Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work.

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  #1   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Robin S.
 
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Default RCM wiki database

Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.

For those unfamiliar...

http://www.wiki.org/wiki.cgi?WhatIsWiki

I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.

I'm sure this group collectively consumes hundreds of hours each week
replying to questions which have been asked dozens of times, only to get
lost in the Google archives, never to be found by thirsty eyes again.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.

Naturally there are issues. User-editable articles can be full of useless or
incorrect information. Ideally the group collectively keeps the content
relevant and error-free, but there's no guarantee. Also, I'm not sure where
the database could be hosted or any of those types of details.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.

Regards,

Robin


  #2   Report Post  
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Ignoramus18798
 
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Default RCM wiki database

I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.

i

On Mon, 22 May 2006 02:37:44 -0400, Robin S. wrote:
Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.

For those unfamiliar...

http://www.wiki.org/wiki.cgi?WhatIsWiki

I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.

I'm sure this group collectively consumes hundreds of hours each week
replying to questions which have been asked dozens of times, only to get
lost in the Google archives, never to be found by thirsty eyes again.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.

Naturally there are issues. User-editable articles can be full of useless or
incorrect information. Ideally the group collectively keeps the content
relevant and error-free, but there's no guarantee. Also, I'm not sure where
the database could be hosted or any of those types of details.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.

Regards,

Robin



  #3   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Ignoramus18798
 
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Default RCM wiki database


On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:32:59 GMT, Ignoramus18798 wrote:
I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Forgot to add, this wiki will probably be published under GNU Free
Documentation License (GFDL).

http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html

If so, I will post a nightly snapshot of the database so that it can
be reproduced elsewhere in case if, say, I should die.

In other words, the data would not be proprietary.

i
i

On Mon, 22 May 2006 02:37:44 -0400, Robin S. wrote:
Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.

For those unfamiliar...

http://www.wiki.org/wiki.cgi?WhatIsWiki

I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.

I'm sure this group collectively consumes hundreds of hours each week
replying to questions which have been asked dozens of times, only to get
lost in the Google archives, never to be found by thirsty eyes again.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.

Naturally there are issues. User-editable articles can be full of useless or
incorrect information. Ideally the group collectively keeps the content
relevant and error-free, but there's no guarantee. Also, I'm not sure where
the database could be hosted or any of those types of details.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.

Regards,

Robin




  #4   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
 
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I vote for this idea. I dunt know much about metalworking, but there's
a faint hope I may one day learn something useful enough to pass on.

(at least, I hope to be able to contribute more advanced things than:
wot you have just welded will be hot. don't touch it.
wot you have just lathed will be hot. don't touch it.
wot you have just angled grinded......)

  #5   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Dave Hinz
 
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Default RCM wiki database

On Mon, 22 May 2006 02:37:44 -0400, Robin S. wrote:
Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.


I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.


Question: why not just put our stuff in wikipedia? It's on-topic, and
that way it gets administered by _someone else_.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.


Yes, it's an excellent way to maintain documentation without it being a
pain in the butt to write and link.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.


I've implemented, er, a few dozen wikis for clients and employers over
the years. It's a great tool. For something like this group, it'd
definately be an asset, but I think wikipedia would be a better idea
than having one of us host it. (I say this as someone who hosts apps
myself). I'd hate to spend time contributing to something that could
just go away if the one person gets bored with it or short on hosting
money. Wikipedia seems to be self-sustaining for the forseeable
decades.

Dave Hinz


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Larry Jaques
 
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Default RCM wiki database

On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:32:59 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Ignoramus18798 quickly quoth:

I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Go for it, Ig. And Thanks!


--
Be not afraid of growing slowly, be afraid only of standing still.
--Chinese Proverb
------
www.diversify.com -- Growing Websites For Over a Decade Now
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Ignoramus18798
 
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The bad thing about hosting a separate wiki, as you note, is that if
the host loses interest, dies or runs out of money, it would go down.

The good thing about it is that we can discuss topics that would
likely be removed by wikipedia community as too specialized, such as
fine points of metalworking.

