Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353,
only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob |
#2
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a
magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
#3
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 19, 8:54 pm, "42etus" wrote:
What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Uh, duh --- I plead brain fart! Sometime the obvious solution just ain't so obvious. Of course... Anybody know what the problems with the AL block versions might be? Haven't heard any specifics, just "don't get one with an aluminum block". |
#4
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Bob,
Just make sure to check the block and the heads separate of eachother. It's very common for an iron block to be mated with aluminum heads. Respects, Rob Fraser Fraser Competition Engines Chicago, IL. "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 19, 8:54 pm, "42etus" wrote: What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Uh, duh --- I plead brain fart! Sometime the obvious solution just ain't so obvious. Of course... Anybody know what the problems with the AL block versions might be? Haven't heard any specifics, just "don't get one with an aluminum block". |
#5
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 19, 11:14 pm, "RDF" wrote:
Bob, Just make sure to check the block and the heads separate of eachother. It's very common for an iron block to be mated with aluminum heads. Respects, Rob Fraser Fraser Competition Engines Chicago, IL. "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 19, 8:54 pm, "42etus" wrote: What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message roups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Uh, duh --- I plead brain fart! Sometime the obvious solution just ain't so obvious. Of course... Anybody know what the problems with the AL block versions might be? Haven't heard any specifics, just "don't get one with an aluminum block".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'm not sure if detroit had any engines with aluminum heads, and I'm amazed to know they did produce a diesel with an aluminum block. I would say that the majority of problems would be electrolisis (sp) eating away the block especially if raw water cooling in salt water. also the problem with mis matching materials (AL block, copper gasket, and cast iron head) would be the expansion and contraction issue witht he aluminum eventually wearing the head gaskets out. But don't know that for a fact. Wow, a 3-53 in a boat"? 159 cubic inches! is this for a gen set? or the main engine? |
#6
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
"Tim" wrote in message ps.com... On Aug 19, 11:14 pm, "RDF" wrote: Bob, Just make sure to check the block and the heads separate of eachother. It's very common for an iron block to be mated with aluminum heads. Respects, Rob Fraser Fraser Competition Engines Chicago, IL. "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 19, 8:54 pm, "42etus" wrote: What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message roups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Uh, duh --- I plead brain fart! Sometime the obvious solution just ain't so obvious. Of course... Anybody know what the problems with the AL block versions might be? Haven't heard any specifics, just "don't get one with an aluminum block".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'm not sure if detroit had any engines with aluminum heads, and I'm amazed to know they did produce a diesel with an aluminum block. I would say that the majority of problems would be electrolisis (sp) eating away the block especially if raw water cooling in salt water. also the problem with mis matching materials (AL block, copper gasket, and cast iron head) would be the expansion and contraction issue witht he aluminum eventually wearing the head gaskets out. But don't know that for a fact. Wow, a 3-53 in a boat"? 159 cubic inches! Yes, but it being a 2 Cycle multiply that by 2 and add a blower. Steve is this for a gen set? or the main engine? |
#7
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 19, 10:35 pm, Tim wrote:
On Aug 19, 11:14 pm, "RDF" wrote: Bob, Just make sure to check the block and the heads separate of eachother. It's very common for an iron block to be mated with aluminum heads. Respects, Rob Fraser Fraser Competition Engines Chicago, IL. "Bob" wrote in message roups.com... On Aug 19, 8:54 pm, "42etus" wrote: What are you asking here? How to tell if the block is aluminum or not? Try a magnet. 42 "Bob" wrote in message roups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob -- Posted via a free Usenet account fromhttp://www.teranews.com Uh, duh --- I plead brain fart! Sometime the obvious solution just ain't so obvious. Of course... Anybody know what the problems with the AL block versions might be? Haven't heard any specifics, just "don't get one with an aluminum block".- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - I'm not sure if detroit had any engines with aluminum heads, and I'm amazed to know they did produce a diesel with an aluminum block. I would say that the majority of problems would be electrolisis (sp) eating away the block especially if raw water cooling in salt water. also the problem with mis matching materials (AL block, copper gasket, and cast iron head) would be the expansion and contraction issue witht he aluminum eventually wearing the head gaskets out. But don't know that for a fact. Wow, a 3-53 in a boat"? 159 cubic inches! is this for a gen set? or the main engine?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Tim -- Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob |
