which is less effective at slower speeds, and that the shafts are
commonly threaded to accept the flywheel, because the motor's intended use
is to run in one direction only.

Generally, the only maintenance issue for a quality DC PM motor such as a
Leeson would be to inspect the brushes to make sure that they're replaced
before they wear out, along with cleaning out any brush dust that may
accumulate in the brush holder/commutator area.
Obviously, if the motor becomes noisy, the bearings should be inspected and
replaced as needed.

Other stuff..
Switches are usually rated for how much current they can switch (as in
turning a device on/off).
Since the reversing switch in this instance only needs to be able to "hold"
the motor current (used for changing direction, not run/stop), it doesn't
really need to be rated for switching the full motor current. A quality 20A
rated toggle switch would likely be adequate for reversing this motor.

The ideal method to start/stop the motor would be the treadmill's original
method, which probably gradually ramps up the motor speed when it's started.
This may have been a connection to the drive board that came from the
treadmill's control panel, or another type of operator's switch.
Starting the motor by switching the output of the drive circuit is likely to
damage the drive circuit, and should be avoided.

Many types of drives employ a safety stop method (such as the occupant
falling off the treadmill), and this connection, often referred to as
inhibit, could be used for an emergency stop switch. The inhibit connections
are a safe way to de-energize the drive's output without risking damage to
the circuit.

Any location on the drive circuit could be hot to earth ground, and the
circuit should be in a protective housing to eliminate any possibility of
contact with the circuit.
The AC line connections and the other circuit connections, including the
start/stop switch connections, all need be insulated for safety.
Any electrical connections should be treated as potential electrocoution
hazards, especially since this is being considered for a metalworking
machine.
That's one reason why so many devices today have so much plastic on them.

It's creepy to see pics of home shops where drive circuit boards and other
electrical devices are hung on a nail in the wall, with wires strung around
to the machine.

WB
..........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"DanG" wrote in message
...
engineman,

I appreciate everyone's input, but I want to clear up the reversing. The
motor has red, black, green that terminate on a printed circuit board.
I'm sure the circuit board's primary responsibility is to create DC and
also to provide the variable input. If I understand correctly, reversing
the red, black motor leads should reverse the direction. My main concern
would be to not hurt the circuit board. The reversing should occur after
the circuit board, and the circuit board should not be affected?

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)






--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Wild_Bill wrote:
...
Another consideration for the generic variety of treadmill motors is
that they sometimes utilize a flywheel with fins to act as a fan to cool
the motor, which is less effective at slower speeds, and that the shafts
are commonly threaded to accept the flywheel, because the motor's
intended use is to run in one direction only.

Right - realize that if the shaft is threaded, you can only run the
motor in one direction, no reversing. In fact that one direction may be
opposite what you need for your drill press! Check it!


...

The ideal method to start/stop the motor would be the treadmill's
original method, which probably gradually ramps up the motor speed when
it's started. This may have been a connection to the drive board that
came from the treadmill's control panel, or another type of operator's
switch.
....

The treadmill's control board is meant to avoid instant starts. The
boards I've used required that the speed pot be turned up from zero.
This is a major nuisance, which I kinda' got around by having a push
button which shorted the pot and made the board think it was at zero.
Still, having to push the button after turning it on was still
inconvenient, so I bought a real controller on eBay.

Bob

Thankyou for the information.

William, I've heard treadmill motors recommended for drill presses
in the past, you are the first hollering NO.

Bill, I didn't know you had been to my shop. My feelings are
hurt, though. I don't have the boards and wiring hanging on
nails, I use screws, zip ties, and Velcro. Wrapping everything in
electrician's tape is so hard to rework.

For those who asked:

The motor is a Leeson
1.5 HP
90 volt
15 AMP
4800 RPM
The output shaft is NOT threaded - normal flatted shaft.
It does say Torque 19.7, I've not seen this before and I am
curious what this one means.

The control board is identical to figure 9 he
http://www.leeson.com/cgi-bin/nicefetchpdf.cgi/literature/manuals/pdf/manual_speedmaster_scrthyristor.pdf

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




"Wild_Bill" wrote in message
.. .
Dan, it seems that your motor is a fairly common PM (permanent
magnet field)-type, and therefore has no field wires/leads to be
concerned with.
It should be fairly obvious that the green wire is earth ground,
and is very likely connected to the motor's case/housing.

Yes, reversing the red & black connections will reverse the
direction of the motor when the switch is located between the
circuit board and the motor.
The only precaution is to only switch the direction when the
motor is stopped (the drive circuit board output is zero).
The reversing switch that's generally used is a DPDT (six
terminals) type.