The issue of the wiki page depending on one person can be mitigated by
publishing the wiki database snapshot, this way it can be reproduced
elsewhere with a minimum of damage.

i

  #8   Report Post  
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Ignoramus18798
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 08:26:05 -0700, Larry Jaques novalidaddress@di wrote:
On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:32:59 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm,
Ignoramus18798 quickly quoth:

I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Go for it, Ig. And Thanks!


Here's are some things that I would like to propose:

1) It is published under GNU free documentation license. That means
that it is an open source style license, anyone could take these
articles and republish (with credit given).

2) A daily snapshot of the wiki database would be published, so it can
be archived off site and reproduced in case if my hosting goes bad.

Should I host in under a hostname such as metalworking.algebra.com?
Or should I register a separate domain? What's a good name here?

What I want is to set up some safeguards and protections so that this
"body of knowledge" is not my proprietary thing, but is instead a
collective asset (smacks of communism, but this is information that
wants to be free, not "real goods").

Also, I do not want to create any controversy, so if there are enough
people objecting, (say over 20% of all opinions expressed, or 4
persons, whichever is less), I will not go ahead with this.

i

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Robin S.
 
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"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...


Question: why not just put our stuff in wikipedia? It's on-topic, and
that way it gets administered by _someone else_.


Dave,

I wasn't aware this was an option. Indeed I thought it might be somewhat
frowned upon. From my novice point of view, it seems like our data might get
lost in a sea of related but not specifically RCM information if it's hosted
on wikipedia. I can't find any examples of separate communities on
wikipedia, but that's after only two minutes of looking.

Obviously I really have no idea of how this should be done. It's good to see
that we have at least two experts here.

Regards,

Robin


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Dave Hinz
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 15:31:22 GMT, Ignoramus18798 wrote:
The bad thing about hosting a separate wiki, as you note, is that if
the host loses interest, dies or runs out of money, it would go down.


Right.

The good thing about it is that we can discuss topics that would
likely be removed by wikipedia community as too specialized, such as
fine points of metalworking.


Right.

The issue of the wiki page depending on one person can be mitigated by
publishing the wiki database snapshot, this way it can be reproduced
elsewhere with a minimum of damage.


Good point. I've got hosting, obviously you do too. (who are you using
by the way? I just signed up for a quarter with dotster and will see
how it goes, but dreamhost looks pretty damn good too.

So, mediawiki, eh? I should see if I have that as an easy option for
what I'm doing. If so, I wouldn't mind mirroring what you do if you set
it up (or even just doing offsite backups of a dump you schedule).
If the group wants to go forward, I've got the resources and it won't
cost anyone anything.

Dave


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Robin S.
 
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"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
...


One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Forgot to add, this wiki will probably be published under GNU Free
Documentation License (GFDL).

http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html

If so, I will post a nightly snapshot of the database so that it can
be reproduced elsewhere in case if, say, I should die.

In other words, the data would not be proprietary.


Iggy,

Thanks for the offer. It sounds like one way or the other we can get
something started. Dave's idea about using Wikipedia sounds very lucrative
(see my other post). Do you have any thoughts on the hosting side of things?
Donated server space sounds like a hassle and inconvenience for those who
are donating.

Regards,

Robin


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Adam Smith
 
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+1

I think the open source published database is an important point.

Re the domain: a separate link under the existing metalworking.com domain
would be best (IMO), rather than going with a new domain for the resource.

Adam Smith
Midland, ON

(BTW there is another Adam Smith who has posted to rcm from time to time,
which is why, since I bumped into him, I've always included the town on the
sig line. I just mention it since it might be relevant to a vote. )


  #13   Report Post  
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Dave Hinz
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:37:24 -0400, Robin S. wrote:

"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...


Question: why not just put our stuff in wikipedia? It's on-topic, and
that way it gets administered by _someone else_.


I wasn't aware this was an option. Indeed I thought it might be somewhat
frowned upon.


Not really. I've started quite a few "trees" over in wikipedia that
have grown surprisingly well in the years since I started them there.

From my novice point of view, it seems like our data might get
lost in a sea of related but not specifically RCM information if it's hosted
on wikipedia. I can't find any examples of separate communities on
wikipedia, but that's after only two minutes of looking.