#8
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Bob wrote: Wow, a 3-53 in a boat"? 159 cubic inches! is this for a gen set? or the main engine?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Tim -- Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob Interesting. I know the old 6-71 "jimmy" was a 426 CID and was rated at 238 hp in a standard (not marine) configuration. So I'm amazed that the little 3-53 can obtain 100hp. |
#9
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 20:43:25 -0700, Bob wrote:
I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob Dunno about Detroit Diesel in particular, but in general I know that an aluminum block engine will last forever if it's designed right (i.e. if it's not a Vega engine) and it's maintained right. "Maintained right" for an Al block engine requires a lot more attention to the coolant than Fe block engines, which is why so many die early deaths in automotive applications. If, as mentioned in another post, they're running salt water through it's veins you can probably take it as "not designed right". -- Tim Wescott Control systems and communications consulting http://www.wescottdesign.com Need to learn how to apply control theory in your embedded system? "Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" by Tim Wescott Elsevier/Newnes, http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html |
#10
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Tim Wescott wrote: Dunno about Detroit Diesel in particular, but in general I know that an aluminum block engine will last forever if it's designed right (i.e. if it's not a Vega engine) and it's maintained right. "Maintained right" for an Al block engine requires a lot more attention to the coolant than Fe block engines, which is why so many die early deaths in automotive applications. The Vega was an aluminum block and cast iron head, a particularly odd combination. If you allowed it to overheat, even a LITTLE, like stuck in traffic, it would warp the head. A little hotter and the head would crack. And, of course, no iron liners, just silicon-aluminum with the aluminum etched back in the bores. Jon |
#11
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Jon Elson wrote:
Tim Wescott wrote: Dunno about Detroit Diesel in particular, but in general I know that an aluminum block engine will last forever if it's designed right (i.e. if it's not a Vega engine) and it's maintained right. "Maintained right" for an Al block engine requires a lot more attention to the coolant than Fe block engines, which is why so many die early deaths in automotive applications. The Vega was an aluminum block and cast iron head, a particularly odd combination. If you allowed it to overheat, even a LITTLE, like stuck in traffic, it would warp the head. A little hotter and the head would crack. And, of course, no iron liners, just silicon-aluminum with the aluminum etched back in the bores. It was, I believe, the cylinder bores that were usually at fault -- they worked well in theory, but if you got the slightest scuff in the bore it'd go through the nitriding and then the whole thing would wear out exceedingly fast. Any time anyone needs to know the difference between "inexpensive" and "cheap", just park a Vega next to a VW bug and give them a guided tour. -- Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com Do you need to implement control loops in software? "Applied Control Theory for Embedded Systems" gives you just what it says. See details at http://www.wescottdesign.com/actfes/actfes.html |
#12
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
What size is the hull and what material is it made of?
b "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob |
#13
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 20, 10:41 am, Bob wrote:
Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob- Bob, by searching around the typical listings on a naturally aspirated 3-53 is about 75 hp. Which I feel is more realistic. I could be wrong, though. http://www.usedboats.com/index.php?s...istoryback =1 |
#14
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
"Tim" wrote in message ps.com... On Aug 20, 10:41 am, Bob wrote: Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob- Bob, by searching around the typical listings on a naturally aspirated 3-53 is about 75 hp. Which I feel is more realistic. I could be wrong, though. http://www.usedboats.com/index.php?s...istoryback =1 http://www.adieselengine.com/new_page_1.htm shows 101 hp for the 3-53 and 175 for the 3-53T And since it shows a T I would assume turbocharged. As the 6-71 with a blower was a 6V-71. the same blower that was used for years on dragsters and driven via a Gilmer belt. |
#15
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:00:33 -0700, Tim wrote:
Interesting. I know the old 6-71 "jimmy" was a 426 CID and was rated at 238 hp in a standard (not marine) configuration. So I'm amazed that the little 3-53 can obtain 100hp. The naturally aspirated (non-turbocharged) 6-71 can produce up to 320 hp depending on the injectors used. I have the Johnson & Towers 280 hp version on my trawler. |
#16
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:00:33 -0700, Tim wrote:
Bob wrote: Wow, a 3-53 in a boat"? 159 cubic inches! is this for a gen set? or the main engine?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - Tim -- Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob Interesting. I know the old 6-71 "jimmy" was a 426 CID and was rated at 238 hp in a standard (not marine) configuration. So I'm amazed that the little 3-53 can obtain 100hp. If you have worked around the 71 series and somebody lights off a 53 you'll figure out real quick how they got that horsepower. They were real screamers for their day. The only ones I worked on were in 5 ton yard cranes but I believe there was a turbo option for them also. Bruce in Bangkok (brucepaigeATgmailDOTcom) |