Since the motor is a Leeson, and from a piece of commercial
equipment, it probably has adequate cooling for being run at low
speeds.
This is an important consideration when various other types of
motors, intended to be run at higher operating speeds, are
utilized for running shop machines at lower than (the motor's)
optimum speeds.
Another consideration for the generic variety of treadmill
motors is that they sometimes utilize a flywheel with fins to
act as a fan to cool the motor, which is less effective at
slower speeds, and that the shafts are commonly threaded to
accept the flywheel, because the motor's intended use is to run
in one direction only.

Generally, the only maintenance issue for a quality DC PM motor
such as a Leeson would be to inspect the brushes to make sure
that they're replaced before they wear out, along with cleaning
out any brush dust that may accumulate in the brush
holder/commutator area.
Obviously, if the motor becomes noisy, the bearings should be
inspected and replaced as needed.

Other stuff..
Switches are usually rated for how much current they can switch
(as in turning a device on/off).
Since the reversing switch in this instance only needs to be
able to "hold" the motor current (used for changing direction,
not run/stop), it doesn't really need to be rated for switching
the full motor current. A quality 20A rated toggle switch would
likely be adequate for reversing this motor.

The ideal method to start/stop the motor would be the
treadmill's original method, which probably gradually ramps up
the motor speed when it's started. This may have been a
connection to the drive board that came from the treadmill's
control panel, or another type of operator's switch.
Starting the motor by switching the output of the drive circuit
is likely to damage the drive circuit, and should be avoided.

Many types of drives employ a safety stop method (such as the
occupant falling off the treadmill), and this connection, often
referred to as inhibit, could be used for an emergency stop
switch. The inhibit connections are a safe way to de-energize
the drive's output without risking damage to the circuit.

Any location on the drive circuit could be hot to earth ground,
and the circuit should be in a protective housing to eliminate
any possibility of contact with the circuit.
The AC line connections and the other circuit connections,
including the start/stop switch connections, all need be
insulated for safety.
Any electrical connections should be treated as potential
electrocoution hazards, especially since this is being
considered for a metalworking machine.
That's one reason why so many devices today have so much plastic
on them.

It's creepy to see pics of home shops where drive circuit boards
and other electrical devices are hung on a nail in the wall,
with wires strung around to the machine.

WB
.........
metalworking projects
www.kwagmire.com/metal_proj.html


"DanG" wrote in message
...
engineman,

I appreciate everyone's input, but I want to clear up the
reversing. The motor has red, black, green that terminate on a
printed circuit board. I'm sure the circuit board's primary
responsibility is to create DC and also to provide the variable
input. If I understand correctly, reversing the red, black
motor leads should reverse the direction. My main concern
would be to not hurt the circuit board. The reversing should
occur after the circuit board, and the circuit board should not
be affected?

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)






--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

According to DanG :

[ ... ]

For those who asked:

The motor is a Leeson
1.5 HP
90 volt
15 AMP
4800 RPM
The output shaft is NOT threaded - normal flatted shaft.
It does say Torque 19.7, I've not seen this before and I am
curious what this one means.

At a guess -- DC PM motors often have a limit on the current
which can pass through them before it starts to demagnetize the
permanent magnet fields.

The current in a DC motor is proportional to torque.

So this is probably the maximum safe torque (probably
corresponding to the 15A spec). At a guess, that is foot pounds, but it
could be inch pounds, or Newton Meters without units from the data
place.

Enjoy,
DoN.
--
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

On 6 Sep 2007 01:18:15 GMT, (DoN. Nichols) wrote:

According to DanG :

[ ... ]

For those who asked:

The motor is a Leeson
1.5 HP
90 volt
15 AMP
4800 RPM
The output shaft is NOT threaded - normal flatted shaft.
It does say Torque 19.7, I've not seen this before and I am
curious what this one means.

At a guess -- DC PM motors often have a limit on the current
which can pass through them before it starts to demagnetize the
permanent magnet fields.

The current in a DC motor is proportional to torque.

So this is probably the maximum safe torque (probably
corresponding to the 15A spec). At a guess, that is foot pounds, but it
could be inch pounds, or Newton Meters without units from the data
place.

HP = in*lb x RPM / 63,000

1.5HP = 19.7 in*lb x 4800 RPM / 63,000

So except for the fact that the units are not shown, the torque number
is redundant.

Demag current on this sort of motor is usually around 3x rated
current, it can be as high as 7x for fancy motors with expensive
magnets.

--
Ned Simmons