Well, it doesn't need to be a seperate anything there, really. A base
article on Metalworking, could mention different operations such as
milling, drilling, lathe work, welding, bending, casting, etc etc etc.
Each of those can have their own article which then talk about
equipment, techniques, or however. Doesn't matter which wiki we build
it on or in, the organization will be organic and dynamic, the
inter-linking is what makes it useful.

Ah. In fact, check out the article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metalworking
Looks like someone has a good start at it already, and there's a flag on
the article saying "This article or section is in need of attention from
an expert on the subject. Please help recruit one, or improve this
page yourself if you can. Please see discussion page for details."

So, sounds like we're not just welcome to use it, but being asked to
help.

Obviously I really have no idea of how this should be done. It's good to see
that we have at least two experts here.


I'm open to either approach, leaning somewhat to the wikipedia one
because it's less work and will be around forever.

Dave Hinz
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Ignoramus18798
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:40:15 -0400, Robin S. wrote:

"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
...


One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Forgot to add, this wiki will probably be published under GNU Free
Documentation License (GFDL).

http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/fdl.html

If so, I will post a nightly snapshot of the database so that it can
be reproduced elsewhere in case if, say, I should die.

In other words, the data would not be proprietary.


Iggy,

Thanks for the offer. It sounds like one way or the other we can get
something started. Dave's idea about using Wikipedia sounds very lucrative
(see my other post). Do you have any thoughts on the hosting side of things?
Donated server space sounds like a hassle and inconvenience for those who
are donating.


Wikipedia is an extremely useful resource. Dave is right about
that. On the other hand, it would be against their nature to publish
extremely specialized articles, like how to select argon pressure and
CFM for welding or how to measure thread pitch, etc. And that, I
think, would be a real benefit of metalworking wiki.

Also, we could refer to wikipedia articles from the metalworking wiki,
so that we do not need to rewrite the great stuff that is maintained
there.

I own algebra.com and have a decicated server to host algebra.com
anyway, so hosting one more virtual domain is very easy for
me. (algebra.com is a little algebra tutor community where free tutors
help students for free).

i

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Ignoramus18798
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 11:48:03 -0400, Adam Smith wrote:
+1

I think the open source published database is an important point.

Re the domain: a separate link under the existing metalworking.com domain
would be best (IMO), rather than going with a new domain for the resource.


That's fine with me. Either way is fine: a metalworking.com hostname
(if the owner of that site is responsive), a algebra.com hostname, or
a separate domain.

i

Adam Smith
Midland, ON

(BTW there is another Adam Smith who has posted to rcm from time to time,
which is why, since I bumped into him, I've always included the town on the
sig line. I just mention it since it might be relevant to a vote. )





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Robin S.
 
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"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
.. .

Wikipedia is an extremely useful resource. Dave is right about
that. On the other hand, it would be against their nature to publish
extremely specialized articles, like how to select argon pressure and
CFM for welding or how to measure thread pitch, etc. And that, I
think, would be a real benefit of metalworking wiki.


I think we share the same vision. I think the wiki should be very
specilized, like a textbook or guide to specific metalworking techniques.

Ultimately I think that usenet just isn't all that great for archiving
content in an easy to find way. People end up endlessly explaining the
differences between various import machinery manufacturers and products, how
to get into CNC at home, speeds and feeds, etc. I know from personal
experience that after years of repeating yourself, you eventually just don't
contribute any more.


Also, we could refer to wikipedia articles from the metalworking wiki,
so that we do not need to rewrite the great stuff that is maintained
there.


True. It's a good start for people who are very new to metalworking.


I own algebra.com and have a decicated server to host algebra.com
anyway, so hosting one more virtual domain is very easy for
me. (algebra.com is a little algebra tutor community where free tutors
help students for free).


You are a virtual philanthropist, Iggy. Giving your time and money to those
in need is a noble endeavour. I think everyone here donates a lot of time to
helping others get into this craft as well. This is exactly why wiki would
be so powerful.

Perhaps it would be a good start to host on your algebra server. At least to
get the ball rolling and see how things move. The metalworking.com name
would be more appropriate aesthetically, and would tie things in more
neatly, but I'd be more concerned with ultimately getting content online.