#17
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 20, 11:03 pm, "Calif Bill" wrote:
"Tim" wrote in message ps.com... On Aug 20, 10:41 am, Bob wrote: Yep, they used to be pretty common main engines in small workboats and utility craft, now mostly used for deck engines and gen sets. The marine engine configuration produces just over 100 hp naturally aspirated. Bob- Bob, by searching around the typical listings on a naturally aspirated 3-53 is about 75 hp. Which I feel is more realistic. I could be wrong, though. http://www.usedboats.com/index.php?s...om§ion=search&.... http://www.adieselengine.com/new_page_1.htm shows 101 hp for the 3-53 and 175 for the 3-53T And since it shows a T I would assume turbocharged. As the 6-71 with a blower was a 6V-71. the same blower that was used for years on dragsters and driven via a Gilmer belt. Oh OK, I see they're pushing it up to 2800 rpm, instead of the customary 2100 max. That might be the clue to the 100 hp. |
#18
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.boats
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 20, 11:09 pm, Wayne.B wrote:
On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 10:00:33 -0700, Tim wrote: Interesting. I know the old 6-71 "jimmy" was a 426 CID and was rated at 238 hp in a standard (not marine) configuration. So I'm amazed that the little 3-53 can obtain 100hp. The naturally aspirated (non-turbocharged) 6-71 can produce up to 320 hp depending on the injectors used. I have the Johnson & Towers 280 hp version on my trawler. I didn't realize that Wayne. Thanks! But then again when I was talking the lower hp ranges, I was mentioning "standard" version of the engines, too. |
#19
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Bob,
What size is the hull and of what material is it made? Thanks "jusme" wrote in message ... What size is the hull and what material is it made of? b "Bob" wrote in message ups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob |
#20
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
On Aug 21, 11:35 am, "jusme" wrote:
Bob, What size is the hull and of what material is it made? Thanks "jusme" wrote in message ... What size is the hull and what material is it made of? b "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It's an ex-Coast Guard 27' utility boat. Hull is in excellent condition, deck was spongy, but deck and house have been professionally replaced and look nice. It's in running condition, but needs to have the cabin fitted out and equipment (which is present) reinstalled. Haven't seen the underwater profile yet, but am assuming with that power it will run at semi-displacement speeds, which is fine for me. Bob |
#21
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
Thanks for the info, Bob.
I had a forty footer, steel-hulled trawler with a 3-53 in it and loved it. In a trawler, the 3-53 is a great engine. "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... On Aug 21, 11:35 am, "jusme" wrote: Bob, What size is the hull and of what material is it made? Thanks "jusme" wrote in message ... What size is the hull and what material is it made of? b "Bob" wrote in message oups.com... I'm looking at a nice little fishing boat/cruiser with a Detroit 353, only about 1000 hours on it, runs great. I know this is one of the more reliable diesels ever made, but I have heard some not-so-good things about the ones that came with aluminum blocks. The boat was built in 1987, so the engine is at least that old. The owner doesn't know much about it. Is there a way to tell which version it is? Thanks, Bob- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - It's an ex-Coast Guard 27' utility boat. Hull is in excellent condition, deck was spongy, but deck and house have been professionally replaced and look nice. It's in running condition, but needs to have the cabin fitted out and equipment (which is present) reinstalled. Haven't seen the underwater profile yet, but am assuming with that power it will run at semi-displacement speeds, which is fine for me. Bob |
#22
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
|
|||
|
|||
Detroit 353 diesel -- aluminum block? How to tell?
My 3-53 had an emergency shut-down, which was a spring-loaded damper door
that when tripped, it shut off the air from the 'blower'. "JohnM" wrote in message m... Eisboch wrote: "JohnM" wrote in message m... All two-stroke Detroits have a blower. It's necessary to the operation of the engine, does the job that crankcase pressure does in a little two-stroke. On the inline motors it mounts on the side of the block. John If a "blower" is defined by you as a turbo (i.e. .., device to increase air flow into the cylinders), then you are in error. I know several people with 2 stroke DD 6-71's. Some are naturally aspirated, some have turbos (blowers). Eisboch Find a cutaway picture of a Detroit Diesel, you'll see what the blower does and you can figure out how. Don't pay no 'tention to turbos, a turbo isn't a blower. A naturally aspirated Detroit two-stroke has a blower. John |
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
Hey Bill in Detroit! | Woodworking | |||
Public Lumber in Detroit | Woodworking | |||
Detroit Industrial | Metalworking | |||
Detroit-New Yankee Workshop?????? | Woodworking | |||
electronics store near detroit? | Electronics |