Regards,

Robin


  #17   Report Post  
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Grant Erwin
 
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Ah. In fact, check out the article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metalworking
Looks like someone has a good start at it already, and there's a flag on
the article saying "This article or section is in need of attention from
an expert on the subject. Please help recruit one, or improve this
page yourself if you can. Please see discussion page for details."

So, sounds like we're not just welcome to use it, but being asked to
help.



Dave Hinz


I'm no wikimaster to say the least, but I went and poked around the
above-referenced link and all I saw were definitions, as is consistent with a
dictionary. I didn't see a single article in the sense we would think of it,
e.g. Teenut on how to grind a cutoff tool.

This all sounds like an attempt to revive the long long dormant FAQ (not updated
to my knowledge since 1995) which would be welcome indeed.

I do know something about technical writing, and any such publication would be
of dubious quality unless some attempt were made to keep it to a certain minimum
level of writing quality. This could be accomplished by a system of peer review
which might look like: a guy writes a piece and publishes it, then another
person reads it and sees how it could be improved and contacts the author with
suggestions, after which the author edits it and updates the piece, iterated
indefinitely. This would require a separate communication system. Even better
would be if the whole thing had a person who acted as a global moderator, who
could if given sufficient motivation remove articles entirely.

I have written articles and posted them to places like metalwebnews and had them
mangled in publication and nobody to respond to my requests to fix.

Anyway, it all sounds great to me.

GWE
  #18   Report Post  
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Ignoramus18798
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 12:47:07 -0400, Robin S. wrote:

"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
.. .

Wikipedia is an extremely useful resource. Dave is right about
that. On the other hand, it would be against their nature to publish
extremely specialized articles, like how to select argon pressure and
CFM for welding or how to measure thread pitch, etc. And that, I
think, would be a real benefit of metalworking wiki.


I think we share the same vision. I think the wiki should be very
specilized, like a textbook or guide to specific metalworking techniques.


Yes, like a FAQ, but with more text, hierarchy, pictures etc.

Plus, I think, it could host pages with members' project descriptions,
e.g. "how I made my homemade CNC router table from hospital gurneys",
etc, with pictures uploaded and all Wiki bells and whistles.

Ultimately I think that usenet just isn't all that great for
archiving content in an easy to find way. People end up endlessly
explaining the differences between various import machinery
manufacturers and products, how to get into CNC at home, speeds and
feeds, etc. I know from personal experience that after years of
repeating yourself, you eventually just don't contribute any more.


Also true.


Also, we could refer to wikipedia articles from the metalworking wiki,
so that we do not need to rewrite the great stuff that is maintained
there.


True. It's a good start for people who are very new to metalworking.


I own algebra.com and have a decicated server to host algebra.com
anyway, so hosting one more virtual domain is very easy for
me. (algebra.com is a little algebra tutor community where free tutors
help students for free).


You are a virtual philanthropist, Iggy. Giving your time and money to those
in need is a noble endeavour. I think everyone here donates a lot of time to
helping others get into this craft as well. This is exactly why wiki would
be so powerful.

Perhaps it would be a good start to host on your algebra server. At least to
get the ball rolling and see how things move. The metalworking.com name
would be more appropriate aesthetically, and would tie things in more
neatly, but I'd be more concerned with ultimately getting content online.


Yes, that can always be changed, the main thing is to put in enough
safeguards to protect the community nature of this project.

i

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Dave Hinz
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 17:04:05 GMT, Ignoramus18798 wrote:
On Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:55 +0000, Christopher Tidy wrote:


That is a very good point. In my experience the Wikipedia community can
be excessively eager to remove articles which are accurate and useful,
but don't conform to their criteria for encyclopedia content. They are
quite pedantic.


Yes, this wiki could host also descriptions of members' projects, with
uploaded pictures, etc. One page per project. I see nothing wrong with that.


Well then I'm definately in for at least a nightly backup repository if
not a mirror. Iggy, I can set you up a username and password so you can
push, or I can fetch from you if you give me a username/passwd. Probaby
easier if you push after you do the archive, less potential for race
conditions that way.

Dave
  #20   Report Post  
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Dave Hinz
 
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On Mon, 22 May 2006 10:05:07 -0700, Grant Erwin wrote:

I do know something about technical writing, and any such publication would be
of dubious quality unless some attempt were made to keep it to a certain minimum
level of writing quality.


Well, that's the cool think about a wiki. You can drop a template into
an article, change it so it's a basic map, and people who care enough to
improve it will do so. All changes can be backed out in case some idiot
comes in and valdalizes it, of course.

This could be accomplished by a system of peer review
which might look like: a guy writes a piece and publishes it, then another
person reads it and sees how it could be improved and contacts the author with
suggestions, after which the author edits it and updates the piece, iterated
indefinitely. This would require a separate communication system. Even better
would be if the whole thing had a person who acted as a global moderator, who
could if given sufficient motivation remove articles entirely.


In the case of a wiki, everybody, and nobody, is the moderator. Those
who care about the artcle watch it, improve it, and so on. Vandalism is
surprisingly rare.

It's worth a shot. If his setup of a wiki is as easy as my setup of a
wiki, we've spent more time talking about it than it would take to set
it up.

Dave


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Ignoramus18798
 
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On 22 May 2006 17:18:03 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:
On Mon, 22 May 2006 17:04:05 GMT, Ignoramus18798 wrote:
On Mon, 22 May 2006 17:42:55 +0000, Christopher Tidy wrote:


That is a very good point. In my experience the Wikipedia community can
be excessively eager to remove articles which are accurate and useful,
but don't conform to their criteria for encyclopedia content. They are
quite pedantic.


Yes, this wiki could host also descriptions of members' projects, with
uploaded pictures, etc. One page per project. I see nothing wrong with that.


Well then I'm definately in for at least a nightly backup repository if
not a mirror. Iggy, I can set you up a username and password so you can
push, or I can fetch from you if you give me a username/passwd. Probaby
easier if you push after you do the archive, less potential for race
conditions that way.


You tell me what to do and I will do it, push or pull is fine. I
usually create files with a .tmp extension, and rename them to give
them the ultimate filename, after they are fully created. No race
conditions.

i

  #22   Report Post  
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Robin S.
 
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"Grant Erwin" wrote in message
...

I do know something about technical writing, and any such publication
would be of dubious quality unless some attempt were made to keep it to a
certain minimum level of writing quality. This could be accomplished by a
system of peer review which might look like: a guy writes a piece and
publishes it, then another person reads it and sees how it could be
improved and contacts the author with suggestions, after which the author
edits it and updates the piece, iterated indefinitely. This would require
a separate communication system. Even better would be if the whole thing
had a person who acted as a global moderator, who could if given
sufficient motivation remove articles entirely.


Grant,

It sounds like a global moderator would be ultimately virtually impossible.
Perhaps a group of individuals would be more appropriate. I'm not really
sure even that could happen. It sounds like the host would effectively have
control content to that extent.

The good thing about wiki is you can always edit it at any time. You don't
need to ask anyone. Personally I don't know the nitty gritty details about
how editing actually works - if there are "global moderators," how to keep
out questionable information, keeping people who are detrimental to the
community at bay and indeed identifying what is detrimental and what is
allowable, etc.

I'm sure there's info available on one of those sites. I'll have to poke
around.

Regards,

Robin


  #23   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Robin S.
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database


"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...

Well then I'm definately in for at least a nightly backup repository if
not a mirror.


If it would be helpful, I'd be more than happy to keep a
nightly/weekly/whatever backup as a just-in-case. I don't have enough
bandwidth to host, but I've got plenty for single downloads.

Regards,

Robin


  #24   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Christopher Tidy
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

Ignoramus18798 wrote:
The bad thing about hosting a separate wiki, as you note, is that if
the host loses interest, dies or runs out of money, it would go down.

The good thing about it is that we can discuss topics that would
likely be removed by wikipedia community as too specialized, such as
fine points of metalworking.


That is a very good point. In my experience the Wikipedia community can
be excessively eager to remove articles which are accurate and useful,
but don't conform to their criteria for encyclopedia content. They are
quite pedantic.

Good luck if you decide to proceed with the plan!

Chris

  #25   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Dave Hinz
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On Mon, 22 May 2006 13:37:07 -0400, Robin S. wrote:

"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...

Well then I'm definately in for at least a nightly backup repository if
not a mirror.


If it would be helpful, I'd be more than happy to keep a
nightly/weekly/whatever backup as a just-in-case. I don't have enough
bandwidth to host, but I've got plenty for single downloads.


Redundancy is never a bad thing in IT.
Redundancy is never a bad thing in IT.



  #26   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Kelly Jones
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database


"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
.. .
I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.


Gosh, what a great idea. I have been lurking here for a couple years and I
really like the idea of a searchable, organized database for RCM topics.
How can I help?


  #27   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Grant Erwin
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

OK, now we need lists of topics to write up! Boy, this could be a huge project.
Can these writeups include photos?

I volunteer to write up a summary of rust removal techniques for starters. I am
already pretty good at acid dipping, wire brushing, sandblasting, lye/zinc bath
soaking and electrolytic derusting. I'm planning to research the molasses
granules soak technique and also an aqueuous zinc solution soak, would add those
too.

GWE
  #28   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Dave Hinz
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On Mon, 22 May 2006 12:02:59 -0700, Grant Erwin wrote:
OK, now we need lists of topics to write up! Boy, this could be a huge project.
Can these writeups include photos?


Yes, they can. I just added a start of a template for user's project
pages, nothing fancy but in the nature of a wiki, anyone can improve it
if they want. The user interface is very intuitive, just click on the
icon that looks like a picture, it builds the syntax for you which you
just change to the image name you want. If it's not there and you click
on an image link, it takes you to the "upload an image" page.

I volunteer to write up a summary of rust removal techniques for starters. I am
already pretty good at acid dipping, wire brushing, sandblasting, lye/zinc bath
soaking and electrolytic derusting.


Sounds like a perfect entry for the "howto" section, maybe a new section
called "derusting".

I'm planning to research the molasses
granules soak technique and also an aqueuous zinc solution soak, would add those
too.


....and so it starts...

Thanks for doing this, Iggy.

Dave Hinz
  #29   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
R. Zimmerman
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

We had a sci.engr.joining.welding FAQ website that has been closed. Any
chance of a "welding section"? I still have some of my contributions to
that previous FAQ.
Randy


"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
.. .
I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.

i

On Mon, 22 May 2006 02:37:44 -0400, Robin S. wrote:
Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable

solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.

For those unfamiliar...

http://www.wiki.org/wiki.cgi?WhatIsWiki

I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is

an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.

I'm sure this group collectively consumes hundreds of hours each week
replying to questions which have been asked dozens of times, only to get
lost in the Google archives, never to be found by thirsty eyes again.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and

experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.

Naturally there are issues. User-editable articles can be full of useless

or
incorrect information. Ideally the group collectively keeps the content
relevant and error-free, but there's no guarantee. Also, I'm not sure

where
the database could be hosted or any of those types of details.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.

Regards,

Robin





  #30   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Ignoramus18798
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On Mon, 22 May 2006 22:07:42 GMT, R. Zimmerman wrote:
We had a sci.engr.joining.welding FAQ website that has been closed. Any
chance of a "welding section"? I still have some of my contributions to
that previous FAQ.


That website surely has a welding section.

metalworking.algebra.com/Welding_howto

i



"Ignoramus18798" wrote in message
.. .
I already host two wikis on algebra.com and will be happy to set up a
metalworking wiki. I use mediawiki, the same software that wikipedia
runs.

One wiki is wiki.algebra.com and another is a financial planning wiki
for misc.invest.financial-plan newsgroup.

So... If a few people say so, I will create one so that we can create
a "collective body of knowledge". Should be 1 day to me.

i

On Mon, 22 May 2006 02:37:44 -0400, Robin S. wrote:
Food for thought:

I was thinking that a Wiki database for RCM would be a very viable

solution
for archiving the seemingly endless knowledge available within this group.

For those unfamiliar...

http://www.wiki.org/wiki.cgi?WhatIsWiki

I'd say the most well known example of wiki is www.wikipedia.org which is

an
encyclopaedia composed of articles contributed and edited by anyone at any
time.

I'm sure this group collectively consumes hundreds of hours each week
replying to questions which have been asked dozens of times, only to get
lost in the Google archives, never to be found by thirsty eyes again.

Wiki would allow everyone to contribute their own techniques and

experiences
as quickly, if not more quickly, than on this group. It would also allow
users to easily contribute and find information based on specific subjects
in an organized and simple hierarchy menu system.

Naturally there are issues. User-editable articles can be full of useless

or
incorrect information. Ideally the group collectively keeps the content
relevant and error-free, but there's no guarantee. Also, I'm not sure

where
the database could be hosted or any of those types of details.

Perhaps we have some experts here? Any thoughts are helpful.

Regards,

Robin








  #31   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Brent Philion
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

HEHEH until you find a Linear ring

Eastbound and westbound strands in the same fibre sheath

4 strands in the same glass means Kaboom when you think its really
redundnat

On 22 May 2006 17:54:00 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Mon, 22 May 2006 13:37:07 -0400, Robin S. wrote:

"Dave Hinz" wrote in message
...

Well then I'm definately in for at least a nightly backup repository if
not a mirror.


If it would be helpful, I'd be more than happy to keep a
nightly/weekly/whatever backup as a just-in-case. I don't have enough
bandwidth to host, but I've got plenty for single downloads.


Redundancy is never a bad thing in IT.
Redundancy is never a bad thing in IT.


  #32   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Gunner
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On 22 May 2006 20:27:13 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Mon, 22 May 2006 12:02:59 -0700, Grant Erwin wrote:
OK, now we need lists of topics to write up! Boy, this could be a huge project.
Can these writeups include photos?


Yes, they can. I just added a start of a template for user's project
pages, nothing fancy but in the nature of a wiki, anyone can improve it
if they want. The user interface is very intuitive, just click on the
icon that looks like a picture, it builds the syntax for you which you
just change to the image name you want. If it's not there and you click
on an image link, it takes you to the "upload an image" page.

I volunteer to write up a summary of rust removal techniques for starters. I am
already pretty good at acid dipping, wire brushing, sandblasting, lye/zinc bath
soaking and electrolytic derusting.


Sounds like a perfect entry for the "howto" section, maybe a new section
called "derusting".

I'm planning to research the molasses
granules soak technique and also an aqueuous zinc solution soak, would add those
too.


...and so it starts...

Thanks for doing this, Iggy.

Dave Hinz


anyone got the Hardinge spindle bearing treatise I wrote? I have
photos to go with it.

Gunner

"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be
as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment
is to gull**** in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at
all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in
sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration,
knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure
but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33
  #33   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Ignoramus18798
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On Tue, 23 May 2006 01:42:47 GMT, Gunner wrote:
On 22 May 2006 20:27:13 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Mon, 22 May 2006 12:02:59 -0700, Grant Erwin wrote:
OK, now we need lists of topics to write up! Boy, this could be a huge project.
Can these writeups include photos?


Yes, they can. I just added a start of a template for user's project
pages, nothing fancy but in the nature of a wiki, anyone can improve it
if they want. The user interface is very intuitive, just click on the
icon that looks like a picture, it builds the syntax for you which you
just change to the image name you want. If it's not there and you click
on an image link, it takes you to the "upload an image" page.

I volunteer to write up a summary of rust removal techniques for starters. I am
already pretty good at acid dipping, wire brushing, sandblasting, lye/zinc bath
soaking and electrolytic derusting.


Sounds like a perfect entry for the "howto" section, maybe a new section
called "derusting".

I'm planning to research the molasses
granules soak technique and also an aqueuous zinc solution soak, would add those
too.


...and so it starts...

Thanks for doing this, Iggy.

Dave Hinz


anyone got the Hardinge spindle bearing treatise I wrote? I have
photos to go with it.



how about


http://groups.google.com/group/rec.c...1cd758b054c37b

?

i

  #34   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Gunner
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On Tue, 23 May 2006 01:52:51 GMT, Ignoramus18798
wrote:

On Tue, 23 May 2006 01:42:47 GMT, Gunner wrote:
On 22 May 2006 20:27:13 GMT, Dave Hinz wrote:

On Mon, 22 May 2006 12:02:59 -0700, Grant Erwin wrote:
OK, now we need lists of topics to write up! Boy, this could be a huge project.
Can these writeups include photos?

Yes, they can. I just added a start of a template for user's project
pages, nothing fancy but in the nature of a wiki, anyone can improve it
if they want. The user interface is very intuitive, just click on the
icon that looks like a picture, it builds the syntax for you which you
just change to the image name you want. If it's not there and you click
on an image link, it takes you to the "upload an image" page.

I volunteer to write up a summary of rust removal techniques for starters. I am
already pretty good at acid dipping, wire brushing, sandblasting, lye/zinc bath
soaking and electrolytic derusting.

Sounds like a perfect entry for the "howto" section, maybe a new section
called "derusting".

I'm planning to research the molasses
granules soak technique and also an aqueuous zinc solution soak, would add those
too.

...and so it starts...

Thanks for doing this, Iggy.

Dave Hinz


anyone got the Hardinge spindle bearing treatise I wrote? I have
photos to go with it.



how about


http://groups.google.com/group/rec.c...1cd758b054c37b

?

i


Ayup..dats der one.

Gunner


"If thy pride is sorely vexed when others disparage your offering, be
as lamb's wool is to cold rain and the Gore-tex of Odin's raiment
is to gull**** in the gale, for thy angst shall vex them not at
all. Yea, they shall scorn thee all the more. Rejoice in
sharing what you have to share without expectation of adoration,
knowing that sharing your treasure does not diminish your treasure
but enriches it."

- Onni 1:33
  #35   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
TheAndroid
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

I have a question regarding the GFDL. It assigns ownership and credit
to the author (cool) but does not require the source of the
documentation be disclosed (uncool). What this means is anyone can reap
the site and sell CD's of the contents on EBay under the pretense of a
personally constructed collection. Is there a means to extend the GFDL
to cover the fact that the documentation gleaned came from this
metalworking wiki? I'm concerned that someone will swoop in and profit
from your work. Unless of course no one else cares.

I raise this issue as we had this exact same scenario earlier with the
Dropbox as there was no clear understanding that the information
contained within the site was not for resale, period. I don't want us
to get into another brouhaha.

If the GFDL can (and maybe it does) require credit be given to the
container of the collection as well, I would feel better.



  #36   Report Post  
Posted to rec.crafts.metalworking
Ignoramus8797
 
Posts: n/a
Default RCM wiki database

On 23 May 2006 09:22:17 -0700, TheAndroid wrote:
I have a question regarding the GFDL. It assigns ownership and credit
to the author (cool) but does not require the source of the
documentation be disclosed (uncool). What this means is anyone can reap
the site and sell CD's of the contents on EBay under the pretense of a
personally constructed collection. Is there a means to extend the GFDL
to cover the fact that the documentation gleaned came from this
metalworking wiki? I'm concerned that someone will swoop in and profit
from your work. Unless of course no one else cares.


I personally do not care if anyone profits from anything that I write
publicly, however, GFDL requires some sort of acknowledgment.

J. Preserve the network location, if any, given in the Document for
public access to a Transparent copy of the Document, and likewise the
network locations given in the Document for previous versions it was
based on. These may be placed in the "History" section. You may omit a
network location for a work that was published at least four years
before the Document itself, or if the original publisher of the
version it refers to gives permission.

I raise this issue as we had this exact same scenario earlier with the
Dropbox as there was no clear understanding that the information
contained within the site was not for resale, period. I don't want us
to get into another brouhaha.


Did the person who wanted to profit, actually profit at all?

Making money from selling CDs with copies of webpages, is not very
easy.

If the GFDL can (and maybe it does) require credit be given to the
container of the collection as well, I would feel better.


I believe that it does, maybe I am mistaken. The nice thing about GFDL
is that it allows mirroring and copying, which helps preserve these
materials.

i

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